Subject: [ppsp] International P2P streaming workshop notes(Day1:Industrial and Cross Standard Organizations Discussion in P2P streaming and PPSP)

From: "zhangyunfei" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 28 Jun 2010 22:50:50 +0800

Hi all,
   We had a successful international P2P streaming workshop in Beijing on June 17 and 18.About 100 guests from IETF,3GPP,ITU as well as industrial and academic partipipants attended this workshop with hot discussion on PPSP related standardizations.
   The following is the the notes on the 1st day session:Industrial and Cross Standard Organizations Discussion in P2P streaming and PPSP.Thanks Spencer for taking the wonderful notes.We'll upload the slides in the workshop shortly and I'll let you know once they are available.

BR
Yunfei
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International Peer to Peer Streaming Industrial and Standards Workshop
June 17-18, 2010 Beijing, China
 
Day1：Industrial and Cross Standard Organizations Discussion in P2P streaming and PPSP
Notes from Spencer Dawkins
1         Detailed Notes 
1.1                Welcome Speech  
Xiaoyun WANG      Deputy General Manager of China Mobile Research Institute
P2P has been a great success, but there is still work to do…
1.2                Opening Speech    
Xiaohui DAI     Deputy Director-general of Technology Department of MIIT, China
This was in Chinese, with subtitles …
The view is that PPSP happens in IETF, PPSP integration into IMS happens in 3GPP, and PPSP is one of the NGN architectures in ITU-T.
1.3                Opening Speech  
Baoxin ZHOU General Secretary of CCSA
Also in Chinese with subtitles …
“CCSA has established internal counterparts with IETF and 3GPP…”
Very much a consolidated standards approach (ITU-T research project to push PPSP standardization in IETF).
Claiming 222M live/on-demand video users as of June 2009, 233M mobile Internet users in China (“further growth is expected”).
Very strong emphasis on injecting innovation into standards (not clear that you can standardize something that’s moving this fast).
1.4                P2P streaming in IETF 
Martin Stiemerling  IETF NSIS Chair, NEC Laboratories Europe
RTSP not suitable for P2P streaming (client-server assumption, no information about which parts of the media are available where).
Most RTSP 1.0 implementations are actually pseudo-“RTSP 1.1” – not really implementing a standard, and extensions aren’t interoperable – standardizing a streaming control protocol is hard!
Need fewer, better-documented features!
PPSP must meet lots of requirements (user management, media management, description, and deliver, etc), and there are lots of decision points (mesh or tree P2P? one or more scheduling algorithm(s)? single video/audio codec combination? variable or fixed chunk sizes?)
Live streaming? Video on demand? Time-shifted TV?
P2P systems today tend to use a single codec (for audio/for video).
P2P streaming system must be network-aware (feedback mechanisms between peers, interaction between PPSP and network operators, like ALTO).
Proposing a minimal solution to start with (join swarm, play, pause, leave swarm), with future features in mind.
Need to give guidance to implementers.
1.5                P2P streaming in ITU-T 
Duo LIU   ITU-T SG 13 Vice Chair, Director of Communication Standard Research Institute, CATR, MIIT
(speaking without slides)
Lots of study groups all working on IPTV standards (9, 12, 13, 16 …)
Looking for guidance from 3GPP and IETF experts on two new related questions in SG13, multi-path and DSN.
1.6                P2P streaming in 3GPP 
Hong LIU 3GPP SA2 Vice Chair, Senior Project Manager, China Mobile Research Institute
(speaking without slides)
Doing a high-level overview of current 3GPP work (LTE, SAE, etc). 
Have already standardized RTSP/RTP-based solutions in 3GPP, more recently standardizing IMS-based streaming. Have just approved technical report on study of P2P streaming.
Still lots of unsolved problems merging P2P with existing networks – especially mobile networks.
1.7                Trend and progress of P2P streaming and its industrial development  
Prof. Ziqiang HOU  Professor of CAS, Member of Communication Science & Technology Committee, MIIT
Usual assortment of Internet TV technology names plus cloud computing as infrastructure…
View that the Internet terminal will be TVs, mobile devices, or both.
IPTV as a closed system, Internet TV as an open system.
Most network service in China is 2Mbps (capable of supporting 720P HDTV). Some service is 4Mbps (capable of supporting 1280 HDTV).
CNTV supporting P2P mode on CBox client software, B/S mode on browsers.
New offering is 3D video.
Morgan Stanley thinks video is already (in 2009) the largest category of Internet traffic, and also the fastest-growing.
For cloud computing infrastructure:
Digitizing, mass storage, index and mining of TV content 
Support environment for PP2P
50M simultaneous mobile browser users in 2009Q3. 61 percent of mobile browser users have UCWEB browser, 25 percent have OperaMini.
1700 terrabit capacity for CDN.
www.p2p-next.com is EU project. 
Suggesting that DVB adopt an optional P2PP interface as an enhancement.
Chinese National Information Technology Standardization committee started P2P standardization working group in August 2008. Producing a DDP discovery protocol – what’s the relationship with P2P work in IETF?
1.8                DSN streaming introduction       
Jin PENG       Technical Manager of Network Architecture Laboratory, CMRI
Motivations for DSN are large-scale streaming support, reduced CAPEX/OPEX, and momentum for the future from a new technology.
CAPEX/OPEX is longest list of bullets – want to use idle computing resources throughout the network and use inexpensive clustered infrastructure to achieve required performance at lower costs.
View is that content switches aren’t an evolution of VoIP switches because content can be cached and distributed throughout the network. Content already dominates their networks, so that’s what they need to optimize for.
Three overlays – a VoIP overlay, a content overlay, and a relay overlay.
Have already demoed VoIP calls through P2P overlay – Network Function Node supports 50-100K subscribers per node – they have a 6M-user switch equivalent in their 60-blade lab system.
We’re right at the beginning of PPSP standardization in IETF – working group was chartered in March 2010.
Really interesting slide 12 showing relationship between P2PSIP/RELOAD, ALTO, and PPSP protocols. We needed this slide two years ago when CMCC started holding bar BOFs at IETFs!
1.9                UUSee Practice and its standards considerations  
Harold LIU      CTO of UUSee
“The most Economical, Flexible and Extendible Network”
30M active monthly subscribers, over 1M concurrent users watching Olympics in Beijing.
Concerned about increasing cost of video distribution to huge number of users for HD content.
View that they must provide a higher QoS for P2P streaming (why?).
Concerned about delivering content at the end of the long tail (when almost no one has the content). 
Using P2SP protocol to improve QoS – want  a standardized interface so telecom carriers, P2P vendors and CDN vendors can cooperate.
P2SP protocol is intelligent enough to deliver content through P2P or CDN depending on the quality of service.
P2SP presents a CDN client interface to CDN – can deploy P2P with no impact on CDN.
New technologies – time-shifting for live-broadcasting with P2P, P2P on mobile platforms (Android, iPhone).
Advice to PPSP – use standard network protocols, use open/mature technology to set up supernode, standardize content format, standardize network information exchange protocol so each P2P vendor can optimize its own strategy. 
UUsee wants to have deep cooperation with telecom carriers, participate in PPSP standardization discussions, and offer a testbed for PPSP implementations. 
1.10          Internet Use, Mobile Internet Use, and Video Use       
Xiaodong Lee  Vice President and CTO of CNNIC
(speaking in Chinese with English slides)
346M broadband Internet users at end of 2009. 284M video users at end of 2009 (if I captured the number correctly from his slides).
Subscribers spending more time online (16.6 hours/week in 2008, 18.7 hours/week in 2009). Most are still leisure time-only users (so emphasis is on recreational applications).
Large gap in Internet penetration between Eastern China and the rest of the country. Beijing and Shanghai are about 65-62 percent, respectively. 
Computer (non-laptop) usage is down in 2009. Laptop usage is up slightly, but mobile devices is up from 40 percent to 60 percent of users reporting that they used this category of device.
233M mobile Internet users at end of 2009. More than half of mobile Internet users surf the Internet for more than an hour per day.
91 percent of mobile Internet users have read news on a cell phone.
More people will pay for eBooks than anything else. More people will accept ads in video than in anything else.
240M Internet video users at end of 2009. More than 95 percent have used Internet video with broadband access. More than 54 percent of broadband access is 2Mbps or higher (can support HD Internet video).
Only 10.7 percent of Internet video users use HD “often”.
About half of users use Internet video at least once per day. About 80 percent of users have shared video, including talking and IM (this is sharing with a known person, not sharing with the public).
Most users think ads in Internet video are at least acceptable (if they don’t interfere with viewing, if the ads are good, and other caveats all apply).
Internet video usage tends to displace TV viewing – often, users quit watching TV altogether.
1.11          Ravy architecture and important points for PPSP       
Omer Luzzatti CTO of RayV
Their core technical team is from VocalTech, who did VoIP in 1995.
Major business case seems to be based on asymmetric bandwidth (download vs. upload), adding “typical” nodes, streaming to each of them, and redistributing from them to other peers (so they are “amplifiers”).
Telco requirements – SLA, stream must exist in “reliable sources”, low delay (8-10 seconds) with fast channel switching, minimize number of hops, synchronize clocks between peers, use push protocol from donor.
Business rules from content owners (operators, ISPs, and telcos), plus technical rules.
Also need reporting (including real-time monitoring and data mining) and security (access control, maybe DRM, per-program ability to stop viewing). 
1.12          Streaming applications: Operator's opportunities and challenges   
Fei YUAN       Director of Standards Department, ZTE
In China, video/streaming on the Internet has been the 4th most popular application.
Expecting that edge network architecture will be further flattened, topology-based traffic optimization (P4P, ALTO) would be introduced, DPI would be used to improve the interaction between application layer and bearer layer, and cache technology would be used to resolve the issue of bandwidth bottlenecks.
FT, China Telecom and PCCW all have more than 1M IPTV subscribers. CAGR is about 50 percent per year.
China is still at the beginning of CDN deployment and views P2P as a way to leapfrog other markets.
Improving Quality of Experience (QoE) – Application Layer Forward Error Correction and Fast Channel Change.
CDN has already been widely deployed in IPTV. Want to use P2P technology for a distributed and cooperative CDN.
1.13          Xunlei Streaming Practice     
Paul HUANG  Vice President of Xunlei Corp.
Was not able to attend this workshop.
1.14          IETF PPSP activities 
Yunfei ZHANG       IETF PPSP Chair, CMCC
CMCC has seen lots of proprietary P2P streaming systems, and the problem is that these systems are optimized for existing network infrastructure – there’s no attempt to do system-wide optimization. Can’t reuse infrastructure for other applications.
Tudou with PPLive is using P2P accelerators with HTTP streaming.
DPI equipment must be updated continuously because P2P streaming applications change so often – there’s no stable way to recognize this traffic.
CMCC believes that the rapid growth in mobile Internet usage signals an opportunity to migrate to standardized PPSP before deployment of proprietary P2P streaming services is complete.
Want running code for PPSP within two years, implementing a uniform application-layer P2P streaming signaling protocol for a variety of applications, media types, and P2P network node types.
PPSP is tracker-based, and includes two protocols – a tracker protocol with peer/content registration and peer request/response, and a peer protocol that supports chunk exchange signaling.
Want to use P2PSIP/RELOAD for tracker protocol. May use ALTO to choose better peers (but ALTO tracker-to-server operation isn’t chartered yet). May use LEDBAT for transmission. 
DECADE may be complementary to PPSP, but won’t be part of PPSP itself.
The P2P Research Group may also be used to research open questions.
Expect to use PPSP for 3GPP P2P CDS, ITU-T DSN, and TISPAN P2P CDN.
1.15          P2P Streaming: key issues and industrial deployments     
Zhijia Chen     Techniques and Standards Director of Force Innovations Technology Inc.
Lots of new algorithms – content-driven peer selection algorithm, piece-on-demand, rapid live chunk delivery algorithm …
This is the P2P content distribution system that China Mobile is using in their testing.
1.16          IMS-based Peer-to-Peer Content Distribution Services in   3GPP SA1
Gang LI          3GPP SA1 CDS Chair, CMCC
CMCC has large-scale IMS deployment which has been focused on telecommunications services, but they want to do content-based services.
Want to use P2P to optimize the media plane for multimedia distribution services, relieving bandwidth and content server workload.
SA1 completed its study in May 2010 and sent a liaison inviting SA2 to work on IMS-based peer-to-peer content distribution services.
Adding User Peer, Network Peer, and Tracker Server to IMS architecture.
Use cases are Content on Demand, Live Streaming, and File Distribution.
Hmmm. They are concerned about battery life when viewing movies, but want to use P2P to have the UAs use more battery power when streaming to other UAs…
Open questions – how to guarantee QoS of P2P live streaming (which may be subject to “flash crowds”? How to deploy appropriate network peers in macro mobile, home mobile and fixed broadband networks?
1.17          Network Assisted Mobile Peer to Peer Content Distribution     
Dr.  Jim WU  Motorola UK
SA1 WID on P2P is still ”TBD”.
Two technical specifications in SA4 – TS 26.237 and 26.114. 
Progressive download is supported by most media players and platforms, and popular video-sharing websites.
Selecting “appropriate radio access technology” for wireless peers (trusted users sharing the same wifi hotspot, for example).
Operators don’t want to be “dumb pipes”.
Preferring network-tracker-assisted peer selection.
Further research on wide area radio resource usage reduction is required.
1.18          3GPP SA2 considerations on P2P Streaming      
Qing YU  Project Manager, CMRI
Principles – keep the separation between control and media plane, reuse SIP URI/E.164 as identities, reuse Gm interface, optimize media plane using P2P streaming between UEs.
Want to do “loose control” – where not all signaling messages to/from tracker traverse IMS Core. This lessens the load on the IMS Core.
China Mobile has developed a “loose control” demo system and will now push forward a technical trial during the next two years.
China Mobile is now planning to request new work in SA2 that will lead to more work in SA3 and SA5.
1.19          Pandora’s Box - P2P Security and Considerations in 3GPP SA3
Judy Zhu China Mobile
P2P has the same security threats as any other Internet Protocol-based network.
Asserting that we can use the characteristics of the mobile Internet to improve security between the mobile Internet and the Internet at large – not sure I understand this.
Asserting that because P2P has better performance, it will also spread threats faster…
DSN security logic architecture – 8 considerations, but only one goes end-to-end?
SA3 prepares to propose a study of security together with SA1 and SA2.
1.20          IPTV, CDN and P2P: TISPAN Standardization and Future Outlook  
Zhipeng ZHOU       Huawei
Will Li (Li Jincheng) is actual presenter (Zhipeng’s flight from Shenzhen was cancelled).
TISPAN CDN (WI 2076) is now in Stage 2 (Architecture). Planned to complete in September 2010, with protocol work (Stage 3) initiated afterwards.
Functional architecture uses three layers.

zhangyunfei
2010-06-28