Subject: draft Minutes from 50th IETF

From: Donald Eastlake 3rd <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2001 15:23:27 -0500

Hi,

Below are the draft minutes.  Thanks to Walt Houser.

Donald
==================================================================
 Donald Eastlake 3rd  +1 508-634-2066(h)  [email-masked]
 155 Beaver Street    +1 508-261-5434(w)  [email-masked]
 Milford, MA 01757 USA

Internet Open Trading Protocol Working Group (WG) - TRADE
Minutes of meeting in Minneapolis at the 50th IETF Meeting

WEDNESDAY, March 21 at 1300-1500
================================

CHAIR:	Donald E. Eastlake 3rd <[email-masked]> 
REPORTER:  Walter Houser <[email-masked]>
edits: Donald E. Eastlake 3rd.

Agenda Bashing - no change.

Documents Status - Don presented his report, which appear in the
slides that will be submitted to the proceedings.  Three documents
have in working group last call for some time:
draft-ietf-trade-iotp-v1.0-papi-03.txt,
draft-ietf-trade-iotp-v1.0-set-02.txt, and
draft-ietf-trade-drt-requirements-02.txt.  Due to comments during WG
last call, the title Digital Rights has been changed to Voucher in the
drt-requirements draft.  Minor edits for readability have been made in
the papi-03 draft producing papi-04 which is available from
<ftp://ftp.pothole.com/pub/ietf-trade/> and will shortly be posted in
the IETF Internet-Draft directories.  The consensus among those at the
WG meeting was to submit these for publication as Informational RFCs.

Don listed the existing drafts currently under consideration:
draft-ietf-trade-voucher-lang-00.txt,
draft-ietf-trade-ecml2-req-00.txt, draft-ietf-trade-ecml2-spec-00.txt,
draft-ietf-trade-iotp2-req-00.txt.  The ECML Version 2 requirements
document is fairly close to final but the others need work.

Two WG documents are called for that do not yet exist:

1) Secure Channel Credit Debit, a payment method of equivalent
security to HTML forms.  Don suggested this might be accomplished by
light encapsulation of ECML.  There were no objections at the meeting
to this approach.

2) IOTP v2 specification, scheduled for April, no author yet which
makes meeting that milestone pretty unlikely...

Tony Lewis requested that updated milestone dates be posted in the
WG's IETF web page.  Don will look into the Charter change that would
require.

IOTP/ECML Implementation Experience - Don reported that these include
the V1 IOTP Japanese SMILE project.  There is a partial list of
merchant sites at http://www.ecml.org/, but the list needs to be
updated. It notes the IBM wallet and the Microsoft wallet.

ECML V2 Requirements - Is this ready for last call?  Don plans a last
call in a month. V1 was HTML form oriented, whereas v2 is to be XML
oriented.  Comments solicited.

ECML V2 Specification - ISO 8583 fields being added.  Dave Shepherd of
IBM (mailto:[email-masked]) suggested incorporating changes for
Java Commerce messages (JCM). JCM uses lineItems, which do not appear
in ECML v2. We currently don't have a namespace for ECML. V1 has a DTD
but no schema or namespace. Parsons has added fields for v2.
	What syntax do we use to ask for missing data? When asking for
data, how do we indicate whether the request is Optional or mandatory?

XML Voucher: Generic Voucher Language - Ko Fujimura of NTT
(mailto:[email-masked]) presented background on voucher and
current status. Voucher component is not an instance but a definition
of voucher. VC defines the rights (or value) per one unit of the
voucher instance. Ko outlined the processing model (see slides). Ko
plans to publish an API. He is proposing a new trust model based on
the voucher components (see slides). The monetary value properties are
needed to calculating the redemption. His studies suggest that 90
percent of vouchers can be provided using three or four properties:

1. Minimum number of vouchers needed for redemption
2. Merchandise limitation
3. Merchandise value can be specified in as fixed or percentage of
discount. 

An xml:ns is specified. Proposed actions for April include
Internet-Draft on XML voucher and submit Internet-Draft on VTS
(Voucher Trading System) API.  Although much discussion on voucher, no
major issues so far. Ko asked how should we proceed with specifying
the VTS API?

Don noted that our past experience in specifying an API in XML was not
satisfactory. But a Java or C binding is reasonable. As the author
provides the dates, he saw no problem. There were no other comments.

IOTP V2 Requirements - Version 2 is to be a superset of v1 (but not
necessarily backward compatible), dynamic definition of trading
sequences, offer request block, improved problem resolution, handle
payment protocols not tunneled through IOTP, say via TCP.  Optional
items include support for wallet servers, repeated or ongoing in
payment, enhance server to server (timing of submissions to the
payment handler), and the ability to add both fields and attributes to
trading blocks. Not to be included are legal and regulatory issues,
the XML messaging layer, and XML digital signature.  Perhaps a profile
on these standards use with IOTP V2 may in order.

Walt Houser asked which XML messaging layer would be used? Don replied
that was to be decided but he thought ebXML was a bit ahead.  Walt
noted that ebXML uses SOAP rather than BEEP. SOAP is an industry
consortia protocol that competes with the IETF BEEP standard.

Tony Lewis asked if there is anything in the way of the digital
signature becoming a standard?  Don replied that the work of the joint
IETF/W3C XML Digital Signature Work Group is currently a Proposed
Standard in the IETF and a Candidate Recommendation in the W3C.  The
W3C plans to make it a full RECommendation abut the time the IETF
should be advancing it to Draft Standard.  It is unclear when the IETF
will further advance it to Full Internet Standard because this
requires widespread deployment.

Ko asked how would one approach dynamic definition of trading
sequences. Don replied describing one method, which has been partially
specified by Dave Burdett, where the merchant proposes the structure
of the trade along with the prices and currencies, etc.

Schedule of Future Actions/Meetings -

1) Authors are needed for SCCD and IOTP v2 specification

2) The WG will meet in London in early August and until then continue
work on the mailing list.

The WG meeting adjourned at 14:22