Subject: RE: [seamoby] SeaMoby MicroMobility Work

From: [email-masked]
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2001 13:23:41 +0300

Hi Andrew,

> I have been contributing for the last few years and 
> I intend to keep contributing.

That I am aware of.  No disrespect intended.

Right now, I'm a little tired of long tirades about how 
things are unfair, or certain models are moral insults to
the integrity of the Internet.  In my mind, 
the only way forward is to propose something better.  

> But we should question the decision making when
> we believe that it counter productive to wireless
> IP rollout. Or no?

I'd suggest that it is neither here nor there.  IETF is not
a business forum.  The wireless IP rollout will be made
on a business case decision.  If there is money to be made, 
I'm fairly certain someone will do it.  Also, if there is a 
better solution in the market place, customers will vote with 
there feet.

> You see I firmly believe that if IETF standardized an 
> IP micro-mobility protocol today then wireless
> IP access would roll out far quicker than
> we have seen with MIP. And that protocol would
> be the basis for 4G.

I'm not so sure I'd agree with you about that.  Given the 
current investment in 2.5G / 3G & the current stock situation, 
I don't think anyone is going to be freely spending money on 
such things.
 
> Pushing micro-mobility into the IRTF was the 
> wrong decision in my mind it should have been
> accelerated in the Seamoby WG - just my opinion.

I'm not so sure the change of venues will affect too 
much, as long as those who are interested participate.
 
> I think you are aware what is going on out there
> in the industry; the 3G shakedown.

To be honest, I have yet to really see this mythical beast.
2.5G networks are just being deployed, handsets are 
generally few and far between.  The DSL market is in
termoil; the dot-com revolution is bankrupt.  

However, at least here in Finland, people do seem to be using
their cell phones alot, and just just for voice.  Mobile commerce
is picking up, as services become available.

Wireless voice over IP solutions will have to provide some 
additional incentives before they can compete with cellular.
Right now, local calls are cheaper when called from a mobile
phone, for example.  

I can even stream audio over HSCD (43.2k) reasonable well.
IMode isn't really the Internet, but it seems to have a lot
of subscibers ... Heck, I even use Google with WAP (hopefully
that won't discredit me) ...

Anyhow, if you have made it this far, I'd just want to re-iterate
my main point - let's cut out the doom-n-gloom & the marketing
hype and get down to actual engineering?

I sent the original mail of this thread, because I wanted to
gauge support for the MM work items ... so far, noone has
addressed that.  I'd still like comments on the MM Problem
Statement.  In my opinion, that should still go forward,
if just to document the problem ...

best regards,
John

---

From: Jim Bound <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2001 07:00:48 -0400 (EDT)

John,

I agree with you again.  Also on the East Coast of the U.S. or the
Northeast to be specific the cell phones are alive and well.  I am seeing
more Blackberry's and IPAQs these days for email though than I had a few
years ago.  I hope anyway that AT&T adopting GSM will be a wakeup call to
our providers over here though.

/jim