Subject: [ippm] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ippm-owdp-reqs-01.txt

From: [email-masked]
Date: Mon, 03 Dec 2001 08:37:23 -0500

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Metrics Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: A One-way Active Measurement Protocol Requirements
	Author(s)	: S. Shalunov, B. Teitelbaum
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ippm-owdp-reqs-01.txt
	Pages		: 9
	Date		: 30-Nov-01
	
With growing availability of good time sources to network nodes, it
becomes increasingly possible to measure one-way IP performance
metrics with high precision.  To do so in an interoperable manner, a
common protocol for such measurements is required.  This document
specifies requirements for a one-way active measurement protocol
(OWAMP) standard.  The protocol can measure one-way delay, as well as
other unidirectional characteristics, such as one-way loss.

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From: Matthew Luckie <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2001 13:15:39 -0800 (PST)

>  +  Allow UDP as the transport protocol, since the protocol needs to
>     be able to measure individual packet delivery times and has to run
>     on various machines.

is this requirement really necessary?

Matthew Luckie
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From: stanislav shalunov <[email-masked]>
Date: 03 Dec 2001 16:40:26 -0500

> is this requirement really necessary?

Please elaborate.  I don't understand this one-liner.  Do you mean we
should use general packet templates, TCP packets, separate IP protocol
packets as IPMP does, or something else?

Separate protocol number, in my opinion, won't do it.  It contradicts
requirement of section 6.2 (and you can't do it efficiently in
userspace).

Being able to do TCP would be nice; this is not excluded by the
requirement.  Not that we know how to do TCP without ripping out TCP
stack from the kernel and replacing it with something instrumented
even more heavily than, say, Web100, really.  (For the inbound
traffic, there's the timestamps option, too.)

-- 
Stanislav Shalunov		http://www.internet2.edu/~shalunov/

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---

From: Matthew Luckie <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2001 14:24:18 -0800 (PST)

> packets as IPMP does, or something else?

I'm just wondering if allowing UDP as the transport protocol is a
necessary requirement.

As you point out, there are multiple protocol types that can be used in
conducting one-way active measurements (the OWAMP-Test).

> requirement of section 6.2 (and you can't do it efficiently in

but i'm not suggesting that (1).

> requirement.

It's not excluded by the requirements specification, but my reading of the
specification is that you should have a UDP implementation of the
OWAMP-Test protocol too.  Section 4.6 spends some time discussing the use
of other protocol types.

More-over, I'm wondering if the requirements specification is designed
specifically for the OWAMP protocol draft or whether I should be able to
apply the requirements draft to other one-way active measurement protocols
as well.

----

(1) you can do `it' efficiently in kernel space though, and section 6.3 of
    rfc2330 touches briefly on this.
    if you really wanted to do it efficiently in user-space
    (modifications to raw sockets or something like that)
    you could.

---

From: stanislav shalunov <[email-masked]>
Date: 03 Dec 2001 17:42:26 -0500

> conducting one-way active measurements (the OWAMP-Test).

But we need to have a lowest common denominator that works on maximum
number of machines, across domain boundaries, etc.  UDP's not ideal.
But it'll give us ability to conduct some measurements.  We should
make their domain of applicability as large as possible.

> OWAMP-Test protocol too.

Yes.

> Section 4.6 spends some time discussing the use of other protocol
> types.

Yes, or rather difficulties we'd need to overcome to do more than UDP,
essentially.

> More-over, I'm wondering if the requirements specification is
> designed specifically for the OWAMP protocol draft or whether I
> should be able to apply the requirements draft to other one-way
> active measurement protocols as well.

draft-ietf-ippm-owdp-reqs-01.txt covers OWAMP requirements only.
It should not be read as constraining your work on IPMP in any way.

"Hey!  Who took the cork off my lunch?!"               -- W. C. Fields
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