Subject: suggestion: mention about xml:id

From: Domel <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 02 May 2005 15:33:02 +0200

I think that you should mention about xml:id attribute (just like you 
did with xml:base attribute).
xml:id is very useful attribute. It can be used in XPath, XPointer, CSS, 
DOM (maybe in JS) etc.

http://www.w3.org/TR/xml-id/ (now in CR)

Dominik Tomaszuk

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From: Anne van Kesteren <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 02 May 2005 15:41:04 +0200

> http://www.w3.org/TR/xml-id/ (now in CR)

What is the use case?

-- 
  Anne van Kesteren
  <http://annevankesteren.nl/>

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From: Anne van Kesteren <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 02 May 2005 16:02:56 +0200

Domel wrote:
> Many case. Two examples:
> 1. Selectros in CSS. Now selectors can only be element like * , E, E F, 
> E > F and pseudo-class/pseudo-elements like: E:first-child. But we can't 
> matche any E element ID. Atom 0.8 support xml:lang so support also 
> E:lang(c) but there aren't any id attributes  to CSS 's E#myid

Perhaps I should have been more specific. What is the use case of 
styling Atom?

> 2. XPointers - point some parto of document in URI/IRI for example: 
> http://example.org/atom.xml#myid

Also, what is the use case for this. What should it actually when given 
to a feed reader.

Note also that you can safely add the xml:id attribute to any element 
without causing any harm. It might be that the feed validator dislikes 
it, but that should't be a problem.

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From: "Nikolas 'Atrus' Coukouma" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 02 May 2005 10:36:38 -0400

Anne van Kesteren wrote:

>
> Domel wrote:
>
>> Many case. Two examples:
>> 1. Selectros in CSS. Now selectors can only be element like * , E, E
>> F, E > F and pseudo-class/pseudo-elements like: E:first-child. But we
>> can't matche any E element ID. Atom 0.8 support xml:lang so support
>> also E:lang(c) but there aren't any id attributes  to CSS 's E#myid
>
>
> Also, what is the use case for this. What should it actually when
> given to a feed reader.
>

I concur. XML has many useful features. The Atom spec should only cover
ones that are:
1) likely to be useful in a significant portion of cases (the use cases)
2) require clarification in the context of Atom

If you look at section 2, where xml:lang and xml:base are mentioned, you
can see that they require some clarification (base MUSt be used to
resolve relative URLs, lang has some context and inheritence issues).

-Nikolas 'Atrus' Coukouma

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From: Domel <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 02 May 2005 16:43:15 +0200

> Perhaps I should have been more specific. What is the use case of 

Some people styling feeds. OK, I don't think everybody must styling Atom
but when somebody want why not?

> Also, what is the use case for this. What should it actually when 

I don't agree. XPointers give a lot of advantages to feed reader
(framework to navigation and other "going" to some part, it allow
display field which will be define). It has also advantages to linking
to Atom.

OK, another example:
3. DOM tree - getElementByID

Atom is a XML application and majority of XML application define id
attribute. XML also refer to ID attribute. xml:id is like predefined
atributtes should support it. http://www.w3.org/2001/xml.xsd

Dominik Tomaszuk

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From: Anne van Kesteren <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 02 May 2005 16:40:37 +0200

> but when somebody want why not?

Yeah why not? That does not have anything to do with Atom mentioning the 
xml:id attribute though. Authors can include it themselves if desired. 
xml:base and xml:lang solve specific Atom problems, xml:id doesn't do 
that. (Atom uses something else to uniquely identify each entry. It also 
couldn't reuse xml:id for this  by the way.)

>> Also, what is the use case for this. What should it actually when 

I meant: "What should it actually [do] when given to a feed reader".

> I don't agree.

I'm not sure how you can't agree when I didn't even make a statement.

> XPointers give a lot of advantages to feed reader 

So are you saying XPointer should be part of the Atom specification as 
well..?

> 3. DOM tree - getElementByID

Again, what is the use case for Atom?

> attribute.

Because they need an ID attribute, Atom doesn't.

> XML also refer to ID attribute. xml:id is like predefined 

That does not mean Atom has to include a reference to it in the 
specification and depend on xml:id to become a rec.

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From: Domel <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 02 May 2005 16:42:59 +0200

Many case. Two examples:

Dominik Tomaszuk

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From: Domel <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 02 May 2005 17:04:46 +0200

Anne van Kesteren wrote:

>
> Yeah why not? That does not have anything to do with Atom mentioning 
> the xml:id attribute though. Authors can include it themselves if 
> desired. xml:base and xml:lang solve specific Atom problems, xml:id 
> doesn't do that. (Atom uses something else to uniquely identify each 
> entry. It also couldn't reuse xml:id for this  by the way.)

I don't see difference between xml:lang and xml:id in this context, 
xml:lang MAY be used in Atom and in my proposition xml:id MAY be used.

> So are you saying XPointer should be part of the Atom specification as 

No, I say that xml:id should be part of Atom specyfication and when it 
will be then we can use XPointers in Atom (and other extensions) 
(analogy: Atom not need namespaces, XML rec don't defined xmlns 
attribute, but Atom has xmlns attribute, because it provide many features)

> Again, what is the use case for Atom?

Grand of features to webdeveloper.

Dominik Tomaszuk

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From: Domel <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 02 May 2005 17:19:42 +0200

Dominik Tomaszuk