Subject: Re: Internet Companies Welcome Idea of G

From: [email-masked] (Noel Chiappa)
Date: Tue, 4 Nov 97 14:38:10 -0500

From: "Theodore Y. Ts'o" <[email-masked]>

    the lack of representation of the interests of the actual *users* in
    many, if not all, of these various attempts at defining the "governance
    of the internet" does make it very easy for there to be the appearance of
    unfairness and back-room dealings

Quite true, and I hope people remember this.

    It has been argued that ... it is similarly impossible to offer IP
    address portability. ... who has *not* been as well represented these
    forums, by and large? The users themselves --- the only ones which would
    really stand to benefit from having IP address portability!!!

While I don't disagree with your general point above, your example is just
plain wrong. The issue of address portability was debated *extensively* in a
*variety* of IETF forums (including CIDRD, and the main IETF list) where all,
*including* users, had a chance to chime in.

    This view may or may not merit, and it is not my purpose to debate it
    here. ... this doesn't necessarily mean that the people who claim that IP
    address portability is impossible are wrong .. and I'm not making this
    claim at this time.

Your repeated claims of innocence don't impress me. This issue has been
beaten past death several times, and if you have managed to restart the
firestorm, it's going to be very upsetting. At the very least, if you really
are solely interested in the issue of governance, it was damn stupid to use
this as an example, since the risk of derailing the discussion into yet
another rehash of "address portability" is very high.

So, can we all please act like Ted never mentioned "address portability",
and stick to governance issues?

	Noel

---

From: [email-masked]
Date: Tue, 04 Nov 1997 16:54:08 -0500

> Quite true, and I hope people remember this.

Umm.. has anybody involved in this asked Bill Gates what *he* intends to do?

I'm serious here.
-- 
				Valdis Kletnieks
				Computer Systems Senior Engineer
				Virginia Tech

---

From: Owain Vaughan <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 5 Nov 1997 10:15:36 +0000 (GMT)

> Umm.. has anybody involved in this asked Bill Gates what *he* intends to do?

Surely not?? Mr. Gates can hardly be considered as representing *users*
of the internet.. he's in it for personal gain and a vain attempt to
actually own it himself...

Owain Vaughan

---

From: Einar Stefferud <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 04 Nov 1997 22:10:34 -0800

No need to ask, just listen to his many speeches;-)...

He intends to gain control of the entire Internet market...
By populating all the workstations and servers with MS systems.

Since the Internet is actually controlled from the edges, where the
DNS servers live, he just might succeed, for a while.  But, if he
does, then the IBM fate will most likely come and get him;-)...

This includes antitrust messes, and finally getting too big to turn
the old supertanker around in the harbor.  MS is almost already too
big to change its directions, though Bill Gates is doing his best to
make it happen.

Unless MS learns how important it is to keep the Internet Open and
Free.  Or, maybe he will doo what IBM could not do, and that is to
split the company into smaller more agile parts.

Consider where the world would be today if IBM had split into 4-5
separate companies in 1982.  The combined stockholder value of those
companies today would dwarf the stockholder value of IBM stock today.

I'm serious too;-)...Cheers...\Stef

>From your message Tue, 04 Nov 1997 16:54:08 -0500:
}
}On Tue, 04 Nov 1997 14:38:10 EST, Noel Chiappa said:
}>     From: "Theodore Y. Ts'o" <[email-masked]>
}> 
}>     the lack of representation of the interests of the actual *users* in
}>     many, if not all, of these various attempts at defining the "governance
}>     of the internet" does make it very easy for there to be the appearance of
}>     unfairness and back-room dealings
}> 
}> Quite true, and I hope people remember this.
}
}Umm.. has anybody involved in this asked Bill Gates what *he* intends to do?
}
}I'm serious here.
}-- 
}				Valdis Kletnieks
}				Computer Systems Senior Engineer
}				Virginia Tech