Subject: Re: Complaint on abuse of DNSOP lists

From: [email-masked] (Noel Chiappa)
Date: Mon, 10 May 2004 19:34:11 -0400 (EDT)

> From: Dean Anderson <[email-masked]>

    >> If you look at the message, you will note that it is a bounce from the
    >> WG co-chair's _personal_ email address, directly to your email address.

    > it was a bounce to a message Mr. Austein posted on DNSOP.

I assume you mean "it was a bounce to [a reply to] a message Mr. Austein
posted on DNSOP", right? (No need to confirm, just checking.)

    > It was not private business. It was IETF business.

So? Rob's not refusing to accept *any* email *at all* from you as a person
(just from a range of addresses which are generating email he doesn't like);
and you're more than savvy enough technically to get email to him via some
other path.

He's not under any more obligation to accept email from you via whatever
channel you feel like using, no matter how onerous for him, than he is to
accept messages written on 12' long oak logs of 3' diameter.

Get a life, will you? Your constant whining and flaming is really getting
old. You're getting really close to the line at which I'd ask the Chair to
ban you from posting. Oh wait, I know what your response would be - you'd sue
us. And you seem to think the rest of the world is doing things which is
making you look bad. Here's another free clue: you're doing a far better job
of that than the rest of us could do with a decade of free time.

	Noel

_______________________________________________
Ietf mailing list
[email-masked]
https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf

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From: Dean Anderson <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 14:26:22 -0400 (EDT)

> and you're more than savvy enough technically to get email to him via some

As an IETF WG chair, he's obligated to follow the IETF rules on public
participation.  He can't block anything that the IETF mail server can't
block: Public Participants.

> of that than the rest of us could do with a decade of free time.

I'm entitled to particpate, and I'm entitled to send email to the WG 
chairs as a participant.

One thing I've noticed is that of none of the people criticizing me has
thought to address the fact that OUR ADDRESS SPACE IS NOT HIJACKED, and
that these people associated with the IETF: Paul Vixie, Joe Abley, Bill
Manning, and Rob Austein as WG Co-chair in his role for IETF business, all
claim that it is.  But anyone can plainly see they are lying.

Dean Anderson
Av8 Internet, Inc

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From: Dean Anderson <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 14:26:22 -0400 (EDT)

Dean Anderson
Av8 Internet, Inc

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From: John Stracke <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 14:50:59 -0400

>claim that it is.  But anyone can plainly see they are lying.
No, actually, that's very difficult for anyone to see.  First off 
there's the simple matter that "hijacked" doesn't mean you hijacked it; 
as has already been pointed out, it could mean that someone else 
hijacked part of it from you.

Second there's the fact that ARIN lists your netblock as being assigned 
to the Open Software Foundation (with yourself as the contact).  It is 
impossible for an outsider to know whether or not the OSF transferred 
the block to av8.com legitimately.  I don't suspect it, you 
understand--nor do I much care--I'm just pointing out that it's not 
plain whether anybody here is lying.

-- 
/===============================================================\
|John Stracke      [email-masked]                        |
|Principal Engineer|http://www.centive.com                      |
|Centive           |My opinions are my own.                     |
|===============================================================|
|"Baldric, how did you manage to find a turnip that cost 400,000|
|pounds?" "Well, I had to haggle." --Blackadder III             |
\===============================================================/

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From: John Stracke <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 14:50:59 -0400

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From: Rick Wesson <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 12:16:54 -0700 (PDT)

Dean,

ok, i asked nicely and privately several times.
PLEASE! take this thread some place else.

-rick

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From: Rick Wesson <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 12:16:54 -0700 (PDT)

Dean,

-rick

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From: Dean Anderson <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 16:49:51 -0400 (EDT)

Where would you suggest I take it?  

It says in the IETF mission statement:

   The IETF will pursue this mission in adherence to the following
   cardinal principles:

   Open process - that any interested participant can in fact
      participate in the work, know what is being decided, and make his
      or her voice heard on the issue. Part of this principle is our
      commitment to making our documents, our WG mailing lists, our
      attendance lists and our meeting minutes publicly available on the
      Net.

How can one have an open process if WG chairs don't receive email?

How can it be taken off-list if IETF staff don't receive email?

Your request seems to be contradictory.

		--Dean

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From: Dean Anderson <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 16:49:51 -0400 (EDT)

--Dean

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From: Joe Abley <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 17:07:03 -0400

On 11 May 2004, at 14:26, Dean Anderson wrote:

> claim that it is.

What?

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From: Joe Abley <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 11 May 2004 17:07:03 -0400

What?