Subject: [Ace] new use case... only half :-)

From: Michael Richardson <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 24 Apr 2015 09:10:20 -0400

Now, is this constrained? Probably not very.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/23/business/international/audi-to-test-plan-to-deliver-amazon-packages-to-drivers-trunks.html?FRANKFURT

>Almost since the invention of the automobile, people have been using
>cars for more than just getting from place to place. The car is also a place
>to eat, to sleep and soon, it appears, to receive packages.

>Audi, the German carmaker, said Wednesday that it would begin testing a
>system in Munich next month that would allow people to order goods from
>Amazon and have them delivered by DHL, the German package delivery service,
>to the trunk of their parked car.

>The idea is not completely new. Volvo Cars said more than a year ago that it
>was testing a similar system. A Volvo spokesman said Wednesday that the
>company has finished its testing and expected to announce soon that it would
>be offering the service to consumers in Sweden, where Volvo has its highest
>market share. Newer Volvo cars are already equipped with technology that
>would enable package delivery to vehicles, the spokesman said.

--
Michael Richardson <[email-masked]>, Sandelman Software Works
 -= IPv6 IoT consulting =-

---

From: Derek Atkins <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 24 Apr 2015 12:27:03 -0400

Hi,

> Now, is this constrained? Probably not very.

By some definitions yes, by other definitions no.
It's a powered device, so the power budget is generally unlimited.
Similarly, the heat budget is practically unlimited.

However there are size, weight, and cost constraints, which means that
they will still probably use "low end" devices.  I doubt they'll have an
i7 or even a Xeon in there.  More likely they'll use a low-end ARM
(Cortex-M) or possibly even an MSP430 or 8051!

-derek

> _______________________________________________
> Ace mailing list
> [email-masked]
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ace

-- 
       Derek Atkins                 617-623-3745
       [email-masked]             www.ihtfp.com
       Computer and Internet Security Consultant

---

From: Michael Richardson <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 24 Apr 2015 14:22:43 -0400

> By some definitions yes, by other definitions no.  It's a powered
    > device, so the power budget is generally unlimited.  Similarly, the
    > heat budget is practically unlimited.

    > they will still probably use "low end" devices.  I doubt they'll have
    > an i7 or even a Xeon in there.  More likely they'll use a low-end ARM

The handheld that the DHL person has is likely at least as powerful as two
generation smartphone (i.e. HTC G2/iPhone 4). That's an aweful lot. With 3G
connectivity at multiple megabits.

The vehicles have at least equivalent devices in the dashboard, which is
where the trunk control would be, and also have 3G/LTE connectivity.

I see no technical reason why one can't go the entire OAUTH2 route for this
kind of thing.  But, as you say, I could be wrong.

The trunk lock mechanism might be an 8051, true, but I think it will talk to
another component in the vehicle, not directly to the DHL handheld.

    >>> cars for more than just getting from place to place. The car is also
    >>> a place to eat, to sleep and soon, it appears, to receive packages.
    >>
    >>> Audi, the German carmaker, said Wednesday that it would begin testing
    >>> a system in Munich next month that would allow people to order goods
    >>> from Amazon and have them delivered by DHL, the German package
    >>> delivery service, to the trunk of their parked car.
    >>
    >>> The idea is not completely new. Volvo Cars said more than a year ago
    >>> that it was testing a similar system. A Volvo spokesman said
    >>> Wednesday that the company has finished its testing and expected to
    >>> announce soon that it would be offering the service to consumers in
    >>> Sweden, where Volvo has its highest market share. Newer Volvo cars
    >>> are already equipped with technology that would enable package
    >>> delivery to vehicles, the spokesman said.
    >>
    >>
    >> --
    >> _______________________________________________ Ace mailing list
    >> [email-masked] https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ace

    > --
    >        Derek Atkins 617-623-3745 [email-masked] www.ihtfp.com Computer
    > and Internet Security Consultant

    > _______________________________________________ Ace mailing list
    > [email-masked] https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ace

---

From: "Kim, William G" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 24 Apr 2015 19:54:12 +0000

Very interesting. I think this is somewhat more streamlined use case since
the constrained trunk lock/sensor is completely integrated into the car
itself -- the constrained trunk device fully trusts the unconstrained
dashboard system already. It could be a good example of how a constrained
device relies on a unconstrained authorization server with a built-in
trust relationship. But then I would agree with you that this devolves
into straightforward traditional OAuth 2.0 between the unconstrained
devices, and perhaps not much would be novel for ACE for this specific use
case?

-William

On 4/24/15, 2:22 PM, "Michael Richardson" <[email-masked]> wrote:

>http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/23/business/international/audi-to-test-plan
>-to-deliver-amazon-packages-to-drivers-trunks.html?FRANKFURT
>    >>

---

From: Samuel Erdtman <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 25 Apr 2015 14:10:52 +0200

Hi ,

It might not be a super constraint use case but it is very similar to
"Remotely letting in a visitor" (
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ace-usecases-03#section-2.2.3). It
might even be slightly more constraint since the car might be offline (no
cellular network connection) when a request comes to open the trunk for a
package.

Best Regards
//Samuel

---

From: Michael Richardson <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 25 Apr 2015 19:03:47 -0400

Kim, William G <[email-masked]> wrote:
    > Very interesting. I think this is somewhat more streamlined use case
    > since the constrained trunk lock/sensor is completely integrated into
    > the car itself -- the constrained trunk device fully trusts the
    > unconstrained dashboard system already. It could be a good example of
    > how a constrained device relies on a unconstrained authorization server
    > with a built-in trust relationship. But then I would agree with you
    > that this devolves into straightforward traditional OAuth 2.0 between
    > the unconstrained devices, and perhaps not much would be novel for ACE
    > for this specific use case?

This is a good point: in the context where the trunk opening device
communicates *directly* with the DHL handheld, and the unconstrained
dashboard system is powered off, then ACE would apply.

--
]               Never tell me the odds!                 | ipv6 mesh networks [
]   Michael Richardson, Sandelman Software Works        | network architect  [
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