Subject: Re: OSPF WG Charter Proposal

From: "Manral, Vishwas" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 08:22:54 -0500

Hi Rohit/Acee,

>Is anybody running OSPF networks hitting this problem with no workarounds
in sight?
I am not sure about this statement exactly, however I do think it can be
helpful in a few cases. A recent paper by Aman Shaikh/Albert Greenberg
et.al. about analyzing OSPF for Enterprise is one such case. One of our
drafts "Congestion Avoidance and Control for OSPF networks" talks about
problems that have been caused by flooding overload in production networks.

I think the hitless restart MIB info can go in the OSPFv2/v3 MIB itself.
Besides from a previous mail on this list I recollect that Cisco/Juniper
already have the MIB in place for OSPF-TE.

Regarding the last item in the charter "IPSec usage with OSPFv3", I remember
one of the comments on the list was that the mechanism could be generalized
for other protocols like RIPng etc, would we pursue this item on this WG?

Thanks,
Vishwas

-----Original Message-----
From: Rohit Dube [mailto:[email-masked]]
Sent: Tuesday, October 29, 2002 5:17 AM
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: OSPF WG Charter Proposal

Venkata,

Thanks for your comments. Some of my own are inline.

A meta comment first - our first goal is to clear the decks
by getting done with all the work (drafts + implementation
experience) that has accumulated over time. Once enough
of this done, it would be a natural point for the WG to
expand on the charter.

On Mon, 28 Oct 2002 18:22:02 -0500 "Naidu, Venkata" writes:
=>Rohit/Acee,
=>
=> Some quick comments w.r.t new charter.
=>
=> 1. Can you consider "Flooding Optimizations" into charter ?
=>    If not, can you please explain the reason, why we should not ?
=>    This is field of its own - we might expect lot of drafts.

We considered this but would like to see some operational requirements
before including this in the charter. Is anybody running OSPF networks
hitting this problem with no workarounds in sight?

It would be a candidate for a future version of the charter once some
of the current items clear.

=>
=> 2. One of the Alex's work "OSPF Link-local Signaling" will
=>    be very imp for future OSPF enhancements. As you know,
=>    the options are getting over in OSPF headers.
=>
=> 3. "OSPF TE" and "OSPF Hitless Restart" MIBs must be
=>    considered as separate drafts. Recent OSPFv2 MIB only
=>    talks about Opaque LSAs - but content carried in those
=>    LSAs are not specified in any MIB. I am be willing
=>    to write those drafts - what is your opinion, Kireeti/Padma ?

I was considering reflecting OSPF-TE in a MIB too. And this could
be a potential item for this or a future. But is there an operator
burning for this stuff?

=>
=> 4. "Flooding over Parallel Point-to-Point Links" can be
=>    considered as an informational RFC.

What draft are you referring to?
=> Thank You.
=>Venkata.

Best,
--rohit.

---

From: Mukesh Gupta <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 10:03:27 -0800

> for other protocols like RIPng etc, would we pursue this item on this WG?

There are parts of the proposed draft that are generic and could be used for
RIPng as well. But there are some specific things like virtual links that are
just for OSPFv3. As this already involves more than one group (IPsec and OSPF),
I would suggest keeping it in OSPF WG so that we can focus on it and finish it
on time.

I think some vendors have already implemented the OSPFv3 security using IPsec
and we in Nokia are almost done with it too. It would be good if we could
finalize things sooner.

regards
Mukesh
--
******************************************************************
Life is the biggest bargain. We get it for nothing.
******************************************************************
Mukesh Gupta
Phone: (650) 625-2264
Cell : (650) 868-9111
http://www.iprg.nokia.com/~mgupta
******************************************************************

---

From: Rohit Dube <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 13:51:08 -0500

On Tue, 29 Oct 2002 08:22:54 -0500 "Manral, Vishwas" writes:
=>Hi Rohit/Acee,
=>
=>>Is anybody running OSPF networks hitting this problem with no workarounds
=>in sight?
=>I am not sure about this statement exactly, however I do think it can be
=>helpful in a few cases. A recent paper by Aman Shaikh/Albert Greenberg
=>et.al. about analyzing OSPF for Enterprise is one such case. One of our
=>drafts "Congestion Avoidance and Control for OSPF networks" talks about
=>problems that have been caused by flooding overload in production networks.
[snip]

Vishwas,

I am familiar with Aman's work. The problem identified there was
that of (a) sub-optimal network/ospf configuration and (b) broken router.
This does not ofcourse justify building new protocol mechanisms, thereby
complicating the protocol.

I will look at the congestion again to see if/why it concludes otherwise.

Regards,
--rohit.

---

From: Acee Lindem <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 13:53:11 -0500

> and we in Nokia are almost done with it too. It would be good if we could

Rohit and I discussed this and we agree that there are enough differences in
the application of IPSec to OSPFv3 to keep the documents separate. Additionally,
as Mukesh points out, it will be much easier to get the progress the draft
through a single WG.

Thanks,
Acee

--
Acee