Subject: Re: [edu-team] From the edu team -- the kind of "interdomain routing" tutorial we'd like to see

From: David Ward <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2008 13:29:46 -0500

Radia and team -

Ok, I have my slides together and as usual there are far too many. I  
found that covering most of the topics below (all but the "how is  
money done") takes a ton of time and explanation. I've done my best  
to keep protocol details out of the deck and of course minimize Cisco- 
isms. I also kept the security section shorter than the multi-homing/ 
routing&addressing issues. There is so much confusion on network  
deployments and what impacts what level of the internet, I thought it  
might be useful. Let me check on a few basics:

My talk is 1300-1445, correct? What happens if I go over that time  
slot? Will we get kicked out of the room? Should I just try and get a  
longer slot or cover less material or at a higher level?

Are the slides publicly available? The edu webpage is still hosed so,  
I have no idea what has been done before, etc.

-DWard

On Mar 28, 2008, at 11:00 PM, Radia Perlman wrote:

> Dave...
>
> I'm glad you volunteered to teach a Sunday afternoon routing  
> tutorial at the next IETF. The particular slant
> the edu team would like to see is to explain interdomain routing.  
> Not so much the particulars
> of BGP, but how interdomain works....information that is folklore  
> that isn't in the RFCs.
>
> For instance, what is the DFZ and why is it interesting? Who peers  
> with whom at what levels?
> What types of BGP filters do they use in which directions? What are  
> "incompatible
> policies"? What types of effects do people need that they want  
> policies for?
> How is money done? Is there incentive to be a through carrier from  
> A to B because
> you get paid money, or is all the through traffic an AS forwards  
> purely "community service"?
>
> What controls are in place
> to prevent random BGP routes from hitting the DFZ? What types of  
> things can (and do)
> go wrong with the current system? What hope is there for S-BGP, or  
> (forgot the name
> of the other security BGP thing, which I think Russ White worked  
> on). What are they?
>
> I won't be at the next IETF, but I'd be glad to help you prepare,  
> mostly by asking
> you questions and reviewing slides. I suspect the result could be  
> turned into an excellent
> paper for publication somewhere. Again, I'm happy to help in any  
> way I can.
>
> We already have had routing tutorials on link state/distance vector/ 
> path vector/spanning tree.
> (I did that actually). And then we had Geoff Huston do one, where  
> we were hoping it would
> be along the lines of what I said above, but it was mostly also  
> link state/distance/vector/
> path vector plus walking through the BGP packet formats.
>
> What we're asking for is really hard, I know, because it's mostly  
> not written down, but
> it would be really valuable if you could cover at least some of the  
> above.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Radia
>

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---

From: Margaret Wasserman <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 12:41:35 +0100

Hi David,

Sorry not to get back to you before your tutorial.  I hope it went well!

Yes, the slides are publicly posted.  There is a new edu page (still  
at edu.ietf.org) on the tools Wiki that is not longer hosed.  We are  
busy populating it with past information, but I am posting everything  
from this IETF.  So, if you could send me the slides, I'll post them  
there.

Thanks,
Margaret

---

From: David Ward <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 07:00:53 -0500

Do I get any kind of feedback from the preso? I had no blue sheets  
and I didn't know if there was anything I was to direct folks to do.  
We had about 50 people that were actively engaged throughout.

-DWard

On Jul 30, 2008, at 6:41 AM, Margaret Wasserman wrote:

> Yes, the slides are publicly posted.  There is a new edu page  
> (still at edu.ietf.org) on the tools Wiki that is not longer  
> hosed.  We are busy populating it with past information, but I am  
> posting everything from this IETF.  So, if you could send me the  
> slides, I'll post them there.
>
> Thanks,
> Margaret
>
>

---

From: Margaret Wasserman <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 10:13:24 +0100

Hi Dave,

There are no blue sheets for the tutorials.

I wasn't able to be there, as I was preparing to give my own  
tutorial.  Were any of the other EDU Team members present?

Margaret

---

From: David Ward <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2008 04:21:08 -0500

Margaret -

I didn't see any other members but, I might have missed them.   
Overall I had a lot of fun giving the session. It was very  
interactive, people were attentive and engaging and seemed to be able  
to hold on.

Thanks for the opportunity.

-DWard