Subject: Re: [Asrg] SMTP AUTH

From: [email-masked]
Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 05:12:38 +0000 (GMT)

>> Let me see, you have an IP conection, presumably connected to the
> Internet. You should be able to access the submission port to send your
> mail via your mail server. You just might not be able to use port 25/tcp
> there.

> Actually, there are some cases where submission port (587) also cannot
be used. For example, my personal experience in McDonalds Free WiFi in
Singapore. I tried using my SMTP AUTH server, but they 'hijack' all
SMTP related traffic and send it through their own gateway.

And, of course, if you're using a public access Internet terminal (at a library, 
airport waiting lounge, most cruise ships, etc), then you might have NO choice 
whatsoever regarding what SMTP server they've chosen to route their outgoing 
mail through, let alone what port you might wish you could use. 

Gordon Peterson                  http://personal.terabites.com/
1977-2002  Twenty-fifth anniversary year of Local Area Networking!
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From: John Levine <[email-masked]>
Date: 6 Dec 2004 06:37:33 -0000

>SMTP related traffic and send it through their own gateway.

Were you trying port 25 or port 587?  I've occasionally heard of 587
being blocked, but I've never heard of it being spoofed.

>And, of course, if you're using a public access Internet terminal (at
>a library, airport waiting lounge, most cruise ships, etc), then you
>might have NO choice whatsoever regarding what SMTP server they've
>chosen to route their outgoing mail through,

I dunno about you, but when I'm using someone else's computer, I use
my web mail.  I've seen public internet terminals in airports that
claim that they'll download your POP mail if you put in your password,
but I don't think I've ever seen anyone do that.  It strikes me as a
rare scenario, getting rarer.

-- 
John R. Levine, IECC, POB 727, Trumansburg NY 14886 +1 607 330 5711
[email-masked], Mayor, http://johnlevine.com, 
Member, Provisional board, Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial E-mail

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From: William Leibzon <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 5 Dec 2004 23:18:56 -0800 (PST)

> rare scenario, getting rarer.

Well the solution for remote access to email is IMAP and it would be
good if email could be submitted as part of IMAP system, but that is
actually not quite so easy technically because you want to submit
email and include/reference part of existing message but dont want
to download that message to remote terminal, so complex system or
referencing part of the message has to be devised - this is something
that LEMONADE is working on.

But it seems to me many people do not trust those airport terminals with 
their passwords. But perhaps solution (for 5-10 years from now) could 
involve cryptography and smart cards - this would require standard for 
such email authentication with in a way that intermediate system 
(i.e. airport terminal) would never actually know the password or
retain access to account beyond user session.

---
William Leibzon
   mailto: [email-masked]
Anti-Spam and Email Security Research Worksite:
   http://www.elan.net/~william/emailsecurity/
Whois & DNS Network Investigation Tools:
   http://www.completewhois.com

---

From: M Z R <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 16:25:26 +0800

> >> Actually, there are some cases where submission port (587) also cannot
[snip]
> being blocked, but I've never heard of it being spoofed.

I was using port 587, as I always do. :) The first Received: header
was awfully ugly:

Received: from support.isp.com (mcdonalds.isp.com [xxx.xxx.xx.x] (may
be forged))
	by receiverbordermta (XXX xxxx)
	with SMTP id ADX01445;
	Fri, 8 Oct 2004 19:36:23 +0800 (SGT)