Subject: Re: Bake-off as trademark

From: "Steven M. Bellovin" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 15:59:05 -0500

In message <[email-masked]>, "Henning G. Schulzrinne" writes
:
>I've been approached regarding the use of the (claimed-to-be)
>trademarked term bake-off. It would be helpful if somebody can provide
>credible evidence that this term has been used within the technical
>community for many years. (In case you didn't know,
>http://www.bakeoff.com/ shows the non-technical use....)

It's used in RFC 1371, from October 1992.  Of course, that RFC also 
says:

   The IAB/IETF are committed to a timely introduction of OSI into the
   Internet.

Anyway -- I seem to recall seeing the term in "TCP/IP Protocol 
Transition Handbook", from circa 193, but my copy isn't conveniently 
accessible at the moment.

		--Steve Bellovin

---

From: Bill Manning <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 14:08:01 -0800 (PST)

% 
% In message <[email-masked]>, "Henning G. Schulzrinne" writes
% :
% >I've been approached regarding the use of the (claimed-to-be)
% >trademarked term bake-off. It would be helpful if somebody can provide
% >credible evidence that this term has been used within the technical
% >community for many years. (In case you didn't know,
% >http://www.bakeoff.com/ shows the non-technical use....)
% 
% It's used in RFC 1371, from October 1992.  Of course, that RFC also 
% says:
% 
%    The IAB/IETF are committed to a timely introduction of OSI into the
%    Internet.
% 
% Anyway -- I seem to recall seeing the term in "TCP/IP Protocol 
% Transition Handbook", from circa 193, but my copy isn't conveniently 
% accessible at the moment.
% 
% 		--Steve Bellovin

Interop was Dan Lynches venue for TCP/IP bakeoffs in the 1980's.
(thats why we have only three IETFs... :)

--bill

---

From: [email-masked]
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 18:24:35 -0800 (PST)

>    The IAB/IETF are committed to a timely introduction of OSI into the

I seem to recall Jake Feinler (who fought had against the mandate of
OSI by the government in GOSIP) said that the appropriate timing of
the introduction of OSI protocols would be measured by ice crystal
formation in Hell.  "Never" is time too, after all.

See RFC1169 for more about GOSIP.  We're your government, and we're
here to help you.

			Ted Hardie
			(No longer part of anyone's government)