Subject: RE: FW: Fwd: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ppvpn-cl-tunneling-vpn-00.txt

From: "Chen, Weijing" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2002 13:35:46 -0600

The other problem with this draft is that it is unknown how the proposal
handles the Internet access from VPN and inter-VPN access.

Nonetheless, the scaleable and manageable operation issues of current VPN
brought by this draft are still a valid and major concern among service
providers.  Witness the draft
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-allen-lap-ipv6-00.txt, it raises
the same concern.  The solution proposed by the late draft may have some
same disadvantages layout by Eric's email, such as rely on IPv6 as core
network, encapsulation in IPv6, etc.  Although IPv6 was chosen for the
solution, it doesn't prevent the solution from expansion into IPv4.  But
from the ongoing industry and market trend, it seems too late to do anything
other than MPLS VPN in IPv4 space.  

Once again, we operation group in service provider has very serious concern
about scaleable manageability of MPLS/VPN.  We may have to swallow the pill
now. But we still hope that the manageability is not side stepped. 

Regards,

--
Weijing Chen

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From: Yakov Rekhter <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 02 Nov 2002 15:00:12 -0800

Weijing,

> about scaleable manageability of MPLS/VPN.  

Could you please elaborate on what exactly you are concerned with
respect to "scaleable manageability of MPLS/VPN".

Also, when you said "we operation group in service provider", do you
mean a specific service provider ?

Yakov.

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From: Muneyoshi Suzuki <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2002 15:50:56 +0900

Chen,

> about scaleable manageability 

draft-ietf-ppvpn-cl-tunneling-vpn-00.txt does not claim that the MPLS/BGP
approach is not scale, so it also does not claim it is much scale than
the MPLS/BGP. 2547 mainly discusses BGP-4 extensions for VPN routing,
membership discovery, and MPLS signaling for it, while, our draft discuss
IP-in-IPv6 tunnel control mechanism. 

Scalability of 2547 is already discussed in draft-ietf-ppvpn-as2547-00.txt.
If you have scalability or manageability issues about 2547 approach,
please specifically point out it on the PPVPN WG mailing list or to the AS 
documents design team.

Thanks,

Muneyoshi Suzuki