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From: "Xiejingrong (Jingrong)" <xiejingrong@huawei.com>
To: "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Technical Errata Reported] RFC6625 (5605)
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Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2020 04:01:04 +0000
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Subject: [bess] FW: [Technical Errata Reported] RFC6625 (5605)
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From: "Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang" <zzhang@juniper.net>
To: Wen Lin <wlin=40juniper.net@dmarc.ietf.org>, "slitkows.ietf@gmail.com" <slitkows.ietf@gmail.com>, 'BESS' <bess@ietf.org>
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Thread-Topic: [bess] WGLC, IPR and implementation poll for draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast-04
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/BgPCFr7NQjTqAFN1ZIiytKBVCLo>
Subject: Re: [bess] WGLC, IPR and implementation poll for draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast-04
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From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
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Thread-Topic: [bess] IETF 107 presentation  - please send request
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Subject: Re: [bess] IETF 107 presentation  - please send request
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From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2020 18:25:53 -0500
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Subject: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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--000000000000d9049e059fe782a0
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Dear BESS WG

Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in the Data Center arena to
extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor making the Hypervisor
part of the  vxlan fabric.  This could eliminate use of MLAG on the leaf
switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereby
maximizing  stability.

Kind regards,

Gyan
-- 

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

--000000000000d9049e059fe782a0
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
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<div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Dear BESS WG</div><div dir=3D=
"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP developm=
ent in the Data Center arena to extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hyp=
ervisor making the Hypervisor part of the =C2=A0vxlan fabric.=C2=A0 This co=
uld eliminate use of MLAG on the leaf switches and eliminate L2 completely =
from the vxlan fabric thereby maximizing =C2=A0stability.</div><div dir=3D"=
auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind regards,</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br>=
</div><div dir=3D"auto">Gyan</div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_si=
gnature" data-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr=
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From: Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2020 00:39:50 +0100
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To: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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Hi Gyan,

Similar architecture has been invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now
that project after they got acquired by Juniper has been renamed to
Tungsten Fabric https://tungsten.io/ while Juniper continued to keep the
original project's name and commercial flavor of it. No guarantees of any
product quality at this point.

Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor BGP to the host. The proposed above
alternative were well thought out and turned to work ways far more
efficient and practical if you zoom into details.

Best,
Robert.


On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> Dear BESS WG
>
> Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in the Data Center arena to
> extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor making the Hypervisor
> part of the  vxlan fabric.  This could eliminate use of MLAG on the leaf
> switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereby
> maximizing  stability.
>
> Kind regards,
>
> Gyan
> --
>
> Gyan  Mishra
>
> Network Engineering & Technology
>
> Verizon
>
> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>
> Phone: 301 502-1347
>
> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr">Hi Gyan,<div><br></div><div>Similar architecture has been =
invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now that project after they got acqu=
ired=C2=A0by Juniper has been renamed to Tungsten Fabric=C2=A0<a href=3D"ht=
tps://tungsten.io/">https://tungsten.io/</a>=C2=A0while Juniper continued t=
o keep the original project&#39;s name and commercial flavor of it. No guar=
antees of any product quality at this point.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div=
>Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor BGP to the host. The proposed above alternat=
ive were well thought out and turned to work ways far more efficient and pr=
actical if you zoom into details.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Best,</div=
><div>Robert.</div><div><br></div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div=
 dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan Mish=
ra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&g=
t; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0p=
x 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div d=
ir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Dear BESS WG</div><div dir=3D"auto"=
><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in=
 the Data Center arena to extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hyperviso=
r making the Hypervisor part of the =C2=A0vxlan fabric.=C2=A0 This could el=
iminate use of MLAG on the leaf switches and eliminate L2 completely from t=
he vxlan fabric thereby maximizing =C2=A0stability.</div><div dir=3D"auto">=
<br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind regards,</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div>=
<div dir=3D"auto">Gyan</div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><=
div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia=
, serif"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=
=3D"#000000">yan=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font=
 size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &=
amp; Technology=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" col=
or=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"=
MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silve=
r Spring, MD 20904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=
=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">E=
mail: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s=
.mishra@verizon.com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div=
><br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>
_______________________________________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><br>
</blockquote></div>

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From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2020 18:59:51 -0500
Message-ID: <CABNhwV3BbtNUOLCjsyU3icsJEWJJ4pXmi=hjPDxqwVF7MGWhJg@mail.gmail.com>
To: Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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Thanks Robert for the quick response

Just thinking out loud -  I can see there maybe some advantages of
elimination of L2 to the host but the one major disadvantage is that BGP
multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing so not as desirable
from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash.

Other big down side is most enterprises have the hypervisor managed by
server admins but if you run BGP now that ends up shifting to network.
More complicated.

Kind regards

Gyan

On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:39 PM Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net> wrote:

> Hi Gyan,
>
> Similar architecture has been invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now
> that project after they got acquired by Juniper has been renamed to
> Tungsten Fabric https://tungsten.io/ while Juniper continued to keep the
> original project's name and commercial flavor of it. No guarantees of any
> product quality at this point.
>
> Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor BGP to the host. The proposed above
> alternative were well thought out and turned to work ways far more
> efficient and practical if you zoom into details.
>
> Best,
> Robert.
>
>
> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> Dear BESS WG
>>
>> Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in the Data Center arena to
>> extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor making the Hypervisor
>> part of the  vxlan fabric.  This could eliminate use of MLAG on the leaf
>> switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereby
>> maximizing  stability.
>>
>> Kind regards,
>>
>> Gyan
>> --
>>
>> Gyan  Mishra
>>
>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>
>> Verizon
>>
>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>
>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>
>> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> BESS mailing list
>> BESS@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>>
> --

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

--000000000000432f2e059fe7fc44
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div><br></div><div><div dir=3D"auto">Thanks Robert for the quick=C2=A0resp=
onse</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Just thinking out l=
oud - =C2=A0I can see there maybe some advantages of elimination of L2 to t=
he host but the one major disadvantage is that BGP multipath provides flow =
based uneven load balancing so not as desirable from that standpoint compar=
e to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></di=
v><div dir=3D"auto">Other big down side is most enterprises have the hyperv=
isor managed by server admins but if you run BGP now that ends up shifting =
to network.=C2=A0 More complicated. =C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div=
><div dir=3D"auto">Kind=C2=A0regards</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div =
dir=3D"auto">Gyan</div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" clas=
s=3D"gmail_attr">On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:39 PM Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:robert@raszuk.net">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><bl=
ockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #=
ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr">Hi Gyan,<div><br></div><div>Si=
milar architecture has been invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now that=
 project after they got acquired=C2=A0by Juniper has been renamed to Tungst=
en Fabric=C2=A0<a href=3D"https://tungsten.io/" target=3D"_blank">https://t=
ungsten.io/</a>=C2=A0while Juniper continued to keep the original project&#=
39;s name and commercial flavor of it. No guarantees of any product quality=
 at this point.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN no=
r BGP to the host. The proposed above alternative were well thought out and=
 turned to work ways far more efficient and practical if you zoom into deta=
ils.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Best,</div><div>Robert.</div><div><br><=
/div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"></div><div class=3D"gmail_quote">=
<div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan =
Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">hayab=
usagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div></div><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><=
blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-l=
eft:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"></blockquote></div><div cl=
ass=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0=
px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div =
dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Dear BESS WG</div><div dir=3D"auto=
"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development i=
n the Data Center arena to extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervis=
or making the Hypervisor part of the =C2=A0vxlan fabric.=C2=A0 This could e=
liminate use of MLAG on the leaf switches and eliminate L2 completely from =
the vxlan fabric thereby maximizing =C2=A0stability.</div><div dir=3D"auto"=
><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind regards,</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div=
><div dir=3D"auto">Gyan</div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div>=
<div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div di=
r=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgi=
a, serif"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=
=3D"#000000">yan=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font=
 size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &=
amp; Technology=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" col=
or=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"=
MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silve=
r Spring, MD 20904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=
=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">E=
mail: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s=
.mishra@verizon.com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div=
><br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquo=
te></div><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=
=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding=
-left:1ex">
_______________________________________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><br>
</blockquote></div>
</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature" =
data-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><=
div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font si=
ze=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=
=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" colo=
r=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=
=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" =
face=3D"georgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><fon=
t size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20=
904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" fac=
e=3D"georgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><=
font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D=
"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.=
com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div=
></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>

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From: Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2020 01:07:53 +0100
Message-ID: <CAOj+MMENs6=14hbAQ6tgoLbfPFjQfn9Af840Nux+6k973ivD8w@mail.gmail.com>
To: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Cc: BESS <bess@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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--000000000000daaf61059fe818c5
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"

Hi Gyan,

You are touching subject close to me so let me share my perspective on your
doubts below ;)

>  maybe some advantages of elimination of L2 to the host

Not some but huge !

>  BGP multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing

First Contrail/Tungsten does not use BGP to the hypervisor but XMPP. But
this is opaque to your concern.

Load balancing and hashing construction is your choice, BGP or XMPP only
deliver you next hops .. how you spread traffic to them is 100% up to your
choice. That is the same on hypervisor or on any decent router. LAGs also
build hash in the way you configure them to do so.

>  hypervisor managed by server admins

In any decent network or for that matter even in my lab this is all 100%
automated. You run one template and execute it. Ansible works pretty well,
but there are other choices too.

Many thx,
R.


On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 1:00 AM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> Thanks Robert for the quick response
>
> Just thinking out loud -  I can see there maybe some advantages of
> elimination of L2 to the host but the one major disadvantage is that BGP
> multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing so not as desirable
> from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash.
>
> Other big down side is most enterprises have the hypervisor managed by
> server admins but if you run BGP now that ends up shifting to network.
> More complicated.
>
> Kind regards
>
> Gyan
>
> On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:39 PM Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net> wrote:
>
>> Hi Gyan,
>>
>> Similar architecture has been invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now
>> that project after they got acquired by Juniper has been renamed to
>> Tungsten Fabric https://tungsten.io/ while Juniper continued to keep the
>> original project's name and commercial flavor of it. No guarantees of any
>> product quality at this point.
>>
>> Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor BGP to the host. The proposed above
>> alternative were well thought out and turned to work ways far more
>> efficient and practical if you zoom into details.
>>
>> Best,
>> Robert.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Dear BESS WG
>>>
>>> Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in the Data Center arena to
>>> extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor making the Hypervisor
>>> part of the  vxlan fabric.  This could eliminate use of MLAG on the leaf
>>> switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereby
>>> maximizing  stability.
>>>
>>> Kind regards,
>>>
>>> Gyan
>>> --
>>>
>>> Gyan  Mishra
>>>
>>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>>
>>> Verizon
>>>
>>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>>
>>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>>
>>> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> BESS mailing list
>>> BESS@ietf.org
>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>>>
>> --
>
> Gyan  Mishra
>
> Network Engineering & Technology
>
> Verizon
>
> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>
> Phone: 301 502-1347
>
> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>
>
>
>

--000000000000daaf61059fe818c5
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr">Hi Gyan,<div><br></div><div>You are touch=
ing subject close to me so let me share my perspective on your doubts below=
 ;)=C2=A0</div></div><div><br></div><div>&gt;=C2=A0

maybe some advantages of elimination of L2 to the host

</div><div><br></div><div>Not some but huge !=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><di=
v>&gt;=C2=A0 BGP multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing=C2=A0=
=C2=A0<br></div><div><br></div><div>First Contrail/Tungsten does not use BG=
P to the hypervisor=C2=A0but XMPP. But this is opaque to your concern.=C2=
=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Load balancing and hashing construction is you=
r choice, BGP or XMPP only deliver you next hops .. how you spread traffic =
to them is 100% up to your choice. That is the same on hypervisor or on any=
 decent router. LAGs also build hash in the way you configure them to do so=
.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>&gt;=C2=A0 hypervisor managed by server ad=
mins=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>In any decent network=C2=A0or for that=
=C2=A0matter even in my lab this=C2=A0is all 100% automated. You run one te=
mplate and execute it. Ansible works pretty well, but there=C2=A0are other =
choices too.</div><div><br></div><div>Many thx,<br>R.</div><div>=C2=A0<br><=
/div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">O=
n Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 1:00 AM Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm=
@gmail.com">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=
=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rg=
b(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div><br></div><div><div dir=3D"auto">Than=
ks Robert for the quick=C2=A0response</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div=
 dir=3D"auto">Just thinking out loud - =C2=A0I can see there maybe some adv=
antages of elimination of L2 to the host but the one major disadvantage is =
that BGP multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing so not as desi=
rable from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash=
.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Other big down side is=
 most enterprises have the hypervisor managed by server admins but if you r=
un BGP now that ends up shifting to network.=C2=A0 More complicated. =C2=A0=
</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind=C2=A0regards</div>=
<div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Gyan</div><br><div class=3D"g=
mail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:=
39 PM Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:robert@raszuk.net" target=3D"_bla=
nk">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_qu=
ote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,20=
4);padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr">Hi Gyan,<div><br></div><div>Similar a=
rchitecture has been invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now that projec=
t after they got acquired=C2=A0by Juniper has been renamed to Tungsten Fabr=
ic=C2=A0<a href=3D"https://tungsten.io/" target=3D"_blank">https://tungsten=
.io/</a>=C2=A0while Juniper continued to keep the original project&#39;s na=
me and commercial flavor of it. No guarantees of any product quality at thi=
s point.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor BGP t=
o the host. The proposed above alternative were well thought out and turned=
 to work ways far more efficient and practical if you zoom into details.=C2=
=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Best,</div><div>Robert.</div><div><br></div></=
div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"></div><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div di=
r=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan Mishra =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@=
gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div></div><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockqu=
ote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px=
 solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"></blockquote></div><div class=3D"=
gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px =
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"=
auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Dear BESS WG</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br><=
/div><div dir=3D"auto">Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in the D=
ata Center arena to extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor maki=
ng the Hypervisor part of the =C2=A0vxlan fabric.=C2=A0 This could eliminat=
e use of MLAG on the leaf switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxl=
an fabric thereby maximizing =C2=A0stability.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></=
div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind regards,</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div d=
ir=3D"auto">Gyan</div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div di=
r=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"lt=
r"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, seri=
f"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#00=
0000">yan=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=
=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; =
Technology=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D=
"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNo=
rmal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spr=
ing, MD 20904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#0=
00000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"Ms=
oNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: =
<a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishr=
a@verizon.com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br><=
/div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote></d=
iv><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"ma=
rgin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:=
1ex">
_______________________________________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><br>
</blockquote></div>
</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div=
 dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D=
"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, s=
erif"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"=
#000000">yan=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font siz=
e=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp;=
 Technology=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=
=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"Ms=
oNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver =
Spring, MD 20904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D=
"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D=
"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Emai=
l: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mi=
shra@verizon.com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><b=
r></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>
</blockquote></div></div>

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From: Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
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To: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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Gyan,

On open source side of things - FRR supports EVPN on the host.
Any vendor virtualized NOS would provide you the same (at least Junos/cRPD o=
r  XRv).
EVPN ESI load-sharing eliminates need for MLAG (basic thought, the devil is i=
n the details :))
ECMP vs LAG load-balancing - the algorithms supported are quite similar, in s=
ome code bases actually the same, so this statement is not really correct.

Would be glad to better understand your requirements and help you!

Regards,
Jeff

> On Mar 2, 2020, at 16:00, Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:
>=20
> =EF=BB=BF
>=20
> Thanks Robert for the quick response
>=20
> Just thinking out loud -  I can see there maybe some advantages of elimina=
tion of L2 to the host but the one major disadvantage is that BGP multipath p=
rovides flow based uneven load balancing so not as desirable from that stand=
point compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash.
>=20
> Other big down side is most enterprises have the hypervisor managed by ser=
ver admins but if you run BGP now that ends up shifting to network.  More co=
mplicated. =20
>=20
> Kind regards
>=20
> Gyan
>=20
>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:39 PM Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net> wrote:
>> Hi Gyan,
>>=20
>> Similar architecture has been invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now t=
hat project after they got acquired by Juniper has been renamed to Tungsten =
Fabric https://tungsten.io/ while Juniper continued to keep the original pro=
ject's name and commercial flavor of it. No guarantees of any product qualit=
y at this point.=20
>>=20
>> Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor BGP to the host. The proposed above alterna=
tive were well thought out and turned to work ways far more efficient and pr=
actical if you zoom into details.=20
>>=20
>> Best,
>> Robert.
>>=20
>>=20
>>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrot=
e:
>>=20
>>>=20
>>> Dear BESS WG
>>>=20
>>> Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in the Data Center arena to e=
xtend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor making the Hypervisor part=
 of the  vxlan fabric.  This could eliminate use of MLAG on the leaf switche=
s and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereby maximizing  stab=
ility.
>>>=20
>>> Kind regards,
>>>=20
>>> Gyan
>>> --=20
>>> Gyan  Mishra
>>>=20
>>> Network Engineering & Technology=20
>>>=20
>>> Verizon=20
>>>=20
>>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>>=20
>>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>>=20
>>> Email: gyan.s..mishra@verizon.com
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>=20
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> BESS mailing list
>>> BESS@ietf.org
>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
> --=20
> Gyan  Mishra
>=20
> Network Engineering & Technology=20
>=20
> Verizon=20
>=20
> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>=20
> Phone: 301 502-1347
>=20
> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess

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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto">Gyan,<div><br></div><div>On open source sid=
e of things - FRR supports EVPN on the host.</div><div>Any vendor virtualize=
d NOS would provide you the same (at least Junos/cRPD or &nbsp;XRv).</div><d=
iv>EVPN ESI load-sharing eliminates need for MLAG (basic thought, the devil i=
s in the details :))</div><div>ECMP vs LAG load-balancing - the algorithms s=
upported are quite similar, in some code bases actually the same, so this st=
atement is not really correct.</div><div><br></div><div>Would be glad to bet=
ter understand your requirements and help you!<br><br><div dir=3D"ltr">Regar=
ds,<div>Jeff</div></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br><blockquote type=3D"cite">On Ma=
r 2, 2020, at 16:00, Gyan Mishra &lt;hayabusagsm@gmail.com&gt; wrote:<br><br=
></blockquote></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr">=EF=BB=BF<div=
><br></div><div><div dir=3D"auto">Thanks Robert for the quick&nbsp;response<=
/div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Just thinking out loud - &=
nbsp;I can see there maybe some advantages of elimination of L2 to the host b=
ut the one major disadvantage is that BGP multipath provides flow based unev=
en load balancing so not as desirable from that standpoint compare to L3 MLA=
G bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D=
"auto">Other big down side is most enterprises have the hypervisor managed b=
y server admins but if you run BGP now that ends up shifting to network.&nbs=
p; More complicated. &nbsp;</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"aut=
o">Kind&nbsp;regards</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Gyan=
</div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">O=
n Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:39 PM Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:robert@ras=
zuk.net">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmai=
l_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:=
1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr">Hi Gyan,<div><br></div><div>Similar architecture has b=
een invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now that project after they got a=
cquired&nbsp;by Juniper has been renamed to Tungsten Fabric&nbsp;<a href=3D"=
https://tungsten.io/" target=3D"_blank">https://tungsten.io/</a>&nbsp;while J=
uniper continued to keep the original project's name and commercial flavor o=
f it. No guarantees of any product quality at this point.&nbsp;</div><div><b=
r></div><div>Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor BGP to the host. The proposed abo=
ve alternative were well thought out and turned to work ways far more effici=
ent and practical if you zoom into details.&nbsp;</div><div><br></div><div>B=
est,</div><div>Robert.</div><div><br></div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quo=
te"></div><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">O=
n Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm=
@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div>=
</div><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"=
margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left=
:1ex"></blockquote></div><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gma=
il_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,20=
4,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Dear B=
ESS WG</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Is anyone aware of=
 any IETF BGP development in the Data Center arena to extend BGP VXLAN EVPN t=
o a blade server Hypervisor making the Hypervisor part of the &nbsp;vxlan fa=
bric.&nbsp; This could eliminate use of MLAG on the leaf switches and elimin=
ate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereby maximizing &nbsp;stability.<=
/div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind regards,</div><div d=
ir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Gyan</div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"><d=
iv dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div d=
ir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><fo=
nt face=3D"georgia, serif"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font s=
ize=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan&nbsp; Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"Ms=
oNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network E=
ngineering &amp; Technology&nbsp;</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font siz=
e=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Verizon&nbsp;</font></p><p=
 class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, ser=
if">Silver Spring, MD 20904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1=
" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p=
 class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, ser=
if">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gy=
an.s..mishra@verizon.com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div>=
<div><br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></block=
quote></div><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" sty=
le=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);paddin=
g-left:1ex">
_______________________________________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess" rel=3D"noreferrer" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><br>
</blockquote></div>
</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature" d=
ata-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><di=
v dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D=
"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font size=3D=
"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan&nbsp; M=
ishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000=
000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology&nbsp;</fon=
t></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"geor=
gia, serif">Verizon&nbsp;</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" c=
olor=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20904</font></p><=
p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, se=
rif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" c=
olor=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mis=
hra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></font></p><=
p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div></div></div></div><=
/div></div></div></div></div>
<span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span>BESS m=
ailing list</span><br><span>BESS@ietf.org</span><br><span>https://www.ietf.o=
rg/mailman/listinfo/bess</span><br></div></blockquote></div></body></html>=

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From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2020 20:40:29 -0500
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To: Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
Cc: BESS <bess@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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Appreciate you sharing thoughts.

On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 7:08 PM Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net> wrote:

> Hi Gyan,
>
> You are touching subject close to me so let me share my perspective on
> your doubts below ;)
>
> >  maybe some advantages of elimination of L2 to the host
>
> Not some but huge !
>

  Please name a few benefits of L3 comparing to L2 MLAG & no STP.  One
issue is host lacp misconfiguration which as a standard we suspend
individual links  to force server folks to fix lacp

>
> >  BGP multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing
>
> First Contrail/Tungsten does not use BGP to the hypervisor but XMPP. But
> this is opaque to your concern.
>

   Do you know of any vendor or project with a BGP based L3 to host
solution w/ or w/o extending vxlan fabric?

>
> Load balancing and hashing construction is your choice, BGP or XMPP only
> deliver you next hops .. how you spread traffic to them is 100% up to your
> choice. That is the same on hypervisor or on any decent router. LAGs also
> build hash in the way you configure them to do so.
>

    Understood.  ECMP L3 flow based load balancing has inherently always
had that downside with load balancing compare to per packet Ether bundling
hash are any layer of the network DC, Access, Core etc.

>
> >  hypervisor managed by server admins
>
> In any decent network or for that matter even in my lab this is all 100%
> automated. You run one template and execute it. Ansible works pretty well,
> but there are other choices too.
>
> Many thx,
> R.
>
>
   Good point as most networks these days have orchestration built into the
solution.   Agreed.

>
>
> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 1:00 AM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> Thanks Robert for the quick response
>>
>> Just thinking out loud -  I can see there maybe some advantages of
>> elimination of L2 to the host but the one major disadvantage is that BGP
>> multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing so not as desirable
>> from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash.
>>
>> Other big down side is most enterprises have the hypervisor managed by
>> server admins but if you run BGP now that ends up shifting to network.
>> More complicated.
>>
>> Kind regards
>>
>> Gyan
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:39 PM Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Gyan,
>>>
>>> Similar architecture has been invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now
>>> that project after they got acquired by Juniper has been renamed to
>>> Tungsten Fabric https://tungsten.io/ while Juniper continued to keep
>>> the original project's name and commercial flavor of it. No guarantees of
>>> any product quality at this point.
>>>
>>> Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor BGP to the host. The proposed above
>>> alternative were well thought out and turned to work ways far more
>>> efficient and practical if you zoom into details.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>> Robert.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Dear BESS WG
>>>>
>>>> Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in the Data Center arena to
>>>> extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor making the Hypervisor
>>>> part of the  vxlan fabric.  This could eliminate use of MLAG on the leaf
>>>> switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereby
>>>> maximizing  stability.
>>>>
>>>> Kind regards,
>>>>
>>>> Gyan
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Gyan  Mishra
>>>>
>>>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>>>
>>>> Verizon
>>>>
>>>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>>>
>>>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>>>
>>>> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> BESS mailing list
>>>> BESS@ietf.org
>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>>>>
>>> --
>>
>> Gyan  Mishra
>>
>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>
>> Verizon
>>
>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>
>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>
>> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>>
>>
>>
>> --

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

--00000000000033e741059fe9648a
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Appreciate you sharing thoughts.</div><div=
><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Mo=
n, Mar 2, 2020 at 7:08 PM Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:robert@raszuk=
.net">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_=
quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1=
ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr">Hi Gyan,<div><br></div><div>You are t=
ouching subject close to me so let me share my perspective on your doubts b=
elow ;)=C2=A0</div></div><div><br></div><div>&gt;=C2=A0

maybe some advantages of elimination of L2 to the host

</div><div><br></div><div>Not some but huge !=C2=A0</div></div></blockquote=
><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">=C2=A0 Please name a few ben=
efits of L3 comparing to L2 MLAG &amp; no STP.=C2=A0 One issue is host lacp=
 misconfiguration which as a standard we suspend individual links =C2=A0to =
force server folks to fix lacp</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=
=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div></div><div><br></div><div>&gt;=C2=A0 BGP multipath provides f=
low based uneven load balancing=C2=A0=C2=A0<br></div><div><br></div><div>Fi=
rst Contrail/Tungsten does not use BGP to the hypervisor=C2=A0but XMPP. But=
 this is opaque to your concern.=C2=A0</div></div></blockquote><div dir=3D"=
auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">=C2=A0 =C2=A0Do you know of any vendor or=
 project with a BGP based L3 to host solution w/ or w/o extending vxlan fab=
ric?</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;bord=
er-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div></div><div><=
br></div><div>Load balancing and hashing construction is your choice, BGP o=
r XMPP only deliver you next hops .. how you spread traffic to them is 100%=
 up to your choice. That is the same on hypervisor or on any decent router.=
 LAGs also build hash in the way you configure them to do so.=C2=A0</div><d=
iv></div></div></blockquote><div dir=3D"auto">=C2=A0 =C2=A0</div><div dir=
=3D"auto">=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Understood.=C2=A0 ECMP L3 flow based load balancing=
 has inherently always had that downside with load balancing compare to per=
 packet Ether bundling hash are any layer of the network DC, Access, Core e=
tc.</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;borde=
r-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><br></div><di=
v>&gt;=C2=A0 hypervisor managed by server admins=C2=A0</div><div><br></div>=
<div>In any decent network=C2=A0or for that=C2=A0matter even in my lab this=
=C2=A0is all 100% automated. You run one template and execute it. Ansible w=
orks pretty well, but there=C2=A0are other choices too.</div><div><br></div=
><div>Many thx,<br>R.</div></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div>=C2=A0</div></div></=
blockquote><div dir=3D"auto">=C2=A0 =C2=A0Good point as most networks these=
 days have orchestration built into the solution. =C2=A0 Agreed. =C2=A0</di=
v><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:=
1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><br></div><br><div c=
lass=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Tue, Mar 3, 2=
020 at 1:00 AM Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote cl=
ass=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid=
 rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div><br></div><div><div dir=3D"auto">T=
hanks Robert for the quick=C2=A0response</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><=
div dir=3D"auto">Just thinking out loud - =C2=A0I can see there maybe some =
advantages of elimination of L2 to the host but the one major disadvantage =
is that BGP multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing so not as d=
esirable from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port h=
ash.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Other big down side=
 is most enterprises have the hypervisor managed by server admins but if yo=
u run BGP now that ends up shifting to network.=C2=A0 More complicated. =C2=
=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind=C2=A0regards</d=
iv><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Gyan</div><br><div class=
=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 =
at 6:39 PM Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:robert@raszuk.net" target=3D=
"_blank">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gma=
il_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,2=
04,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr">Hi Gyan,<div><br></div><div>Simi=
lar architecture has been invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now that p=
roject after they got acquired=C2=A0by Juniper has been renamed to Tungsten=
 Fabric=C2=A0<a href=3D"https://tungsten.io/" target=3D"_blank">https://tun=
gsten.io/</a>=C2=A0while Juniper continued to keep the original project&#39=
;s name and commercial flavor of it. No guarantees of any product quality a=
t this point.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor =
BGP to the host. The proposed above alternative were well thought out and t=
urned to work ways far more efficient and practical if you zoom into detail=
s.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Best,</div><div>Robert.</div><div><br></d=
iv></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"></div><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><d=
iv dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan Mi=
shra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabus=
agsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div></div><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><bl=
ockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-lef=
t:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"></blockquote></div><div clas=
s=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px=
 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div di=
r=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Dear BESS WG</div><div dir=3D"auto">=
<br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in =
the Data Center arena to extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor=
 making the Hypervisor part of the =C2=A0vxlan fabric.=C2=A0 This could eli=
minate use of MLAG on the leaf switches and eliminate L2 completely from th=
e vxlan fabric thereby maximizing =C2=A0stability.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><=
br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind regards,</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><=
div dir=3D"auto">Gyan</div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><d=
iv dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia=
, serif"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=
=3D"#000000">yan=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font=
 size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &=
amp; Technology=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" col=
or=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"=
MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silve=
r Spring, MD 20904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=
=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">E=
mail: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s=
.mishra@verizon.com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div=
><br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquo=
te></div><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=
=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding=
-left:1ex">
_______________________________________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><br>
</blockquote></div>
</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div=
 dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D=
"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, s=
erif"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"=
#000000">yan=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font siz=
e=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp;=
 Technology=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=
=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"Ms=
oNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver =
Spring, MD 20904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D=
"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D=
"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Emai=
l: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mi=
shra@verizon.com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><b=
r></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>
</blockquote></div></div>
</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature" =
data-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><=
div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font si=
ze=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=
=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" colo=
r=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=
=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" =
face=3D"georgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><fon=
t size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20=
904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" fac=
e=3D"georgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><=
font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D=
"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.=
com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div=
></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>

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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the BGP Enabled ServiceS WG of the IETF.

        Title           : EVPN Virtual Ethernet Segment
        Authors         : Ali Sajassi
                          Patrice Brissette
                          Rick Schell
                          John E Drake
                          Jorge Rabadan
	Filename        : draft-ietf-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment-05.txt
	Pages           : 23
	Date            : 2020-03-02

Abstract:
   EVPN and PBB-EVPN introduce a family of solutions for multipoint
   Ethernet services over MPLS/IP network with many advanced features
   among which their multi-homing capabilities.  These solutions
   introduce Single-Active and All-Active for an Ethernet Segment (ES),
   itself defined as a set of physical links between the multi-homed
   device/network and a set of PE devices that they are connected to.
   This document extends the Ethernet Segment concept so that an ES can
   be associated to a set of EVCs (e.g., VLANs) or other objects such as
   MPLS Label Switch Paths (LSPs) or Pseudowires (PWs), referred to as
   Virtual Ethernet Segments (vES).  This draft describes the
   requirements and the extensions needed to support vES in EVPN and
   PBB-EVPN.



The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment/

There are also htmlized versions available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment-05
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment-05

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment-05


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
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From: <slitkows.ietf@gmail.com>
To: <draft-ietf-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment@ietf.org>, "Luc Andre Burdet \(lburdet\)" <lburdet@cisco.com>
Cc: "'BESS'" <bess@ietf.org>
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Subject: [bess] Chair review of draft-ietf-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment-05
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Hi Authors,

 

Please find  below my chair review:

 

Nits:

 

  == Missing Reference: 'ETH-OAM' is mentioned on line 606, but not defined
 
  == Missing Reference: 'MPLS-OAM' is mentioned on line 612, but not defined
 
  == Missing Reference: 'PW-OAM' is mentioned on line 612, but not defined
 
  == Missing Reference: 'EVPN-IRB' is mentioned on line 746, but not defined

 

 

Introduction:

There should be an issue with XML source as the reference to RFC7432 is not
a link.

 

Section 1.1:

The figure legend is not understandable as there are two many acronyms.

"Figure 1: DHD/DHN (both SA/AA) and SH on same ENNI"
 
Or It may be good to put terminology section before.
 

Section 1.2:

Similar comment for Figure 2

In addition, I'm wondering if there are some issues with the figure itself
regarding the attachment of EVCs.

Finally  section talks about Access MPLS Networks, but figure talks about
Aggregation Network. Of course this is applicable to both cases, but
legend/title/figure are not matching.

 

 

"  Since the PWs for the two VPWS instances can be
   aggregated into the same LSPs going to the MPLS network, a common
   virtual ES can be defined for LSP1 and LSP2.  This vES will be shared
   by two separate EVIs in the EVPN network."
 
Which MPLS network are you talking about ? Aggregation or IP/MPLS ? This is
ambiguous.
 
 
Section 3.1:
Can't we merge R1a,b, c and d as a single requirement ?
 
 
Section 3.2:
I'm a bit concerned about the scaling requirements. Scaling is always a
matter of platform resources and computing power. That's fine to have these
numbers in mind when building the protocol, however we can't be sure that
all platforms will be able to handle this numbers.
 
 
Section 3.4:
The requirements are not expressed correctly IMO. When reading R4a and b,
this definition/requirement comes indirectly from RFC7432. Shouldn't we use
something more tied to vES requirement like: a vES SHOULD support EVCs based
on a VLAN based/bundle service
 
 
Section 3.5
s/defult procedure/default procedure/

Needs also to comply to RFC8584 ?

 
 
Section 3.7
Need to create a new paragraph for R7b,c,d.
 
MHD and MHN are not expanded in terminology section.
 
 
Section 3.8:
Need a paragraph separation to introduce R8a.
 

 

Section 4.1:

Needs also to comply to RFC8584 ?

 

 

Brgds

 

Stephane

 


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<o:idmap v:ext=3D"edit" data=3D"1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DFR =
link=3D"#0563C1" vlink=3D"#954F72"><div class=3DWordSection1><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>Hi Authors,<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>Please find &nbsp;below my chair =
review:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>Nits:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp; =3D=3D Missing Reference: 'ETH-OAM' is =
mentioned on line 606, but not defined<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp; =3D=3D Missing Reference: =
'MPLS-OAM' is mentioned on line 612, but not =
defined<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp; =3D=3D Missing Reference: =
'PW-OAM' is mentioned on line 612, but not =
defined<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp; =3D=3D Missing Reference: =
'EVPN-IRB' is mentioned on line 746, but not =
defined<o:p></o:p></span></pre><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>Introduction:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US>There should be an issue with XML =
source as the reference to RFC7432 is not a =
link.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>Section 1.1:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US>The figure legend is not =
understandable as there are two many =
acronyms.<o:p></o:p></span></p><pre><span lang=3DEN-US>&#8220;<span =
style=3D'color:black'>Figure 1: DHD/DHN (both SA/AA) and SH on same =
ENNI&#8221;<o:p></o:p></span></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>Or It may be good to put terminology =
section before.<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US>Section =
1.2:<o:p></o:p></span></p><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>Similar comment for Figure =
2<o:p></o:p></span></pre><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US>In =
addition, I&#8217;m wondering if there are some issues with the figure =
itself regarding the attachment of EVCs.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US>Finally&nbsp; section talks about =
Access MPLS Networks, but figure talks about Aggregation Network. Of =
course this is applicable to both cases, but legend/title/figure are not =
matching.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US>&#8220;<span style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp; Since the PWs for =
the two VPWS instances can be<o:p></o:p></span></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp;&nbsp; aggregated into the same =
LSPs going to the MPLS network, a =
common<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp;&nbsp; virtual ES can be defined for LSP1 =
and LSP2.&nbsp; This vES will be =
shared<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp;&nbsp; by two separate EVIs in the EVPN =
network.&#8221;<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>Which MPLS network are you talking =
about ? Aggregation or IP/MPLS ? This is =
ambiguous.<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>Section =
3.1:<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>Can&#8217;t we merge R1a,b, c and d as a single =
requirement ?<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>Section =
3.2:<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>I&#8217;m a bit concerned about the scaling =
requirements. Scaling is always a matter of platform resources and =
computing power. That&#8217;s fine to have these numbers in mind when =
building the protocol, however we can&#8217;t be sure that all platforms =
will be able to handle this numbers.<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>Section =
3.4:<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>The requirements are not expressed correctly IMO. =
When reading R4a and b, this definition/requirement comes indirectly =
from RFC7432. Shouldn&#8217;t we use something more tied to vES =
requirement like: a vES SHOULD support EVCs based on a VLAN based/bundle =
service<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>Section =
3.5<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>s/defult procedure/default =
procedure/<o:p></o:p></span></pre><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>Needs also to comply to RFC8584 =
?<o:p></o:p></span></p><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>Section =
3.7<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>Need to create a new paragraph for =
R7b,c,d.<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>MHD and MHN are not expanded in =
terminology section.<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>Section =
3.8:<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>Need a paragraph separation to introduce =
R8a.<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US>Section =
4.1:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US>Needs =
also to comply to RFC8584 ?<o:p></o:p></span></p><pre><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US>Brgds<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US>Stephane<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div></body></html>
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Subject: [bess] Milestones changed for bess WG
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Changed milestone "Submit specification for BGP NSH controlplane to IESG as
PS", resolved as "Done", added draft-ietf-bess-nsh-bgp-control-plane to
milestone.

URL: https://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/bess/about/


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Changed milestone "Submit specifications for VPLS multi-homing to IESG as
PS", resolved as "Done", added draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming to milestone.

Changed milestone "Submit a Yang or SMI datamodel for RFC4364 to IESG as PS",
set due date to December 2020 from January 2019, added
draft-ietf-bess-l3vpn-yang to milestone.

Changed milestone "Submit a Yang or SMI datamodel for E-VPN to IESG as PS",
set due date to December 2020 from January 2019, added
draft-ietf-bess-evpn-yang to milestone.

Changed milestone "Submit a YANG datamodel for L2VPN to IESG as PS", set due
date to December 2020 from January 2019, added draft-ietf-bess-l2vpn-yang to
milestone.

Changed milestone "Submit a YANG datamodel for mVPN to IESG as PS", set due
date to December 2020 from June 2019, added draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-yang to
milestone.

URL: https://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/bess/about/


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Subject: [bess] Request for IANA early allocation for draft-ietf-bess-srv6-services code points
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Hello,
We would like to request IANA to perform early allocations for https://tools=
.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-srv6-services-02#section-9.1 as follows:

=20

       Value               Type                    Reference

       ---------------------------------------------------------

       4                Deprecated              <this document>

       5 (suggested)    SRv6 L3 Service TLV     <this document>

       6 (suggested)    SRv6 L2 Service TLV     <this document>

=20

Thanks,

Gaurav (on behalf of co-authors)

=20


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<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto">Hello,<div dir="ltr"><div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoPlainText">We would like to request IANA to perform early allocations for
<a href="https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-srv6-services-02#section-9.1">
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-srv6-services-02#section-9.1</a> as follows:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Value&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Type&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Reference<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; ---------------------------------------------------------<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 4&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Deprecated&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&lt;this document&gt;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;5 (suggested)&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; SRv6 L3 Service TLV&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;this document&gt;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><span style="font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;6 (suggested)&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; SRv6 L2 Service TLV&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;this document&gt;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">Gaurav (on behalf of co-authors)<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div></div><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr"><div class="WordSection1">
</div>


</div></blockquote></body></html>
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From: Donald Eastlake <d3e3e3@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2020 11:22:10 -0500
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To: "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>
Cc: "draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd@ietf.org" <draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>,  "bess-chairs@ietf.org" <bess-chairs@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd-04
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I am not aware on any undisclosed IPR in this draft.

I support WG adoption of this draft as a co-author.

Thanks,
Donald
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
 Donald E. Eastlake 3rd   +1-508-333-2270 (cell)
 2386 Panoramic Circle, Apopka, FL 32703 USA
 d3e3e3@gmail.com

On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:42 AM Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)
<matthew.bocci@nokia.com> wrote:
>
> Hello,
>
>
>
> This email begins a two-weeks WG adoption poll for draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-b=
fd-04 [1] .
>
>
>
> Please review the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group l=
ist.
>
>
>
> We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to =
this Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with IET=
F IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).
>
>
>
> If you are listed as an author or a contributor of this document, please =
respond to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any rele=
vant undisclosed IPR, copying the BESS mailing list. The document won't pro=
gress without answers from all the authors and contributors.
>
>
>
> Currently, there are no IPR disclosures against this document.
>
>
>
> If you are not listed as an author or a contributor, then please explicit=
ly respond only if you are aware of any IPR that has not yet been disclosed=
 in conformance with IETF rules.
>
>
>
> This poll for adoption closes on Wednesday 11th March 2020.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Matthew and Stephane
>
>
>
> [1] https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd/
>
>
>
>
>
>


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From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
To: "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>
CC: "bess-chairs@ietf.org" <bess-chairs@ietf.org>, "draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd@ietf.org" <draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd-04
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/afqWOxw_4uJBW8eM6xsnQxxSyz0>
Subject: Re: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd-04
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I support the WG adoption of draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd-04

Linda Dunbar



On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:42 AM Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB) <matthew.bocci@=
nokia.com> wrote:
>
> Hello,
>
>
>
> This email begins a two-weeks WG adoption poll for draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-b=
fd-04 [1] .
>
>
>
> Please review the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group l=
ist.
>
>
>
> We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to =
this Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with IET=
F IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).
>
>
>
> If you are listed as an author or a contributor of this document, please =
respond to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any rele=
vant undisclosed IPR, copying the BESS mailing list. The document won't pro=
gress without answers from all the authors and contributors.
>
>
>
> Currently, there are no IPR disclosures against this document.
>
>
>
> If you are not listed as an author or a contributor, then please explicit=
ly respond only if you are aware of any IPR that has not yet been disclosed=
 in conformance with IETF rules.
>
>
>
> This poll for adoption closes on Wednesday 11th March 2020.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Matthew and Stephane
>
>
>
> [1]=20
> https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdata
> tracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd%2F&amp;data=3D02%7C01%
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>
>

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From: "Ali Sajassi (sajassi)" <sajassi@cisco.com>
To: "slitkows.ietf@gmail.com" <slitkows.ietf@gmail.com>, "draft-ietf-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment@ietf.org>, "Luc Andre Burdet (lburdet)" <lburdet@cisco.com>
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From: "Andrew G. Malis" <agmalis@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2020 17:59:34 -0500
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To: "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>
Cc: "draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd@ietf.org" <draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>,  "bess-chairs@ietf.org" <bess-chairs@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd-04
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Matthew,

I support adoption of this draft.

Cheers,
Andy


On Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:42 AM Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB) <
matthew.bocci@nokia.com> wrote:

> Hello,
>
>
>
> This email begins a two-weeks WG adoption poll for
> draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd-04 [1] .
>
>
>
> Please review the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group
> list.
>
>
>
> We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to
> this Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with
> IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).
>
>
>
> If you are listed as an author or a contributor of this document, please
> respond to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any
> relevant undisclosed IPR, copying the BESS mailing list. The document won't
> progress without answers from all the authors and contributors.
>
>
>
> Currently, there are no IPR disclosures against this document.
>
>
>
> If you are not listed as an author or a contributor, then please
> explicitly respond only if you are aware of any IPR that has not yet been
> disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.
>
>
>
> This poll for adoption closes on Wednesday 11th March 2020.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Matthew and Stephane
>
>
>
> [1] https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd/
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr">Matthew,<div><br></div><div>I support adoption of this dra=
ft.</div><div><br></div><div>Cheers,</div><div>Andy</div><div><br></div></d=
iv><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On =
Wed, Feb 26, 2020 at 9:42 AM Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB) &lt;<a href=3D"mai=
lto:matthew.bocci@nokia.com">matthew.bocci@nokia.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></di=
v><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;borde=
r-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-GB">
<div class=3D"gmail-m_1338880723009921334WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:black">Hello,<u></u><u></u></sp=
an></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">This email begins a two-weeks WG<span class=3D"=
gmail-m_1338880723009921334apple-converted-space">=C2=A0</span></span><span=
 style=3D"color:white;background:rgb(106,90,0)">adoption</span><span class=
=3D"gmail-m_1338880723009921334apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"color:=
black">=C2=A0</span></span><span style=3D"color:black">poll
 for draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd-04 [1] .<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></sp=
an></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">Please review the draft and post any comments t=
o the BESS working group list.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">We are also=C2=A0polling for knowledge of any u=
ndisclosed IPR that applies to this Document, to ensure that IPR has been d=
isclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5=
378 for more details).<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">If you are listed as an author or a contributor=
 of this document, please respond to this email and indicate whether or not=
 you are aware of any relevant undisclosed IPR, copying the BESS mailing li=
st. The document won&#39;t progress without
 answers from all the authors and contributors.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">Currently, there are no IPR disclosures against=
 this document.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">If you are not listed as an author or a contrib=
utor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any IPR that =
has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.<u></u><u></u></s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">This poll for<span class=3D"gmail-m_13388807230=
09921334apple-converted-space">=C2=A0</span></span><span style=3D"color:whi=
te;background:rgb(106,90,0)">adoption</span><span class=3D"gmail-m_13388807=
23009921334apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0</span>=
</span><span style=3D"color:black">closes
 on Wednesday 11th March 2020. =C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">Regards,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">Matthew<span class=3D"gmail-m_13388807230099213=
34apple-converted-space">=C2=A0and Stephane</span><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">[1]=C2=A0</span><a href=3D"https://datatracker.=
ietf.org/doc/draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd/" target=3D"_blank">https://datatrack=
er.ietf.org/doc/draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd/</a><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:black"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></sp=
an></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;w=
ord-spacing:0px">
<span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>

_______________________________________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><br>
</blockquote></div>

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To: "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>, "draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd@ietf.org" <draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
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From: "UTTARO, JAMES" <ju1738@att.com>
To: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>, BESS <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2020 15:17:29 +0000
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2020 10:47:10 -0500
From: Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
To: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>, BESS <bess@ietf.org>,  =?utf-8?Q?UTTARO=2C_JAMES?= <ju1738@att.com>
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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--5e5fcd84_541f28cd_ba8d
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James,

ESI multihoming (load-sharing) works just fine with VxLAN encapsulation (=
when supported), there=E2=80=99s no need for additional (proprietary) mec=
hanisms (at least with basic synchronization).

Gyan - the devil is in the details (as always) - I=E2=80=99m looking at m=
ultivendor EVPN VxLAN ESI designs as we speak, I=E2=80=99m yet to figure =
out how ESI type 3 (only ESI type supported in NX-OS) is going to work wi=
th ESI types 0/1 supported in Junos and Arista. I=E2=80=99d assume upcomi=
ng open source implementations will support type 0 (manual) only.

To second James - replacing MLAG with ESI multihoming could be a really b=
ig deal in terms of simplification and normalization of the fabric (and y=
ou could finally remove peer-links=21).
L2 vs L3 discussion is somewhat orthogonal to that, if your services requ=
ire stretched L2, whether your VTEPs are on a server or switch - you=E2=80=
=99d still be doing L2overL3.

I still wouldn=E2=80=99t dare to deploy multivendor leafs though, but one=
 step at a time ;-)

Cheers,
Jeff
On Mar 4, 2020, 10:17 AM -0500, UTTARO, JAMES <ju1738=40att.com>, wrote:
> Gyan,
>
> =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 One of the big advantages of EVPN is the MLAG capability without t=
he need for proprietary MLAG solutions. We have been actively testing EV-=
LAG to accomplish this in the WAN for L2 services.. That being said, we u=
se EVPN/MPLS where MH ( EV-LAG ) is conveyed via labels.. My understandin=
g is that when using EVPN/VXLAN proprietary mechanisms are need to make E=
V-LAG work.. The is no SH label..
>
> Thanks,
> =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 Jim Uttaro
>
> =46rom: BESS <bess-bounces=40ietf.org> On Behalf Of Gyan Mishra
> Sent: Monday, March 02, 2020 6:26 PM
> To: BESS <bess=40ietf.org>
> Subject: =5Bbess=5D VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
>
>
> Dear BESS WG
>
> Is anyone aware of any IET=46 BGP development in the Data Center arena =
to extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor making the Hypervis=
or part of the =C2=A0vxlan fabric.=C2=A0 This could eliminate use of MLAG=
 on the leaf switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric t=
hereby maximizing =C2=A0stability.
>
> Kind regards,
>
> Gyan
> --
> Gyan=C2=A0 Mishra
> Network Engineering & Technology
> Verizon
> Silver Spring, MD 20904
> Phone: 301 502-1347
> Email: gyan.s.mishra=40verizon.com
>
>
> =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=
=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F
> BESS mailing list
> BESS=40ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess

--5e5fcd84_541f28cd_ba8d
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Content-Disposition: inline

<html xmlns=3D=22http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml=22>
<head>
<title></title>
</head>
<body>
<div name=3D=22messageBodySection=22>
<div dir=3D=22auto=22>James,
<div dir=3D=22auto=22><br /></div>
<div dir=3D=22auto=22>ESI multihoming (load-sharing) works just fine with=
 VxLAN encapsulation (when supported), there=E2=80=99s no need for additi=
onal (proprietary) mechanisms (at least with basic synchronization). &=23=
160;&=23160;</div>
<div dir=3D=22auto=22><br /></div>
<div dir=3D=22auto=22>Gyan - the devil is in the details (as always) - I=E2=
=80=99m looking at multivendor EVPN VxLAN ESI designs as we speak, I=E2=80=
=99m yet to figure out how ESI type 3 (only ESI type supported in NX-OS) =
is going to work with ESI types 0/1 supported in Junos and Arista. I=E2=80=
=99d assume upcoming open source implementations will support type 0 (man=
ual) only.<br /></div>
<div dir=3D=22auto=22><br /></div>
<div dir=3D=22auto=22>To second James - replacing MLAG with ESI multihomi=
ng could be a really big deal in terms of simplification and normalizatio=
n of the fabric (and you could finally remove peer-links=21).&=23160;</di=
v>
<div dir=3D=22auto=22>L2 vs L3 discussion is somewhat orthogonal to that,=
 if your services require stretched L2, whether your VTEPs are on a serve=
r or switch - you=E2=80=99d still be doing L2overL3.</div>
<div dir=3D=22auto=22><br /></div>
<div dir=3D=22auto=22>I still wouldn=E2=80=99t dare to deploy multivendor=
 leafs though, but one step at a time ;-)</div>
</div>
</div>
<div name=3D=22messageSignatureSection=22><br />
<div class=3D=22match=46ont=22>Cheers,
<div>Jeff</div>
</div>
</div>
<div name=3D=22messageReplySection=22>On Mar 4, 2020, 10:17 AM -0500, UTT=
ARO, JAMES &lt;ju1738=40att.com&gt;, wrote:<br />
<blockquote type=3D=22cite=22 class=3D=22spark=5Fquote=22 style=3D=22marg=
in: 5px 5px; padding-left: 10px; border-left: thin solid =231abc9c;=22>
<div class=3D=22WordSection1=22>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22><b><span style=3D=22font-size:12.0pt;color:=23=
7030A0=22>Gyan,</span></b></p>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22><b><span style=3D=22font-size:12.0pt;color:=23=
7030A0=22>&=23160;</span></b></p>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22><b><span style=3D=22font-size:12.0pt;color:=23=
7030A0=22>&=23160;&=23160;&=23160;&=23160;&=23160;&=23160;&=23160;&=23160=
;&=23160;&=23160;&=23160;&=23160;&=23160; One of the big advantages of EV=
PN is the MLAG capability without the need for proprietary MLAG solutions=
. We have been actively testing EV-LAG to accomplish this in the WAN for =
L2 services.. That being said, we use EVPN/MPLS where MH ( EV-LAG ) is co=
nveyed via labels.. My understanding is that when using EVPN/VXLAN propri=
etary mechanisms are need to make EV-LAG work.. The is no SH label..</spa=
n></b></p>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22><b><span style=3D=22font-size:12.0pt;color:=23=
7030A0=22>&=23160;</span></b></p>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22><b><span style=3D=22font-size:12.0pt;color:=23=
7030A0=22>Thanks,</span></b></p>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22><b><span style=3D=22font-size:12.0pt;color:=23=
7030A0=22>&=23160;&=23160;&=23160;&=23160;&=23160;&=23160;&=23160;&=23160=
;&=23160;&=23160;&=23160;&=23160;&=23160; Jim Uttaro</span></b></p>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22><b><span style=3D=22font-size:12.0pt;color:=23=
7030A0=22>&=23160;</span></b></p>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22><b>=46rom:</b> BESS &lt;bess-bounces=40ietf.or=
g&gt; <b>On Behalf Of</b> Gyan Mishra<br />
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, March 02, 2020 6:26 PM<br />
<b>To:</b> BESS &lt;bess=40ietf.org&gt;<br />
<b>Subject:</b> =5Bbess=5D VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM</=
p>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22>&=23160;</p>
<div>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22>&=23160;</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22>Dear BESS WG</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22>&=23160;</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22>Is anyone aware of any IET=46 BGP development =
in the Data Center arena to extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hyper=
visor making the Hypervisor part of the &=23160;vxlan fabric.&=23160; Thi=
s could eliminate use of MLAG on the leaf switches and eliminate L2 compl=
etely from the vxlan fabric thereby maximizing &=23160;stability.</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22>&=23160;</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22>Kind regards,</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22>&=23160;</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22>Gyan</p>
</div>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22>--</p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22 style=3D=22mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-=
bottom-alt:auto=22><span style=3D=22font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Geo=
rgia&quot;,serif;color:black=22>Gyan&=23160; Mishra</span></p>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22 style=3D=22mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-=
bottom-alt:auto=22><span style=3D=22font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Geo=
rgia&quot;,serif;color:black=22>Network Engineering &amp; Technology&=231=
60;</span></p>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22 style=3D=22mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-=
bottom-alt:auto=22><span style=3D=22font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Geo=
rgia&quot;,serif;color:black=22>Verizon&=23160;</span></p>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22 style=3D=22mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-=
bottom-alt:auto=22><span style=3D=22font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Geo=
rgia&quot;,serif;color:black=22>Silver Spring, MD 20904</span></p>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22 style=3D=22mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-=
bottom-alt:auto=22><span style=3D=22font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Geo=
rgia&quot;,serif;color:black=22>Phone: 301 502-1347</span></p>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22 style=3D=22mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-=
bottom-alt:auto=22><span style=3D=22font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Geo=
rgia&quot;,serif;color:black=22>Email: <a href=3D=22mailto:gyan.s.mishra=40=
verizon.com=22 target=3D=22=5Fblank=22>gyan.s.mishra=40verizon.com</a></s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22 style=3D=22mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-=
bottom-alt:auto=22>&=23160;</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D=22MsoNormal=22>&=23160;</p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=
=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F<br />
BESS mailing list<br />
BESS=40ietf.org<br />
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess<br /></blockquote>
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From: "Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang" <zzhang@juniper.net>
To: "UTTARO, JAMES" <ju1738@att.com>, Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>, BESS <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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From: "UTTARO, JAMES" <ju1738@att.com>
To: Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>, Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>, BESS <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2020 15:56:30 +0000
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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To: "Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang" <zzhang@juniper.net>, Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>, BESS <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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From: "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>
To: "UTTARO, JAMES" <ju1738@att.com>, Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>,  Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>, BESS <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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Hi Gyan and Robert,

 > This could eliminate use of MLAG on the leaf switches

Contrail/Tungsten just provide L2/L3 overlay routes to Compute via XMPP(MP-BGP), not support underlay multipath.
At this time, vRouter of Contrail/Tungsten does not follow changes in the routing table of host OS.
So there are still MLAG or Virtual-Chassis or VRRP and I'm struggling with them.
This is just implementation issue and will be resolved in the future.

Just for your information,
Yuya
SDN Tech Lead, NTT

On 2020/03/03 9:07, Robert Raszuk wrote:
> Hi Gyan,
> 
> You are touching subject close to me so let me share my perspective on your doubts below ;)
> 
>  > maybe some advantages of elimination of L2 to the host
> 
> Not some but huge !
> 
>  >Â  BGP multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing
> 
> First Contrail/Tungsten does not use BGP to the hypervisorÂ but XMPP. But this is opaque to your concern.
> 
> Load balancing and hashing construction is your choice, BGP or XMPP only deliver you next hops .. how you spread traffic to them is 100% up to your choice. That is the same on hypervisor or on any decent router. LAGs also build hash in the way you configure them to do so..
> 
>  >Â  hypervisor managed by server admins
> 
> In any decent networkÂ or for thatÂ matter even in my lab thisÂ is all 100% automated. You run one template and execute it. Ansible works pretty well, but thereÂ are other choices too.
> 
> Many thx,
> R.
> 
> 
> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 1:00 AM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com <mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com>> wrote:
> 
> 
>     Thanks Robert for the quickÂ response
> 
>     Just thinking out loud - Â I can see there maybe some advantages of elimination of L2 to the host but the one major disadvantage is that BGP multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing so not as desirable from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash..
> 
>     Other big down side is most enterprises have the hypervisor managed by server admins but if you run BGP now that ends up shifting to network.Â  More complicated.
> 
>     KindÂ regards
> 
>     Gyan
> 
>     On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:39 PM Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net <mailto:robert@raszuk.net>> wrote:
> 
>         Hi Gyan,
> 
>         Similar architecture has been invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now that project after they got acquiredÂ by Juniper has been renamed to Tungsten Fabric https://tungsten..io/ <https://tungsten.io/>Â while Juniper continued to keep the original project's name and commercial flavor of it. No guarantees of any product quality at this point.
> 
>         Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor BGP to the host. The proposed above alternative were well thought out and turned to work ways far more efficient and practical if you zoom into details.
> 
>         Best,
>         Robert.
> 
> 
>         On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com <mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com>> wrote:
> 
> 
>             Dear BESS WG
> 
>             Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in the Data Center arena to extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor making the Hypervisor part of the Â vxlan fabric.Â  This could eliminate use of MLAG on the leaf switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereby maximizing Â stability.
> 
>             Kind regards,
> 
>             Gyan
>             -- 
> 
>             GyanÂ  Mishra
> 
>             Network Engineering & Technology
> 
>             Verizon
> 
>             Silver Spring, MD 20904
> 
>             Phone: 301 502-1347
> 
>             Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com <mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com>
> 
> 
> 
>             _______________________________________________
>             BESS mailing list
>             BESS@ietf.org <mailto:BESS@ietf.org>
>             https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
> 
>     -- 
> 
>     GyanÂ  Mishra
> 
>     Network Engineering & Technology
> 
>     Verizon
> 
>     Silver Spring, MD 20904
> 
>     Phone: 301 502-1347
> 
>     Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com <mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
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From: <slitkows.ietf@gmail.com>
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Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2020 19:11:55 +0100
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Subject: [bess] IETF 107 BESS meeting will be cancelled
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Hi WG,

 

Due to new coming corporate travel restrictions associated to this
Coronavirus, there will be no chair or secretary attending the IETF 107
physically.

 

We will have to cancel the BESS sessions unfortunately.

 

For your information, we received only 2 slots requests for now, while in
general the agenda was almost full.

 

We, chairs, will keep you posted soon on the way we will proceed to do a
sync-up before next IETF physical meeting.

 

Sorry for that and stay safe.

 

Stephane & Matthew

 

 


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link=3D"#0563C1" vlink=3D"#954F72"><div class=3DWordSection1><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>Hi WG,<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>Due to new coming corporate travel restrictions associated =
to this Coronavirus, there will be no chair or secretary attending the =
IETF 107 physically.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>We will have to cancel the BESS sessions =
unfortunately.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>For your information, we received only 2 slots requests for =
now, while in general the agenda was almost =
full.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>We, chairs, will keep you posted soon on the way we will =
proceed to do a sync-up before next IETF physical =
meeting.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>Sorry for that and stay safe.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US>Stephane &amp; =
Matthew<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div></body></html>
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From nobody Wed Mar  4 12:39:25 2020
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In-Reply-To: <361FEEDE-DDD9-4F67-A166-841C1E75006A@nokia.com>
From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2020 15:39:09 -0500
Message-ID: <CABNhwV19yX4abtS+XyAtiJTwh=ShTaUSQ3f9uiCy+ouiodELFw@mail.gmail.com>
To: "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>
Cc: BESS <bess@ietf.org>, Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>,  "UTTARO, JAMES" <ju1738@att.com>
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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Thanks Jorge!!

https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8365#page-16

Since VXLAN and NVGRE encapsulations do not include the ESI label,
   other means of performing the split-horizon filtering function must
   be devised for these encapsulations.  The following approach is
   recommended for split-horizon filtering when VXLAN (or NVGRE)
   encapsulation is used.

   Every NVE tracks the IP address(es) associated with the other NVE(s)
   with which it has shared multihomed ESs.  When the NVE receives a
   multi-destination frame from the overlay network, it examines the
   source IP address in the tunnel header (which corresponds to the
   ingress NVE) and filters out the frame on all local interfaces
   connected to ESs that are shared with the ingress NVE.  With this
   approach, it is required that the ingress NVE perform replication
   locally to all directly attached Ethernet segments (regardless of the
   DF election state) for all flooded traffic ingress from the access
   interfaces (i.e., from the hosts).  This approach is referred to as
   "Local Bias", and has the advantage that only a single IP address
   need be used per NVE for split-horizon filtering, as opposed to
   requiring an IP address per Ethernet segment per NVE.


On Wed, Mar 4, 2020 at 11:01 AM Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View) <
jorge.rabadan@nokia.com> wrote:

> I would also refer to RFC8365, specifically the local-bias explanation fo=
r
> multi-homing Split-Horizon, and also the NVE residing in the hypervisor.
>
> That=E2=80=99s usually the reference here.
>
>
>
> My two cents..
>
> Thx
>
> Jorge
>
>
>
> *From: *BESS <bess-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of "UTTARO, JAMES" <
> ju1738@att.com>
> *Date: *Wednesday, March 4, 2020 at 4:57 PM
> *To: *Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>, Gyan Mishra <
> hayabusagsm@gmail.com>, BESS <bess@ietf.org>
> *Subject: *Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
>
>
>
> *Gyan,*
>
>
>
> *              The following draft may also be of interest. AT&T (
> A.Lingala ) has co-authored a draft that addresses unequal load balancing
> within a data center.. This draft intends to optimize the use of links of
> different size within the data center to fully utilize the capacity of th=
e
> links from the leaf=E2=80=99s to the servers.. *
>
>
>
> *https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-03
> <https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-03> *
>
>
>
> *Thanks,*
>
> *              Jim Uttaro*
>
>
>
> *From:* Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, March 04, 2020 10:47 AM
> *To:* Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>; BESS <bess@ietf.org>; UTTARO,
> JAMES <ju1738@att.com>
> *Subject:* Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
>
>
>
> James,
>
>
>
> ESI multihoming (load-sharing) works just fine with VxLAN encapsulation
> (when supported), there=E2=80=99s no need for additional (proprietary) me=
chanisms
> (at least with basic synchronization).
>
>
>
> Gyan - the devil is in the details (as always) - I=E2=80=99m looking at
> multivendor EVPN VxLAN ESI designs as we speak, I=E2=80=99m yet to figure=
 out how
> ESI type 3 (only ESI type supported in NX-OS) is going to work with ESI
> types 0/1 supported in Junos and Arista. I=E2=80=99d assume upcoming open=
 source
> implementations will support type 0 (manual) only.
>
>
>
> To second James - replacing MLAG with ESI multihoming could be a really
> big deal in terms of simplification and normalization of the fabric (and
> you could finally remove peer-links!).
>
> L2 vs L3 discussion is somewhat orthogonal to that, if your services
> require stretched L2, whether your VTEPs are on a server or switch - you=
=E2=80=99d
> still be doing L2overL3.
>
>
>
> I still wouldn=E2=80=99t dare to deploy multivendor leafs though, but one=
 step at
> a time ;-)
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> Jeff
>
> On Mar 4, 2020, 10:17 AM -0500, UTTARO, JAMES <ju1738@att.com>, wrote:
>
>
> *Gyan,*
>
>
>
> *              One of the big advantages of EVPN is the MLAG capability
> without the need for proprietary MLAG solutions. We have been actively
> testing EV-LAG to accomplish this in the WAN for L2 services.. That being
> said, we use EVPN/MPLS where MH ( EV-LAG ) is conveyed via labels.. My
> understanding is that when using EVPN/VXLAN proprietary mechanisms are ne=
ed
> to make EV-LAG work.. The is no SH label..*
>
>
>
> *Thanks,*
>
> *              Jim Uttaro*
>
>
>
> *From:* BESS <bess-bounces@ietf.org> *On Behalf Of* Gyan Mishra
> *Sent:* Monday, March 02, 2020 6:26 PM
> *To:* BESS <bess@ietf.org>
> *Subject:* [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
>
>
>
>
>
> Dear BESS WG
>
>
>
> Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in the Data Center arena to
> extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor making the Hypervisor
> part of the  vxlan fabric.  This could eliminate use of MLAG on the leaf
> switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereby
> maximizing  stability.
>
>
>
> Kind regards,
>
>
>
> Gyan
>
> --
>
> Gyan  Mishra
>
> Network Engineering & Technology
>
> Verizon
>
> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>
> Phone: 301 502-1347
>
> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.ietf.org_mail=
man_listinfo_bess&d=3DDwQFaQ&c=3DLFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&r=3D3qhKphE8RnwJQ6u=
8MrAGeA&m=3DfDyO1T8959Mh1nCyB_DTHbuaJUWs7wQ01X_Pd18tPg0&s=3DsySZWuq5YBFtsqh=
6Y6wIrU5SDUpVQaB-cxlVNTZ84g8&e=3D>
>
> --

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

--00000000000036f73405a00d6a4a
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div><div dir=3D"auto">Thanks Jo=
rge!!</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><div><a href=3D"ht=
tps://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8365#page-16">https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8=
365#page-16</a></div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><pre class=3D"newpage" sty=
le=3D"font-size:1em;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;break-before:page">Sin=
ce VXLAN and NVGRE encapsulations do not include the ESI label,
   other means of performing the split-horizon filtering function must
   be devised for these encapsulations.  The following approach is
   recommended for split-horizon filtering when VXLAN (or NVGRE)
   encapsulation is used.

   Every NVE tracks the IP address(es) associated with the other NVE(s)
   with which it has shared multihomed ESs.  When the NVE receives a
   multi-destination frame from the overlay network, it examines the
   source IP address in the tunnel header (which corresponds to the
   ingress NVE) and filters out the frame on all local interfaces
   connected to ESs that are shared with the ingress NVE.  With this
   approach, it is required that the ingress NVE perform replication
   locally to all directly attached Ethernet segments (regardless of the
   DF election state) for all flooded traffic ingress from the access
   interfaces (i.e., from the hosts).  This approach is referred to as
   &quot;Local Bias&quot;, and has the advantage that only a single IP addr=
ess
   need be used per NVE for split-horizon filtering, as opposed to
   requiring an IP address per Ethernet segment per NVE.</pre></div><br><di=
v class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Wed, Mar 4=
, 2020 at 11:01 AM Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View) &lt;<a href=3D=
"mailto:jorge.rabadan@nokia.com">jorge.rabadan@nokia.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>=
</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-l=
eft:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">
<div class=3D"m_-7777820750481840244WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">I would also refer to RFC8365, specifically the local-bias explanation fo=
r multi-homing Split-Horizon, and also the NVE residing in the hypervisor.<=
u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">That=E2=80=99s usually the reference here.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">My two cents..<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">Thx</span></p></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purp=
le"><div class=3D"m_-7777820750481840244WordSection1"><p class=3D"MsoNormal=
"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas"><u></u><u></u></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">Jorge<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><b><span style=3D"font-=
size:12.0pt;color:black">From:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">BESS &lt;<a href=3D=
"mailto:bess-bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess-bounces@ietf.org</a>&=
gt; on behalf of &quot;UTTARO, JAMES&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ju1738@att=
.com" target=3D"_blank">ju1738@att.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Date: </b>Wednesday, March 4, 2020 at 4:57 PM<br>
<b>To: </b>Jeff Tantsura &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jefftant.ietf@gmail.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">jefftant.ietf@gmail.com</a>&gt;, Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"=
mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&g=
t;, BESS &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.o=
rg</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM<u><=
/u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><b><span style=3D"font-=
size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">Gyan,</span></b><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><b><span style=3D"font-=
size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">=C2=A0</span></b><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><b><span style=3D"font-=
size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 The following draft may also be of interest.=
 AT&amp;T ( A.Lingala ) has co-authored a draft that addresses unequal load=
 balancing within a data center..
 This draft intends to optimize the use of links of different size within t=
he data center to fully utilize the capacity of the links from the leaf=E2=
=80=99s to the servers..
</span></b><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><b><span style=3D"font-=
size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">=C2=A0</span></b><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><b><span style=3D"font-=
size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0"><a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-iet=
f-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-03" target=3D"_blank">https://tools.ietf.org/html/dr=
aft-ietf-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-03</a>
</span></b><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><b><span style=3D"font-=
size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">=C2=A0</span></b><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><b><span style=3D"font-=
size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">Thanks,</span></b><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><b><span style=3D"font-=
size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Jim Uttaro</span></b><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><b><span style=3D"font-=
size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">=C2=A0</span></b><u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><b>From:</b> Jeff Tants=
ura &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jefftant.ietf@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">jeffta=
nt.ietf@gmail.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, March 04, 2020 10:47 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=
=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt;; BESS &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@=
ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a>&gt;; UTTARO, JAMES &lt;<a hre=
f=3D"mailto:ju1738@att.com" target=3D"_blank">ju1738@att.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM<u><=
/u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p=
>
<div name=3D"messageBodySection">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">James, <u></u><u></u></=
p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">ESI multihoming (load-s=
haring) works just fine with VxLAN encapsulation (when supported), there=E2=
=80=99s no need for additional (proprietary) mechanisms (at least with basi=
c synchronization). =C2=A0=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Gyan - the devil is in =
the details (as always) - I=E2=80=99m looking at multivendor EVPN VxLAN ESI=
 designs as we speak, I=E2=80=99m yet to figure out how ESI type 3 (only ES=
I type supported in NX-OS) is going to work with ESI
 types 0/1 supported in Junos and Arista. I=E2=80=99d assume upcoming open =
source implementations will support type 0 (manual) only.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">To second James - repla=
cing MLAG with ESI multihoming could be a really big deal in terms of simpl=
ification and normalization of the fabric (and you could finally remove pee=
r-links!).=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">L2 vs L3 discussion is =
somewhat orthogonal to that, if your services require stretched L2, whether=
 your VTEPs are on a server or switch - you=E2=80=99d still be doing L2over=
L3.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">I still wouldn=E2=80=99=
t dare to deploy multivendor leafs though, but one step at a time ;-)<u></u=
><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div name=3D"messageSignatureSection">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p=
>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Cheers, <u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Jeff<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div name=3D"messageReplySection">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">On Mar 4, 2020, 10:17 A=
M -0500, UTTARO, JAMES &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ju1738@att.com" target=3D"_bla=
nk">ju1738@att.com</a>&gt;, wrote:<br>
<br>
<br>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #1abc9c 1.0pt;padding:0c=
m 0cm 0cm 8.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:3.75pt;margin-right:3.75pt;ma=
rgin-bottom:3.75pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">Gyan,</span></b><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">=C2=A0</span></b><u></u><=
u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 One of the big advan=
tages of EVPN is the MLAG capability without the need for proprietary MLAG =
solutions. We have been actively testing EV-LAG to accomplish this in the W=
AN for L2 services.. That
 being said, we use EVPN/MPLS where MH ( EV-LAG ) is conveyed via labels.. =
My understanding is that when using EVPN/VXLAN proprietary mechanisms are n=
eed to make EV-LAG work.. The is no SH label..</span></b><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">=C2=A0</span></b><u></u><=
u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">Thanks,</span></b><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Jim Uttaro</span></b=
><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">=C2=A0</span></b><u></u><=
u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<b>From:</b> BESS &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess-bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_b=
lank">bess-bounces@ietf.org</a>&gt;
<b>On Behalf Of</b> Gyan Mishra<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, March 02, 2020 6:26 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> BESS &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess=
@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM<u></u><=
u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
Dear BESS WG<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in the Data Center arena to ext=
end BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor making the Hypervisor part =
of the =C2=A0vxlan fabric.=C2=A0 This could eliminate use of MLAG on the le=
af switches and eliminate L2 completely from
 the vxlan fabric thereby maximizing =C2=A0stability.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
Kind regards,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
--<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Gyan=C2=A0 Mishra</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Verizon=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Silver Spring, MD 20904</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Phone: 301 502-1347</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank=
">
gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">_______________________=
________________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.ietf.=
org_mailman_listinfo_bess&amp;d=3DDwQFaQ&amp;c=3DLFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&amp=
;r=3D3qhKphE8RnwJQ6u8MrAGeA&amp;m=3DfDyO1T8959Mh1nCyB_DTHbuaJUWs7wQ01X_Pd18=
tPg0&amp;s=3DsySZWuq5YBFtsqh6Y6wIrU5SDUpVQaB-cxlVNTZ84g8&amp;e=3D" target=
=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><u></u><u></u></p=
>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature" =
data-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><=
div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font si=
ze=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=
=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" colo=
r=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=
=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" =
face=3D"georgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><fon=
t size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20=
904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" fac=
e=3D"georgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><=
font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D=
"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.=
com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div=
></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>

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From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2020 16:02:53 -0500
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To: Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
Cc: BESS <bess@ietf.org>, Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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Thank you all for the feedback!!

Our requirements we ar looking for a way to increase stability without
sacrificing bandwidth availability and convergence with Data Center host
connectivity to an existing vxlan fabric.  Our server traffic volume is
higher bandwidth East to West then North to South.

We have a Cisco Nexus based vxlan evpn fabric with multi site feature
connecting all of our PODs intra DC and use BGP EVPN over an MPLS core for
DCI inter connect inter Data Center connectivity.

We have orchestration via Cisco NSO and DCNM for network programmability.
Typical Cisco shop.

Our Data Center host attachment model as been with MLAG using Cisco=E2=80=
=99s vPC.
That has been problematic having that L2 extension so we would like to find
a better way to maybe leverage our existing vxlan fabric and extend to
server hypervisor if at all possible.

So with a hypervisor connected to two leaf switches in a vxlan fabric  it
sounds like it maybe possible with Cisco=E2=80=99s IETF standards based
implementation of vxlan overlay following NVO3 RFC 8365 and BGP EVPN RFC
7432 that we could extend the fabric to server hypervisor.

The question related to L3 ECMP versus L2 MLAG become moot as with existing
BGP EVPN load balancing procedures with EVPN type 4 default gateway DF
election we can achieve all active multi homed load balancing from the
hypervisor.  As was mentioned RFC 8365 since vxlan evpn does not use ESI
the local bias feature would have to be used for split horizon.

Of course with the extension to the hypervisor we would use are existing
orchestration of the fabric to manage the server hypervisor layer.

Has this ever been done before and with which hypervisors ?

Kind regards

Gyan

On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 7:58 PM Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Gyan,
>
> On open source side of things - FRR supports EVPN on the host.
> Any vendor virtualized NOS would provide you the same (at least Junos/cRP=
D
> or  XRv).
> EVPN ESI load-sharing eliminates need for MLAG (basic thought, the devil
> is in the details :))
> ECMP vs LAG load-balancing - the algorithms supported are quite similar,
> in some code bases actually the same, so this statement is not really
> correct.
>
> Would be glad to better understand your requirements and help you!
>
> Regards,
> Jeff
>
> On Mar 2, 2020, at 16:00, Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> =EF=BB=BF
>
> Thanks Robert for the quick response
>
> Just thinking out loud -  I can see there maybe some advantages of
> elimination of L2 to the host but the one major disadvantage is that BGP
> multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing so not as desirable
> from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash.
>
> Other big down side is most enterprises have the hypervisor managed by
> server admins but if you run BGP now that ends up shifting to network.
> More complicated.
>
> Kind regards
>
> Gyan
>
> On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:39 PM Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net> wrote:
>
>> Hi Gyan,
>>
>> Similar architecture has been invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now
>> that project after they got acquired by Juniper has been renamed to
>> Tungsten Fabric https://tungsten.io/ while Juniper continued to keep the
>> original project's name and commercial flavor of it. No guarantees of an=
y
>> product quality at this point.
>>
>> Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor BGP to the host. The proposed above
>> alternative were well thought out and turned to work ways far more
>> efficient and practical if you zoom into details.
>>
>> Best,
>> Robert.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Dear BESS WG
>>>
>>> Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in the Data Center arena to
>>> extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor making the Hyperviso=
r
>>> part of the  vxlan fabric.  This could eliminate use of MLAG on the lea=
f
>>> switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereby
>>> maximizing  stability.
>>>
>>> Kind regards,
>>>
>>> Gyan
>>> --
>>>
>>> Gyan  Mishra
>>>
>>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>>
>>> Verizon
>>>
>>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>>
>>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>>
>>> Email: gyan.s..mishra@verizon.com <gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> BESS mailing list
>>> BESS@ietf.org
>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>>>
>> --
>
> Gyan  Mishra
>
> Network Engineering & Technology
>
> Verizon
>
> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>
> Phone: 301 502-1347
>
> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>
> --

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

--00000000000017495f05a00dbf82
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Thank you all for the feedback!!</div><div=
><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Our requirements we ar looki=
ng for a way to increase stability without sacrificing bandwidth availabili=
ty and convergence with Data Center host connectivity to an existing vxlan =
fabric.=C2=A0 Our server traffic volume is higher bandwidth East to West th=
en North to South.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">We ha=
ve a Cisco Nexus based vxlan evpn fabric with multi site feature connecting=
 all of our PODs intra DC and use BGP EVPN over an MPLS core for DCI inter =
connect inter Data Center connectivity.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><d=
iv dir=3D"auto">We have orchestration via Cisco NSO and DCNM for network pr=
ogrammability.=C2=A0 Typical Cisco shop.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><=
div dir=3D"auto">Our Data Center host attachment model as been with MLAG us=
ing Cisco=E2=80=99s vPC.=C2=A0 That has been problematic having that L2 ext=
ension so we would like to find a better way to maybe leverage our existing=
 vxlan fabric and extend to server hypervisor if at all possible. =C2=A0</d=
iv><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">So with a hypervisor conne=
cted to two leaf switches in a vxlan fabric =C2=A0it sounds like it maybe p=
ossible with Cisco=E2=80=99s IETF standards based implementation of vxlan o=
verlay following NVO3 RFC 8365 and BGP EVPN RFC 7432 that we could extend t=
he fabric to server hypervisor.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=
=3D"auto">The question related to L3 ECMP versus L2 MLAG become moot as wit=
h existing BGP EVPN load balancing procedures with EVPN type 4 default gate=
way DF election we can achieve all active multi homed load balancing from t=
he hypervisor.=C2=A0 As was mentioned RFC 8365 since vxlan evpn does not us=
e ESI the local bias feature would have to be used for split horizon.</div>=
<div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Of course with the extension =
to the hypervisor we would use are existing orchestration of the fabric to =
manage the server hypervisor layer.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div d=
ir=3D"auto">Has this ever been done before and with which hypervisors ?</di=
v><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind regards=C2=A0</div><di=
v dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Gyan</div><br><div class=3D"gmai=
l_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 7:58 =
PM Jeff Tantsura &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jefftant.ietf@gmail.com">jefftant.ie=
tf@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" styl=
e=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div di=
r=3D"auto">Gyan,<div><br></div><div>On open source side of things - FRR sup=
ports EVPN on the host.</div><div>Any vendor virtualized NOS would provide =
you the same (at least Junos/cRPD or =C2=A0XRv).</div><div>EVPN ESI load-sh=
aring eliminates need for MLAG (basic thought, the devil is in the details =
:))</div><div>ECMP vs LAG load-balancing - the algorithms supported are qui=
te similar, in some code bases actually the same, so this statement is not =
really correct.</div><div><br></div><div>Would be glad to better understand=
 your requirements and help you!<br><br><div dir=3D"ltr">Regards,<div>Jeff<=
/div></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br><blockquote type=3D"cite">On Mar 2, 2020, a=
t 16:00, Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D=
"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></blockquote></div><bl=
ockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr">=EF=BB=BF<div><br></div><div><div d=
ir=3D"auto">Thanks Robert for the quick=C2=A0response</div><div dir=3D"auto=
"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Just thinking out loud - =C2=A0I can see ther=
e maybe some advantages of elimination of L2 to the host but the one major =
disadvantage is that BGP multipath provides flow based uneven load balancin=
g so not as desirable from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Sr=
c/Dest/Port hash.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Other =
big down side is most enterprises have the hypervisor managed by server adm=
ins but if you run BGP now that ends up shifting to network.=C2=A0 More com=
plicated. =C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind=C2=
=A0regards</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Gyan</div><br=
><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Mon, M=
ar 2, 2020 at 6:39 PM Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:robert@raszuk.net=
" target=3D"_blank">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote c=
lass=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;=
padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr">Hi Gyan,<div><br></div><div>Similar arch=
itecture has been invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now that project a=
fter they got acquired=C2=A0by Juniper has been renamed to Tungsten Fabric=
=C2=A0<a href=3D"https://tungsten.io/" target=3D"_blank">https://tungsten.i=
o/</a>=C2=A0while Juniper continued to keep the original project&#39;s name=
 and commercial flavor of it. No guarantees of any product quality at this =
point.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor BGP to =
the host. The proposed above alternative were well thought out and turned t=
o work ways far more efficient and practical if you zoom into details.=C2=
=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Best,</div><div>Robert.</div><div><br></div></=
div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"></div><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div di=
r=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan Mishra =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@=
gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div></div><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockqu=
ote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px=
 solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"></blockquote></div><div class=3D"=
gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px =
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"=
auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Dear BESS WG</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br><=
/div><div dir=3D"auto">Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in the D=
ata Center arena to extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor maki=
ng the Hypervisor part of the =C2=A0vxlan fabric.=C2=A0 This could eliminat=
e use of MLAG on the leaf switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxl=
an fabric thereby maximizing =C2=A0stability.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></=
div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind regards,</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div d=
ir=3D"auto">Gyan</div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div di=
r=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"lt=
r"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, seri=
f"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#00=
0000">yan=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=
=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; =
Technology=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D=
"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNo=
rmal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spr=
ing, MD 20904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#0=
00000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"Ms=
oNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: =
<a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s..mish=
ra@verizon.com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br>=
</div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote></=
div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div><div dir=3D"aut=
o"><div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div class=3D"gmail=
_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border=
-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquo=
te class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px =
solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
_______________________________________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><br>
</blockquote></div>
</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr" data-smartmail=3D"gmail_si=
gnature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000=
000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=C2=A0 Mishra</font></fo=
nt></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"ge=
orgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</font></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">V=
erizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#00=
0000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20904</font></p><p class=3D=
"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Phon=
e: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"=
#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@ver=
izon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></font></p><p clas=
s=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div></div></div></div></div>=
</div></div></div></div>
<span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span>BESS =
mailing list</span><br><span><a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_bl=
ank">BESS@ietf.org</a></span><br><span><a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mail=
man/listinfo/bess" target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/=
bess</a></span><br></div></blockquote></div></div></blockquote></div></div>=
-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature" data-smartmail=3D"gmail_s=
ignature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000=
000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=C2=A0 Mishra</font></fo=
nt></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"ge=
orgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</font></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">V=
erizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#00=
0000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20904</font></p><p class=3D=
"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Phon=
e: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"=
#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@ver=
izon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></font></p><p clas=
s=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div></div></div></div></div>=
</div></div></div></div>

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From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2020 16:57:05 -0500
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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Thank you Yuya!!

On Wed, Mar 4, 2020 at 11:58 AM Yuya KAWAKAMI <yuyarin@yuyarin.net> wrote:

> Hi Gyan and Robert,
>
>  > This could eliminate use of MLAG on the leaf switches
>
> Contrail/Tungsten just provide L2/L3 overlay routes to Compute via
> XMPP(MP-BGP), not support underlay multipath.
> At this time, vRouter of Contrail/Tungsten does not follow changes in the
> routing table of host OS.
> So there are still MLAG or Virtual-Chassis or VRRP and I'm struggling with
> them.
> This is just implementation issue and will be resolved in the future.
>
> Just for your information,
> Yuya
> SDN Tech Lead, NTT
>
> On 2020/03/03 9:07, Robert Raszuk wrote:
> > Hi Gyan,
> >
> > You are touching subject close to me so let me share my perspective on
> your doubts below ;)
> >
> >  > maybe some advantages of elimination of L2 to the host
> >
> > Not some but huge !
> >
> >  >  BGP multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing
> >
> > First Contrail/Tungsten does not use BGP to the hypervisor but XMPP. But
> this is opaque to your concern.
> >
> > Load balancing and hashing construction is your choice, BGP or XMPP only
> deliver you next hops .. how you spread traffic to them is 100% up to your
> choice. That is the same on hypervisor or on any decent router. LAGs also
> build hash in the way you configure them to do so..
> >
> >  >  hypervisor managed by server admins
> >
> > In any decent network or for that matter even in my lab this is all 100%
> automated. You run one template and execute it. Ansible works pretty well,
> but there are other choices too.
> >
> > Many thx,
> > R.
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 1:00 AM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com
> <mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> >
> >     Thanks Robert for the quick response
> >
> >     Just thinking out loud -  I can see there maybe some advantages of
> elimination of L2 to the host but the one major disadvantage is that BGP
> multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing so not as desirable
> from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash..
> >
> >     Other big down side is most enterprises have the hypervisor managed
> by server admins but if you run BGP now that ends up shifting to network.
> More complicated.
> >
> >     Kind regards
> >
> >     Gyan
> >
> >     On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:39 PM Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net
> <mailto:robert@raszuk.net>> wrote:
> >
> >         Hi Gyan,
> >
> >         Similar architecture has been invented and shipped by Contrail
> team. Now that project after they got acquired by Juniper has been renamed
> to Tungsten Fabric https://tungsten..io/ <https://tungsten.io/> while
> Juniper continued to keep the original project's name and commercial flavor
> of it. No guarantees of any product quality at this point.
> >
> >         Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor BGP to the host. The proposed
> above alternative were well thought out and turned to work ways far more
> efficient and practical if you zoom into details.
> >
> >         Best,
> >         Robert.
> >
> >
> >         On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan Mishra <
> hayabusagsm@gmail.com <mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> >
> >             Dear BESS WG
> >
> >             Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in the Data
> Center arena to extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor making
> the Hypervisor part of the  vxlan fabric.  This could eliminate use of MLAG
> on the leaf switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric
> thereby maximizing  stability.
> >
> >             Kind regards,
> >
> >             Gyan
> >             --
> >
> >             Gyan  Mishra
> >
> >             Network Engineering & Technology
> >
> >             Verizon
> >
> >             Silver Spring, MD 20904
> >
> >             Phone: 301 502-1347
> >
> >             Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com <mailto:
> gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com>
> >
> >
> >
> >             _______________________________________________
> >             BESS mailing list
> >             BESS@ietf.org <mailto:BESS@ietf.org>
> >             https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
> >
> >     --
> >
> >     Gyan  Mishra
> >
> >     Network Engineering & Technology
> >
> >     Verizon
> >
> >     Silver Spring, MD 20904
> >
> >     Phone: 301 502-1347
> >
> >     Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com <mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > BESS mailing list
> > BESS@ietf.org
> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>
-- 

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

--000000000000fa5c9b05a00e8066
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Thank you Yuya!!</div><div><br><div class=
=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Wed, Mar 4, 2020 =
at 11:58 AM Yuya KAWAKAMI &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:yuyarin@yuyarin.net">yuyari=
n@yuyarin.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" sty=
le=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Hi Gya=
n and Robert,<br>
<br>
=C2=A0&gt; This could eliminate use of MLAG on the leaf switches<br>
<br>
Contrail/Tungsten just provide L2/L3 overlay routes to Compute via XMPP(MP-=
BGP), not support underlay multipath.<br>
At this time, vRouter of Contrail/Tungsten does not follow changes in the r=
outing table of host OS.<br>
So there are still MLAG or Virtual-Chassis or VRRP and I&#39;m struggling w=
ith them.<br>
This is just implementation issue and will be resolved in the future.<br>
<br>
Just for your information,<br>
Yuya<br>
SDN Tech Lead, NTT<br>
<br>
On 2020/03/03 9:07, Robert Raszuk wrote:<br>
&gt; Hi Gyan,<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; You are touching subject close to me so let me share my perspective on=
 your doubts below ;)<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 &gt; maybe some advantages of elimination of L2 to the host<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Not some but huge !<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 &gt;=C2=A0 BGP multipath provides flow based uneven load balanci=
ng<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; First Contrail/Tungsten does not use BGP to the hypervisor=C2=A0but XM=
PP. But this is opaque to your concern.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Load balancing and hashing construction is your choice, BGP or XMPP on=
ly deliver you next hops .. how you spread traffic to them is 100% up to yo=
ur choice. That is the same on hypervisor or on any decent router. LAGs als=
o build hash in the way you configure them to do so..<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 &gt;=C2=A0 hypervisor managed by server admins<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; In any decent network=C2=A0or for that=C2=A0matter even in my lab this=
=C2=A0is all 100% automated. You run one template and execute it. Ansible w=
orks pretty well, but there=C2=A0are other choices too.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Many thx,<br>
&gt; R.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 1:00 AM Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayab=
usagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a> &lt;mailto:<a=
 href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.=
com</a>&gt;&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Thanks Robert for the quick=C2=A0response<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Just thinking out loud - =C2=A0I can see there mayb=
e some advantages of elimination of L2 to the host but the one major disadv=
antage is that BGP multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing so n=
ot as desirable from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest=
/Port hash..<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Other big down side is most enterprises have the hy=
pervisor managed by server admins but if you run BGP now that ends up shift=
ing to network.=C2=A0 More complicated.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Kind=C2=A0regards<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Gyan<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:39 PM Robert Raszuk &lt;<a=
 href=3D"mailto:robert@raszuk.net" target=3D"_blank">robert@raszuk.net</a> =
&lt;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:robert@raszuk.net" target=3D"_blank">robert@ra=
szuk.net</a>&gt;&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Hi Gyan,<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Similar architecture has been invente=
d and shipped by Contrail team. Now that project after they got acquired=C2=
=A0by Juniper has been renamed to Tungsten Fabric <a href=3D"https://tungst=
en." rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://tungsten.</a>.io/ &lt;<a =
href=3D"https://tungsten.io/" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://=
tungsten.io/</a>&gt;=C2=A0while Juniper continued to keep the original proj=
ect&#39;s name and commercial flavor of it. No guarantees of any product qu=
ality at this point.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor BGP to =
the host. The proposed above alternative were well thought out and turned t=
o work ways far more efficient and practical if you zoom into details.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Best,<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Robert.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan =
Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">hayab=
usagsm@gmail.com</a> &lt;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt;&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Dear BESS WG<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Is anyone aware of any =
IETF BGP development in the Data Center arena to extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a=
 blade server Hypervisor making the Hypervisor part of the =C2=A0vxlan fabr=
ic.=C2=A0 This could eliminate use of MLAG on the leaf switches and elimina=
te L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereby maximizing =C2=A0stability.<=
br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Kind regards,<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Gyan<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0-- <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Gyan=C2=A0 Mishra<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Network Engineering &am=
p; Technology<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Verizon<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Silver Spring, MD 20904=
<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Phone: 301 502-1347<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Email: <a href=3D"mailt=
o:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a=
> &lt;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank"=
>gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a>&gt;<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0_______________________=
________________________<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0BESS mailing list<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@=
ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a> &lt;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:=
BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0<a href=3D"https://www.=
ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https:=
//www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0-- <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Gyan=C2=A0 Mishra<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Network Engineering &amp; Technology<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Verizon<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Silver Spring, MD 20904<br>
&gt; <br>
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From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
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Subject: Re: [bess] IETF 107 BESS meeting will be cancelled
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Hi Stephane,

=20

> Due to new coming corporate travel restrictions associated to this

> Coronavirus, there will be no chair or secretary attending the

> IETF 107 physically.

=20

That=E2=80=99s a shame, but understandable.

=20

> We will have to cancel the BESS sessions unfortunately.

=20

That does not follow from the previous statement. Remote chairing, proxy =
chairing, etc., etc. are possibilities.

Consider that interim meetings are usually virtual these days, and work =
fine.

=20

> For your information, we received only 2 slots requests for now,

> while in general the agenda was almost full.

=20

Now, that is a good reason not to have a 3.5 hours of meetings =
=F0=9F=98=8A

But also, it should be easy to have 20 minutes of meeting (virtual or =
otherwise) to accommodate those 2 slots.

Wednesday morning in Canada would even fit within the chairs=E2=80=99 =
domestic time zones.

=20

If, on the other hand, you were going to reject the 2 slot requests =
leaving an empty agenda, that=E2=80=99s a different matter.

=20

> We, chairs, will keep you posted soon on the way we will proceed

> to do a sync-up before next IETF physical meeting.

=20

Thanks. That is much appreciated.

=20

Best,

Adrian

=20


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--></style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext=3D"edit" spidmax=3D"1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext=3D"edit">
<o:idmap v:ext=3D"edit" data=3D"1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DEN-GB =
link=3D"#0563C1" vlink=3D"#954F72"><div class=3DWordSection1><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>Hi Stephane,<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>&gt; Due to new coming corporate travel restrictions =
associated to this<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>&gt; </span><span lang=3DEN-US>Coronavirus, there will be =
no chair or secretary attending the<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US>&gt; </span><span lang=3DEN-US>IETF =
107 physically.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>That=E2=80=99s a shame, but =
understandable.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>&gt; We will have to cancel the BESS sessions =
unfortunately.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>That does not follow from the previous statement. Remote =
chairing, proxy chairing, etc., etc. are =
possibilities.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>Consider that interim meetings are usually virtual these =
days, and work fine.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>&gt; For your information, we received only 2 slots =
requests for now,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>&gt; </span><span lang=3DEN-US>while in general the agenda =
was almost full.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>Now, that is a good reason not to have a 3.5 hours of =
meetings </span><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-family:"Segoe UI =
Emoji",sans-serif'>&#128522;</span><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>But also, it should be easy to have 20 minutes of meeting =
(virtual or otherwise) to accommodate those 2 =
slots.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>Wednesday morning in Canada would even fit within the =
chairs=E2=80=99 domestic time zones.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US>If, on the other hand, you were =
going to reject the 2 slot requests leaving an empty agenda, =
that=E2=80=99s a different matter.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US>&gt; We, chairs, will keep you =
posted soon on the way we will proceed<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US>&gt; </span><span lang=3DEN-US>to =
do a sync-up before next IETF physical meeting.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US>Thanks. That is much =
appreciated.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US>Adrian<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div></body></html>
------=_NextPart_000_0828_01D5F2C5.45533DE0--


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From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2020 17:03:54 -0500
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To: Sandy Breeze <sandy.breeze@eu.clara.net>
Cc: BESS <bess@ietf.org>, Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>,  Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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Hi Sandy

Thank you for the feedback on your use cases.

For now will remain L2 MLAG to the host.

BESS WG,

If anyone hears of any new developments on vxlan fabric extension to
hypervisor and any vendors supporting even 3rd party open source
implementations of fabric extensions please reach out to me.

As an aside when reading RFC 8365 NVO3 section 7  it kind of gets excited
by the subject heading =E2=80=9Csingle homed NVE residing in Hypervisor=E2=
=80=9D or section
8 MH NVE in TOR server - thinking that maybe fabric extension to hypervisor
does actually exist but of course the let down that no vendor supports it.

It does seem there would be a lot of customers wanting this fabric
extension to hypervisor capabilities for MH load balancing- and very
surprising that it does not exist.

https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8365#section-7



Kind regards

Gyan Mishra
Verizon
Cell 301 502-1347

On Wed, Mar 4, 2020 at 4:57 PM Sandy Breeze <sandy.breeze@eu.clara.net>
wrote:

> Hi Gyan,
>
>
>
> Here, we use a mix of NXOS & Arista EOS for leaf and spine, ASR9k DCI
> doing L2 + L3 VTEP and stitching to MPLS EVPN / traditional VPNv4/6.  We
> also confess to pockets of proprietary NXOS vPC, and, pockets of Arista
> ESI-MH.  Incidentally, the older Broadcom NXOS boxes do have ESI-MH
> capabilities and that worked alright.  Customers, like us, have been long
> promised the vendor silicon will catch up, though we=E2=80=99ve yet to se=
e it
> happen.
>
>
>
> We=E2=80=99re entirely a home grown automation / orchestration stack, wit=
h many
> years behind it.  Have a look at some talks we=E2=80=99ve given publicly =
for the
> background in our =E2=80=98GOLF=E2=80=99 project.
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DjXOrdHfBqb0&t=3D
>
>
>
> > Has this ever been done before and with which hypervisors ?
>
> We had the same requirements as you 2-3 years ago.  Have we solved it?
> TL;DR: not really!  We did make an interesting proof of concept though=E2=
=80=A6
>
> Being largely a VMWare NSX house, we found VMWare closed to offering any
> type of EVPN orchestrated VTEP extension into the physical fabric.  Quite
> simply, its model of extending to physical VTEP is OVSDB.  That=E2=80=99s=
 not
> exactly compatible with an EVPN ToR, for various reasons.  So, we had the
> idea that we=E2=80=99d build something which spoke both OVSDB (to NSX) an=
d EVPN (to
> the physical ToR).  The high level idea being, we=E2=80=99d use this to c=
reate
> routes in EVPN if they were seen from OVSDB, and visa-versa, only we=E2=
=80=99d
> maintain the original next-hop.  Kinda like an iBGP RR, only between 2
> different control-planes.  Internally, we called it VxGlue.
>
>
>
> At a high level, it worked well in achieving nice loadbalancing of traffi=
c
> into the hypervisor.  It would no doubt scale fairly well too.  Is it the
> right thing to do in a production network?  We decided not.  For one, its
> very hard to keep up with pace of development of underlying VMWare API=E2=
=80=99s.
> As I say, this was a few years ago and things have moved on.  Maybe we=E2=
=80=99ll
> revisit.
>
>
>
> Sandy
>
>
>
>
>
> On 04/03/2020, 21:03, "BESS on behalf of Gyan Mishra" <
> bess-bounces@ietf.org on behalf of hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> Thank you all for the feedback!!
>
>
>
> Our requirements we ar looking for a way to increase stability without
> sacrificing bandwidth availability and convergence with Data Center host
> connectivity to an existing vxlan fabric.  Our server traffic volume is
> higher bandwidth East to West then North to South.
>
>
>
> We have a Cisco Nexus based vxlan evpn fabric with multi site feature
> connecting all of our PODs intra DC and use BGP EVPN over an MPLS core fo=
r
> DCI inter connect inter Data Center connectivity.
>
>
>
> We have orchestration via Cisco NSO and DCNM for network programmability.
> Typical Cisco shop.
>
>
>
> Our Data Center host attachment model as been with MLAG using Cisco=E2=80=
=99s
> vPC.  That has been problematic having that L2 extension so we would like
> to find a better way to maybe leverage our existing vxlan fabric and exte=
nd
> to server hypervisor if at all possible.
>
>
>
> So with a hypervisor connected to two leaf switches in a vxlan fabric  it
> sounds like it maybe possible with Cisco=E2=80=99s IETF standards based
> implementation of vxlan overlay following NVO3 RFC 8365 and BGP EVPN RFC
> 7432 that we could extend the fabric to server hypervisor.
>
>
>
> The question related to L3 ECMP versus L2 MLAG become moot as with
> existing BGP EVPN load balancing procedures with EVPN type 4 default
> gateway DF election we can achieve all active multi homed load balancing
> from the hypervisor.  As was mentioned RFC 8365 since vxlan evpn does not
> use ESI the local bias feature would have to be used for split horizon.
>
>
>
> Of course with the extension to the hypervisor we would use are existing
> orchestration of the fabric to manage the server hypervisor layer.
>
>
>
> Has this ever been done before and with which hypervisors ?
>
>
>
> Kind regards
>
>
>
> Gyan
>
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 7:58 PM Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> Gyan,
>
>
>
> On open source side of things - FRR supports EVPN on the host.
>
> Any vendor virtualized NOS would provide you the same (at least Junos/cRP=
D
> or  XRv).
>
> EVPN ESI load-sharing eliminates need for MLAG (basic thought, the devil
> is in the details :))
>
> ECMP vs LAG load-balancing - the algorithms supported are quite similar,
> in some code bases actually the same, so this statement is not really
> correct.
>
>
>
> Would be glad to better understand your requirements and help you!
>
> Regards,
>
> Jeff
>
>
>
> On Mar 2, 2020, at 16:00, Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> Thanks Robert for the quick response
>
>
>
> Just thinking out loud -  I can see there maybe some advantages of
> elimination of L2 to the host but the one major disadvantage is that BGP
> multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing so not as desirable
> from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash.
>
>
>
> Other big down side is most enterprises have the hypervisor managed by
> server admins but if you run BGP now that ends up shifting to network.
> More complicated.
>
>
>
> Kind regards
>
>
>
> Gyan
>
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:39 PM Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net> wrote:
>
> Hi Gyan,
>
>
>
> Similar architecture has been invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now
> that project after they got acquired by Juniper has been renamed to
> Tungsten Fabric https://tungsten.io/
> <https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Ftung=
sten.io%2F&data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433ba=
eee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C63718952594698=
4085&sdata=3DYOxnBjXir%2B%2Br4h2Emgz0%2BMkYxBrR75TpcLWqEuXiftY%3D&reserved=
=3D0> while
> Juniper continued to keep the original project's name and commercial flav=
or
> of it. No guarantees of any product quality at this point.
>
>
>
> Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor BGP to the host. The proposed above
> alternative were well thought out and turned to work ways far more
> efficient and practical if you zoom into details.
>
>
>
> Best,
>
> Robert.
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote=
:
>
>
>
> Dear BESS WG
>
>
>
> Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in the Data Center arena to
> extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor making the Hypervisor
> part of the  vxlan fabric.  This could eliminate use of MLAG on the leaf
> switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereby
> maximizing  stability.
>
>
>
> Kind regards,
>
>
>
> Gyan
>
> --
>
> Gyan  Mishra
>
> Network Engineering & Technology
>
> Verizon
>
> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>
> Phone: 301 502-1347
>
> Email: gyan.s..mishra@verizon.com <gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
> <https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.=
ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu.cla=
ra.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c15947cf5=
6%7C0%7C0%7C637189525946994081&sdata=3DioGt83d8%2FQ%2FUFiA9L0T%2BgrGmoDBiqA=
DpUzw7kaRfxhI%3D&reserved=3D0>
>
> --
>
> Gyan  Mishra
>
> Network Engineering & Technology
>
> Verizon
>
> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>
> Phone: 301 502-1347
>
> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
> <https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.=
ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu.cla=
ra.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c15947cf5=
6%7C0%7C0%7C637189525947004076&sdata=3DCEduzdoebDfvYoDdqSQJEafpKGKycyM5YpCY=
OYviX%2FE%3D&reserved=3D0>
>
> --
>
> Gyan  Mishra
>
> Network Engineering & Technology
>
> Verizon
>
> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>
> Phone: 301 502-1347
>
> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>
>
>
>
>
--=20

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

--00000000000027b49c05a022b727
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div><div dir=3D"auto">Hi Sandy=C2=A0</div></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></di=
v><div dir=3D"auto">Thank you for the feedback on your use cases.</div><div=
 dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">For now will remain L2 MLAG to th=
e host.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">BESS WG,</div><d=
iv dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">If anyone hears of any new deve=
lopments on vxlan fabric extension to hypervisor and any vendors supporting=
 even 3rd party open source implementations of fabric extensions please rea=
ch out to me.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">As an asid=
e when reading RFC 8365 NVO3 section 7 =C2=A0it kind of gets excited by the=
 subject heading =E2=80=9Csingle homed NVE residing in Hypervisor=E2=80=9D =
or section 8 MH NVE in TOR server - thinking that maybe fabric extension to=
 hypervisor does actually exist but of course the let down that no vendor s=
upports it.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">It does seem=
 there would be a lot of customers wanting this fabric extension to hypervi=
sor capabilities for MH load balancing- and very surprising that it does no=
t exist.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><div><a href=3D=
"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8365#section-7">https://tools.ietf.org/html=
/rfc8365#section-7</a></div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=
=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind regards=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"a=
uto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Gyan Mishra=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto">V=
erizon</div><div dir=3D"auto">Cell 301 502-1347</div><div><br><div class=3D=
"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Wed, Mar 4, 2020 at =
4:57 PM Sandy Breeze &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sandy.breeze@eu.clara.net">sandy=
.breeze@eu.clara.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quo=
te" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"=
>





<div lang=3D"EN-GB" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">
<div class=3D"m_-7618998331414318212WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>Hi Gyan,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>Here, we use a mix of NXOS &amp; Arista EOS fo=
r leaf and spine, ASR9k DCI doing L2 + L3 VTEP and stitching to MPLS EVPN /=
 traditional VPNv4/6.=C2=A0 We also confess to pockets of proprietary NXOS =
vPC, and,
 pockets of Arista ESI-MH.=C2=A0 Incidentally, the older Broadcom NXOS boxe=
s do have ESI-MH capabilities and that worked alright.=C2=A0 Customers, lik=
e us, have been long promised the vendor silicon will catch up, though we=
=E2=80=99ve yet to see it happen.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>We=E2=80=99re entirely a home grown automation=
 / orchestration stack, with many years behind it.=C2=A0 Have a look at som=
e talks we=E2=80=99ve given publicly for the background in our =E2=80=98GOL=
F=E2=80=99 project.=C2=A0
</span><a href=3D"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DjXOrdHfBqb0&amp;t=3D" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DjXOrdHfBqb0&amp;t=3D</a>=
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>&gt;</span> Has this ever been done before and=
 with which hypervisors ?<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We had the same requirements as you 2-3 years ago.=
=C2=A0 Have we solved it?=C2=A0 TL;DR: not really!=C2=A0 We did make an int=
eresting proof of concept though=E2=80=A6=C2=A0
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Being largely a VMWare NSX house, we found VMWare cl=
osed to offering any type of EVPN orchestrated VTEP extension into the phys=
ical fabric.=C2=A0 Quite simply, its model of extending to physical VTEP is=
 OVSDB.=C2=A0 That=E2=80=99s not exactly compatible
 with an EVPN ToR, for various reasons.=C2=A0 So, we had the idea that we=
=E2=80=99d build something which spoke both OVSDB (to NSX) and EVPN (to the=
 physical ToR).=C2=A0 The high level idea being, we=E2=80=99d use this to c=
reate routes in EVPN if they were seen from OVSDB, and visa-versa,
 only we=E2=80=99d maintain the original next-hop.=C2=A0 Kinda like an iBGP=
 RR, only between 2 different control-planes.=C2=A0 Internally, we called i=
t VxGlue.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">At a high level, it worked well in achieving nice lo=
adbalancing of traffic into the hypervisor.=C2=A0 It would no doubt scale f=
airly well too.=C2=A0 Is it the right thing to do in a production network?=
=C2=A0 We decided not.=C2=A0 For one, its very hard to
 keep up with pace of development of underlying VMWare API=E2=80=99s.=C2=A0=
 As I say, this was a few years ago and things have moved on.=C2=A0 Maybe w=
e=E2=80=99ll revisit.</p></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-GB" link=3D"blue" vlin=
k=3D"purple"><div class=3D"m_-7618998331414318212WordSection1"><p class=3D"=
MsoNormal"><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sandy<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">On 04/03/2020, 21:03, &=
quot;BESS on behalf of Gyan Mishra&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess-bounces=
@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess-bounces@ietf.org</a> on behalf of
<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmai=
l.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Thank you all for the f=
eedback!!<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Our requirements we ar =
looking for a way to increase stability without sacrificing bandwidth avail=
ability and convergence with Data Center host connectivity to an existing v=
xlan fabric.=C2=A0 Our server traffic volume
 is higher bandwidth East to West then North to South.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">We have a Cisco Nexus b=
ased vxlan evpn fabric with multi site feature connecting all of our PODs i=
ntra DC and use BGP EVPN over an MPLS core for DCI inter connect inter Data=
 Center connectivity.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">We have orchestration v=
ia Cisco NSO and DCNM for network programmability.=C2=A0 Typical Cisco shop=
.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Our Data Center host at=
tachment model as been with MLAG using Cisco=E2=80=99s vPC.=C2=A0 That has =
been problematic having that L2 extension so we would like to find a better=
 way to maybe leverage our existing vxlan fabric
 and extend to server hypervisor if at all possible. =C2=A0<u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">So with a hypervisor co=
nnected to two leaf switches in a vxlan fabric =C2=A0it sounds like it mayb=
e possible with Cisco=E2=80=99s IETF standards based implementation of vxla=
n overlay following NVO3 RFC 8365 and BGP EVPN RFC
 7432 that we could extend the fabric to server hypervisor.<u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">The question related to=
 L3 ECMP versus L2 MLAG become moot as with existing BGP EVPN load balancin=
g procedures with EVPN type 4 default gateway DF election we can achieve al=
l active multi homed load balancing
 from the hypervisor.=C2=A0 As was mentioned RFC 8365 since vxlan evpn does=
 not use ESI the local bias feature would have to be used for split horizon=
.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Of course with the exte=
nsion to the hypervisor we would use are existing orchestration of the fabr=
ic to manage the server hypervisor layer.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Has this ever been done=
 before and with which hypervisors ?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Kind regards=C2=A0<u></=
u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at =
7:58 PM Jeff Tantsura &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jefftant.ietf@gmail.com" target=
=3D"_blank">jefftant.ietf@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0c=
m 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Gyan, <u></u><u></u></p=
>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">On open source side of =
things - FRR supports EVPN on the host.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Any vendor virtualized =
NOS would provide you the same (at least Junos/cRPD or =C2=A0XRv).<u></u><u=
></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">EVPN ESI load-sharing e=
liminates need for MLAG (basic thought, the devil is in the details :))<u><=
/u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">ECMP vs LAG load-balanc=
ing - the algorithms supported are quite similar, in some code bases actual=
ly the same, so this statement is not really correct.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margi=
n-left:36.0pt">
Would be glad to better understand your requirements and help you!<u></u><u=
></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Regards, <u></u><u></u>=
</p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Jeff<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><br>
<br>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margi=
n-left:36.0pt">
On Mar 2, 2020, at 16:00, Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gma=
il.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u=
></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Thanks Robert for the q=
uick=C2=A0response<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Just thinking out loud =
- =C2=A0I can see there maybe some advantages of elimination of L2 to the h=
ost but the one major disadvantage is that BGP multipath provides flow base=
d uneven load balancing so not as desirable
 from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash.<u><=
/u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Other big down side is =
most enterprises have the hypervisor managed by server admins but if you ru=
n BGP now that ends up shifting to network.=C2=A0 More complicated. =C2=A0<=
u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Kind=C2=A0regards<u></u=
><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at =
6:39 PM Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:robert@raszuk.net" target=3D"_b=
lank">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0c=
m 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Hi Gyan, <u></u><u></u>=
</p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Similar architecture ha=
s been invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now that project after they g=
ot acquired=C2=A0by Juniper has been renamed to Tungsten Fabric=C2=A0<a hre=
f=3D"https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Ftu=
ngsten.io%2F&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c=
2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C63718952=
5946984085&amp;sdata=3DYOxnBjXir%2B%2Br4h2Emgz0%2BMkYxBrR75TpcLWqEuXiftY%3D=
&amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https://tungsten.io/</a>=C2=A0while
 Juniper continued to keep the original project&#39;s name and commercial f=
lavor of it. No guarantees of any product quality at this point.=C2=A0<u></=
u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Btw ,,, no need for VXL=
AN nor BGP to the host. The proposed above alternative were well thought ou=
t and turned to work ways far more efficient and practical if you zoom into=
 details.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Best,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Robert.<u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at =
12:26 AM Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D=
"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0c=
m 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Dear BESS WG<u></u><u><=
/u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Is anyone aware of any =
IETF BGP development in the Data Center arena to extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a=
 blade server Hypervisor making the Hypervisor part of the =C2=A0vxlan fabr=
ic.=C2=A0 This could eliminate use of MLAG on
 the leaf switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereb=
y maximizing =C2=A0stability.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Kind regards,<u></u><u>=
</u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Gyan=C2=A0 Mishra</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Verizon=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Silver Spring, MD 20904</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Phone: 301 502-1347</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank=
">
gyan.s..mishra@verizon.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0c=
m 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0c=
m 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">_______________________=
________________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2=
F%2Fwww.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.bre=
eze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5f=
ab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525946994081&amp;sdata=3DioGt83d8%2FQ%2FUFiA9=
L0T%2BgrGmoDBiqADpUzw7kaRfxhI%3D&amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https:=
//www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><u></u><u></u></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Gyan=C2=A0 Mishra</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Verizon=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Silver Spring, MD 20904</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Phone: 301 502-1347</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank=
">
gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">_______________________=
________________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2=
F%2Fwww.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.bre=
eze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5f=
ab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525947004076&amp;sdata=3DCEduzdoebDfvYoDdqSQJ=
EafpKGKycyM5YpCYOYviX%2FE%3D&amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https://ww=
w.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Gyan=C2=A0 Mishra</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Verizon=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Silver Spring, MD 20904</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Phone: 301 502-1347</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank=
">
gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature" =
data-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><=
div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font si=
ze=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=
=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" colo=
r=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=
=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" =
face=3D"georgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><fon=
t size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20=
904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" fac=
e=3D"georgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><=
font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D=
"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.=
com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div=
></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>

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From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2020 19:51:00 -0500
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Subject: Re: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd-04
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I have read the draft and I support WG adoption.

Kind regards

Gyan

On Wed, Mar 4, 2020 at 2:43 AM <xiao.min2@zte.com.cn> wrote:

> Hi Matthew,
>
>
> I've read this draft and I supoort WG adoption.
>
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Xiao Min
> =E5=8E=9F=E5=A7=8B=E9=82=AE=E4=BB=B6
> *=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA=EF=BC=9A*Bocci,Matthew(Nokia-GB) <matthew.bo=
cci@nokia.com>
> *=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA=EF=BC=9A*draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd@ietf.org <=
draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd@ietf.org
> >;bess@ietf.org <bess@ietf.org>;
> *=E6=8A=84=E9=80=81=E4=BA=BA=EF=BC=9A*bess-chairs@ietf.org <bess-chairs@i=
etf.org>;
> *=E6=97=A5 =E6=9C=9F =EF=BC=9A*2020=E5=B9=B402=E6=9C=8826=E6=97=A5 22:42
> *=E4=B8=BB =E9=A2=98 =EF=BC=9A**[bess] WG adoption poll for draft-gmsm-be=
ss-evpn-bfd-04*
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>
> Hello,
>
>
>
> This email begins a two-weeks WG adoption poll for
> draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd-04 [1] .
>
>
>
> Please review the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group
> list.
>
>
>
> We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to
> this Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with
> IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).
>
>
>
> If you are listed as an author or a contributor of this document, please
> respond to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any
> relevant undisclosed IPR, copying the BESS mailing list. The document won=
't
> progress without answers from all the authors and contributors.
>
>
>
> Currently, there are no IPR disclosures against this document.
>
>
>
> If you are not listed as an author or a contributor, then please
> explicitly respond only if you are aware of any IPR that has not yet been
> disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.
>
>
>
> This poll for adoption closes on Wednesday 11th March 2020.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Matthew and Stephane
>
>
>
> [1] https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd/
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>
--=20

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

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<div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">I have read the draft and I support WG ado=
ption.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind=C2=A0regards=
</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Gyan</div><div><br><div=
 class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Wed, Mar 4,=
 2020 at 2:43 AM &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:xiao.min2@zte.com.cn">xiao.min2@zte.=
com.cn</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"m=
argin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><p style=
=3D"font-size:14px;font-family:arial">Hi Matthew,</p><p style=3D"font-size:=
14px;font-family:arial"><br></p><p style=3D"font-size:14px;font-family:aria=
l">I&#39;ve read this draft and I supoort WG adoption.</p><p style=3D"font-=
size:14px;font-family:arial"><br></p><p style=3D"font-size:14px;font-family=
:arial">Best Regards,</p><p style=3D"font-size:14px;font-family:arial">Xiao=
 Min</p><div><div></div></div><div></div><div><div style=3D"display:block">=
<div style=3D"width:100%;height:28px;line-height:28px;background-color:#e0e=
5e9;color:#1388ff;text-align:center">=E5=8E=9F=E5=A7=8B=E9=82=AE=E4=BB=B6</=
div><div id=3D"m_-3946015078755079591zwriteHistoryContainer"><div><div styl=
e=3D"padding:8px;background-color:#f5f6f8"><div><strong>=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=
=E4=BA=BA=EF=BC=9A</strong><span>Bocci,Matthew(Nokia-GB) &lt;<a href=3D"mai=
lto:matthew.bocci@nokia.com" target=3D"_blank">matthew.bocci@nokia.com</a>&=
gt;</span></div><div><strong>=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA=EF=BC=9A</strong><=
span style=3D"display:inline"><a href=3D"mailto:draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd@ie=
tf.org" target=3D"_blank">draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd@ietf.org</a> &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">draft-gmsm-=
bess-evpn-bfd@ietf.org</a>&gt;;</span><span style=3D"display:inline"><a hre=
f=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a> &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a>&gt;;</span></=
div><div><strong>=E6=8A=84=E9=80=81=E4=BA=BA=EF=BC=9A</strong><span style=
=3D"display:inline"><a href=3D"mailto:bess-chairs@ietf.org" target=3D"_blan=
k">bess-chairs@ietf.org</a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess-chairs@ietf.org" tar=
get=3D"_blank">bess-chairs@ietf.org</a>&gt;;</span></div><div><strong>=E6=
=97=A5 =E6=9C=9F =EF=BC=9A</strong><span>2020=E5=B9=B402=E6=9C=8826=E6=97=
=A5 22:42</span></div><div><strong>=E4=B8=BB =E9=A2=98 =EF=BC=9A</strong><s=
pan><strong>[bess] WG adoption poll for draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd-04</strong=
></span></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><div><div><div style=3D"d=
isplay:block"><div id=3D"m_-3946015078755079591zwriteHistoryContainer"><div=
><div></div><div><div>_______________________________________________<br>BE=
SS=C2=A0mailing=C2=A0list<br><a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_bl=
ank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br><a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/=
bess" target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><br><=
br><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:black">Hello,<u></u><u>=
</u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;tex=
t-align:start;word-spacing:0px"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u=
></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;te=
xt-align:start;word-spacing:0px"><span style=3D"color:black">This email beg=
ins a two-weeks WG<span>=C2=A0</span></span><span style=3D"color:white;back=
ground:#6a5a00">adoption</span><span><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0</sp=
an></span><span style=3D"color:black">poll
 for draft-gmsm-bess-evpn-bfd-04 [1] .<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"=
MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p><p cl=
ass=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;word-s=
pacing:0px"><span style=3D"color:black">Please review the draft and post an=
y comments to the BESS working group list.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;word-spac=
ing:0px"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p><p clas=
s=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;word-spa=
cing:0px"><span style=3D"color:black">We are also=C2=A0polling for knowledg=
e of any undisclosed IPR that applies to this Document, to ensure that IPR =
has been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, =
3669 and 5378 for more details).<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNor=
mal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;word-spacing:0px"><=
span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNo=
rmal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;word-spacing:0px">=
<span style=3D"color:black">If you are listed as an author or a contributor=
 of this document, please respond to this email and indicate whether or not=
 you are aware of any relevant undisclosed IPR, copying the BESS mailing li=
st. The document won&#39;t progress without
 answers from all the authors and contributors.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p =
class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;word=
-spacing:0px"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p><p=
 class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;wor=
d-spacing:0px"><span style=3D"color:black">Currently, there are no IPR disc=
losures against this document.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNorma=
l" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;word-spacing:0px"><sp=
an style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNorm=
al" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;word-spacing:0px"><s=
pan style=3D"color:black">If you are not listed as an author or a contribut=
or, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any IPR that ha=
s not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.<u></u><u></u></spa=
n></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:s=
tart;word-spacing:0px"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></sp=
an></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:=
start;word-spacing:0px"><span style=3D"color:black">This poll for<span>=C2=
=A0</span></span><span style=3D"color:white;background:#6a5a00">adoption</s=
pan><span><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0</span></span><span style=3D"co=
lor:black">closes
 on Wednesday 11th March 2020. =C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"M=
soNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;word-spacing:0=
px"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"=
MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;word-spacing:=
0px"><span style=3D"color:black">Regards,<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;word-spac=
ing:0px"><span style=3D"color:black">Matthew<span>=C2=A0and Stephane</span>=
<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-caps:=
normal;text-align:start;word-spacing:0px"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=
=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"font-variant-ca=
ps:normal;text-align:start;word-spacing:0px"><span style=3D"color:black">[1=
]=C2=A0</span><a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-gmsm-bess-e=
vpn-bfd/" target=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-gmsm-bes=
s-evpn-bfd/</a><u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"colo=
r:black"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"fon=
t-variant-caps:normal;text-align:start;word-spacing:0px"><span style=3D"col=
or:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=
=A0<u></u></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><p><br></p></div>__=
_____________________________________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><br>
</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature" =
data-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><=
div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font si=
ze=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=
=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" colo=
r=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=
=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" =
face=3D"georgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><fon=
t size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20=
904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" fac=
e=3D"georgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><=
font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D=
"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.=
com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div=
></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>

--000000000000c0cf3205a0250c59--


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Reply-To: <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: "'Bocci, Matthew \(Nokia - GB\)'" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>, <draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org>, <bess@ietf.org>
References: <C10DE36B-2593-4C80-A34E-2B7BFFFA14A4@nokia.com>
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Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2020 13:00:22 -0000
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/oIiyYTwEeM2RFrY-g3fRNQXftzU>
Subject: Re: [bess] REMINDER Re:  WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation Poll for draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04
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Hi Matt,=20

Sorry, did I miss this before?

I am not aware of any IPR that needs to be disclosed and has not already =
been disclosed for this document.

=20

Of course (?) I support progressing this work which I think is a simple =
addition to enable quite a lot of function. I still regret that we used =
the =E2=80=9Cdatacentre-gateway=E2=80=9D file name as the document is =
about SR-enabled domains as indicated in the Title and Abstract.

=20

Looking back at my email trail, there was a final point of discussion =
with Stephane that I am not sure was completely resolved: Stephane?

=20

Also, since -04 expired, would you like me to post a keep-alive -05?

=20

Thanks,

Adrian

=20

From: Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB) <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>=20
Sent: 26 February 2020 11:29
To: draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org; bess@ietf.org
Subject: REMINDER Re: [bess] WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation Poll =
for draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04

=20

WG

=20

I have only seen one IPR responses to this WG last call and no comments. =
I will therefore extend it for another two weeks.

=20

Regards

=20

Matthew

=20

From: BESS <bess-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - =
GB)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>
Date: Monday, 10 February 2020 at 16:17
To: "draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org" =
<draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" =
<bess@ietf.org>
Subject: [bess] WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation Poll for =
draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04

=20


This email starts a two-week working group last call for =
draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04


Please review the draft and send any comments to the BESS list. Also, =
please indicate if you support publishing the draft as a standards track =
RFC.

=20

This poll runs until Monday 24th February 2020.

=20

We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to =
this Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with =
IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).

If you are listed as an Author or a Contributor of this document please =
respond to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any =
relevant undisclosed IPR. The Document won't progress without answers =
from all the Authors and Contributors.=20

There is currently no IPR disclosed. =20

We are also polling for any existing implementation as per [1]. Please =
indicate if you are aware of any implementations of the modified =
protocol described in this draft.

 Thank you,

Matthew

=20

[1]  =
<https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw> =
https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw

=20

=20


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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DEN-GB =
link=3D"#0563C1" vlink=3Dpurple><div class=3DWordSection1><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Hi Matt, =
<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Sorry, did I miss this =
before?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>I am not aware of any IPR that needs to be =
disclosed and has not already been disclosed for this =
document.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Of course (?) I =
support progressing this work which I think is a simple addition to =
enable quite a lot of function. I still regret that we used the =
=E2=80=9Cdatacentre-gateway=E2=80=9D file name as the document is about =
SR-enabled domains as indicated in the Title and =
Abstract.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Looking back at my =
email trail, there was a final point of discussion with Stephane that I =
am not sure was completely resolved: Stephane?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Also, since -04 =
expired, would you like me to post a keep-alive =
-05?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Thanks,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Adrian<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB'>From:</span></b><sp=
an lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB'> =
Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB) &lt;matthew.bocci@nokia.com&gt; =
<br><b>Sent:</b> 26 February 2020 11:29<br><b>To:</b> =
draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org; =
bess@ietf.org<br><b>Subject:</b> REMINDER Re: [bess] WG Last Call, IPR =
and Implementation Poll for =
draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p=
 class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>WG<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>I have only =
seen one IPR responses to this WG last call and no comments. I will =
therefore extend it for another two weeks.<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>Regards<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>Matthew<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span style=3D'color:black'>From: =
</span></b><span style=3D'color:black'>BESS =
&lt;bess-bounces@ietf.org&gt; on behalf of &quot;Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - =
GB)&quot; &lt;matthew.bocci@nokia.com&gt;<br><b>Date: </b>Monday, 10 =
February 2020 at 16:17<br><b>To: =
</b>&quot;draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org&quot; =
&lt;draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org&gt;, =
&quot;bess@ietf.org&quot; &lt;bess@ietf.org&gt;<br><b>Subject: =
</b>[bess] WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation Poll for =
draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04</span><span =
style=3D'color:black;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB'><o:p></o:p></span></p></=
div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><h1><span =
lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black;font-weight:normal'>This email =
starts a two-week working group last call for =
draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04</span><o:p></o:p></h1><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>Please review =
the draft and send any comments to the BESS list. Also, please indicate =
if you support publishing the draft as a standards track =
RFC.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'caret-color: =
rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;caret-color: rgb(255, 255, =
255);word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>This =
poll runs until Monday 24<sup>th</sup> February =
2020.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;caret-color: rgb(255, 255, =
255);word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px'><span =
style=3D'color:black'>We are also polling for knowledge of any =
undisclosed IPR that applies to this Document, to ensure that IPR has =
been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, =
3669 and 5378 for more details).</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'color:black'>If you are listed as an =
Author or a Contributor of this document please respond to this email =
and indicate whether or not you are aware of any relevant undisclosed =
IPR. The Document won't progress without answers from all the Authors =
and Contributors.&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3Dgmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintex=
t><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>There is currently no IPR =
disclosed.&nbsp;&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3Dgmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintex=
t style=3D'caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>We are also polling for any existing =
implementation as per [1]. Please indicate if you are aware of any =
implementations of the modified protocol described in this =
draft.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3Dgmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintex=
t style=3D'font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;caret-color: rgb(255, 255, =
255);word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp;Thank you,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3Dgmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintex=
t style=3D'font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;caret-color: rgb(255, 255, =
255);word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>Matthew</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;caret-color: rgb(255, 255, =
255);word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;caret-color: rgb(255, 255, =
255);word-spacing:0px'><span style=3D'color:black'>[1]<span =
class=3Dapple-converted-space>&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><a =
href=3D"https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdk=
jqDpw" target=3D"_blank"><span lang=3DFR =
style=3D'color:#03386D'>https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1t=
Tqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps: =
normal;orphans: auto;text-align:start;widows: =
auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: =
0px;word-spacing:0px'><span =
style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div></body></html>
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From: Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2020 08:29:52 -0700
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To: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Cc: Sandy Breeze <sandy.breeze@eu.clara.net>, Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>,  Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>, BESS <bess@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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Gyan, the technology that you look for exists and is about to go standards
RFC (i.e. _scalable_ L3 multihoming to the host including bandwidth
load-balancing and many other things that need consideration in such case,
e.g. host asic table scalability). Please look @
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rift-rift/  If you need more
info/code, more than happy to talk out of band

thanks

-- tony

On Thu, Mar 5, 2020 at 2:04 PM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Sandy
>
> Thank you for the feedback on your use cases.
>
> For now will remain L2 MLAG to the host.
>
> BESS WG,
>
> If anyone hears of any new developments on vxlan fabric extension to
> hypervisor and any vendors supporting even 3rd party open source
> implementations of fabric extensions please reach out to me.
>
> As an aside when reading RFC 8365 NVO3 section 7  it kind of gets excited
> by the subject heading =E2=80=9Csingle homed NVE residing in Hypervisor=
=E2=80=9D or section
> 8 MH NVE in TOR server - thinking that maybe fabric extension to hypervis=
or
> does actually exist but of course the let down that no vendor supports it=
.
>
> It does seem there would be a lot of customers wanting this fabric
> extension to hypervisor capabilities for MH load balancing- and very
> surprising that it does not exist.
>
> https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8365#section-7
>
>
>
> Kind regards
>
> Gyan Mishra
> Verizon
> Cell 301 502-1347
>
> On Wed, Mar 4, 2020 at 4:57 PM Sandy Breeze <sandy..breeze@eu.clara.net
> <sandy.breeze@eu.clara.net>> wrote:
>
>> Hi Gyan,
>>
>>
>>
>> Here, we use a mix of NXOS & Arista EOS for leaf and spine, ASR9k DCI
>> doing L2 + L3 VTEP and stitching to MPLS EVPN / traditional VPNv4/6.  We
>> also confess to pockets of proprietary NXOS vPC, and, pockets of Arista
>> ESI-MH.  Incidentally, the older Broadcom NXOS boxes do have ESI-MH
>> capabilities and that worked alright.  Customers, like us, have been lon=
g
>> promised the vendor silicon will catch up, though we=E2=80=99ve yet to s=
ee it
>> happen.
>>
>>
>>
>> We=E2=80=99re entirely a home grown automation / orchestration stack, wi=
th many
>> years behind it.  Have a look at some talks we=E2=80=99ve given publicly=
 for the
>> background in our =E2=80=98GOLF=E2=80=99 project.
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DjXOrdHfBqb0&t=3D
>>
>>
>>
>> > Has this ever been done before and with which hypervisors ?
>>
>> We had the same requirements as you 2-3 years ago.  Have we solved it?
>> TL;DR: not really!  We did make an interesting proof of concept though=
=E2=80=A6
>>
>> Being largely a VMWare NSX house, we found VMWare closed to offering any
>> type of EVPN orchestrated VTEP extension into the physical fabric.  Quit=
e
>> simply, its model of extending to physical VTEP is OVSDB.  That=E2=80=99=
s not
>> exactly compatible with an EVPN ToR, for various reasons.  So, we had th=
e
>> idea that we=E2=80=99d build something which spoke both OVSDB (to NSX) a=
nd EVPN (to
>> the physical ToR).  The high level idea being, we=E2=80=99d use this to =
create
>> routes in EVPN if they were seen from OVSDB, and visa-versa, only we=E2=
=80=99d
>> maintain the original next-hop.  Kinda like an iBGP RR, only between 2
>> different control-planes.  Internally, we called it VxGlue.
>>
>>
>>
>> At a high level, it worked well in achieving nice loadbalancing of
>> traffic into the hypervisor.  It would no doubt scale fairly well too.  =
Is
>> it the right thing to do in a production network?  We decided not.  For
>> one, its very hard to keep up with pace of development of underlying VMW=
are
>> API=E2=80=99s.  As I say, this was a few years ago and things have moved=
 on.  Maybe
>> we=E2=80=99ll revisit.
>>
>>
>>
>> Sandy
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 04/03/2020, 21:03, "BESS on behalf of Gyan Mishra" <
>> bess-bounces@ietf.org on behalf of hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank you all for the feedback!!
>>
>>
>>
>> Our requirements we ar looking for a way to increase stability without
>> sacrificing bandwidth availability and convergence with Data Center host
>> connectivity to an existing vxlan fabric.  Our server traffic volume is
>> higher bandwidth East to West then North to South.
>>
>>
>>
>> We have a Cisco Nexus based vxlan evpn fabric with multi site feature
>> connecting all of our PODs intra DC and use BGP EVPN over an MPLS core f=
or
>> DCI inter connect inter Data Center connectivity.
>>
>>
>>
>> We have orchestration via Cisco NSO and DCNM for network
>> programmability.  Typical Cisco shop..
>>
>>
>>
>> Our Data Center host attachment model as been with MLAG using Cisco=E2=
=80=99s
>> vPC.  That has been problematic having that L2 extension so we would lik=
e
>> to find a better way to maybe leverage our existing vxlan fabric and ext=
end
>> to server hypervisor if at all possible.
>>
>>
>>
>> So with a hypervisor connected to two leaf switches in a vxlan fabric  i=
t
>> sounds like it maybe possible with Cisco=E2=80=99s IETF standards based
>> implementation of vxlan overlay following NVO3 RFC 8365 and BGP EVPN RFC
>> 7432 that we could extend the fabric to server hypervisor.
>>
>>
>>
>> The question related to L3 ECMP versus L2 MLAG become moot as with
>> existing BGP EVPN load balancing procedures with EVPN type 4 default
>> gateway DF election we can achieve all active multi homed load balancing
>> from the hypervisor.  As was mentioned RFC 8365 since vxlan evpn does no=
t
>> use ESI the local bias feature would have to be used for split horizon..
>>
>>
>>
>> Of course with the extension to the hypervisor we would use are existing
>> orchestration of the fabric to manage the server hypervisor layer.
>>
>>
>>
>> Has this ever been done before and with which hypervisors ?
>>
>>
>>
>> Kind regards
>>
>>
>>
>> Gyan
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 7:58 PM Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Gyan,
>>
>>
>>
>> On open source side of things - FRR supports EVPN on the host.
>>
>> Any vendor virtualized NOS would provide you the same (at least
>> Junos/cRPD or  XRv).
>>
>> EVPN ESI load-sharing eliminates need for MLAG (basic thought, the devil
>> is in the details :))
>>
>> ECMP vs LAG load-balancing - the algorithms supported are quite similar,
>> in some code bases actually the same, so this statement is not really
>> correct.
>>
>>
>>
>> Would be glad to better understand your requirements and help you!
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Jeff
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mar 2, 2020, at 16:00, Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks Robert for the quick response
>>
>>
>>
>> Just thinking out loud -  I can see there maybe some advantages of
>> elimination of L2 to the host but the one major disadvantage is that BGP
>> multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing so not as desirable
>> from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash.
>>
>>
>>
>> Other big down side is most enterprises have the hypervisor managed by
>> server admins but if you run BGP now that ends up shifting to network.
>> More complicated.
>>
>>
>>
>> Kind regards
>>
>>
>>
>> Gyan
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:39 PM Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Gyan,
>>
>>
>>
>> Similar architecture has been invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now
>> that project after they got acquired by Juniper has been renamed to
>> Tungsten Fabric https://tungsten.io/
>> <https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Ftun=
gsten.io%2F&data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433b=
aeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C6371895259469=
84085&sdata=3DYOxnBjXir%2B%2Br4h2Emgz0%2BMkYxBrR75TpcLWqEuXiftY%3D&reserved=
=3D0> while
>> Juniper continued to keep the original project's name and commercial fla=
vor
>> of it. No guarantees of any product quality at this point.
>>
>>
>>
>> Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor BGP to the host. The proposed above
>> alternative were well thought out and turned to work ways far more
>> efficient and practical if you zoom into details.
>>
>>
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Robert.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Dear BESS WG
>>
>>
>>
>> Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in the Data Center arena to
>> extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor making the Hypervisor
>> part of the  vxlan fabric.  This could eliminate use of MLAG on the leaf
>> switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereby
>> maximizing  stability.
>>
>>
>>
>> Kind regards,
>>
>>
>>
>> Gyan
>>
>> --
>>
>> Gyan  Mishra
>>
>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>
>> Verizon
>>
>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>
>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>
>> Email: gyan.s..mishra@verizon.com <gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> BESS mailing list
>> BESS@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>> <https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww=
.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu.cl=
ara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c15947cf=
56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525946994081&sdata=3DioGt83d8%2FQ%2FUFiA9L0T%2BgrGmoDBiq=
ADpUzw7kaRfxhI%3D&reserved=3D0>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Gyan  Mishra
>>
>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>
>> Verizon
>>
>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>
>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>
>> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> BESS mailing list
>> BESS@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>> <https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww=
.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu.cl=
ara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c15947cf=
56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525947004076&sdata=3DCEduzdoebDfvYoDdqSQJEafpKGKycyM5YpC=
YOYviX%2FE%3D&reserved=3D0>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Gyan  Mishra
>>
>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>
>> Verizon
>>
>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>
>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>
>> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
> --
>
> Gyan  Mishra
>
> Network Engineering & Technology
>
> Verizon
>
> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>
> Phone: 301 502-1347
>
> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>

--000000000000fc96cd05a06db1de
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><div>Gyan, the technology that you look for exists and is =
about to go standards RFC (i.e. _scalable_ L3 multihoming to the host inclu=
ding bandwidth load-balancing and many other things that need consideration=
 in such case, e.g. host asic table scalability). Please look @ <a href=3D"=
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rift-rift/">https://datatracker=
.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rift-rift/</a>=C2=A0 If you need more info/code, m=
ore than happy to talk out of band <br></div><div><br></div><div>thanks <br=
></div><div><br></div><div>-- tony<br></div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_q=
uote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Thu, Mar 5, 2020 at 2:04 PM =
Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com">hayabusagsm@gmail.=
com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"marg=
in:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1e=
x"><div><div dir=3D"auto">Hi Sandy=C2=A0</div></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br><=
/div><div dir=3D"auto">Thank you for the feedback on your use cases.</div><=
div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">For now will remain L2 MLAG to=
 the host.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">BESS WG,</div=
><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">If anyone hears of any new d=
evelopments on vxlan fabric extension to hypervisor and any vendors support=
ing even 3rd party open source implementations of fabric extensions please =
reach out to me.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">As an a=
side when reading RFC 8365 NVO3 section 7 =C2=A0it kind of gets excited by =
the subject heading =E2=80=9Csingle homed NVE residing in Hypervisor=E2=80=
=9D or section 8 MH NVE in TOR server - thinking that maybe fabric extensio=
n to hypervisor does actually exist but of course the let down that no vend=
or supports it.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">It does =
seem there would be a lot of customers wanting this fabric extension to hyp=
ervisor capabilities for MH load balancing- and very surprising that it doe=
s not exist.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><div><a hre=
f=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8365#section-7" target=3D"_blank">https=
://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8365#section-7</a></div><br></div><div dir=3D"aut=
o"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind regards=C2=
=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Gyan Mishra=C2=A0</d=
iv><div dir=3D"auto">Verizon</div><div dir=3D"auto">Cell 301 502-1347</div>=
<div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">O=
n Wed, Mar 4, 2020 at 4:57 PM Sandy Breeze &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sandy.bree=
ze@eu.clara.net" target=3D"_blank">sandy..breeze@eu.clara.net</a>&gt; wrote=
:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.=
8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-GB">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>Hi Gyan,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>Here, we use a mix of NXOS &amp; Arista EOS fo=
r leaf and spine, ASR9k DCI doing L2 + L3 VTEP and stitching to MPLS EVPN /=
 traditional VPNv4/6.=C2=A0 We also confess to pockets of proprietary NXOS =
vPC, and,
 pockets of Arista ESI-MH.=C2=A0 Incidentally, the older Broadcom NXOS boxe=
s do have ESI-MH capabilities and that worked alright.=C2=A0 Customers, lik=
e us, have been long promised the vendor silicon will catch up, though we=
=E2=80=99ve yet to see it happen.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>We=E2=80=99re entirely a home grown automation=
 / orchestration stack, with many years behind it.=C2=A0 Have a look at som=
e talks we=E2=80=99ve given publicly for the background in our =E2=80=98GOL=
F=E2=80=99 project.=C2=A0
</span><a href=3D"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DjXOrdHfBqb0&amp;t=3D" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DjXOrdHfBqb0&amp;t=3D</a>=
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>&gt;</span> Has this ever been done before and=
 with which hypervisors ?<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We had the same requirements as you 2-3 years ago.=
=C2=A0 Have we solved it?=C2=A0 TL;DR: not really!=C2=A0 We did make an int=
eresting proof of concept though=E2=80=A6=C2=A0
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Being largely a VMWare NSX house, we found VMWare cl=
osed to offering any type of EVPN orchestrated VTEP extension into the phys=
ical fabric.=C2=A0 Quite simply, its model of extending to physical VTEP is=
 OVSDB.=C2=A0 That=E2=80=99s not exactly compatible
 with an EVPN ToR, for various reasons.=C2=A0 So, we had the idea that we=
=E2=80=99d build something which spoke both OVSDB (to NSX) and EVPN (to the=
 physical ToR).=C2=A0 The high level idea being, we=E2=80=99d use this to c=
reate routes in EVPN if they were seen from OVSDB, and visa-versa,
 only we=E2=80=99d maintain the original next-hop.=C2=A0 Kinda like an iBGP=
 RR, only between 2 different control-planes.=C2=A0 Internally, we called i=
t VxGlue.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">At a high level, it worked well in achieving nice lo=
adbalancing of traffic into the hypervisor.=C2=A0 It would no doubt scale f=
airly well too.=C2=A0 Is it the right thing to do in a production network?=
=C2=A0 We decided not.=C2=A0 For one, its very hard to
 keep up with pace of development of underlying VMWare API=E2=80=99s.=C2=A0=
 As I say, this was a few years ago and things have moved on.=C2=A0 Maybe w=
e=E2=80=99ll revisit.</p></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-GB"><div><p class=3D"M=
soNormal"><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sandy<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On 04/03/2020, 21:03, &qu=
ot;BESS on behalf of Gyan Mishra&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess-bounces@i=
etf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess-bounces@ietf.org</a> on behalf of
<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmai=
l.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Thank you all for the fee=
dback!!<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Our requirements we ar lo=
oking for a way to increase stability without sacrificing bandwidth availab=
ility and convergence with Data Center host connectivity to an existing vxl=
an fabric.=C2=A0 Our server traffic volume
 is higher bandwidth East to West then North to South.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">We have a Cisco Nexus bas=
ed vxlan evpn fabric with multi site feature connecting all of our PODs int=
ra DC and use BGP EVPN over an MPLS core for DCI inter connect inter Data C=
enter connectivity.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">We have orchestration via=
 Cisco NSO and DCNM for network programmability.=C2=A0 Typical Cisco shop..=
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Our Data Center host atta=
chment model as been with MLAG using Cisco=E2=80=99s vPC.=C2=A0 That has be=
en problematic having that L2 extension so we would like to find a better w=
ay to maybe leverage our existing vxlan fabric
 and extend to server hypervisor if at all possible. =C2=A0<u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">So with a hypervisor conn=
ected to two leaf switches in a vxlan fabric =C2=A0it sounds like it maybe =
possible with Cisco=E2=80=99s IETF standards based implementation of vxlan =
overlay following NVO3 RFC 8365 and BGP EVPN RFC
 7432 that we could extend the fabric to server hypervisor.<u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">The question related to L=
3 ECMP versus L2 MLAG become moot as with existing BGP EVPN load balancing =
procedures with EVPN type 4 default gateway DF election we can achieve all =
active multi homed load balancing
 from the hypervisor.=C2=A0 As was mentioned RFC 8365 since vxlan evpn does=
 not use ESI the local bias feature would have to be used for split horizon=
..<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Of course with the extens=
ion to the hypervisor we would use are existing orchestration of the fabric=
 to manage the server hypervisor layer.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Has this ever been done b=
efore and with which hypervisors ?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Kind regards=C2=A0<u></u>=
<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 7:=
58 PM Jeff Tantsura &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jefftant.ietf@gmail.com" target=
=3D"_blank">jefftant.ietf@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Gyan, <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On open source side of th=
ings - FRR supports EVPN on the host.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Any vendor virtualized NO=
S would provide you the same (at least Junos/cRPD or =C2=A0XRv).<u></u><u><=
/u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">EVPN ESI load-sharing eli=
minates need for MLAG (basic thought, the devil is in the details :))<u></u=
><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">ECMP vs LAG load-balancin=
g - the algorithms supported are quite similar, in some code bases actually=
 the same, so this statement is not really correct.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-=
left:36pt">
Would be glad to better understand your requirements and help you!<u></u><u=
></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Regards, <u></u><u></u></=
p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Jeff<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><br>
<br>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-=
left:36pt">
On Mar 2, 2020, at 16:00, Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gma=
il.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u=
></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Thanks Robert for the qui=
ck=C2=A0response<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Just thinking out loud - =
=C2=A0I can see there maybe some advantages of elimination of L2 to the hos=
t but the one major disadvantage is that BGP multipath provides flow based =
uneven load balancing so not as desirable
 from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash.<u><=
/u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Other big down side is mo=
st enterprises have the hypervisor managed by server admins but if you run =
BGP now that ends up shifting to network.=C2=A0 More complicated. =C2=A0<u>=
</u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Kind=C2=A0regards<u></u><=
u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:=
39 PM Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:robert@raszuk.net" target=3D"_bla=
nk">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Hi Gyan, <u></u><u></u></=
p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Similar architecture has =
been invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now that project after they got=
 acquired=C2=A0by Juniper has been renamed to Tungsten Fabric=C2=A0<a href=
=3D"https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Ftun=
gsten.io%2F&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2=
433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525=
946984085&amp;sdata=3DYOxnBjXir%2B%2Br4h2Emgz0%2BMkYxBrR75TpcLWqEuXiftY%3D&=
amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https://tungsten.io/</a>=C2=A0while
 Juniper continued to keep the original project&#39;s name and commercial f=
lavor of it. No guarantees of any product quality at this point.=C2=A0<u></=
u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN=
 nor BGP to the host. The proposed above alternative were well thought out =
and turned to work ways far more efficient and practical if you zoom into d=
etails.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Best,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Robert.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12=
:26 AM Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_=
blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Dear BESS WG<u></u><u></u=
></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Is anyone aware of any IE=
TF BGP development in the Data Center arena to extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a b=
lade server Hypervisor making the Hypervisor part of the =C2=A0vxlan fabric=
.=C2=A0 This could eliminate use of MLAG on
 the leaf switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereb=
y maximizing =C2=A0stability.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Kind regards,<u></u><u></=
u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Gyan=C2=A0 Mishra</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Verizon=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Silver Spring, MD 20904</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Phone: 301 502-1347</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank=
">
gyan.s..mishra@verizon.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">_________________________=
______________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2=
F%2Fwww.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.bre=
eze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5f=
ab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525946994081&amp;sdata=3DioGt83d8%2FQ%2FUFiA9=
L0T%2BgrGmoDBiqADpUzw7kaRfxhI%3D&amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https:=
//www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><u></u><u></u></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Gyan=C2=A0 Mishra</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Verizon=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Silver Spring, MD 20904</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Phone: 301 502-1347</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank=
">
gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">_________________________=
______________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2=
F%2Fwww.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.bre=
eze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5f=
ab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525947004076&amp;sdata=3DCEduzdoebDfvYoDdqSQJ=
EafpKGKycyM5YpCYOYviX%2FE%3D&amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https://ww=
w.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Gyan=C2=A0 Mishra</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Verizon=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Silver Spring, MD 20904</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Phone: 301 502-1347</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank=
">
gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div=
 dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D=
"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, s=
erif"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"=
#000000">yan=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font siz=
e=3D"1" face=3D"georgia, serif" color=3D"#000000">Network Engineering &amp;=
 Technology=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" face=3D=
"georgia, serif" color=3D"#000000">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoN=
ormal"><font size=3D"1" face=3D"georgia, serif" color=3D"#000000">Silver Sp=
ring, MD 20904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" face=3D"ge=
orgia, serif" color=3D"#000000">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"M=
soNormal"><font size=3D"1" face=3D"georgia, serif" color=3D"#000000">Email:=
 <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mish=
ra@verizon.com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br>=
</div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>
_______________________________________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><br>
</blockquote></div>

--000000000000fc96cd05a06db1de--


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Reviewer: Ben Niven-Jenkins
Review result: Has Nits

 Hello,

I have been selected as the Routing Directorate reviewer for this draft. The
Routing Directorate seeks to review all routing or routing-related drafts as
they pass through IETF last call and IESG review, and sometimes on special
request. The purpose of the review is to provide assistance to the Routing ADs.
For more information about the Routing Directorate, please see
â€‹http://trac.tools.ietf.org/area/rtg/trac/wiki/RtgDir

Although these comments are primarily for the use of the Routing ADs, it would
be helpful if you could consider them along with any other IETF Last Call
comments that you receive, and strive to resolve them through discussion or by
updating the draft.

Document: draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-05.txt
Reviewer: Ben Niven-Jenkins
Review Date: 9th March 2020
IETF LC End Date: 12th March 2020
Intended Status: Standards Track

Summary: This document is basically ready for publication, but has nits that
should be considered prior to publication.

Comments: This document is readable and presents an easy to follow solution to
a complex problem.

Major Issues: No major issues found.

Minor issues:
Section 3.2 - Deployment Considerations. â€œNote that a CE-ID=0 is invalid and a
PE should discard such an advertisement.â€ Is that really a SHOULD (or a MUST)?

Section 3.3.2.1 - RD. â€œActual process of assigning Route Distinguisher values
must guarantee its uniqueness per PE node.â€ Is that really a MUST?

Section 6.1 - BGP based VPLS. â€œFor compatibility with PEs that use multiple
VE-IDs with non-zero label block values for multi-homing operation, it is a
requirement that a PE receiving such advertisements must use the labels in the
NLRIs associated with lowest VE-ID for PW creation.â€ Is that really a MUST?

Nits:
Section 1 - Introduction introduces the abbreviation BGP MH without expanding
it on first use. As this is the only place in the document where the
abbreviation BGP MH is used, I would suggest just expanding it in the
introduction, i.e. s/BGP MH/BGP multi-homing/

Section 1.1 - General Terminology. You repeat the same two sentences at the end
of paragraph 3 that also constitute paragraph 4: â€˜A VPLS site is a grouping of
ports on a PE that belong to the same VPLS domain.  The terms "VPLS instance"
and "VPLS domain" are used interchangeably in this document.â€™. Remove one of
the sets of repeated sentences.

Section 1.1 - General Terminology, paragraph 5. You say that â€œVPLS siteâ€ and
â€œCE siteâ€ are used interchangeably but the definition of VPLS site doesnâ€™t
mention CEs and â€œCE siteâ€ implies (to me) the site of a particular CE device
which isnâ€™t exactly the same as a â€œVPLS siteâ€ as defined by the document. As
there are only 2 instances of â€œCE siteâ€ in the document (outside of where you
say it is used interchangeably with â€œVPLS siteâ€), you may want to consider just
replacing those 3 instances with â€œVPLS siteâ€ and removing the sentence stating
â€œVPLS siteâ€ and â€œCE siteâ€ are interchangeable in section 1.1.

Section 1.1 - General Terminology, paragraph 6. s/and label base is called as
VE NLRI/and label base is called a VE NLRI/  (i.e. swap â€œasâ€ for â€œaâ€

Section 1.1 - General Terminology, paragraphs 7 & 8. s/Section Section
3.1/Section 3.1/

Section 3.3.3 - Election Procedures. s/specific to designated forwarded
election procedures/specific to designated forwarder election procedures/

Section 3.5 - Pseudowire and Site-ID Binding Properties. The first sentence is
very difficult to parse. I think what you are trying to say is something like
â€œFor the use case where a single PE provides connectivity to a set of CEs where
some CEs are multi-homed and others are not, only a single pseudowire MAY be
established.â€

Section 3.5 - Pseudowire and Site-ID Binding Properties. s/PE3 would
establish/PE3 could establish/  (because using a single PW is optional as per
the earlier MAY)

Section 3.5 - Pseudowire and Site-ID Binding Properties. s/Since label
allocation and pseudowire established is tied to site-ID/Since label allocation
and pseudowire establishment is tied to site-ID/

Regards
Ben



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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the BGP Enabled ServiceS WG of the IETF.

        Title           : Fast Recovery for EVPN DF Election
        Authors         : Ali Sajassi
                          Gaurav Badoni
                          Dhananjaya Rao
                          Patrice Brissette
                          John Drake
                          Jorge Rabadan
	Filename        : draft-ietf-bess-evpn-fast-df-recovery-01.txt
	Pages           : 19
	Date            : 2020-03-09

Abstract:
   Ethernet Virtual Private Network (EVPN) solution [RFC7432] describes
   DF election procedures for multi-homing Ethernet Segments.  These
   procedures are enhanced further in [RFC8584] by applying Highest
   Random Weight Algorithm for DF election in order to avoid DF status
   unnecessarily upon a failure.  This draft makes further improvement
   to DF election procedures in [RFC8584] by providing two options for
   fast DF election upon recovery of the failed link or node associated
   with the multi-homing Ethernet Segment.  This fast DF election is
   achieved independent of number of EVIs associated with that Ethernet
   Segment and it is performed via a simple signaling between the
   recovered PE and each PE in the multi-homing group.


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https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-fast-df-recovery-01

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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the BGP Enabled ServiceS WG of the IETF.

        Title           : EVPN Virtual Ethernet Segment
        Authors         : Ali Sajassi
                          Patrice Brissette
                          Rick Schell
                          John E Drake
                          Jorge Rabadan
	Filename        : draft-ietf-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment-06.txt
	Pages           : 22
	Date            : 2020-03-09

Abstract:
   EVPN and PBB-EVPN introduce a family of solutions for multipoint
   Ethernet services over MPLS/IP network with many advanced features
   among which their multi-homing capabilities.  These solutions
   introduce Single-Active and All-Active for an Ethernet Segment (ES),
   itself defined as a set of physical links between the multi-homed
   device/network and a set of PE devices that they are connected to.
   This document extends the Ethernet Segment concept so that an ES can
   be associated to a set of EVCs (e.g., VLANs) or other objects such as
   MPLS Label Switch Paths (LSPs) or Pseudowires (PWs), referred to as
   Virtual Ethernet Segments (vES).  This draft describes the
   requirements and the extensions needed to support vES in EVPN and
   PBB-EVPN.



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From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 00:14:35 -0400
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To: Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
Cc: Sandy Breeze <sandy.breeze@eu.clara.net>, Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>,  Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>, BESS <bess@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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Hi Tony

I am actually a member of RIFT, as the WG charter description
was intriguing so I joined - to learn more about the RIFT technology.

I downloaded the draft but never made it through as its a lengthy 100+ page
draft.  Now I really have to read it.

Yes that would be great.  Please unicast me on hayabusagsm@gmail.com.

Kind regards

Gyan

On Mon, Mar 9, 2020 at 11:31 AM Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com> wrote=
:

> Gyan, the technology that you look for exists and is about to go standard=
s
> RFC (i.e. _scalable_ L3 multihoming to the host including bandwidth
> load-balancing and many other things that need consideration in such case=
,
> e.g. host asic table scalability). Please look @
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rift-rift/  If you need more
> info/code, more than happy to talk out of band
>
> thanks
>
> -- tony
>
> On Thu, Mar 5, 2020 at 2:04 PM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi Sandy
>>
>> Thank you for the feedback on your use cases.
>>
>> For now will remain L2 MLAG to the host.
>>
>> BESS WG,
>>
>> If anyone hears of any new developments on vxlan fabric extension to
>> hypervisor and any vendors supporting even 3rd party open source
>> implementations of fabric extensions please reach out to me.
>>
>> As an aside when reading RFC 8365 NVO3 section 7  it kind of gets excite=
d
>> by the subject heading =E2=80=9Csingle homed NVE residing in Hypervisor=
=E2=80=9D or section
>> 8 MH NVE in TOR server - thinking that maybe fabric extension to hypervi=
sor
>> does actually exist but of course the let down that no vendor supports i=
t.
>>
>> It does seem there would be a lot of customers wanting this fabric
>> extension to hypervisor capabilities for MH load balancing- and very
>> surprising that it does not exist.
>>
>> https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8365#section-7
>>
>>
>>
>> Kind regards
>>
>> Gyan Mishra
>> Verizon
>> Cell 301 502-1347
>>
>> On Wed, Mar 4, 2020 at 4:57 PM Sandy Breeze <sandy..breeze@eu.clara.net
>> <sandy.breeze@eu.clara.net>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Gyan,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Here, we use a mix of NXOS & Arista EOS for leaf and spine, ASR9k DCI
>>> doing L2 + L3 VTEP and stitching to MPLS EVPN / traditional VPNv4/6.  W=
e
>>> also confess to pockets of proprietary NXOS vPC, and, pockets of Arista
>>> ESI-MH.  Incidentally, the older Broadcom NXOS boxes do have ESI-MH
>>> capabilities and that worked alright.  Customers, like us, have been lo=
ng
>>> promised the vendor silicon will catch up, though we=E2=80=99ve yet to =
see it
>>> happen.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> We=E2=80=99re entirely a home grown automation / orchestration stack, w=
ith many
>>> years behind it.  Have a look at some talks we=E2=80=99ve given publicl=
y for the
>>> background in our =E2=80=98GOLF=E2=80=99 project.
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DjXOrdHfBqb0&t=3D
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> > Has this ever been done before and with which hypervisors ?
>>>
>>> We had the same requirements as you 2-3 years ago.  Have we solved it?
>>> TL;DR: not really!  We did make an interesting proof of concept though=
=E2=80=A6
>>>
>>> Being largely a VMWare NSX house, we found VMWare closed to offering an=
y
>>> type of EVPN orchestrated VTEP extension into the physical fabric.  Qui=
te
>>> simply, its model of extending to physical VTEP is OVSDB.  That=E2=80=
=99s not
>>> exactly compatible with an EVPN ToR, for various reasons.  So, we had t=
he
>>> idea that we=E2=80=99d build something which spoke both OVSDB (to NSX) =
and EVPN (to
>>> the physical ToR).  The high level idea being, we=E2=80=99d use this to=
 create
>>> routes in EVPN if they were seen from OVSDB, and visa-versa, only we=E2=
=80=99d
>>> maintain the original next-hop.  Kinda like an iBGP RR, only between 2
>>> different control-planes.  Internally, we called it VxGlue.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> At a high level, it worked well in achieving nice loadbalancing of
>>> traffic into the hypervisor.  It would no doubt scale fairly well too. =
 Is
>>> it the right thing to do in a production network?  We decided not.  For
>>> one, its very hard to keep up with pace of development of underlying VM=
Ware
>>> API=E2=80=99s.  As I say, this was a few years ago and things have move=
d on.  Maybe
>>> we=E2=80=99ll revisit.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Sandy
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 04/03/2020, 21:03, "BESS on behalf of Gyan Mishra" <
>>> bess-bounces@ietf.org on behalf of hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thank you all for the feedback!!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Our requirements we ar looking for a way to increase stability without
>>> sacrificing bandwidth availability and convergence with Data Center hos=
t
>>> connectivity to an existing vxlan fabric.  Our server traffic volume is
>>> higher bandwidth East to West then North to South.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> We have a Cisco Nexus based vxlan evpn fabric with multi site feature
>>> connecting all of our PODs intra DC and use BGP EVPN over an MPLS core =
for
>>> DCI inter connect inter Data Center connectivity.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> We have orchestration via Cisco NSO and DCNM for network
>>> programmability.  Typical Cisco shop..
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Our Data Center host attachment model as been with MLAG using Cisco=E2=
=80=99s
>>> vPC.  That has been problematic having that L2 extension so we would li=
ke
>>> to find a better way to maybe leverage our existing vxlan fabric and ex=
tend
>>> to server hypervisor if at all possible.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> So with a hypervisor connected to two leaf switches in a vxlan fabric
>>>  it sounds like it maybe possible with Cisco=E2=80=99s IETF standards b=
ased
>>> implementation of vxlan overlay following NVO3 RFC 8365 and BGP EVPN RF=
C
>>> 7432 that we could extend the fabric to server hypervisor.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> The question related to L3 ECMP versus L2 MLAG become moot as with
>>> existing BGP EVPN load balancing procedures with EVPN type 4 default
>>> gateway DF election we can achieve all active multi homed load balancin=
g
>>> from the hypervisor.  As was mentioned RFC 8365 since vxlan evpn does n=
ot
>>> use ESI the local bias feature would have to be used for split horizon.=
.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Of course with the extension to the hypervisor we would use are existin=
g
>>> orchestration of the fabric to manage the server hypervisor layer.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Has this ever been done before and with which hypervisors ?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Kind regards
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Gyan
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 7:58 PM Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Gyan,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On open source side of things - FRR supports EVPN on the host.
>>>
>>> Any vendor virtualized NOS would provide you the same (at least
>>> Junos/cRPD or  XRv).
>>>
>>> EVPN ESI load-sharing eliminates need for MLAG (basic thought, the devi=
l
>>> is in the details :))
>>>
>>> ECMP vs LAG load-balancing - the algorithms supported are quite similar=
,
>>> in some code bases actually the same, so this statement is not really
>>> correct.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Would be glad to better understand your requirements and help you!
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Jeff
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mar 2, 2020, at 16:00, Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks Robert for the quick response
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Just thinking out loud -  I can see there maybe some advantages of
>>> elimination of L2 to the host but the one major disadvantage is that BG=
P
>>> multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing so not as desirable
>>> from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Other big down side is most enterprises have the hypervisor managed by
>>> server admins but if you run BGP now that ends up shifting to network.
>>> More complicated.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Kind regards
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Gyan
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:39 PM Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Gyan,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Similar architecture has been invented and shipped by Contrail team. No=
w
>>> that project after they got acquired by Juniper has been renamed to
>>> Tungsten Fabric https://tungsten.io/
>>> <https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Ftu=
ngsten.io%2F&data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433=
baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525946=
984085&sdata=3DYOxnBjXir%2B%2Br4h2Emgz0%2BMkYxBrR75TpcLWqEuXiftY%3D&reserve=
d=3D0> while
>>> Juniper continued to keep the original project's name and commercial fl=
avor
>>> of it. No guarantees of any product quality at this point.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor BGP to the host. The proposed above
>>> alternative were well thought out and turned to work ways far more
>>> efficient and practical if you zoom into details.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Best,
>>>
>>> Robert.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Dear BESS WG
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in the Data Center arena to
>>> extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor making the Hyperviso=
r
>>> part of the  vxlan fabric.  This could eliminate use of MLAG on the lea=
f
>>> switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereby
>>> maximizing  stability.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Kind regards,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Gyan
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Gyan  Mishra
>>>
>>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>>
>>> Verizon
>>>
>>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>>
>>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>>
>>> Email: gyan.s..mishra@verizon.com <gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> BESS mailing list
>>> BESS@ietf.org
>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>>> <https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fww=
w.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu.c=
lara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c15947c=
f56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525946994081&sdata=3DioGt83d8%2FQ%2FUFiA9L0T%2BgrGmoDBi=
qADpUzw7kaRfxhI%3D&reserved=3D0>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Gyan  Mishra
>>>
>>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>>
>>> Verizon
>>>
>>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>>
>>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>>
>>> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> BESS mailing list
>>> BESS@ietf.org
>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>>> <https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fww=
w.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu.c=
lara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c15947c=
f56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525947004076&sdata=3DCEduzdoebDfvYoDdqSQJEafpKGKycyM5Yp=
CYOYviX%2FE%3D&reserved=3D0>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Gyan  Mishra
>>>
>>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>>
>>> Verizon
>>>
>>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>>
>>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>>
>>> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> --
>>
>> Gyan  Mishra
>>
>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>
>> Verizon
>>
>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>
>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>
>> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> BESS mailing list
>> BESS@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>>
>

--=20

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

--000000000000ccac3f05a0785ddd
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr">Hi Tony<div><br></div><div>I am actually =
a member of RIFT, as the WG charter description was=C2=A0intriguing so I jo=
ined - to learn more about the RIFT technology.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><=
div>I downloaded the draft but never made it through as its a lengthy 100+ =
page draft.=C2=A0 Now I really have to read it.</div></div><div><br></div>Y=
es that would be great.=C2=A0 Please unicast me on <a href=3D"mailto:hayabu=
sagsm@gmail.com">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>.<div><br></div><div>Kind regards=
</div><div><br></div><div>Gyan</div><div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><di=
v dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Mon, Mar 9, 2020 at 11:31 AM Tony Prz=
ygienda &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:tonysietf@gmail.com">tonysietf@gmail.com</a>&=
gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0=
px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div =
dir=3D"ltr"><div>Gyan, the technology that you look for exists and is about=
 to go standards RFC (i.e. _scalable_ L3 multihoming to the host including =
bandwidth load-balancing and many other things that need consideration in s=
uch case, e.g. host asic table scalability). Please look @ <a href=3D"https=
://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rift-rift/" target=3D"_blank">https:=
//datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rift-rift/</a>=C2=A0 If you need more=
 info/code, more than happy to talk out of band <br></div><div><br></div><d=
iv>thanks <br></div><div><br></div><div>-- tony<br></div></div><br><div cla=
ss=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Thu, Mar 5, 202=
0 at 2:04 PM Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" targe=
t=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote clas=
s=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid r=
gb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div><div dir=3D"auto">Hi Sandy=C2=A0</di=
v></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Thank you for the fee=
dback on your use cases.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"=
>For now will remain L2 MLAG to the host.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div>=
<div dir=3D"auto">BESS WG,</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"aut=
o">If anyone hears of any new developments on vxlan fabric extension to hyp=
ervisor and any vendors supporting even 3rd party open source implementatio=
ns of fabric extensions please reach out to me.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br>=
</div><div dir=3D"auto">As an aside when reading RFC 8365 NVO3 section 7 =
=C2=A0it kind of gets excited by the subject heading =E2=80=9Csingle homed =
NVE residing in Hypervisor=E2=80=9D or section 8 MH NVE in TOR server - thi=
nking that maybe fabric extension to hypervisor does actually exist but of =
course the let down that no vendor supports it.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br>=
</div><div dir=3D"auto">It does seem there would be a lot of customers want=
ing this fabric extension to hypervisor capabilities for MH load balancing-=
 and very surprising that it does not exist.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></d=
iv><div dir=3D"auto"><div><a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8365#se=
ction-7" target=3D"_blank">https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8365#section-7</a=
></div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><d=
iv dir=3D"auto">Kind regards=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div di=
r=3D"auto">Gyan Mishra=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto">Verizon</div><div dir=
=3D"auto">Cell 301 502-1347</div><div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div d=
ir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Wed, Mar 4, 2020 at 4:57 PM Sandy Breeze=
 &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sandy.breeze@eu.clara.net" target=3D"_blank">sandy..=
breeze@eu.clara.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quot=
e" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204)=
;padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-GB">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>Hi Gyan,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>Here, we use a mix of NXOS &amp; Arista EOS fo=
r leaf and spine, ASR9k DCI doing L2 + L3 VTEP and stitching to MPLS EVPN /=
 traditional VPNv4/6.=C2=A0 We also confess to pockets of proprietary NXOS =
vPC, and,
 pockets of Arista ESI-MH.=C2=A0 Incidentally, the older Broadcom NXOS boxe=
s do have ESI-MH capabilities and that worked alright.=C2=A0 Customers, lik=
e us, have been long promised the vendor silicon will catch up, though we=
=E2=80=99ve yet to see it happen.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>We=E2=80=99re entirely a home grown automation=
 / orchestration stack, with many years behind it.=C2=A0 Have a look at som=
e talks we=E2=80=99ve given publicly for the background in our =E2=80=98GOL=
F=E2=80=99 project.=C2=A0
</span><a href=3D"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DjXOrdHfBqb0&amp;t=3D" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DjXOrdHfBqb0&amp;t=3D</a>=
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>&gt;</span> Has this ever been done before and=
 with which hypervisors ?<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We had the same requirements as you 2-3 years ago.=
=C2=A0 Have we solved it?=C2=A0 TL;DR: not really!=C2=A0 We did make an int=
eresting proof of concept though=E2=80=A6=C2=A0
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Being largely a VMWare NSX house, we found VMWare cl=
osed to offering any type of EVPN orchestrated VTEP extension into the phys=
ical fabric.=C2=A0 Quite simply, its model of extending to physical VTEP is=
 OVSDB.=C2=A0 That=E2=80=99s not exactly compatible
 with an EVPN ToR, for various reasons.=C2=A0 So, we had the idea that we=
=E2=80=99d build something which spoke both OVSDB (to NSX) and EVPN (to the=
 physical ToR).=C2=A0 The high level idea being, we=E2=80=99d use this to c=
reate routes in EVPN if they were seen from OVSDB, and visa-versa,
 only we=E2=80=99d maintain the original next-hop.=C2=A0 Kinda like an iBGP=
 RR, only between 2 different control-planes.=C2=A0 Internally, we called i=
t VxGlue.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">At a high level, it worked well in achieving nice lo=
adbalancing of traffic into the hypervisor.=C2=A0 It would no doubt scale f=
airly well too.=C2=A0 Is it the right thing to do in a production network?=
=C2=A0 We decided not.=C2=A0 For one, its very hard to
 keep up with pace of development of underlying VMWare API=E2=80=99s.=C2=A0=
 As I say, this was a few years ago and things have moved on.=C2=A0 Maybe w=
e=E2=80=99ll revisit.</p></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-GB"><div><p class=3D"M=
soNormal"><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sandy<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On 04/03/2020, 21:03, &qu=
ot;BESS on behalf of Gyan Mishra&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess-bounces@i=
etf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess-bounces@ietf.org</a> on behalf of
<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmai=
l.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Thank you all for the fee=
dback!!<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Our requirements we ar lo=
oking for a way to increase stability without sacrificing bandwidth availab=
ility and convergence with Data Center host connectivity to an existing vxl=
an fabric.=C2=A0 Our server traffic volume
 is higher bandwidth East to West then North to South.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">We have a Cisco Nexus bas=
ed vxlan evpn fabric with multi site feature connecting all of our PODs int=
ra DC and use BGP EVPN over an MPLS core for DCI inter connect inter Data C=
enter connectivity.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">We have orchestration via=
 Cisco NSO and DCNM for network programmability.=C2=A0 Typical Cisco shop..=
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Our Data Center host atta=
chment model as been with MLAG using Cisco=E2=80=99s vPC.=C2=A0 That has be=
en problematic having that L2 extension so we would like to find a better w=
ay to maybe leverage our existing vxlan fabric
 and extend to server hypervisor if at all possible. =C2=A0<u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">So with a hypervisor conn=
ected to two leaf switches in a vxlan fabric =C2=A0it sounds like it maybe =
possible with Cisco=E2=80=99s IETF standards based implementation of vxlan =
overlay following NVO3 RFC 8365 and BGP EVPN RFC
 7432 that we could extend the fabric to server hypervisor.<u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">The question related to L=
3 ECMP versus L2 MLAG become moot as with existing BGP EVPN load balancing =
procedures with EVPN type 4 default gateway DF election we can achieve all =
active multi homed load balancing
 from the hypervisor.=C2=A0 As was mentioned RFC 8365 since vxlan evpn does=
 not use ESI the local bias feature would have to be used for split horizon=
..<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Of course with the extens=
ion to the hypervisor we would use are existing orchestration of the fabric=
 to manage the server hypervisor layer.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Has this ever been done b=
efore and with which hypervisors ?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Kind regards=C2=A0<u></u>=
<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 7:=
58 PM Jeff Tantsura &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jefftant.ietf@gmail.com" target=
=3D"_blank">jefftant.ietf@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Gyan, <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On open source side of th=
ings - FRR supports EVPN on the host.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Any vendor virtualized NO=
S would provide you the same (at least Junos/cRPD or =C2=A0XRv).<u></u><u><=
/u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">EVPN ESI load-sharing eli=
minates need for MLAG (basic thought, the devil is in the details :))<u></u=
><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">ECMP vs LAG load-balancin=
g - the algorithms supported are quite similar, in some code bases actually=
 the same, so this statement is not really correct.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-=
left:36pt">
Would be glad to better understand your requirements and help you!<u></u><u=
></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Regards, <u></u><u></u></=
p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Jeff<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><br>
<br>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-=
left:36pt">
On Mar 2, 2020, at 16:00, Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gma=
il.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u=
></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Thanks Robert for the qui=
ck=C2=A0response<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Just thinking out loud - =
=C2=A0I can see there maybe some advantages of elimination of L2 to the hos=
t but the one major disadvantage is that BGP multipath provides flow based =
uneven load balancing so not as desirable
 from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash.<u><=
/u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Other big down side is mo=
st enterprises have the hypervisor managed by server admins but if you run =
BGP now that ends up shifting to network.=C2=A0 More complicated. =C2=A0<u>=
</u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Kind=C2=A0regards<u></u><=
u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:=
39 PM Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:robert@raszuk.net" target=3D"_bla=
nk">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Hi Gyan, <u></u><u></u></=
p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Similar architecture has =
been invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now that project after they got=
 acquired=C2=A0by Juniper has been renamed to Tungsten Fabric=C2=A0<a href=
=3D"https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Ftun=
gsten.io%2F&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2=
433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525=
946984085&amp;sdata=3DYOxnBjXir%2B%2Br4h2Emgz0%2BMkYxBrR75TpcLWqEuXiftY%3D&=
amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https://tungsten.io/</a>=C2=A0while
 Juniper continued to keep the original project&#39;s name and commercial f=
lavor of it. No guarantees of any product quality at this point.=C2=A0<u></=
u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN=
 nor BGP to the host. The proposed above alternative were well thought out =
and turned to work ways far more efficient and practical if you zoom into d=
etails.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Best,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Robert.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12=
:26 AM Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_=
blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Dear BESS WG<u></u><u></u=
></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Is anyone aware of any IE=
TF BGP development in the Data Center arena to extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a b=
lade server Hypervisor making the Hypervisor part of the =C2=A0vxlan fabric=
.=C2=A0 This could eliminate use of MLAG on
 the leaf switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereb=
y maximizing =C2=A0stability.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Kind regards,<u></u><u></=
u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Gyan=
=C2=A0 Mishra</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Netwo=
rk Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Veriz=
on=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Silve=
r Spring, MD 20904</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Phone=
: 301 502-1347</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Email=
: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">
gyan.s..mishra@verizon.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">_________________________=
______________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2=
F%2Fwww.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.bre=
eze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5f=
ab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525946994081&amp;sdata=3DioGt83d8%2FQ%2FUFiA9=
L0T%2BgrGmoDBiqADpUzw7kaRfxhI%3D&amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https:=
//www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><u></u><u></u></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Gyan=
=C2=A0 Mishra</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Netwo=
rk Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Veriz=
on=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Silve=
r Spring, MD 20904</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Phone=
: 301 502-1347</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Email=
: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">
gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">_________________________=
______________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2=
F%2Fwww.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.bre=
eze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5f=
ab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525947004076&amp;sdata=3DCEduzdoebDfvYoDdqSQJ=
EafpKGKycyM5YpCYOYviX%2FE%3D&amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https://ww=
w.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Gyan=
=C2=A0 Mishra</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Netwo=
rk Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Veriz=
on=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Silve=
r Spring, MD 20904</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Phone=
: 301 502-1347</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Email=
: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">
gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div=
 dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D=
"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, s=
erif"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"=
#000000">yan=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font siz=
e=3D"1" face=3D"georgia, serif" color=3D"#000000">Network Engineering &amp;=
 Technology=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" face=3D=
"georgia, serif" color=3D"#000000">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoN=
ormal"><font size=3D"1" face=3D"georgia, serif" color=3D"#000000">Silver Sp=
ring, MD 20904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" face=3D"ge=
orgia, serif" color=3D"#000000">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"M=
soNormal"><font size=3D"1" face=3D"georgia, serif" color=3D"#000000">Email:=
 <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mish=
ra@verizon.com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br>=
</div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>
_______________________________________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><br>
</blockquote></div>
</blockquote></div><br clear=3D"all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"=
 class=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr=
"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font size=3D"1=
" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=C2=A0 Mi=
shra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000=
000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</fo=
nt></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"ge=
orgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"=
1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20904</font>=
</p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georg=
ia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=
=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:g=
yan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></=
font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div></div></=
div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>

--000000000000ccac3f05a0785ddd--


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From: Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 00:03:24 -0700
Message-ID: <CA+wi2hOVr2eaoon+MAqCoZ+6FVpp_u23ZuDrrajQ02VULQTY2A@mail.gmail.com>
To: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Cc: Sandy Breeze <sandy.breeze@eu.clara.net>, Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>,  Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>, BESS <bess@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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we're weighing in 161 pages in the last IESG reviews now which is however
not very meaningful ;-) since it's probably 25 pages just IANA request and
it's not just the spec, it's the whole outline of design/narrative/walk
through (folks preferred it that way). With FSMs/algorithms and water-tight
interoperable protocol like it can't be done in 10 easy pages breeze
through (well, one can do that but then customers spend 5 years figuring
out how to interop anything and finding cornercases, not the way RIFT WG is
run ;-)

I'll ping you 1:1 otherwise ;-)

thanks

--- tony

On Mon, Mar 9, 2020 at 9:15 PM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Tony
>
> I am actually a member of RIFT, as the WG charter description
> was intriguing so I joined - to learn more about the RIFT technology.
>
> I downloaded the draft but never made it through as its a lengthy 100+
> page draft.  Now I really have to read it.
>
> Yes that would be great.  Please unicast me on hayabusagsm@gmail.com.
>
> Kind regards
>
> Gyan
>
> On Mon, Mar 9, 2020 at 11:31 AM Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Gyan, the technology that you look for exists and is about to go
>> standards RFC (i.e. _scalable_ L3 multihoming to the host including
>> bandwidth load-balancing and many other things that need consideration i=
n
>> such case, e.g. host asic table scalability). Please look @
>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rift-rift/  If you need more
>> info/code, more than happy to talk out of band
>>
>> thanks
>>
>> -- tony
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 5, 2020 at 2:04 PM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote=
:
>>
>>> Hi Sandy
>>>
>>> Thank you for the feedback on your use cases.
>>>
>>> For now will remain L2 MLAG to the host.
>>>
>>> BESS WG,
>>>
>>> If anyone hears of any new developments on vxlan fabric extension to
>>> hypervisor and any vendors supporting even 3rd party open source
>>> implementations of fabric extensions please reach out to me.
>>>
>>> As an aside when reading RFC 8365 NVO3 section 7  it kind of gets
>>> excited by the subject heading =E2=80=9Csingle homed NVE residing in Hy=
pervisor=E2=80=9D or
>>> section 8 MH NVE in TOR server - thinking that maybe fabric extension t=
o
>>> hypervisor does actually exist but of course the let down that no vendo=
r
>>> supports it.
>>>
>>> It does seem there would be a lot of customers wanting this fabric
>>> extension to hypervisor capabilities for MH load balancing- and very
>>> surprising that it does not exist.
>>>
>>> https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8365#section-7
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Kind regards
>>>
>>> Gyan Mishra
>>> Verizon
>>> Cell 301 502-1347
>>>
>>> On Wed, Mar 4, 2020 at 4:57 PM Sandy Breeze <sandy..breeze@eu.clara.net
>>> <sandy.breeze@eu.clara.net>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Gyan,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Here, we use a mix of NXOS & Arista EOS for leaf and spine, ASR9k DCI
>>>> doing L2 + L3 VTEP and stitching to MPLS EVPN / traditional VPNv4/6.  =
We
>>>> also confess to pockets of proprietary NXOS vPC, and, pockets of Arist=
a
>>>> ESI-MH.  Incidentally, the older Broadcom NXOS boxes do have ESI-MH
>>>> capabilities and that worked alright.  Customers, like us, have been l=
ong
>>>> promised the vendor silicon will catch up, though we=E2=80=99ve yet to=
 see it
>>>> happen.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> We=E2=80=99re entirely a home grown automation / orchestration stack, =
with many
>>>> years behind it.  Have a look at some talks we=E2=80=99ve given public=
ly for the
>>>> background in our =E2=80=98GOLF=E2=80=99 project.
>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DjXOrdHfBqb0&t=3D
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> > Has this ever been done before and with which hypervisors ?
>>>>
>>>> We had the same requirements as you 2-3 years ago.  Have we solved it?
>>>> TL;DR: not really!  We did make an interesting proof of concept though=
=E2=80=A6
>>>>
>>>> Being largely a VMWare NSX house, we found VMWare closed to offering
>>>> any type of EVPN orchestrated VTEP extension into the physical fabric.
>>>> Quite simply, its model of extending to physical VTEP is OVSDB.  That=
=E2=80=99s not
>>>> exactly compatible with an EVPN ToR, for various reasons.  So, we had =
the
>>>> idea that we=E2=80=99d build something which spoke both OVSDB (to NSX)=
 and EVPN (to
>>>> the physical ToR).  The high level idea being, we=E2=80=99d use this t=
o create
>>>> routes in EVPN if they were seen from OVSDB, and visa-versa, only we=
=E2=80=99d
>>>> maintain the original next-hop.  Kinda like an iBGP RR, only between 2
>>>> different control-planes.  Internally, we called it VxGlue.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> At a high level, it worked well in achieving nice loadbalancing of
>>>> traffic into the hypervisor.  It would no doubt scale fairly well too.=
  Is
>>>> it the right thing to do in a production network?  We decided not.  Fo=
r
>>>> one, its very hard to keep up with pace of development of underlying V=
MWare
>>>> API=E2=80=99s.  As I say, this was a few years ago and things have mov=
ed on.  Maybe
>>>> we=E2=80=99ll revisit.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Sandy
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 04/03/2020, 21:03, "BESS on behalf of Gyan Mishra" <
>>>> bess-bounces@ietf.org on behalf of hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Thank you all for the feedback!!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Our requirements we ar looking for a way to increase stability without
>>>> sacrificing bandwidth availability and convergence with Data Center ho=
st
>>>> connectivity to an existing vxlan fabric.  Our server traffic volume i=
s
>>>> higher bandwidth East to West then North to South.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> We have a Cisco Nexus based vxlan evpn fabric with multi site feature
>>>> connecting all of our PODs intra DC and use BGP EVPN over an MPLS core=
 for
>>>> DCI inter connect inter Data Center connectivity.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> We have orchestration via Cisco NSO and DCNM for network
>>>> programmability.  Typical Cisco shop..
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Our Data Center host attachment model as been with MLAG using Cisco=E2=
=80=99s
>>>> vPC.  That has been problematic having that L2 extension so we would l=
ike
>>>> to find a better way to maybe leverage our existing vxlan fabric and e=
xtend
>>>> to server hypervisor if at all possible.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> So with a hypervisor connected to two leaf switches in a vxlan fabric
>>>>  it sounds like it maybe possible with Cisco=E2=80=99s IETF standards =
based
>>>> implementation of vxlan overlay following NVO3 RFC 8365 and BGP EVPN R=
FC
>>>> 7432 that we could extend the fabric to server hypervisor.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The question related to L3 ECMP versus L2 MLAG become moot as with
>>>> existing BGP EVPN load balancing procedures with EVPN type 4 default
>>>> gateway DF election we can achieve all active multi homed load balanci=
ng
>>>> from the hypervisor.  As was mentioned RFC 8365 since vxlan evpn does =
not
>>>> use ESI the local bias feature would have to be used for split horizon=
..
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Of course with the extension to the hypervisor we would use are
>>>> existing orchestration of the fabric to manage the server hypervisor l=
ayer.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Has this ever been done before and with which hypervisors ?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Kind regards
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Gyan
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 7:58 PM Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Gyan,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On open source side of things - FRR supports EVPN on the host.
>>>>
>>>> Any vendor virtualized NOS would provide you the same (at least
>>>> Junos/cRPD or  XRv).
>>>>
>>>> EVPN ESI load-sharing eliminates need for MLAG (basic thought, the
>>>> devil is in the details :))
>>>>
>>>> ECMP vs LAG load-balancing - the algorithms supported are quite
>>>> similar, in some code bases actually the same, so this statement is no=
t
>>>> really correct.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Would be glad to better understand your requirements and help you!
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>>
>>>> Jeff
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Mar 2, 2020, at 16:00, Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Thanks Robert for the quick response
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Just thinking out loud -  I can see there maybe some advantages of
>>>> elimination of L2 to the host but the one major disadvantage is that B=
GP
>>>> multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing so not as desirabl=
e
>>>> from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Other big down side is most enterprises have the hypervisor managed by
>>>> server admins but if you run BGP now that ends up shifting to network.
>>>> More complicated.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Kind regards
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Gyan
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:39 PM Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net> wrote=
:
>>>>
>>>> Hi Gyan,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Similar architecture has been invented and shipped by Contrail team.
>>>> Now that project after they got acquired by Juniper has been renamed t=
o
>>>> Tungsten Fabric https://tungsten.io/
>>>> <https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Ft=
ungsten.io%2F&data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c243=
3baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C63718952594=
6984085&sdata=3DYOxnBjXir%2B%2Br4h2Emgz0%2BMkYxBrR75TpcLWqEuXiftY%3D&reserv=
ed=3D0> while
>>>> Juniper continued to keep the original project's name and commercial f=
lavor
>>>> of it. No guarantees of any product quality at this point.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor BGP to the host. The proposed above
>>>> alternative were well thought out and turned to work ways far more
>>>> efficient and practical if you zoom into details.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Best,
>>>>
>>>> Robert.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Dear BESS WG
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in the Data Center arena t=
o
>>>> extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor making the Hypervis=
or
>>>> part of the  vxlan fabric.  This could eliminate use of MLAG on the le=
af
>>>> switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereby
>>>> maximizing  stability.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Kind regards,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Gyan
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Gyan  Mishra
>>>>
>>>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>>>
>>>> Verizon
>>>>
>>>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>>>
>>>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>>>
>>>> Email: gyan.s..mishra@verizon.com <gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> BESS mailing list
>>>> BESS@ietf.org
>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>>>> <https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fw=
ww.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu.=
clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c15947=
cf56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525946994081&sdata=3DioGt83d8%2FQ%2FUFiA9L0T%2BgrGmoDB=
iqADpUzw7kaRfxhI%3D&reserved=3D0>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Gyan  Mishra
>>>>
>>>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>>>
>>>> Verizon
>>>>
>>>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>>>
>>>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>>>
>>>> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> BESS mailing list
>>>> BESS@ietf.org
>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>>>> <https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fw=
ww.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu.=
clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c15947=
cf56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525947004076&sdata=3DCEduzdoebDfvYoDdqSQJEafpKGKycyM5Y=
pCYOYviX%2FE%3D&reserved=3D0>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Gyan  Mishra
>>>>
>>>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>>>
>>>> Verizon
>>>>
>>>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>>>
>>>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>>>
>>>> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Gyan  Mishra
>>>
>>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>>
>>> Verizon
>>>
>>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>>
>>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>>
>>> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> BESS mailing list
>>> BESS@ietf.org
>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>>>
>>
>
> --
>
> Gyan  Mishra
>
> Network Engineering & Technology
>
> Verizon
>
> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>
> Phone: 301 502-1347
>
> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>
>
>
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div>we&#39;re weighing in 161 pages in the last IESG revi=
ews now which is however not very meaningful ;-) since it&#39;s probably 25=
 pages just IANA request and it&#39;s not just the spec, it&#39;s the whole=
 outline of design/narrative/walk through (folks preferred it that way). Wi=
th FSMs/algorithms and water-tight interoperable protocol like it can&#39;t=
 be done in 10 easy pages breeze through (well, one can do that but then cu=
stomers spend 5 years figuring out how to interop anything and finding corn=
ercases, not the way RIFT WG is run ;-)</div><div><br></div><div>I&#39;ll p=
ing you 1:1 otherwise ;-)</div><div><br></div><div>thanks</div><div><br></d=
iv><div>--- tony <br></div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D=
"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Mon, Mar 9, 2020 at 9:15 PM Gyan Mishra &lt;<=
a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote=
:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.=
8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"lt=
r"><div dir=3D"ltr">Hi Tony<div><br></div><div>I am actually a member of RI=
FT, as the WG charter description was=C2=A0intriguing so I joined - to lear=
n more about the RIFT technology.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>I download=
ed the draft but never made it through as its a lengthy 100+ page draft.=C2=
=A0 Now I really have to read it.</div></div><div><br></div>Yes that would =
be great.=C2=A0 Please unicast me on <a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.co=
m" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>.<div><br></div><div>Kind reg=
ards</div><div><br></div><div>Gyan</div><div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"=
><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Mon, Mar 9, 2020 at 11:31 AM Tony=
 Przygienda &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:tonysietf@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">to=
nysietf@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote"=
 style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);p=
adding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div>Gyan, the technology that you look f=
or exists and is about to go standards RFC (i.e. _scalable_ L3 multihoming =
to the host including bandwidth load-balancing and many other things that n=
eed consideration in such case, e.g. host asic table scalability). Please l=
ook @ <a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rift-rift/" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rift-rift/</a>=
=C2=A0 If you need more info/code, more than happy to talk out of band <br>=
</div><div><br></div><div>thanks <br></div><div><br></div><div>-- tony<br><=
/div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_a=
ttr">On Thu, Mar 5, 2020 at 2:04 PM Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayab=
usagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br=
></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;=
border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div><div dir=3D"a=
uto">Hi Sandy=C2=A0</div></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto=
">Thank you for the feedback on your use cases.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br>=
</div><div dir=3D"auto">For now will remain L2 MLAG to the host.</div><div =
dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">BESS WG,</div><div dir=3D"auto"><b=
r></div><div dir=3D"auto">If anyone hears of any new developments on vxlan =
fabric extension to hypervisor and any vendors supporting even 3rd party op=
en source implementations of fabric extensions please reach out to me.</div=
><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">As an aside when reading RFC=
 8365 NVO3 section 7 =C2=A0it kind of gets excited by the subject heading =
=E2=80=9Csingle homed NVE residing in Hypervisor=E2=80=9D or section 8 MH N=
VE in TOR server - thinking that maybe fabric extension to hypervisor does =
actually exist but of course the let down that no vendor supports it.</div>=
<div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">It does seem there would be a=
 lot of customers wanting this fabric extension to hypervisor capabilities =
for MH load balancing- and very surprising that it does not exist.</div><di=
v dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><div><a href=3D"https://tools.ie=
tf.org/html/rfc8365#section-7" target=3D"_blank">https://tools.ietf.org/htm=
l/rfc8365#section-7</a></div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=
=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind regards=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"a=
uto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Gyan Mishra=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto">V=
erizon</div><div dir=3D"auto">Cell 301 502-1347</div><div><br><div class=3D=
"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Wed, Mar 4, 2020 at =
4:57 PM Sandy Breeze &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sandy.breeze@eu.clara.net" targe=
t=3D"_blank">sandy..breeze@eu.clara.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote=
 class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px so=
lid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-GB">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>Hi Gyan,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>Here, we use a mix of NXOS &amp; Arista EOS fo=
r leaf and spine, ASR9k DCI doing L2 + L3 VTEP and stitching to MPLS EVPN /=
 traditional VPNv4/6.=C2=A0 We also confess to pockets of proprietary NXOS =
vPC, and,
 pockets of Arista ESI-MH.=C2=A0 Incidentally, the older Broadcom NXOS boxe=
s do have ESI-MH capabilities and that worked alright.=C2=A0 Customers, lik=
e us, have been long promised the vendor silicon will catch up, though we=
=E2=80=99ve yet to see it happen.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>We=E2=80=99re entirely a home grown automation=
 / orchestration stack, with many years behind it.=C2=A0 Have a look at som=
e talks we=E2=80=99ve given publicly for the background in our =E2=80=98GOL=
F=E2=80=99 project.=C2=A0
</span><a href=3D"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DjXOrdHfBqb0&amp;t=3D" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DjXOrdHfBqb0&amp;t=3D</a>=
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>&gt;</span> Has this ever been done before and=
 with which hypervisors ?<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We had the same requirements as you 2-3 years ago.=
=C2=A0 Have we solved it?=C2=A0 TL;DR: not really!=C2=A0 We did make an int=
eresting proof of concept though=E2=80=A6=C2=A0
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Being largely a VMWare NSX house, we found VMWare cl=
osed to offering any type of EVPN orchestrated VTEP extension into the phys=
ical fabric.=C2=A0 Quite simply, its model of extending to physical VTEP is=
 OVSDB.=C2=A0 That=E2=80=99s not exactly compatible
 with an EVPN ToR, for various reasons.=C2=A0 So, we had the idea that we=
=E2=80=99d build something which spoke both OVSDB (to NSX) and EVPN (to the=
 physical ToR).=C2=A0 The high level idea being, we=E2=80=99d use this to c=
reate routes in EVPN if they were seen from OVSDB, and visa-versa,
 only we=E2=80=99d maintain the original next-hop.=C2=A0 Kinda like an iBGP=
 RR, only between 2 different control-planes.=C2=A0 Internally, we called i=
t VxGlue.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">At a high level, it worked well in achieving nice lo=
adbalancing of traffic into the hypervisor.=C2=A0 It would no doubt scale f=
airly well too.=C2=A0 Is it the right thing to do in a production network?=
=C2=A0 We decided not.=C2=A0 For one, its very hard to
 keep up with pace of development of underlying VMWare API=E2=80=99s.=C2=A0=
 As I say, this was a few years ago and things have moved on.=C2=A0 Maybe w=
e=E2=80=99ll revisit.</p></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-GB"><div><p class=3D"M=
soNormal"><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sandy<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On 04/03/2020, 21:03, &qu=
ot;BESS on behalf of Gyan Mishra&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess-bounces@i=
etf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess-bounces@ietf.org</a> on behalf of
<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmai=
l.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Thank you all for the fee=
dback!!<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Our requirements we ar lo=
oking for a way to increase stability without sacrificing bandwidth availab=
ility and convergence with Data Center host connectivity to an existing vxl=
an fabric.=C2=A0 Our server traffic volume
 is higher bandwidth East to West then North to South.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">We have a Cisco Nexus bas=
ed vxlan evpn fabric with multi site feature connecting all of our PODs int=
ra DC and use BGP EVPN over an MPLS core for DCI inter connect inter Data C=
enter connectivity.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">We have orchestration via=
 Cisco NSO and DCNM for network programmability.=C2=A0 Typical Cisco shop..=
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Our Data Center host atta=
chment model as been with MLAG using Cisco=E2=80=99s vPC.=C2=A0 That has be=
en problematic having that L2 extension so we would like to find a better w=
ay to maybe leverage our existing vxlan fabric
 and extend to server hypervisor if at all possible. =C2=A0<u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">So with a hypervisor conn=
ected to two leaf switches in a vxlan fabric =C2=A0it sounds like it maybe =
possible with Cisco=E2=80=99s IETF standards based implementation of vxlan =
overlay following NVO3 RFC 8365 and BGP EVPN RFC
 7432 that we could extend the fabric to server hypervisor.<u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">The question related to L=
3 ECMP versus L2 MLAG become moot as with existing BGP EVPN load balancing =
procedures with EVPN type 4 default gateway DF election we can achieve all =
active multi homed load balancing
 from the hypervisor.=C2=A0 As was mentioned RFC 8365 since vxlan evpn does=
 not use ESI the local bias feature would have to be used for split horizon=
..<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Of course with the extens=
ion to the hypervisor we would use are existing orchestration of the fabric=
 to manage the server hypervisor layer.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Has this ever been done b=
efore and with which hypervisors ?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Kind regards=C2=A0<u></u>=
<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 7:=
58 PM Jeff Tantsura &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jefftant.ietf@gmail.com" target=
=3D"_blank">jefftant.ietf@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Gyan, <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On open source side of th=
ings - FRR supports EVPN on the host.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Any vendor virtualized NO=
S would provide you the same (at least Junos/cRPD or =C2=A0XRv).<u></u><u><=
/u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">EVPN ESI load-sharing eli=
minates need for MLAG (basic thought, the devil is in the details :))<u></u=
><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">ECMP vs LAG load-balancin=
g - the algorithms supported are quite similar, in some code bases actually=
 the same, so this statement is not really correct.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-=
left:36pt">
Would be glad to better understand your requirements and help you!<u></u><u=
></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Regards, <u></u><u></u></=
p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Jeff<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><br>
<br>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-=
left:36pt">
On Mar 2, 2020, at 16:00, Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gma=
il.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u=
></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Thanks Robert for the qui=
ck=C2=A0response<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Just thinking out loud - =
=C2=A0I can see there maybe some advantages of elimination of L2 to the hos=
t but the one major disadvantage is that BGP multipath provides flow based =
uneven load balancing so not as desirable
 from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash.<u><=
/u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Other big down side is mo=
st enterprises have the hypervisor managed by server admins but if you run =
BGP now that ends up shifting to network.=C2=A0 More complicated. =C2=A0<u>=
</u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Kind=C2=A0regards<u></u><=
u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:=
39 PM Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:robert@raszuk.net" target=3D"_bla=
nk">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Hi Gyan, <u></u><u></u></=
p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Similar architecture has =
been invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now that project after they got=
 acquired=C2=A0by Juniper has been renamed to Tungsten Fabric=C2=A0<a href=
=3D"https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Ftun=
gsten.io%2F&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2=
433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525=
946984085&amp;sdata=3DYOxnBjXir%2B%2Br4h2Emgz0%2BMkYxBrR75TpcLWqEuXiftY%3D&=
amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https://tungsten.io/</a>=C2=A0while
 Juniper continued to keep the original project&#39;s name and commercial f=
lavor of it. No guarantees of any product quality at this point.=C2=A0<u></=
u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN=
 nor BGP to the host. The proposed above alternative were well thought out =
and turned to work ways far more efficient and practical if you zoom into d=
etails.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Best,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Robert.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12=
:26 AM Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_=
blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Dear BESS WG<u></u><u></u=
></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Is anyone aware of any IE=
TF BGP development in the Data Center arena to extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a b=
lade server Hypervisor making the Hypervisor part of the =C2=A0vxlan fabric=
.=C2=A0 This could eliminate use of MLAG on
 the leaf switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereb=
y maximizing =C2=A0stability.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Kind regards,<u></u><u></=
u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Gyan=
=C2=A0 Mishra</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Netwo=
rk Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Veriz=
on=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Silve=
r Spring, MD 20904</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Phone=
: 301 502-1347</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Email=
: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">
gyan.s..mishra@verizon.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">_________________________=
______________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2=
F%2Fwww.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.bre=
eze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5f=
ab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525946994081&amp;sdata=3DioGt83d8%2FQ%2FUFiA9=
L0T%2BgrGmoDBiqADpUzw7kaRfxhI%3D&amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https:=
//www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><u></u><u></u></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Gyan=
=C2=A0 Mishra</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Netwo=
rk Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Veriz=
on=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Silve=
r Spring, MD 20904</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Phone=
: 301 502-1347</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Email=
: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">
gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">_________________________=
______________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2=
F%2Fwww.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.bre=
eze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5f=
ab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525947004076&amp;sdata=3DCEduzdoebDfvYoDdqSQJ=
EafpKGKycyM5YpCYOYviX%2FE%3D&amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https://ww=
w.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Gyan=
=C2=A0 Mishra</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Netwo=
rk Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Veriz=
on=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Silve=
r Spring, MD 20904</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Phone=
: 301 502-1347</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Email=
: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">
gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div=
 dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D=
"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, s=
erif"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"=
#000000">yan=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font siz=
e=3D"1" face=3D"georgia, serif" color=3D"#000000">Network Engineering &amp;=
 Technology=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" face=3D=
"georgia, serif" color=3D"#000000">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoN=
ormal"><font size=3D"1" face=3D"georgia, serif" color=3D"#000000">Silver Sp=
ring, MD 20904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" face=3D"ge=
orgia, serif" color=3D"#000000">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"M=
soNormal"><font size=3D"1" face=3D"georgia, serif" color=3D"#000000">Email:=
 <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mish=
ra@verizon.com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br>=
</div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>
_______________________________________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><br>
</blockquote></div>
</blockquote></div><br clear=3D"all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"=
><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><=
div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNorma=
l"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font=
><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p cl=
ass=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" face=3D"georgia, serif" color=3D"#000000=
">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNorma=
l"><font size=3D"1" face=3D"georgia, serif" color=3D"#000000">Verizon=C2=A0=
</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" face=3D"georgia, serif" =
color=3D"#000000">Silver Spring, MD 20904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=
<font size=3D"1" face=3D"georgia, serif" color=3D"#000000">Phone: 301 502-1=
347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" face=3D"georgia, seri=
f" color=3D"#000000">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNorm=
al"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>=
</div></div></div></div>
</blockquote></div>

--0000000000009226ba05a07abcbe--


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To: "adrian@olddog.co.uk" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>, "draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
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--_000_7518A9BBFCDA46BF81EA0ACC9B4E0124nokiacom_--


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Subject: [bess] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-05.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the BGP Enabled ServiceS WG of the IETF.

        Title           : Gateway Auto-Discovery and Route Advertisement for Segment Routing Enabled Domain Interconnection
        Authors         : Adrian Farrel
                          John Drake
                          Eric Rosen
                          Keyur Patel
                          Luay Jalil
	Filename        : draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-05.txt
	Pages           : 12
	Date            : 2020-03-11

Abstract:
   Data centers are critical components of the infrastructure used by
   network operators to provide services to their customers.  Data
   centers are attached to the Internet or a backbone network by gateway
   routers.  One data center typically has more than one gateway for
   commercial, load balancing, and resiliency reasons.

   Segment Routing is a popular protocol mechanism for use within a data
   center, but also for steering traffic that flows between two data
   center sites.  In order that one data center site may load balance
   the traffic it sends to another data center site, it needs to know
   the complete set of gateway routers at the remote data center, the
   points of connection from those gateways to the backbone network, and
   the connectivity across the backbone network.

   Segment Routing may also be operated in other domains, such as access
   networks.  Those domains also need to be connected across backbone
   networks through gateways.

   This document defines a mechanism using the BGP Tunnel Encapsulation
   attribute to allow each gateway router to advertise the routes to the
   prefixes in the Segment Routing domains to which it provides access,
   and also to advertise on behalf of each other gateway to the same
   Segment Routing domain.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway/

There are also htmlized versions available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-05
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-05

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-05


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/



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Reply-To: <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: "'Bocci, Matthew \(Nokia - GB\)'" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>, <draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org>, <bess@ietf.org>
References: <C10DE36B-2593-4C80-A34E-2B7BFFFA14A4@nokia.com> <00e001d5f612$b275b380$17611a80$@olddog.co.uk> <7518A9BB-FCDA-46BF-81EA-0ACC9B4E0124@nokia.com>
In-Reply-To: <7518A9BB-FCDA-46BF-81EA-0ACC9B4E0124@nokia.com>
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2020 09:23:51 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/I1nxy60XSbpAdavAvL70d0APjLs>
Subject: Re: [bess] REMINDER Re:  WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation Poll for draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04
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Hi Matthew, WG,

=20

I just posted -05

=20

That is chiefly a keep-alive refresh, but I also updated the IANA =
section and uses to take account of the FCFS allocation of a code point =
for the document.

=20

We still have an open discussion on a minor point with Stephane =
=E2=80=93 I propose we roll that into the last call.

=20

Wrt IPR

*	Eric Rosen
We may be able to rouse him from his retirement slumber, but perhaps =
not.
I have a memory of Eric sending a cover-all email about Auth-48 and IPR, =
but:
- I may be imagining that
- I certainly can=E2=80=99t find it
*	Keyur Patel
We will prod him!

=20

Best,

Adrian

=20

From: Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB) <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>=20
Sent: 10 March 2020 11:35
To: adrian@olddog.co.uk; draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org; =
bess@ietf.org
Subject: Re: REMINDER Re: [bess] WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation =
Poll for draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04

=20

Hi Adrian

=20

Thanks for the response. Yes, please could you refresh the draft to keep =
it alive.=20

=20

I=E2=80=99ve only received IPR responses from you, Luay and John. Please =
could you chase your other co-authors to respond as well.

=20

I also didn=E2=80=99t see any other comments on the list. I suggest we =
put this document back in the WG LC queue so we can iron out any final =
discussion points before running another last call. It would probably =
make sense to inform the spring WG as well since this is really about =
interconnecting SR-enabled domains.

=20

Cheers

=20

Matthew

=20

=20

From: Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
Organisation: Old Dog Consulting
Reply to: "adrian@olddog.co.uk" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
Date: Monday, 9 March 2020 at 13:00
To: "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>, =
"draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org" =
<draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" =
<bess@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: REMINDER Re: [bess] WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation =
Poll for draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04

=20

Hi Matt,=20

Sorry, did I miss this before?

I am not aware of any IPR that needs to be disclosed and has not already =
been disclosed for this document.

=20

Of course (?) I support progressing this work which I think is a simple =
addition to enable quite a lot of function. I still regret that we used =
the =E2=80=9Cdatacentre-gateway=E2=80=9D file name as the document is =
about SR-enabled domains as indicated in the Title and Abstract.

=20

Looking back at my email trail, there was a final point of discussion =
with Stephane that I am not sure was completely resolved: Stephane?

=20

Also, since -04 expired, would you like me to post a keep-alive -05?

=20

Thanks,

Adrian

=20

From: Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB) <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>=20
Sent: 26 February 2020 11:29
To: draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org; bess@ietf.org
Subject: REMINDER Re: [bess] WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation Poll =
for draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04

=20

WG

=20

I have only seen one IPR responses to this WG last call and no comments. =
I will therefore extend it for another two weeks.

=20

Regards

=20

Matthew

=20

From: BESS <bess-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - =
GB)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>
Date: Monday, 10 February 2020 at 16:17
To: "draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org" =
<draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" =
<bess@ietf.org>
Subject: [bess] WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation Poll for =
draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04

=20


This email starts a two-week working group last call for =
draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04


Please review the draft and send any comments to the BESS list. Also, =
please indicate if you support publishing the draft as a standards track =
RFC.

=20

This poll runs until Monday 24th February 2020.

=20

We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to =
this Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with =
IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).

If you are listed as an Author or a Contributor of this document please =
respond to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any =
relevant undisclosed IPR. The Document won't progress without answers =
from all the Authors and Contributors.=20

There is currently no IPR disclosed. =20

We are also polling for any existing implementation as per [1]. Please =
indicate if you are aware of any implementations of the modified =
protocol described in this draft.

 Thank you,

Matthew

=20

[1]  =
<https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw> =
https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw

=20

=20


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link=3D"#0563C1" vlink=3Dpurple><div class=3DWordSection1><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Hi Matthew, =
WG,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>I just posted =
-05<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>That is chiefly a =
keep-alive refresh, but I also updated the IANA section and uses to take =
account of the FCFS allocation of a code point for the =
document.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>We still have an open =
discussion on a minor point with Stephane =E2=80=93 I propose we roll =
that into the last call.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Wrt =
IPR<o:p></o:p></span></p><ul style=3D'margin-top:0cm' type=3Ddisc><li =
class=3DMsoListParagraph style=3D'margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 level1 =
lfo1'><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Eric Rosen<br>We may be able to =
rouse him from his retirement slumber, but perhaps not.<br>I have a =
memory of Eric sending a cover-all email about Auth-48 and IPR, =
but:<br>- I may be imagining that<br>- I certainly can=E2=80=99t find =
it<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=3DMsoListParagraph =
style=3D'margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Keyur Patel<br>We will prod =
him!<o:p></o:p></span></li></ul><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Adrian<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB'>From:</span></b><sp=
an lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB'> =
Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB) &lt;matthew.bocci@nokia.com&gt; =
<br><b>Sent:</b> 10 March 2020 11:35<br><b>To:</b> adrian@olddog.co.uk; =
draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org; =
bess@ietf.org<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: REMINDER Re: [bess] WG Last Call, =
IPR and Implementation Poll for =
draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p=
 class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>Hi =
Adrian<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>Thanks for the response. Yes, please could you refresh =
the draft to keep it alive. <o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>I=E2=80=99ve =
only received IPR responses from you, Luay and John. Please could you =
chase your other co-authors to respond as well.<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>I also =
didn=E2=80=99t see any other comments on the list. I suggest we put this =
document back in the WG LC queue so we can iron out any final discussion =
points before running another last call. It would probably make sense to =
inform the spring WG as well since this is really about interconnecting =
SR-enabled domains.<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>Cheers<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>Matthew<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span style=3D'color:black'>From: =
</span></b><span style=3D'color:black'>Adrian Farrel =
&lt;adrian@olddog.co.uk&gt;<br><b>Organisation: </b>Old Dog =
Consulting<br><b>Reply to: </b>&quot;adrian@olddog.co.uk&quot; =
&lt;adrian@olddog.co.uk&gt;<br><b>Date: </b>Monday, 9 March 2020 at =
13:00<br><b>To: </b>&quot;Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)&quot; =
&lt;matthew.bocci@nokia.com&gt;, =
&quot;draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org&quot; =
&lt;draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org&gt;, =
&quot;bess@ietf.org&quot; &lt;bess@ietf.org&gt;<br><b>Subject: </b>RE: =
REMINDER Re: [bess] WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation Poll for =
draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04</span><span =
style=3D'color:black;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB'><o:p></o:p></span></p></=
div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Hi Matt, =
</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Sorry, did I miss this =
before?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>I am not aware of any IPR that needs to be =
disclosed and has not already been disclosed for this =
document.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Of course (?) I =
support progressing this work which I think is a simple addition to =
enable quite a lot of function. I still regret that we used the =
=E2=80=9Cdatacentre-gateway=E2=80=9D file name as the document is about =
SR-enabled domains as indicated in the Title and =
Abstract.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Looking back at my =
email trail, there was a final point of discussion with Stephane that I =
am not sure was completely resolved: Stephane?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Also, since -04 =
expired, would you like me to post a keep-alive =
-05?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Thanks,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Adrian</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><div><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB'>From:</span></b><sp=
an lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB'> =
Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB) &lt;matthew.bocci@nokia.com&gt; =
<br><b>Sent:</b> 26 February 2020 11:29<br><b>To:</b> =
draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org; =
bess@ietf.org<br><b>Subject:</b> REMINDER Re: [bess] WG Last Call, IPR =
and Implementation Poll for =
draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p=
 class=3DMsoNormal>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>WG<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>I have only =
seen one IPR responses to this WG last call and no comments. I will =
therefore extend it for another two weeks.<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>Regards<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>Matthew<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span style=3D'color:black'>From: =
</span></b><span style=3D'color:black'>BESS =
&lt;bess-bounces@ietf.org&gt; on behalf of &quot;Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - =
GB)&quot; &lt;matthew.bocci@nokia.com&gt;<br><b>Date: </b>Monday, 10 =
February 2020 at 16:17<br><b>To: =
</b>&quot;draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org&quot; =
&lt;draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org&gt;, =
&quot;bess@ietf.org&quot; &lt;bess@ietf.org&gt;<br><b>Subject: =
</b>[bess] WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation Poll for =
draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><h1><span =
lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black;font-weight:normal'>This email =
starts a two-week working group last call for =
draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04</span><o:p></o:p></h1><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>Please review =
the draft and send any comments to the BESS list. Also, please indicate =
if you support publishing the draft as a standards track =
RFC.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'caret-color: =
rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;caret-color: rgb(255, 255, =
255);word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>This =
poll runs until Monday 24<sup>th</sup> February =
2020.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;caret-color: rgb(255, 255, =
255);word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px'><span =
style=3D'color:black'>We are also polling for knowledge of any =
undisclosed IPR that applies to this Document, to ensure that IPR has =
been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, =
3669 and 5378 for more details).</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'color:black'>If you are listed as an =
Author or a Contributor of this document please respond to this email =
and indicate whether or not you are aware of any relevant undisclosed =
IPR. The Document won't progress without answers from all the Authors =
and Contributors.&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3Dgmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintex=
t><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>There is currently no IPR =
disclosed.&nbsp;&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3Dgmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintex=
t style=3D'caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>We are also polling for any existing =
implementation as per [1]. Please indicate if you are aware of any =
implementations of the modified protocol described in this =
draft.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3Dgmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintex=
t style=3D'font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;caret-color: rgb(255, 255, =
255);word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp;Thank you,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3Dgmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintex=
t style=3D'font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;caret-color: rgb(255, 255, =
255);word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>Matthew</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;caret-color: rgb(255, 255, =
255);word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;caret-color: rgb(255, 255, =
255);word-spacing:0px'><span style=3D'color:black'>[1]<span =
class=3Dapple-converted-space>&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><a =
href=3D"https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdk=
jqDpw" target=3D"_blank"><span lang=3DFR =
style=3D'color:#03386D'>https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1t=
Tqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps: =
normal;orphans: auto;text-align:start;widows: =
auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: =
0px;word-spacing:0px'><span =
style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div></body></html>
------=_NextPart_000_05AE_01D5F786.CAB697A0--


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From: Keyur Patel <keyur@arrcus.com>
To: John E Drake <jdrake@juniper.net>
CC: "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>, "draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: REMINDER Re: [bess] WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation Poll for draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04
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Subject: Re: [bess] REMINDER Re:  WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation Poll for draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04
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To: adrian@olddog.co.uk, "'Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)'" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>, draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org, bess@ietf.org
References: <C10DE36B-2593-4C80-A34E-2B7BFFFA14A4@nokia.com> <00e001d5f612$b275b380$17611a80$@olddog.co.uk> <7518A9BB-FCDA-46BF-81EA-0ACC9B4E0124@nokia.com> <05ad01d5f786$cab697a0$6023c6e0$@olddog.co.uk>
From: Eric C Rosen <erosen52@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9a608a7e-fefc-b36f-edad-3d42faff287d@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2020 18:34:13 -0400
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/mQLfS2i9neRVgQ1rOmAQwPH598E>
Subject: Re: [bess] REMINDER Re:  WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation Poll for draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04
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I am not aware of any undisclosed IPR that applies to this document.

On 3/11/20 5:23 AM, Adrian Farrel wrote:
>
> Hi Matthew, WG,
>
> I just posted -05
>
> That is chiefly a keep-alive refresh, but I also updated the IANA 
> section and uses to take account of the FCFS allocation of a code 
> point for the document.
>
> We still have an open discussion on a minor point with Stephane â€“ I 
> propose we roll that into the last call.
>
> Wrt IPR
>
>   * Eric Rosen
>     We may be able to rouse him from his retirement slumber, but
>     perhaps not.
>     I have a memory of Eric sending a cover-all email about Auth-48
>     and IPR, but:
>     - I may be imagining that
>     - I certainly canâ€™t find it
>   * Keyur Patel
>     We will prod him!
>
> Best,
>
> Adrian
>
> *From:*Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB) <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>
> *Sent:* 10 March 2020 11:35
> *To:* adrian@olddog.co.uk; 
> draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org; bess@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: REMINDER Re: [bess] WG Last Call, IPR and 
> Implementation Poll for draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04
>
> Hi Adrian
>
> Thanks for the response. Yes, please could you refresh the draft to 
> keep it alive.
>
> Iâ€™ve only received IPR responses from you, Luay and John. Please could 
> you chase your other co-authors to respond as well.
>
> I also didnâ€™t see any other comments on the list. I suggest we put 
> this document back in the WG LC queue so we can iron out any final 
> discussion points before running another last call. It would probably 
> make sense to inform the spring WG as well since this is really about 
> interconnecting SR-enabled domains.
>
> Cheers
>
> Matthew
>
> *From: *Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
> *Organisation: *Old Dog Consulting
> *Reply to: *"adrian@olddog.co.uk" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
> *Date: *Monday, 9 March 2020 at 13:00
> *To: *"Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>, 
> "draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org" 
> <draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" 
> <bess@ietf.org>
> *Subject: *RE: REMINDER Re: [bess] WG Last Call, IPR and 
> Implementation Poll for draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04
>
> Hi Matt,
>
> Sorry, did I miss this before?
>
> I am not aware of any IPR that needs to be disclosed and has not 
> already been disclosed for this document.
>
> Of course (?) I support progressing this work which I think is a 
> simple addition to enable quite a lot of function. I still regret that 
> we used the â€œdatacentre-gatewayâ€ file name as the document is about 
> SR-enabled domains as indicated in the Title and Abstract.
>
> Looking back at my email trail, there was a final point of discussion 
> with Stephane that I am not sure was completely resolved: Stephane?
>
> Also, since -04 expired, would you like me to post a keep-alive -05?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Adrian
>
> *From:*Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB) <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>
> *Sent:* 26 February 2020 11:29
> *To:* draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org; bess@ietf.org
> *Subject:* REMINDER Re: [bess] WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation 
> Poll for draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04
>
> WG
>
> I have only seen one IPR responses to this WG last call and no 
> comments. I will therefore extend it for another two weeks.
>
> Regards
>
> Matthew
>
> *From: *BESS <bess-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of "Bocci, Matthew 
> (Nokia - GB)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>
> *Date: *Monday, 10 February 2020 at 16:17
> *To: *"draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org" 
> <draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" 
> <bess@ietf.org>
> *Subject: *[bess] WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation Poll for 
> draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04
>
>
>   This email starts a two-week working group last call for
>   draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04
>
> Please review the draft and send any comments to the BESS list. Also, 
> please indicate if you support publishing the draft as a standards 
> track RFC.
>
> This poll runs until Monday 24^th February 2020.
>
> We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies 
> to this Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance 
> with IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).
>
> If you are listed as an Author or a Contributor of this document 
> please respond to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware 
> of any relevant undisclosed IPR. The Document won't progress without 
> answers from all the Authors and Contributors.
>
> There is currently no IPR disclosed.
>
> We are also polling for any existing implementation as per [1]. Please 
> indicate if you are aware of any implementations of the modified 
> protocol described in this draft.
>
> Â Thank you,
>
> Matthew
>
> [1]https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw
>

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    <p>I am not aware of any undisclosed IPR that applies to this
      document.<br>
    </p>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 3/11/20 5:23 AM, Adrian Farrel
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
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      <div class="WordSection1">
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Hi Matthew,
            WG,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p>Â </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">I just
            posted -05<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p>Â </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">That is
            chiefly a keep-alive refresh, but I also updated the IANA
            section and uses to take account of the FCFS allocation of a
            code point for the document.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p>Â </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">We still
            have an open discussion on a minor point with Stephane â€“ I
            propose we roll that into the last call.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p>Â </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Wrt IPR<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <ul style="margin-top:0cm" type="disc">
          <li class="MsoListParagraph"
            style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1"><span
              style="font-size:11.0pt">Eric Rosen<br>
              We may be able to rouse him from his retirement slumber,
              but perhaps not.<br>
              I have a memory of Eric sending a cover-all email about
              Auth-48 and IPR, but:<br>
              - I may be imagining that<br>
              - I certainly canâ€™t find it<o:p></o:p></span></li>
          <li class="MsoListParagraph"
            style="margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1"><span
              style="font-size:11.0pt">Keyur Patel<br>
              We will prod him!<o:p></o:p></span></li>
        </ul>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p>Â </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Best,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Adrian<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p>Â </o:p></span></p>
        <div>
          <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
            1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
            <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
                  style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB"
                  lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span
                style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB"
                lang="EN-US"> Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)
                <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:matthew.bocci@nokia.com">&lt;matthew.bocci@nokia.com&gt;</a> <br>
                <b>Sent:</b> 10 March 2020 11:35<br>
                <b>To:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:adrian@olddog.co.uk">adrian@olddog.co.uk</a>;
                <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org">draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org</a>;
                <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
                <b>Subject:</b> Re: REMINDER Re: [bess] WG Last Call,
                IPR and Implementation Poll for
                draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          </div>
        </div>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p>Â </o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">Hi Adrian<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p>Â </o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">Thanks for the response. Yes, please could
          you refresh the draft to keep it alive. <o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p>Â </o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">Iâ€™ve only received IPR responses from you,
          Luay and John. Please could you chase your other co-authors to
          respond as well.<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p>Â </o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">I also didnâ€™t see any other comments on the
          list. I suggest we put this document back in the WG LC queue
          so we can iron out any final discussion points before running
          another last call. It would probably make sense to inform the
          spring WG as well since this is really about interconnecting
          SR-enabled domains.<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p>Â </o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">Cheers<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p>Â </o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">Matthew<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p>Â </o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p>Â </o:p></p>
        <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF
          1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
          <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:black">From: </span></b><span
              style="color:black">Adrian Farrel
              <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:adrian@olddog.co.uk">&lt;adrian@olddog.co.uk&gt;</a><br>
              <b>Organisation: </b>Old Dog Consulting<br>
              <b>Reply to: </b><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:adrian@olddog.co.uk">"adrian@olddog.co.uk"</a>
              <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:adrian@olddog.co.uk">&lt;adrian@olddog.co.uk&gt;</a><br>
              <b>Date: </b>Monday, 9 March 2020 at 13:00<br>
              <b>To: </b>"Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)"
              <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:matthew.bocci@nokia.com">&lt;matthew.bocci@nokia.com&gt;</a>,
              <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org">"draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org"</a>
              <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org">&lt;draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org&gt;</a>,
              <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:bess@ietf.org">"bess@ietf.org"</a> <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:bess@ietf.org">&lt;bess@ietf.org&gt;</a><br>
              <b>Subject: </b>RE: REMINDER Re: [bess] WG Last Call, IPR
              and Implementation Poll for
              draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04</span><span
              style="color:black;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
        </div>
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt"><o:p>Â </o:p></span></p>
        </div>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Hi Matt, </span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Sorry, did I
            miss this before?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">I am not
            aware of any IPR that needs to be disclosed and has not
            already been disclosed for this document.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Â </span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Of course
            (?) I support progressing this work which I think is a
            simple addition to enable quite a lot of function. I still
            regret that we used the â€œdatacentre-gatewayâ€ file name as
            the document is about SR-enabled domains as indicated in the
            Title and Abstract.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Â </span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Looking back
            at my email trail, there was a final point of discussion
            with Stephane that I am not sure was completely resolved:
            Stephane?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Â </span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Also, since
            -04 expired, would you like me to post a keep-alive -05?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Â </span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Thanks,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Adrian</span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Â </span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <div>
          <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
            1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
            <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
                  style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB"
                  lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span
                style="font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB"
                lang="EN-US"> Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)
                <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:matthew.bocci@nokia.com">&lt;matthew.bocci@nokia.com&gt;</a> <br>
                <b>Sent:</b> 26 February 2020 11:29<br>
                <b>To:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org">draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org</a>;
                <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
                <b>Subject:</b> REMINDER Re: [bess] WG Last Call, IPR
                and Implementation Poll for
                draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04</span><o:p></o:p></p>
          </div>
        </div>
        <p class="MsoNormal">Â <o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">WG<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">Â <o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">I have only seen one IPR responses to this
          WG last call and no comments. I will therefore extend it for
          another two weeks.<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">Â <o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">Regards<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">Â <o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">Matthew<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">Â <o:p></o:p></p>
        <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF
          1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
          <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:black">From: </span></b><span
              style="color:black">BESS <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:bess-bounces@ietf.org">&lt;bess-bounces@ietf.org&gt;</a> on
              behalf of "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)"
              <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:matthew.bocci@nokia.com">&lt;matthew.bocci@nokia.com&gt;</a><br>
              <b>Date: </b>Monday, 10 February 2020 at 16:17<br>
              <b>To: </b><a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org">"draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org"</a>
              <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org">&lt;draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org&gt;</a>,
              <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:bess@ietf.org">"bess@ietf.org"</a> <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:bess@ietf.org">&lt;bess@ietf.org&gt;</a><br>
              <b>Subject: </b>[bess] WG Last Call, IPR and
              Implementation Poll for
              draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04</span><o:p></o:p></p>
        </div>
        <div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt">Â </span><o:p></o:p></p>
        </div>
        <h1><span
            style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black;font-weight:normal"
            lang="EN-US">This email starts a two-week working group last
            call for draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04</span><o:p></o:p></h1>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black" lang="EN-US">Please
            review the draft and send any comments to the BESS list.
            Also, please indicate if you support publishing the draft as
            a standards track RFC.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0,
          0);font-variant-caps: normal;orphans:
          auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust:
          auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px"><span
            style="color:black" lang="EN-US">Â </span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal" style="font-variant-caps: normal;orphans:
          auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust:
          auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;caret-color: rgb(255, 255,
          255);word-spacing:0px"><span style="color:black" lang="EN-US">This
            poll runs until Monday 24<sup>th</sup> February 2020.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal" style="font-variant-caps: normal;orphans:
          auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust:
          auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;caret-color: rgb(255, 255,
          255);word-spacing:0px"><span style="color:black" lang="EN-US">Â </span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0,
          0);font-variant-caps: normal;orphans:
          auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust:
          auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px"><span
            style="color:black">We are also polling for knowledge of any
            undisclosed IPR that applies to this Document, to ensure
            that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR
            rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">If you are listed
            as an Author or a Contributor of this document please
            respond to this email and indicate whether or not you are
            aware of any relevant undisclosed IPR. The Document won't
            progress without answers from all the Authors and
            Contributors.Â </span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p
class="gmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintext"><span
            style="color:black" lang="EN-US">There is currently no IPR
            disclosed.Â Â </span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p
class="gmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintext"
          style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps:
          normal;orphans: auto;text-align:start;widows:
          auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width:
          0px;word-spacing:0px"><span style="color:black" lang="EN-US">We
            are also polling for any existing implementation as per [1].
            Please indicate if you are aware of any implementations of
            the modified protocol described in this draft.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p
class="gmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintext"
          style="font-variant-caps: normal;orphans:
          auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust:
          auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;caret-color: rgb(255, 255,
          255);word-spacing:0px"><span style="color:black" lang="EN-US">Â Thank
            you,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p
class="gmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintext"
          style="font-variant-caps: normal;orphans:
          auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust:
          auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;caret-color: rgb(255, 255,
          255);word-spacing:0px"><span style="color:black" lang="EN-US">Matthew</span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal" style="font-variant-caps: normal;orphans:
          auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust:
          auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;caret-color: rgb(255, 255,
          255);word-spacing:0px"><span style="color:black" lang="EN-US">Â </span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal" style="font-variant-caps: normal;orphans:
          auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust:
          auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;caret-color: rgb(255, 255,
          255);word-spacing:0px"><span style="color:black">[1]<span
              class="apple-converted-space">Â </span></span><span
            style="color:black" lang="EN-US"><a
href="https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw"
              target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                style="color:#03386D" lang="FR">https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0,
          0);font-variant-caps: normal;orphans:
          auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust:
          auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px"><span
            style="color:black">Â </span><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">Â <o:p></o:p></p>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
  </body>
</html>

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From: "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>
To: Eric C Rosen <erosen52@gmail.com>, "adrian@olddog.co.uk" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>, "draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: REMINDER Re: [bess] WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation Poll for draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04
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Subject: Re: [bess] REMINDER Re:  WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation Poll for draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04
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From: "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>
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From: Eduard Metz <etmetz@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2020 12:18:19 +0100
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Subject: [bess] MPLS to SRv6 migration (in relation to bess-srv6-services)
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Hi,

How is the migration from MPLS to SRv6 dataplane foreseen in relation to
bess-srv6-services?
For instance the case where egress PE supports both MPLS and SRv6 dataplane
and ingress PE supports MPLS only.
Would the egress PE advertise two routes in this case (with different RD)?

cheers,
   Eduard

--00000000000018f4fd05a0baa19c
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<div dir=3D"ltr">Hi,<div><br></div><div>How is the migration from MPLS to S=
Rv6 dataplane foreseen in relation to bess-srv6-services?</div><div>For ins=
tance the case where egress PE supports both MPLS and SRv6 dataplane and in=
gress PE supports MPLS only.</div><div>Would the egress PE advertise two ro=
utes in this case (with different RD)?<br></div><div><br></div><div>cheers,=
</div><div>=C2=A0 =C2=A0Eduard</div><div><br></div></div>

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From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2020 10:21:53 -0400
Message-ID: <CABNhwV0=PD2+XsXDD2Cs5c678_XKcq+RqnuqA+41E4gTHoWf3g@mail.gmail.com>
To: Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
Cc: BESS <bess@ietf.org>, Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>,  Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>, Sandy Breeze <sandy.breeze@eu.clara.net>
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Subject: Re: [bess] VXLAN EVPN fabric extension to Hypervisor VM
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After doing some research I found a few vendors that have a solution that
extends the vxlan fabric to the server hypervisor.

Cisco VTS supports 3rd party x86 available now for vxlan fabric  extension

Arista and Nuage collaboration on vxlan fabric extension solution available
now

VMware also has a solution

Kind regards

Gyan

On Tue, Mar 10, 2020 at 3:04 AM Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com> wrote=
:

> we're weighing in 161 pages in the last IESG reviews now which is however
> not very meaningful ;-) since it's probably 25 pages just IANA request an=
d
> it's not just the spec, it's the whole outline of design/narrative/walk
> through (folks preferred it that way). With FSMs/algorithms and water-tig=
ht
> interoperable protocol like it can't be done in 10 easy pages breeze
> through (well, one can do that but then customers spend 5 years figuring
> out how to interop anything and finding cornercases, not the way RIFT WG =
is
> run ;-)
>
> I'll ping you 1:1 otherwise ;-)
>
> thanks
>
> --- tony
>
> On Mon, Mar 9, 2020 at 9:15 PM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi Tony
>>
>> I am actually a member of RIFT, as the WG charter description
>> was intriguing so I joined - to learn more about the RIFT technology.
>>
>> I downloaded the draft but never made it through as its a lengthy 100+
>> page draft.  Now I really have to read it.
>>
>> Yes that would be great.  Please unicast me on hayabusagsm@gmail.com.
>>
>> Kind regards
>>
>> Gyan
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 9, 2020 at 11:31 AM Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Gyan, the technology that you look for exists and is about to go
>>> standards RFC (i.e. _scalable_ L3 multihoming to the host including
>>> bandwidth load-balancing and many other things that need consideration =
in
>>> such case, e.g. host asic table scalability). Please look @
>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rift-rift/  If you need
>>> more info/code, more than happy to talk out of band
>>>
>>> thanks
>>>
>>> -- tony
>>>
>>> On Thu, Mar 5, 2020 at 2:04 PM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Sandy
>>>>
>>>> Thank you for the feedback on your use cases.
>>>>
>>>> For now will remain L2 MLAG to the host.
>>>>
>>>> BESS WG,
>>>>
>>>> If anyone hears of any new developments on vxlan fabric extension to
>>>> hypervisor and any vendors supporting even 3rd party open source
>>>> implementations of fabric extensions please reach out to me.
>>>>
>>>> As an aside when reading RFC 8365 NVO3 section 7  it kind of gets
>>>> excited by the subject heading =E2=80=9Csingle homed NVE residing in H=
ypervisor=E2=80=9D or
>>>> section 8 MH NVE in TOR server - thinking that maybe fabric extension =
to
>>>> hypervisor does actually exist but of course the let down that no vend=
or
>>>> supports it.
>>>>
>>>> It does seem there would be a lot of customers wanting this fabric
>>>> extension to hypervisor capabilities for MH load balancing- and very
>>>> surprising that it does not exist.
>>>>
>>>> https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8365#section-7
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Kind regards
>>>>
>>>> Gyan Mishra
>>>> Verizon
>>>> Cell 301 502-1347
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Mar 4, 2020 at 4:57 PM Sandy Breeze <sandy..breeze@eu.clara.ne=
t
>>>> <sandy.breeze@eu.clara.net>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Gyan,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Here, we use a mix of NXOS & Arista EOS for leaf and spine, ASR9k DCI
>>>>> doing L2 + L3 VTEP and stitching to MPLS EVPN / traditional VPNv4/6. =
 We
>>>>> also confess to pockets of proprietary NXOS vPC, and, pockets of Aris=
ta
>>>>> ESI-MH.  Incidentally, the older Broadcom NXOS boxes do have ESI-MH
>>>>> capabilities and that worked alright.  Customers, like us, have been =
long
>>>>> promised the vendor silicon will catch up, though we=E2=80=99ve yet t=
o see it
>>>>> happen.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> We=E2=80=99re entirely a home grown automation / orchestration stack,=
 with
>>>>> many years behind it.  Have a look at some talks we=E2=80=99ve given =
publicly for
>>>>> the background in our =E2=80=98GOLF=E2=80=99 project.
>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DjXOrdHfBqb0&t=3D
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> > Has this ever been done before and with which hypervisors ?
>>>>>
>>>>> We had the same requirements as you 2-3 years ago.  Have we solved
>>>>> it?  TL;DR: not really!  We did make an interesting proof of concept
>>>>> though=E2=80=A6
>>>>>
>>>>> Being largely a VMWare NSX house, we found VMWare closed to offering
>>>>> any type of EVPN orchestrated VTEP extension into the physical fabric=
.
>>>>> Quite simply, its model of extending to physical VTEP is OVSDB.  That=
=E2=80=99s not
>>>>> exactly compatible with an EVPN ToR, for various reasons.  So, we had=
 the
>>>>> idea that we=E2=80=99d build something which spoke both OVSDB (to NSX=
) and EVPN (to
>>>>> the physical ToR).  The high level idea being, we=E2=80=99d use this =
to create
>>>>> routes in EVPN if they were seen from OVSDB, and visa-versa, only we=
=E2=80=99d
>>>>> maintain the original next-hop.  Kinda like an iBGP RR, only between =
2
>>>>> different control-planes.  Internally, we called it VxGlue.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> At a high level, it worked well in achieving nice loadbalancing of
>>>>> traffic into the hypervisor.  It would no doubt scale fairly well too=
.  Is
>>>>> it the right thing to do in a production network?  We decided not.  F=
or
>>>>> one, its very hard to keep up with pace of development of underlying =
VMWare
>>>>> API=E2=80=99s.  As I say, this was a few years ago and things have mo=
ved on.  Maybe
>>>>> we=E2=80=99ll revisit.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Sandy
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 04/03/2020, 21:03, "BESS on behalf of Gyan Mishra" <
>>>>> bess-bounces@ietf.org on behalf of hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Thank you all for the feedback!!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Our requirements we ar looking for a way to increase stability withou=
t
>>>>> sacrificing bandwidth availability and convergence with Data Center h=
ost
>>>>> connectivity to an existing vxlan fabric.  Our server traffic volume =
is
>>>>> higher bandwidth East to West then North to South.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> We have a Cisco Nexus based vxlan evpn fabric with multi site feature
>>>>> connecting all of our PODs intra DC and use BGP EVPN over an MPLS cor=
e for
>>>>> DCI inter connect inter Data Center connectivity.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> We have orchestration via Cisco NSO and DCNM for network
>>>>> programmability.  Typical Cisco shop..
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Our Data Center host attachment model as been with MLAG using Cisco=
=E2=80=99s
>>>>> vPC.  That has been problematic having that L2 extension so we would =
like
>>>>> to find a better way to maybe leverage our existing vxlan fabric and =
extend
>>>>> to server hypervisor if at all possible.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> So with a hypervisor connected to two leaf switches in a vxlan fabric
>>>>>  it sounds like it maybe possible with Cisco=E2=80=99s IETF standards=
 based
>>>>> implementation of vxlan overlay following NVO3 RFC 8365 and BGP EVPN =
RFC
>>>>> 7432 that we could extend the fabric to server hypervisor.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> The question related to L3 ECMP versus L2 MLAG become moot as with
>>>>> existing BGP EVPN load balancing procedures with EVPN type 4 default
>>>>> gateway DF election we can achieve all active multi homed load balanc=
ing
>>>>> from the hypervisor.  As was mentioned RFC 8365 since vxlan evpn does=
 not
>>>>> use ESI the local bias feature would have to be used for split horizo=
n..
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Of course with the extension to the hypervisor we would use are
>>>>> existing orchestration of the fabric to manage the server hypervisor =
layer.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Has this ever been done before and with which hypervisors ?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Kind regards
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Gyan
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 7:58 PM Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com=
>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Gyan,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On open source side of things - FRR supports EVPN on the host.
>>>>>
>>>>> Any vendor virtualized NOS would provide you the same (at least
>>>>> Junos/cRPD or  XRv).
>>>>>
>>>>> EVPN ESI load-sharing eliminates need for MLAG (basic thought, the
>>>>> devil is in the details :))
>>>>>
>>>>> ECMP vs LAG load-balancing - the algorithms supported are quite
>>>>> similar, in some code bases actually the same, so this statement is n=
ot
>>>>> really correct.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Would be glad to better understand your requirements and help you!
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>
>>>>> Jeff
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mar 2, 2020, at 16:00, Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks Robert for the quick response
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Just thinking out loud -  I can see there maybe some advantages of
>>>>> elimination of L2 to the host but the one major disadvantage is that =
BGP
>>>>> multipath provides flow based uneven load balancing so not as desirab=
le
>>>>> from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash=
.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Other big down side is most enterprises have the hypervisor managed b=
y
>>>>> server admins but if you run BGP now that ends up shifting to network=
.
>>>>> More complicated.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Kind regards
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Gyan
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:39 PM Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi Gyan,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Similar architecture has been invented and shipped by Contrail team.
>>>>> Now that project after they got acquired by Juniper has been renamed =
to
>>>>> Tungsten Fabric https://tungsten.io/
>>>>> <https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2F=
tungsten.io%2F&data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c24=
33baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C6371895259=
46984085&sdata=3DYOxnBjXir%2B%2Br4h2Emgz0%2BMkYxBrR75TpcLWqEuXiftY%3D&reser=
ved=3D0> while
>>>>> Juniper continued to keep the original project's name and commercial =
flavor
>>>>> of it. No guarantees of any product quality at this point.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN nor BGP to the host. The proposed above
>>>>> alternative were well thought out and turned to work ways far more
>>>>> efficient and practical if you zoom into details.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Best,
>>>>>
>>>>> Robert.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12:26 AM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Dear BESS WG
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Is anyone aware of any IETF BGP development in the Data Center arena
>>>>> to extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a blade server Hypervisor making the Hype=
rvisor
>>>>> part of the  vxlan fabric.  This could eliminate use of MLAG on the l=
eaf
>>>>> switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereby
>>>>> maximizing  stability.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Kind regards,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Gyan
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>> Gyan  Mishra
>>>>>
>>>>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>>>>
>>>>> Verizon
>>>>>
>>>>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>>>>
>>>>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>>>>
>>>>> Email: gyan.s..mishra@verizon.com <gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> BESS mailing list
>>>>> BESS@ietf.org
>>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>>>>> <https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2F=
www.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu=
.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c1594=
7cf56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525946994081&sdata=3DioGt83d8%2FQ%2FUFiA9L0T%2BgrGmoD=
BiqADpUzw7kaRfxhI%3D&reserved=3D0>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>> Gyan  Mishra
>>>>>
>>>>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>>>>
>>>>> Verizon
>>>>>
>>>>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>>>>
>>>>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>>>>
>>>>> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> BESS mailing list
>>>>> BESS@ietf.org
>>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>>>>> <https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2F=
www.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu=
.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c1594=
7cf56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525947004076&sdata=3DCEduzdoebDfvYoDdqSQJEafpKGKycyM5=
YpCYOYviX%2FE%3D&reserved=3D0>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>> Gyan  Mishra
>>>>>
>>>>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>>>>
>>>>> Verizon
>>>>>
>>>>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>>>>
>>>>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>>>>
>>>>> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Gyan  Mishra
>>>>
>>>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>>>
>>>> Verizon
>>>>
>>>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>>>
>>>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>>>
>>>> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> BESS mailing list
>>>> BESS@ietf.org
>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Gyan  Mishra
>>
>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>
>> Verizon
>>
>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>
>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>
>> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>>
>>
>>
>> --

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

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<div><div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">After doing some research I found a f=
ew vendors that have a solution that extends the vxlan fabric to the server=
 hypervisor.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Cisco VTS s=
upports 3rd party x86 available now for vxlan fabric =C2=A0extension=C2=A0<=
/div></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Arista and Nuage c=
ollaboration on vxlan fabric extension solution available now</div><div><di=
v dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">VMware also has a solution=C2=A0=
</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind regards=C2=A0</div=
><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Gyan</div><div><br><div clas=
s=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Tue, Mar 10, 202=
0 at 3:04 AM Tony Przygienda &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:tonysietf@gmail.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">tonysietf@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote clas=
s=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;pad=
ding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div>we&#39;re weighing in 161 pages in the=
 last IESG reviews now which is however not very meaningful ;-) since it&#3=
9;s probably 25 pages just IANA request and it&#39;s not just the spec, it&=
#39;s the whole outline of design/narrative/walk through (folks preferred i=
t that way). With FSMs/algorithms and water-tight interoperable protocol li=
ke it can&#39;t be done in 10 easy pages breeze through (well, one can do t=
hat but then customers spend 5 years figuring out how to interop anything a=
nd finding cornercases, not the way RIFT WG is run ;-)</div><div><br></div>=
<div>I&#39;ll ping you 1:1 otherwise ;-)</div><div><br></div><div>thanks</d=
iv></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><br></div><div>--- tony <br></div></div><br>=
<div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Mon, Ma=
r 9, 2020 at 9:15 PM Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.co=
m" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockqu=
ote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px=
 solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"=
>Hi Tony<div><br></div><div>I am actually a member of RIFT, as the WG chart=
er description was=C2=A0intriguing so I joined - to learn more about the RI=
FT technology.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>I downloaded the draft but ne=
ver made it through as its a lengthy 100+ page draft.=C2=A0 Now I really ha=
ve to read it.</div></div><div><br></div>Yes that would be great.=C2=A0 Ple=
ase unicast me on <a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank=
">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>.<div><br></div><div>Kind regards</div><div><br>=
</div><div>Gyan</div><div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" c=
lass=3D"gmail_attr">On Mon, Mar 9, 2020 at 11:31 AM Tony Przygienda &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:tonysietf@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">tonysietf@gmail.com</=
a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0p=
x 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><d=
iv dir=3D"ltr"><div>Gyan, the technology that you look for exists and is ab=
out to go standards RFC (i.e. _scalable_ L3 multihoming to the host includi=
ng bandwidth load-balancing and many other things that need consideration i=
n such case, e.g. host asic table scalability). Please look @ <a href=3D"ht=
tps://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rift-rift/" target=3D"_blank">htt=
ps://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rift-rift/</a>=C2=A0 If you need m=
ore info/code, more than happy to talk out of band <br></div><div><br></div=
><div>thanks <br></div><div><br></div><div>-- tony<br></div></div><br><div =
class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Thu, Mar 5, =
2020 at 2:04 PM Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote c=
lass=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px soli=
d rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div><div dir=3D"auto">Hi Sandy=C2=A0<=
/div></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Thank you for the =
feedback on your use cases.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"au=
to">For now will remain L2 MLAG to the host.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></d=
iv><div dir=3D"auto">BESS WG,</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"=
auto">If anyone hears of any new developments on vxlan fabric extension to =
hypervisor and any vendors supporting even 3rd party open source implementa=
tions of fabric extensions please reach out to me.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><=
br></div><div dir=3D"auto">As an aside when reading RFC 8365 NVO3 section 7=
 =C2=A0it kind of gets excited by the subject heading =E2=80=9Csingle homed=
 NVE residing in Hypervisor=E2=80=9D or section 8 MH NVE in TOR server - th=
inking that maybe fabric extension to hypervisor does actually exist but of=
 course the let down that no vendor supports it.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br=
></div><div dir=3D"auto">It does seem there would be a lot of customers wan=
ting this fabric extension to hypervisor capabilities for MH load balancing=
- and very surprising that it does not exist.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></=
div><div dir=3D"auto"><div><a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8365#s=
ection-7" target=3D"_blank">https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8365#section-7</=
a></div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><=
div dir=3D"auto">Kind regards=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div d=
ir=3D"auto">Gyan Mishra=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto">Verizon</div><div dir=
=3D"auto">Cell 301 502-1347</div><div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div d=
ir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Wed, Mar 4, 2020 at 4:57 PM Sandy Breeze=
 &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sandy.breeze@eu.clara.net" target=3D"_blank">sandy..=
breeze@eu.clara.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quot=
e" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204)=
;padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-GB">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>Hi Gyan,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>Here, we use a mix of NXOS &amp; Arista EOS fo=
r leaf and spine, ASR9k DCI doing L2 + L3 VTEP and stitching to MPLS EVPN /=
 traditional VPNv4/6.=C2=A0 We also confess to pockets of proprietary NXOS =
vPC, and,
 pockets of Arista ESI-MH.=C2=A0 Incidentally, the older Broadcom NXOS boxe=
s do have ESI-MH capabilities and that worked alright.=C2=A0 Customers, lik=
e us, have been long promised the vendor silicon will catch up, though we=
=E2=80=99ve yet to see it happen.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>We=E2=80=99re entirely a home grown automation=
 / orchestration stack, with many years behind it.=C2=A0 Have a look at som=
e talks we=E2=80=99ve given publicly for the background in our =E2=80=98GOL=
F=E2=80=99 project.=C2=A0
</span><a href=3D"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DjXOrdHfBqb0&amp;t=3D" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DjXOrdHfBqb0&amp;t=3D</a>=
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>&gt;</span> Has this ever been done before and=
 with which hypervisors ?<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We had the same requirements as you 2-3 years ago.=
=C2=A0 Have we solved it?=C2=A0 TL;DR: not really!=C2=A0 We did make an int=
eresting proof of concept though=E2=80=A6=C2=A0
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Being largely a VMWare NSX house, we found VMWare cl=
osed to offering any type of EVPN orchestrated VTEP extension into the phys=
ical fabric.=C2=A0 Quite simply, its model of extending to physical VTEP is=
 OVSDB.=C2=A0 That=E2=80=99s not exactly compatible
 with an EVPN ToR, for various reasons.=C2=A0 So, we had the idea that we=
=E2=80=99d build something which spoke both OVSDB (to NSX) and EVPN (to the=
 physical ToR).=C2=A0 The high level idea being, we=E2=80=99d use this to c=
reate routes in EVPN if they were seen from OVSDB, and visa-versa,
 only we=E2=80=99d maintain the original next-hop.=C2=A0 Kinda like an iBGP=
 RR, only between 2 different control-planes.=C2=A0 Internally, we called i=
t VxGlue.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">At a high level, it worked well in achieving nice lo=
adbalancing of traffic into the hypervisor.=C2=A0 It would no doubt scale f=
airly well too.=C2=A0 Is it the right thing to do in a production network?=
=C2=A0 We decided not.=C2=A0 For one, its very hard to
 keep up with pace of development of underlying VMWare API=E2=80=99s.=C2=A0=
 As I say, this was a few years ago and things have moved on.=C2=A0 Maybe w=
e=E2=80=99ll revisit.</p></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-GB"><div><p class=3D"M=
soNormal"><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sandy<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On 04/03/2020, 21:03, &qu=
ot;BESS on behalf of Gyan Mishra&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess-bounces@i=
etf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess-bounces@ietf.org</a> on behalf of
<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmai=
l.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Thank you all for the fee=
dback!!<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Our requirements we ar lo=
oking for a way to increase stability without sacrificing bandwidth availab=
ility and convergence with Data Center host connectivity to an existing vxl=
an fabric.=C2=A0 Our server traffic volume
 is higher bandwidth East to West then North to South.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">We have a Cisco Nexus bas=
ed vxlan evpn fabric with multi site feature connecting all of our PODs int=
ra DC and use BGP EVPN over an MPLS core for DCI inter connect inter Data C=
enter connectivity.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">We have orchestration via=
 Cisco NSO and DCNM for network programmability.=C2=A0 Typical Cisco shop..=
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Our Data Center host atta=
chment model as been with MLAG using Cisco=E2=80=99s vPC.=C2=A0 That has be=
en problematic having that L2 extension so we would like to find a better w=
ay to maybe leverage our existing vxlan fabric
 and extend to server hypervisor if at all possible. =C2=A0<u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">So with a hypervisor conn=
ected to two leaf switches in a vxlan fabric =C2=A0it sounds like it maybe =
possible with Cisco=E2=80=99s IETF standards based implementation of vxlan =
overlay following NVO3 RFC 8365 and BGP EVPN RFC
 7432 that we could extend the fabric to server hypervisor.<u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">The question related to L=
3 ECMP versus L2 MLAG become moot as with existing BGP EVPN load balancing =
procedures with EVPN type 4 default gateway DF election we can achieve all =
active multi homed load balancing
 from the hypervisor.=C2=A0 As was mentioned RFC 8365 since vxlan evpn does=
 not use ESI the local bias feature would have to be used for split horizon=
..<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Of course with the extens=
ion to the hypervisor we would use are existing orchestration of the fabric=
 to manage the server hypervisor layer.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Has this ever been done b=
efore and with which hypervisors ?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Kind regards=C2=A0<u></u>=
<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 7:=
58 PM Jeff Tantsura &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jefftant.ietf@gmail.com" target=
=3D"_blank">jefftant.ietf@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Gyan, <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On open source side of th=
ings - FRR supports EVPN on the host.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Any vendor virtualized NO=
S would provide you the same (at least Junos/cRPD or =C2=A0XRv).<u></u><u><=
/u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">EVPN ESI load-sharing eli=
minates need for MLAG (basic thought, the devil is in the details :))<u></u=
><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">ECMP vs LAG load-balancin=
g - the algorithms supported are quite similar, in some code bases actually=
 the same, so this statement is not really correct.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-=
left:36pt">
Would be glad to better understand your requirements and help you!<u></u><u=
></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Regards, <u></u><u></u></=
p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Jeff<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><br>
<br>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-=
left:36pt">
On Mar 2, 2020, at 16:00, Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gma=
il.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u=
></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Thanks Robert for the qui=
ck=C2=A0response<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Just thinking out loud - =
=C2=A0I can see there maybe some advantages of elimination of L2 to the hos=
t but the one major disadvantage is that BGP multipath provides flow based =
uneven load balancing so not as desirable
 from that standpoint compare to L3 MLAG bundle XOR Src/Dest/Port hash.<u><=
/u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Other big down side is mo=
st enterprises have the hypervisor managed by server admins but if you run =
BGP now that ends up shifting to network.=C2=A0 More complicated. =C2=A0<u>=
</u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Kind=C2=A0regards<u></u><=
u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On Mon, Mar 2, 2020 at 6:=
39 PM Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:robert@raszuk.net" target=3D"_bla=
nk">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Hi Gyan, <u></u><u></u></=
p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Similar architecture has =
been invented and shipped by Contrail team. Now that project after they got=
 acquired=C2=A0by Juniper has been renamed to Tungsten Fabric=C2=A0<a href=
=3D"https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Ftun=
gsten.io%2F&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.breeze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2=
433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5fab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525=
946984085&amp;sdata=3DYOxnBjXir%2B%2Br4h2Emgz0%2BMkYxBrR75TpcLWqEuXiftY%3D&=
amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https://tungsten.io/</a>=C2=A0while
 Juniper continued to keep the original project&#39;s name and commercial f=
lavor of it. No guarantees of any product quality at this point.=C2=A0<u></=
u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Btw ,,, no need for VXLAN=
 nor BGP to the host. The proposed above alternative were well thought out =
and turned to work ways far more efficient and practical if you zoom into d=
etails.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Best,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Robert.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On Tue, Mar 3, 2020 at 12=
:26 AM Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_=
blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Dear BESS WG<u></u><u></u=
></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Is anyone aware of any IE=
TF BGP development in the Data Center arena to extend BGP VXLAN EVPN to a b=
lade server Hypervisor making the Hypervisor part of the =C2=A0vxlan fabric=
.=C2=A0 This could eliminate use of MLAG on
 the leaf switches and eliminate L2 completely from the vxlan fabric thereb=
y maximizing =C2=A0stability.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Kind regards,<u></u><u></=
u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Gyan=
=C2=A0 Mishra</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Netwo=
rk Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Veriz=
on=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Silve=
r Spring, MD 20904</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Phone=
: 301 502-1347</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Email=
: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">
gyan.s..mishra@verizon.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-color:currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rg=
b(204,204,204);border-style:none none none solid;border-width:medium medium=
 medium 1pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">_________________________=
______________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2=
F%2Fwww.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fbess&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Csandy.bre=
eze%40eu.clara.net%7C5f875c0816c2433baeee08d7c07f7358%7Cf87a76403b944bbdb5f=
ab4c15947cf56%7C0%7C0%7C637189525946994081&amp;sdata=3DioGt83d8%2FQ%2FUFiA9=
L0T%2BgrGmoDBiqADpUzw7kaRfxhI%3D&amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https:=
//www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><u></u><u></u></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
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Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2020 14:55:43 -0400
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Subject: Re: [bess] MPLS to SRv6 migration (in relation to bess-srv6-services)
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Eduard

I have some similar questions related to BE L3 VPN

Dear BESS authors of SRv6 services draft Q&A:

My understanding is that with BE L3 vpn all nodes including the ingress and
egress PE are not SRv6 capable

However, If the egress PE is brown field in an MPLS IPv4 enabled core and
not SRv6 capable and let=E2=80=99s say the ingress PE is SRv6 capable, how =
does the
egress PE signal for SRv6 services sid with the BGP overlay services route
with corresponding RT for VRF to be instantiation.  The egress PE is not
SRv6 capable so would not be able to signal for the SRv6 services SID with
the L3 vpn BGP overlay.  I did notice that in that verbiage in the first
sentence it is saying simultaneous SRv6 and MPLS.  Is that true and if so
then it=E2=80=99s more like MPLS and SRv6 data planes are active simultaneo=
usly
which does not make sense either.

In the introduction verbiage on BE VPN is confusing

To provide SRv6 service with best-effort connectivity, the egress PE
   signals an SRv6 Service SID with the BGP overlay service route.  The
   ingress PE encapsulates the payload in an outer IPv6 header where the
   destination address is the SRv6 Service SID provided by the egress
   PE.  The underlay between the PEs only need to support plain IPv6
   forwarding [RFC2460 <https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2460>].


Section 3 BGP based L3 vpn over IPv6

If the BGP speaker supports MPLS based L3VPN services simultaneously,
   it MAY also populate a valid Label value in the service route NLRI
   encoding, and allow the BGP ingress PE to decide which encapsulation
   to use.  If the BGP speaker does not support MPLS based L3VPN
   services the Label value in any service route NLRI encoding MUST be
   set to Implicit NULL [RFC3032 <https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3032>].

   At an ingress PE, BGP installs the received prefix in the correct RIB
   table, recursing via an SR Policy leveraging the received SRv6
   Service SID.

   Assuming best-effort connectivity to the egress PE, the SR policy has
   a path with a SID list made up of a single SID - the SRv6 Service SID
   received with the related BGP route update.

   However, when the received route is colored with an extended color
   commmunity 'C' and Next-Hop 'N', and the ingress PE has a valid SRv6
   Policy (C, N) associated with SID list <S1,S2, S3> [I-D.filsfils-
   spring-segment-routing-policy], then the effective SR Policy is <S1,
   S2, S3, SRv6-Service-SID>.


In this section for BE services this is where source node Ingres PE is SRv6
capable and egress PE is not and in that case the egress PE services SID
would not be signaled with BGP overlay and the source node would
instantiation of the path would happen on the source node independently of
egress node signaling- and I guess in the case PSP mode would need to be
enabled to remove the SRH header prior to the egress PE final destination.

I started reading through this draft to help with my questions on
interoperability with MPLS and SR-MPLS and brown field deployments where
all nodes have a mix of capabilities.

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-agrawal-spring-srv6-mpls-interworking-02

This draft talks about stitching domains together that SRv6 domain with
MPLS or SR-MPLS domains.

Can you use the same concept of advertising the prefix sid with intra
domain with AFI 2 SAFI 1 from the egress PE to ingress PE to signal the
egress PE for SRv6 instantiation of a BE SRv6 path with capable or non SRv6
capable source node.

Also with MPLS and SR-MPLS we have a bottom of stack service label so the
label stacks are similar as far as bottom of stack service label which
helps with that interoperability.  However with SRv6 there is not any
bottom of stack service label since the egress PE signals via services sid
with bgp overlay to egress PE for instantiation of L3 vpn services.  So
since SRv6 does not have a bottom of stack service label,  I can see how
having an overlay of MPLS and SRv6 operating simultaneously may not be
possible, but I think this capability would really be helpful for brown
field deployments.

3.2 <https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-agrawal-spring-srv6-mpls-interworkin=
g-02#section-3.2>.
Stitching heterogenous domains usin BGP inter domain routing

   For providing services across domains, edge node locators need to be
   reachable.

   -Locators are advertised by edge nodes in the BGP ipv6 unicast
   address family (AFI=3D2,Safi=3D1) to border nodes.  These locators are
   also advertised in its local IGP domain.

   -On border nodes these prefixes are like any IPv6 global prefixes.
   These will be advertised in BGP IPv6 LU[AFI=3D2/SAFI=3D4] session using


On Fri, Mar 13, 2020 at 7:18 AM Eduard Metz <etmetz@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> How is the migration from MPLS to SRv6 dataplane foreseen in relation to
> bess-srv6-services?
> For instance the case where egress PE supports both MPLS and SRv6
> dataplane and ingress PE supports MPLS only.
> Would the egress PE advertise two routes in this case (with different RD)=
?
>
> cheers,
>    Eduard
>
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>
--=20

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

--000000000000b6cfe305a0d5220a
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Eduard</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><d=
iv dir=3D"auto">I have some similar questions related to BE L3 VPN</div><di=
v dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Dear BESS authors of SRv6 servic=
es draft Q&amp;A:</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">My und=
erstanding is that with BE L3 vpn all nodes including the ingress and egres=
s PE are not SRv6 capable=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=
=3D"auto">However, If the egress PE is brown field in an MPLS IPv4 enabled =
core and not SRv6 capable and let=E2=80=99s say the ingress PE is SRv6 capa=
ble, how does the egress PE signal for SRv6 services sid with the BGP overl=
ay services route with corresponding RT for VRF to be instantiation.=C2=A0 =
The egress PE is not SRv6 capable so would not be able to signal for the SR=
v6 services SID with the L3 vpn BGP overlay.=C2=A0 I did notice that in tha=
t verbiage in the first sentence it is saying simultaneous SRv6 and MPLS.=
=C2=A0 Is that true and if so then it=E2=80=99s more like MPLS and SRv6 dat=
a planes are active simultaneously which does not make sense either.</div><=
div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">In the introduction verbiage o=
n BE VPN is confusing=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"au=
to"><pre class=3D"newpage" style=3D"font-size:1em;margin-top:0px;margin-bot=
tom:0px;break-before:page">To provide SRv6 service with best-effort connect=
ivity, the egress PE
   signals an SRv6 Service SID with the BGP overlay service route.  The
   ingress PE encapsulates the payload in an outer IPv6 header where the
   destination address is the SRv6 Service SID provided by the egress
   PE.  The underlay between the PEs only need to support plain IPv6
   forwarding [<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2460" title=3D"&qu=
ot;Internet Protocol, Version 6 (IPv6) Specification&quot;">RFC2460</a>].</=
pre></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Section 3 BGP based=
 L3 vpn over IPv6</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><pre c=
lass=3D"newpage" style=3D"font-size:1em;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;br=
eak-before:page">If the BGP speaker supports MPLS based L3VPN services simu=
ltaneously,
   it MAY also populate a valid Label value in the service route NLRI
   encoding, and allow the BGP ingress PE to decide which encapsulation
   to use.  If the BGP speaker does not support MPLS based L3VPN
   services the Label value in any service route NLRI encoding MUST be
   set to Implicit NULL [<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3032" ti=
tle=3D"&quot;MPLS Label Stack Encoding&quot;">RFC3032</a>].

   At an ingress PE, BGP installs the received prefix in the correct RIB
   table, recursing via an SR Policy leveraging the received SRv6
   Service SID.

   Assuming best-effort connectivity to the egress PE, the SR policy has
   a path with a SID list made up of a single SID - the SRv6 Service SID
   received with the related BGP route update.

   However, when the received route is colored with an extended color
   commmunity &#39;C&#39; and Next-Hop &#39;N&#39;, and the ingress PE has =
a valid SRv6
   Policy (C, N) associated with SID list &lt;S1,S2, S3&gt; [I-D.filsfils-
   spring-segment-routing-policy], then the effective SR Policy is &lt;S1,
   S2, S3, SRv6-Service-SID&gt;.</pre></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><di=
v dir=3D"auto">In this section for BE services this is where source node In=
gres PE is SRv6 capable and egress PE is not and in that case the egress PE=
 services SID would not be signaled with BGP overlay and the source node wo=
uld instantiation of the path would happen on the source node independently=
 of egress node signaling- and I guess in the case PSP mode would need to b=
e enabled to remove the SRH header prior to the egress PE final destination=
.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">I started reading thro=
ugh this draft to help with my questions on interoperability with MPLS and =
SR-MPLS and brown field deployments where all nodes have a mix of capabilit=
ies.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><div><a href=3D"htt=
ps://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-agrawal-spring-srv6-mpls-interworking-02">ht=
tps://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-agrawal-spring-srv6-mpls-interworking-02</a=
></div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">This draft talks about stitching domains=
 together that SRv6 domain with MPLS or SR-MPLS domains.</div><div dir=3D"a=
uto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Can you use the same concept of advertisin=
g the prefix sid with intra domain with AFI 2 SAFI 1 from the egress PE to =
ingress PE to signal the egress PE for SRv6 instantiation of a BE SRv6 path=
 with capable or non SRv6 capable source node.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br><=
/div><div dir=3D"auto">Also with MPLS and SR-MPLS we have a bottom of stack=
 service label so the label stacks are similar as far as bottom of stack se=
rvice label which helps with that interoperability.=C2=A0 However with SRv6=
 there is not any bottom of stack service label since the egress PE signals=
 via services sid with bgp overlay to egress PE for instantiation of L3 vpn=
 services.=C2=A0 So since SRv6 does not have a bottom of stack service labe=
l, =C2=A0I can see how having an overlay of MPLS and SRv6 operating simulta=
neously may not be possible, but I think this capability would really be he=
lpful for brown field deployments.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div di=
r=3D"auto"><pre class=3D"newpage" style=3D"font-size:1em;margin-top:0px;mar=
gin-bottom:0px;break-before:page"><span class=3D"h3" style=3D"display:inlin=
e;font-size:1em;font-weight:bold"><h3 style=3D"display:inline;font-size:1em=
"><a class=3D"selflink" name=3D"section-3.2" href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org=
/html/draft-agrawal-spring-srv6-mpls-interworking-02#section-3.2" style=3D"=
color:black;text-decoration:none">3.2</a>.  Stitching heterogenous domains =
usin BGP inter domain routing</h3></span>

   For providing services across domains, edge node locators need to be
   reachable.

   -Locators are advertised by edge nodes in the BGP ipv6 unicast
   address family (AFI=3D2,Safi=3D1) to border nodes.  These locators are
   also advertised in its local IGP domain.

   -On border nodes these prefixes are like any IPv6 global prefixes.
   These will be advertised in BGP IPv6 LU[AFI=3D2/SAFI=3D4] session using<=
/pre></div><div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gm=
ail_attr">On Fri, Mar 13, 2020 at 7:18 AM Eduard Metz &lt;<a href=3D"mailto=
:etmetz@gmail.com">etmetz@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote cla=
ss=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;pa=
dding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr">Hi,<div><br></div><div>How is the migratio=
n from MPLS to SRv6 dataplane foreseen in relation to bess-srv6-services?</=
div><div>For instance the case where egress PE supports both MPLS and SRv6 =
dataplane and ingress PE supports MPLS only.</div><div>Would the egress PE =
advertise two routes in this case (with different RD)?<br></div><div><br></=
div><div>cheers,</div><div>=C2=A0 =C2=A0Eduard</div><div><br></div></div>
_______________________________________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><br>
</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature" =
data-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><=
div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font si=
ze=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=
=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" colo=
r=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=
=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" =
face=3D"georgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><fon=
t size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20=
904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" fac=
e=3D"georgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><=
font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D=
"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.=
com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div=
></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>

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From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2020 15:05:06 -0400
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Subject: Re: [bess] MPLS to SRv6 migration (in relation to bess-srv6-services)
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BESS authors of services draft,

A follow on question.

My understanding is there are two modes.

a. BE services mode where SRH is not present - brown field or migration
scenario

b. SLA services mode - steering mode where SRH is present -green field
scenario


Please explain both modes in the context of which nodes if any need to SRv6
capable for either to work.

Also is there a difference between SRv6 capable and SRv6 aware nodes.

Kind of reminds me of Graceful restart capability exchange with helper
router being the GR aware  router and the restart router being GR capable
router.

Does that concept apply to SRv6 in the brown field mixed environment.

Kind regards

Gyan

On Sat, Mar 14, 2020 at 2:55 PM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> Eduard
>
> I have some similar questions related to BE L3 VPN
>
> Dear BESS authors of SRv6 services draft Q&A:
>
> My understanding is that with BE L3 vpn all nodes including the ingress
> and egress PE are not SRv6 capable
>
> However, If the egress PE is brown field in an MPLS IPv4 enabled core and
> not SRv6 capable and let=E2=80=99s say the ingress PE is SRv6 capable, ho=
w does the
> egress PE signal for SRv6 services sid with the BGP overlay services rout=
e
> with corresponding RT for VRF to be instantiation.  The egress PE is not
> SRv6 capable so would not be able to signal for the SRv6 services SID wit=
h
> the L3 vpn BGP overlay.  I did notice that in that verbiage in the first
> sentence it is saying simultaneous SRv6 and MPLS.  Is that true and if so
> then it=E2=80=99s more like MPLS and SRv6 data planes are active simultan=
eously
> which does not make sense either.
>
> In the introduction verbiage on BE VPN is confusing
>
> To provide SRv6 service with best-effort connectivity, the egress PE
>    signals an SRv6 Service SID with the BGP overlay service route.  The
>    ingress PE encapsulates the payload in an outer IPv6 header where the
>    destination address is the SRv6 Service SID provided by the egress
>    PE.  The underlay between the PEs only need to support plain IPv6
>    forwarding [RFC2460 <https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2460>].
>
>
> Section 3 BGP based L3 vpn over IPv6
>
> If the BGP speaker supports MPLS based L3VPN services simultaneously,
>    it MAY also populate a valid Label value in the service route NLRI
>    encoding, and allow the BGP ingress PE to decide which encapsulation
>    to use.  If the BGP speaker does not support MPLS based L3VPN
>    services the Label value in any service route NLRI encoding MUST be
>    set to Implicit NULL [RFC3032 <https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3032>].
>
>    At an ingress PE, BGP installs the received prefix in the correct RIB
>    table, recursing via an SR Policy leveraging the received SRv6
>    Service SID.
>
>    Assuming best-effort connectivity to the egress PE, the SR policy has
>    a path with a SID list made up of a single SID - the SRv6 Service SID
>    received with the related BGP route update.
>
>    However, when the received route is colored with an extended color
>    commmunity 'C' and Next-Hop 'N', and the ingress PE has a valid SRv6
>    Policy (C, N) associated with SID list <S1,S2, S3> [I-D.filsfils-
>    spring-segment-routing-policy], then the effective SR Policy is <S1,
>    S2, S3, SRv6-Service-SID>.
>
>
> In this section for BE services this is where source node Ingres PE is
> SRv6 capable and egress PE is not and in that case the egress PE services
> SID would not be signaled with BGP overlay and the source node would
> instantiation of the path would happen on the source node independently o=
f
> egress node signaling- and I guess in the case PSP mode would need to be
> enabled to remove the SRH header prior to the egress PE final destination=
.
>
> I started reading through this draft to help with my questions on
> interoperability with MPLS and SR-MPLS and brown field deployments where
> all nodes have a mix of capabilities.
>
> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-agrawal-spring-srv6-mpls-interworking-0=
2
>
> This draft talks about stitching domains together that SRv6 domain with
> MPLS or SR-MPLS domains.
>
> Can you use the same concept of advertising the prefix sid with intra
> domain with AFI 2 SAFI 1 from the egress PE to ingress PE to signal the
> egress PE for SRv6 instantiation of a BE SRv6 path with capable or non SR=
v6
> capable source node.
>
> Also with MPLS and SR-MPLS we have a bottom of stack service label so the
> label stacks are similar as far as bottom of stack service label which
> helps with that interoperability.  However with SRv6 there is not any
> bottom of stack service label since the egress PE signals via services si=
d
> with bgp overlay to egress PE for instantiation of L3 vpn services.  So
> since SRv6 does not have a bottom of stack service label,  I can see how
> having an overlay of MPLS and SRv6 operating simultaneously may not be
> possible, but I think this capability would really be helpful for brown
> field deployments.
>
> 3.2 <https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-agrawal-spring-srv6-mpls-interwork=
ing-02#section-3.2>.  Stitching heterogenous domains usin BGP inter domain =
routing
>
>    For providing services across domains, edge node locators need to be
>    reachable.
>
>    -Locators are advertised by edge nodes in the BGP ipv6 unicast
>    address family (AFI=3D2,Safi=3D1) to border nodes.  These locators are
>    also advertised in its local IGP domain.
>
>    -On border nodes these prefixes are like any IPv6 global prefixes.
>    These will be advertised in BGP IPv6 LU[AFI=3D2/SAFI=3D4] session usin=
g
>
>
> On Fri, Mar 13, 2020 at 7:18 AM Eduard Metz <etmetz@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> How is the migration from MPLS to SRv6 dataplane foreseen in relation to
>> bess-srv6-services?
>> For instance the case where egress PE supports both MPLS and SRv6
>> dataplane and ingress PE supports MPLS only.
>> Would the egress PE advertise two routes in this case (with different RD=
)?
>>
>> cheers,
>>    Eduard
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> BESS mailing list
>> BESS@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>>
> --
>
> Gyan  Mishra
>
> Network Engineering & Technology
>
> Verizon
>
> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>
> Phone: 301 502-1347
>
> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>
>
>
> --

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

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<div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div><div dir=3D"auto">BESS auth=
ors of services draft,</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">A=
 follow on question.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">My =
understanding is there are two modes.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div=
 dir=3D"auto">a. BE services mode where SRH is not present - brown field or=
 migration scenario=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto=
">b. SLA services mode - steering mode where SRH is present -green field sc=
enario=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><=
div dir=3D"auto">Please explain both modes in the context of which nodes if=
 any need to SRv6 capable for either to work.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></=
div><div dir=3D"auto">Also is there a difference between SRv6 capable and S=
Rv6 aware nodes.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind of=
 reminds me of Graceful restart capability exchange with helper router bein=
g the GR aware =C2=A0router and the restart router being GR capable router.=
</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Does that concept apply=
 to SRv6 in the brown field mixed environment.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br><=
/div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind regards=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div>=
<div dir=3D"auto">Gyan</div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr"=
 class=3D"gmail_attr">On Sat, Mar 14, 2020 at 2:55 PM Gyan Mishra &lt;<a hr=
ef=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br=
></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-=
left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Edua=
rd</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">I have some similar q=
uestions related to BE L3 VPN</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"=
auto">Dear BESS authors of SRv6 services draft Q&amp;A:</div><div dir=3D"au=
to"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">My understanding is that with BE L3 vpn all=
 nodes including the ingress and egress PE are not SRv6 capable=C2=A0</div>=
<div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">However, If the egress PE is =
brown field in an MPLS IPv4 enabled core and not SRv6 capable and let=E2=80=
=99s say the ingress PE is SRv6 capable, how does the egress PE signal for =
SRv6 services sid with the BGP overlay services route with corresponding RT=
 for VRF to be instantiation.=C2=A0 The egress PE is not SRv6 capable so wo=
uld not be able to signal for the SRv6 services SID with the L3 vpn BGP ove=
rlay.=C2=A0 I did notice that in that verbiage in the first sentence it is =
saying simultaneous SRv6 and MPLS.=C2=A0 Is that true and if so then it=E2=
=80=99s more like MPLS and SRv6 data planes are active simultaneously which=
 does not make sense either.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"a=
uto">In the introduction verbiage on BE VPN is confusing=C2=A0</div><div di=
r=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><pre style=3D"font-size:1em;margin-t=
op:0px;margin-bottom:0px;break-before:page">To provide SRv6 service with be=
st-effort connectivity, the egress PE
   signals an SRv6 Service SID with the BGP overlay service route.  The
   ingress PE encapsulates the payload in an outer IPv6 header where the
   destination address is the SRv6 Service SID provided by the egress
   PE.  The underlay between the PEs only need to support plain IPv6
   forwarding [<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2460" title=3D"&qu=
ot;Internet Protocol, Version 6 (IPv6) Specification&quot;" target=3D"_blan=
k">RFC2460</a>].</pre></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">S=
ection 3 BGP based L3 vpn over IPv6</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div d=
ir=3D"auto"><pre style=3D"font-size:1em;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;br=
eak-before:page">If the BGP speaker supports MPLS based L3VPN services simu=
ltaneously,
   it MAY also populate a valid Label value in the service route NLRI
   encoding, and allow the BGP ingress PE to decide which encapsulation
   to use.  If the BGP speaker does not support MPLS based L3VPN
   services the Label value in any service route NLRI encoding MUST be
   set to Implicit NULL [<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3032" ti=
tle=3D"&quot;MPLS Label Stack Encoding&quot;" target=3D"_blank">RFC3032</a>=
].

   At an ingress PE, BGP installs the received prefix in the correct RIB
   table, recursing via an SR Policy leveraging the received SRv6
   Service SID.

   Assuming best-effort connectivity to the egress PE, the SR policy has
   a path with a SID list made up of a single SID - the SRv6 Service SID
   received with the related BGP route update.

   However, when the received route is colored with an extended color
   commmunity &#39;C&#39; and Next-Hop &#39;N&#39;, and the ingress PE has =
a valid SRv6
   Policy (C, N) associated with SID list &lt;S1,S2, S3&gt; [I-D.filsfils-
   spring-segment-routing-policy], then the effective SR Policy is &lt;S1,
   S2, S3, SRv6-Service-SID&gt;.</pre></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><di=
v dir=3D"auto">In this section for BE services this is where source node In=
gres PE is SRv6 capable and egress PE is not and in that case the egress PE=
 services SID would not be signaled with BGP overlay and the source node wo=
uld instantiation of the path would happen on the source node independently=
 of egress node signaling- and I guess in the case PSP mode would need to b=
e enabled to remove the SRH header prior to the egress PE final destination=
.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">I started reading thro=
ugh this draft to help with my questions on interoperability with MPLS and =
SR-MPLS and brown field deployments where all nodes have a mix of capabilit=
ies.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><div><a href=3D"htt=
ps://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-agrawal-spring-srv6-mpls-interworking-02" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-agrawal-spring-srv6-mpls-=
interworking-02</a></div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">This draft talks about=
 stitching domains together that SRv6 domain with MPLS or SR-MPLS domains.<=
/div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Can you use the same con=
cept of advertising the prefix sid with intra domain with AFI 2 SAFI 1 from=
 the egress PE to ingress PE to signal the egress PE for SRv6 instantiation=
 of a BE SRv6 path with capable or non SRv6 capable source node.</div><div =
dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Also with MPLS and SR-MPLS we have=
 a bottom of stack service label so the label stacks are similar as far as =
bottom of stack service label which helps with that interoperability.=C2=A0=
 However with SRv6 there is not any bottom of stack service label since the=
 egress PE signals via services sid with bgp overlay to egress PE for insta=
ntiation of L3 vpn services.=C2=A0 So since SRv6 does not have a bottom of =
stack service label, =C2=A0I can see how having an overlay of MPLS and SRv6=
 operating simultaneously may not be possible, but I think this capability =
would really be helpful for brown field deployments.</div><div dir=3D"auto"=
><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><pre style=3D"font-size:1em;margin-top:0px;mar=
gin-bottom:0px;break-before:page"><span style=3D"display:inline;font-size:1=
em;font-weight:bold"><h3 style=3D"display:inline;font-size:1em"><a name=3D"=
m_4284420292135552205_section-3.2" href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/draf=
t-agrawal-spring-srv6-mpls-interworking-02#section-3.2" style=3D"color:blac=
k;text-decoration:none" target=3D"_blank">3.2</a>.  Stitching heterogenous =
domains usin BGP inter domain routing</h3></span>

   For providing services across domains, edge node locators need to be
   reachable.

   -Locators are advertised by edge nodes in the BGP ipv6 unicast
   address family (AFI=3D2,Safi=3D1) to border nodes.  These locators are
   also advertised in its local IGP domain.

   -On border nodes these prefixes are like any IPv6 global prefixes.
   These will be advertised in BGP IPv6 LU[AFI=3D2/SAFI=3D4] session using<=
/pre></div><div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gm=
ail_attr">On Fri, Mar 13, 2020 at 7:18 AM Eduard Metz &lt;<a href=3D"mailto=
:etmetz@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">etmetz@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></d=
iv><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left=
:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr">Hi,<div><br></div><div>H=
ow is the migration from MPLS to SRv6 dataplane foreseen in relation to bes=
s-srv6-services?</div><div>For instance the case where egress PE supports b=
oth MPLS and SRv6 dataplane and ingress PE supports MPLS only.</div><div>Wo=
uld the egress PE advertise two routes in this case (with different RD)?<br=
></div><div><br></div><div>cheers,</div><div>=C2=A0 =C2=A0Eduard</div><div>=
<br></div></div>
_______________________________________________<br>
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</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr" data-smartmail=3D"gmail_si=
gnature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000=
000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=C2=A0 Mishra</font></fo=
nt></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"ge=
orgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</font></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">V=
erizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#00=
0000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20904</font></p><p class=3D=
"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Phon=
e: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"=
#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@ver=
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</div></div></div></div>
</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature" =
data-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><=
div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
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ze=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=
=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" colo=
r=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=
=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" =
face=3D"georgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><fon=
t size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20=
904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" fac=
e=3D"georgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><=
font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D=
"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.=
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></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>

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From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2020 15:12:42 -0400
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Subject: Re: [bess] MPLS to SRv6 migration (in relation to bess-srv6-services)
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Sorry for so many questions.

This may belong in rtgwg - are their plans for SRv6 to support SR-TE.

My understanding is that with SRv6 with all nodes SRv6 capable that with
prefix sid specifies for End behavior you have the ECMP & UCMP capability
but then the vpn coloring capabilities as well as other capabilities you
don=E2=80=99t get without SR-TE.

If it=E2=80=99s true that SR-TE will not be added to SRv6 then that makes S=
R-MPLS
more attractive then SRv6.

Gyan

On Sat, Mar 14, 2020 at 3:05 PM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:

>
>
> BESS authors of services draft,
>
> A follow on question.
>
> My understanding is there are two modes.
>
> a. BE services mode where SRH is not present - brown field or migration
> scenario
>
> b. SLA services mode - steering mode where SRH is present -green field
> scenario
>
>
> Please explain both modes in the context of which nodes if any need to
> SRv6 capable for either to work.
>
> Also is there a difference between SRv6 capable and SRv6 aware nodes.
>
> Kind of reminds me of Graceful restart capability exchange with helper
> router being the GR aware  router and the restart router being GR capable
> router.
>
> Does that concept apply to SRv6 in the brown field mixed environment.
>
> Kind regards
>
> Gyan
>
> On Sat, Mar 14, 2020 at 2:55 PM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote=
:
>
>>
>> Eduard
>>
>> I have some similar questions related to BE L3 VPN
>>
>> Dear BESS authors of SRv6 services draft Q&A:
>>
>> My understanding is that with BE L3 vpn all nodes including the ingress
>> and egress PE are not SRv6 capable
>>
>> However, If the egress PE is brown field in an MPLS IPv4 enabled core an=
d
>> not SRv6 capable and let=E2=80=99s say the ingress PE is SRv6 capable, h=
ow does the
>> egress PE signal for SRv6 services sid with the BGP overlay services rou=
te
>> with corresponding RT for VRF to be instantiation.  The egress PE is not
>> SRv6 capable so would not be able to signal for the SRv6 services SID wi=
th
>> the L3 vpn BGP overlay.  I did notice that in that verbiage in the first
>> sentence it is saying simultaneous SRv6 and MPLS.  Is that true and if s=
o
>> then it=E2=80=99s more like MPLS and SRv6 data planes are active simulta=
neously
>> which does not make sense either.
>>
>> In the introduction verbiage on BE VPN is confusing
>>
>> To provide SRv6 service with best-effort connectivity, the egress PE
>>    signals an SRv6 Service SID with the BGP overlay service route.  The
>>    ingress PE encapsulates the payload in an outer IPv6 header where the
>>    destination address is the SRv6 Service SID provided by the egress
>>    PE.  The underlay between the PEs only need to support plain IPv6
>>    forwarding [RFC2460 <https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2460>].
>>
>>
>> Section 3 BGP based L3 vpn over IPv6
>>
>> If the BGP speaker supports MPLS based L3VPN services simultaneously,
>>    it MAY also populate a valid Label value in the service route NLRI
>>    encoding, and allow the BGP ingress PE to decide which encapsulation
>>    to use.  If the BGP speaker does not support MPLS based L3VPN
>>    services the Label value in any service route NLRI encoding MUST be
>>    set to Implicit NULL [RFC3032 <https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3032>].
>>
>>    At an ingress PE, BGP installs the received prefix in the correct RIB
>>    table, recursing via an SR Policy leveraging the received SRv6
>>    Service SID.
>>
>>    Assuming best-effort connectivity to the egress PE, the SR policy has
>>    a path with a SID list made up of a single SID - the SRv6 Service SID
>>    received with the related BGP route update.
>>
>>    However, when the received route is colored with an extended color
>>    commmunity 'C' and Next-Hop 'N', and the ingress PE has a valid SRv6
>>    Policy (C, N) associated with SID list <S1,S2, S3> [I-D.filsfils-
>>    spring-segment-routing-policy], then the effective SR Policy is <S1,
>>    S2, S3, SRv6-Service-SID>.
>>
>>
>> In this section for BE services this is where source node Ingres PE is
>> SRv6 capable and egress PE is not and in that case the egress PE service=
s
>> SID would not be signaled with BGP overlay and the source node would
>> instantiation of the path would happen on the source node independently =
of
>> egress node signaling- and I guess in the case PSP mode would need to be
>> enabled to remove the SRH header prior to the egress PE final destinatio=
n.
>>
>> I started reading through this draft to help with my questions on
>> interoperability with MPLS and SR-MPLS and brown field deployments where
>> all nodes have a mix of capabilities.
>>
>> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-agrawal-spring-srv6-mpls-interworking-=
02
>>
>> This draft talks about stitching domains together that SRv6 domain with
>> MPLS or SR-MPLS domains.
>>
>> Can you use the same concept of advertising the prefix sid with intra
>> domain with AFI 2 SAFI 1 from the egress PE to ingress PE to signal the
>> egress PE for SRv6 instantiation of a BE SRv6 path with capable or non S=
Rv6
>> capable source node.
>>
>> Also with MPLS and SR-MPLS we have a bottom of stack service label so th=
e
>> label stacks are similar as far as bottom of stack service label which
>> helps with that interoperability.  However with SRv6 there is not any
>> bottom of stack service label since the egress PE signals via services s=
id
>> with bgp overlay to egress PE for instantiation of L3 vpn services.  So
>> since SRv6 does not have a bottom of stack service label,  I can see how
>> having an overlay of MPLS and SRv6 operating simultaneously may not be
>> possible, but I think this capability would really be helpful for brown
>> field deployments.
>>
>> 3.2 <https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-agrawal-spring-srv6-mpls-interwor=
king-02#section-3.2>.  Stitching heterogenous domains usin BGP inter domain=
 routing
>>
>>    For providing services across domains, edge node locators need to be
>>    reachable.
>>
>>    -Locators are advertised by edge nodes in the BGP ipv6 unicast
>>    address family (AFI=3D2,Safi=3D1) to border nodes.  These locators ar=
e
>>    also advertised in its local IGP domain.
>>
>>    -On border nodes these prefixes are like any IPv6 global prefixes.
>>    These will be advertised in BGP IPv6 LU[AFI=3D2/SAFI=3D4] session usi=
ng
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Mar 13, 2020 at 7:18 AM Eduard Metz <etmetz@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> How is the migration from MPLS to SRv6 dataplane foreseen in relation t=
o
>>> bess-srv6-services?
>>> For instance the case where egress PE supports both MPLS and SRv6
>>> dataplane and ingress PE supports MPLS only.
>>> Would the egress PE advertise two routes in this case (with different
>>> RD)?
>>>
>>> cheers,
>>>    Eduard
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> BESS mailing list
>>> BESS@ietf.org
>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>>>
>> --
>>
>> Gyan  Mishra
>>
>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>
>> Verizon
>>
>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>
>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>
>> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>
> Gyan  Mishra
>
> Network Engineering & Technology
>
> Verizon
>
> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>
> Phone: 301 502-1347
>
> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>
>
>
> --

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

--0000000000007116d605a0d560a0
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div><div dir=3D"auto">Sorry for=
 so many questions.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">This=
 may belong in rtgwg - are their plans for SRv6 to support SR-TE.</div><div=
 dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">My understanding is that with SRv=
6 with all nodes SRv6 capable that with prefix sid specifies for End behavi=
or you have the ECMP &amp; UCMP capability but then the vpn coloring capabi=
lities as well as other capabilities you don=E2=80=99t get without SR-TE.</=
div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">If it=E2=80=99s true that=
 SR-TE will not be added to SRv6 then that makes SR-MPLS more attractive th=
en SRv6.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Gyan=C2=A0</div=
><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Sa=
t, Mar 14, 2020 at 3:05 PM Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gm=
ail.com">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D=
"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding=
-left:1ex"><div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div><div dir=3D"auto=
">BESS authors of services draft,</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=
=3D"auto">A follow on question.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=
=3D"auto">My understanding is there are two modes.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><=
br></div><div dir=3D"auto">a. BE services mode where SRH is not present - b=
rown field or migration scenario=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><di=
v dir=3D"auto">b. SLA services mode - steering mode where SRH is present -g=
reen field scenario=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto=
"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Please explain both modes in the context of w=
hich nodes if any need to SRv6 capable for either to work.</div><div dir=3D=
"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Also is there a difference between SRv6 =
capable and SRv6 aware nodes.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"=
auto">Kind of reminds me of Graceful restart capability exchange with helpe=
r router being the GR aware =C2=A0router and the restart router being GR ca=
pable router.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Does that =
concept apply to SRv6 in the brown field mixed environment.</div><div dir=
=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind regards=C2=A0</div></div><div><d=
iv dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Gyan</div><br><div class=3D"gma=
il_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Sat, Mar 14, 2020 at 2:5=
5 PM Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_bl=
ank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gma=
il_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-lef=
t:1ex"><div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Eduard</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br><=
/div><div dir=3D"auto">I have some similar questions related to BE L3 VPN</=
div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Dear BESS authors of SRv6=
 services draft Q&amp;A:</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"=
>My understanding is that with BE L3 vpn all nodes including the ingress an=
d egress PE are not SRv6 capable=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><di=
v dir=3D"auto">However, If the egress PE is brown field in an MPLS IPv4 ena=
bled core and not SRv6 capable and let=E2=80=99s say the ingress PE is SRv6=
 capable, how does the egress PE signal for SRv6 services sid with the BGP =
overlay services route with corresponding RT for VRF to be instantiation.=
=C2=A0 The egress PE is not SRv6 capable so would not be able to signal for=
 the SRv6 services SID with the L3 vpn BGP overlay.=C2=A0 I did notice that=
 in that verbiage in the first sentence it is saying simultaneous SRv6 and =
MPLS.=C2=A0 Is that true and if so then it=E2=80=99s more like MPLS and SRv=
6 data planes are active simultaneously which does not make sense either.</=
div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">In the introduction verbi=
age on BE VPN is confusing=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=
=3D"auto"><pre style=3D"font-size:1em;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;brea=
k-before:page">To provide SRv6 service with best-effort connectivity, the e=
gress PE
   signals an SRv6 Service SID with the BGP overlay service route.  The
   ingress PE encapsulates the payload in an outer IPv6 header where the
   destination address is the SRv6 Service SID provided by the egress
   PE.  The underlay between the PEs only need to support plain IPv6
   forwarding [<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2460" title=3D"&qu=
ot;Internet Protocol, Version 6 (IPv6) Specification&quot;" target=3D"_blan=
k">RFC2460</a>].</pre></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">S=
ection 3 BGP based L3 vpn over IPv6</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div d=
ir=3D"auto"><pre style=3D"font-size:1em;margin-top:0px;margin-bottom:0px;br=
eak-before:page">If the BGP speaker supports MPLS based L3VPN services simu=
ltaneously,
   it MAY also populate a valid Label value in the service route NLRI
   encoding, and allow the BGP ingress PE to decide which encapsulation
   to use.  If the BGP speaker does not support MPLS based L3VPN
   services the Label value in any service route NLRI encoding MUST be
   set to Implicit NULL [<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3032" ti=
tle=3D"&quot;MPLS Label Stack Encoding&quot;" target=3D"_blank">RFC3032</a>=
].

   At an ingress PE, BGP installs the received prefix in the correct RIB
   table, recursing via an SR Policy leveraging the received SRv6
   Service SID.

   Assuming best-effort connectivity to the egress PE, the SR policy has
   a path with a SID list made up of a single SID - the SRv6 Service SID
   received with the related BGP route update.

   However, when the received route is colored with an extended color
   commmunity &#39;C&#39; and Next-Hop &#39;N&#39;, and the ingress PE has =
a valid SRv6
   Policy (C, N) associated with SID list &lt;S1,S2, S3&gt; [I-D.filsfils-
   spring-segment-routing-policy], then the effective SR Policy is &lt;S1,
   S2, S3, SRv6-Service-SID&gt;.</pre></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><di=
v dir=3D"auto">In this section for BE services this is where source node In=
gres PE is SRv6 capable and egress PE is not and in that case the egress PE=
 services SID would not be signaled with BGP overlay and the source node wo=
uld instantiation of the path would happen on the source node independently=
 of egress node signaling- and I guess in the case PSP mode would need to b=
e enabled to remove the SRH header prior to the egress PE final destination=
.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">I started reading thro=
ugh this draft to help with my questions on interoperability with MPLS and =
SR-MPLS and brown field deployments where all nodes have a mix of capabilit=
ies.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><div><a href=3D"htt=
ps://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-agrawal-spring-srv6-mpls-interworking-02" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-agrawal-spring-srv6-mpls-=
interworking-02</a></div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">This draft talks about=
 stitching domains together that SRv6 domain with MPLS or SR-MPLS domains.<=
/div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Can you use the same con=
cept of advertising the prefix sid with intra domain with AFI 2 SAFI 1 from=
 the egress PE to ingress PE to signal the egress PE for SRv6 instantiation=
 of a BE SRv6 path with capable or non SRv6 capable source node.</div><div =
dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Also with MPLS and SR-MPLS we have=
 a bottom of stack service label so the label stacks are similar as far as =
bottom of stack service label which helps with that interoperability.=C2=A0=
 However with SRv6 there is not any bottom of stack service label since the=
 egress PE signals via services sid with bgp overlay to egress PE for insta=
ntiation of L3 vpn services.=C2=A0 So since SRv6 does not have a bottom of =
stack service label, =C2=A0I can see how having an overlay of MPLS and SRv6=
 operating simultaneously may not be possible, but I think this capability =
would really be helpful for brown field deployments.</div><div dir=3D"auto"=
><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><pre style=3D"font-size:1em;margin-top:0px;mar=
gin-bottom:0px;break-before:page"><span style=3D"display:inline;font-size:1=
em;font-weight:bold"><h3 style=3D"display:inline;font-size:1em"><a name=3D"=
m_3922952342053134396_m_4284420292135552205_section-3.2" href=3D"https://to=
ols.ietf.org/html/draft-agrawal-spring-srv6-mpls-interworking-02#section-3.=
2" style=3D"color:black;text-decoration:none" target=3D"_blank">3.2</a>.  S=
titching heterogenous domains usin BGP inter domain routing</h3></span>

   For providing services across domains, edge node locators need to be
   reachable.

   -Locators are advertised by edge nodes in the BGP ipv6 unicast
   address family (AFI=3D2,Safi=3D1) to border nodes.  These locators are
   also advertised in its local IGP domain.

   -On border nodes these prefixes are like any IPv6 global prefixes.
   These will be advertised in BGP IPv6 LU[AFI=3D2/SAFI=3D4] session using<=
/pre></div><div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gm=
ail_attr">On Fri, Mar 13, 2020 at 7:18 AM Eduard Metz &lt;<a href=3D"mailto=
:etmetz@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">etmetz@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></d=
iv><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left=
:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr">Hi,<div><br></div><div>H=
ow is the migration from MPLS to SRv6 dataplane foreseen in relation to bes=
s-srv6-services?</div><div>For instance the case where egress PE supports b=
oth MPLS and SRv6 dataplane and ingress PE supports MPLS only.</div><div>Wo=
uld the egress PE advertise two routes in this case (with different RD)?<br=
></div><div><br></div><div>cheers,</div><div>=C2=A0 =C2=A0Eduard</div><div>=
<br></div></div>
_______________________________________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><br>
</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr" data-smartmail=3D"gmail_si=
gnature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000=
000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=C2=A0 Mishra</font></fo=
nt></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"ge=
orgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</font></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">V=
erizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#00=
0000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20904</font></p><p class=3D=
"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Phon=
e: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"=
#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@ver=
izon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></font></p><p clas=
s=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div></div></div></div></div>=
</div></div></div></div>
</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr" data-smartmail=3D"gmail_si=
gnature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000=
000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=C2=A0 Mishra</font></fo=
nt></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"ge=
orgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</font></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">V=
erizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#00=
0000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20904</font></p><p class=3D=
"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Phon=
e: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"=
#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@ver=
izon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></font></p><p clas=
s=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div></div></div></div></div>=
</div></div></div></div>
</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature" =
data-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><=
div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font si=
ze=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=
=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" colo=
r=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=
=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" =
face=3D"georgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><fon=
t size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20=
904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" fac=
e=3D"georgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><=
font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D=
"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.=
com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div=
></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>

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From: Boris Hassanov <bhassanov@yahoo.com>
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Subject: [bess] FURTHER REMINDER Re: WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation Poll for draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04
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Hi Matthew and all,
I read the draft and personally support its publication.
Here are some comments:1) Introduction part has the following statement: "S=
egment Routing (SR) [RFC8402] is a popular protocol mechanism for use withi=
n a DC...". I would love to see SR as popular mechanism within DC worldwide=
, but such statement requires either=C2=A0 a reference to some cases/exampl=
es of SR-baced DCs or, IMO, has to be changed to something like "...become =
a popular mechanism..."=20

2) Fig 1, IMO, needs additional information about which AS/ ASes are used f=
or Ingress and Egress SR Domains (Guess AS1 and AS2 respectively, but it ha=
s to be shown). Current version looks a bit confusing, for example, why we =
need AS3 on Fig.1?
3) If new Tunnel Encapsulation is defined as SR Tunnel, will ietf-idr-tunne=
l-encaps be updated accordingly?=C2=A0 15th version does not have it so far=
.
4) Part 3. SR Domain GW Auto-Discovery says: "=C2=A0Each GW is configured w=
ith an identifier for the SR domain."What is this identifier? I was not abl=
e to see its definition/reference or missed it.
5) May be it would be good to explicitly mention in Part 3 that it is a BGP=
 based AD?
6) I would also swap the order of Part 4 and 5 (make Part 5 as Part 4 and v=
ice versa), because, IMO, the definition of how we will assign and transfer=
 the SID for those GWs for prefix X is much more important than usage of BG=
P-EPE in this scenario.
7) Sorry, i didn't=C2=A0 get the idea of the last paragraph in existing Par=
t 5: "Alternatively, if the GWs for a given SR domain are configured to
allow remote GWs to perform SR TE through that SR domain for a prefix X, th=
en each GW computes an SR TE path through that SR domain to X from each of =
the currently active GWs, and places each in an MPLS label stack sub-TLV [I=
-D.ietf-idr-tunnel-encaps] in the SR tunnel instance for that GW."Could you=
 pls consider to re-phrase it in more simple manner?=C2=A0
8) Would you consider the case when we could have different SR domains, i.e=
., SR-MPLS and SRv6?
Thank you.
SY,Boris


[bess] FURTHER REMINDER Re: WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation Poll for d=
raft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04
=20
 "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com> Thu, 12 March 2020=
 10:51 UTCShow header=20
 Folks

I=E2=80=99m keeping the WG last call running for another two weeks (until 2=
5th March).

Please read the draft and indicate to the list if you have any comments. Ev=
en if you do not have comments, please indicate if you do or do not support=
 publication.

I will also advertise the WG last call to the SPRING list.

Thanks

Matthew


------=_Part_3360129_1150439945.1584266420177
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<html><head></head><body><div class=3D"ydp4f576a35yahoo-style-wrap" style=
=3D"font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:13px=
;"><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">Hi Matthew and all,</div><div dir=
=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"fa=
lse">I read the draft and personally support its publication.</div><div dir=
=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"fa=
lse">Here are some comments:</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><d=
iv dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">1) Introduction part has the following=
 statement: "Segment Routing (SR) [RFC8402] is a popular protocol mechanism=
 for use within a DC...". I would love to see SR as popular mechanism withi=
n DC worldwide, but such statement requires either&nbsp; a reference to som=
e cases/examples of SR-baced DCs or, IMO, has to be changed to something li=
ke "...become a popular mechanism..." <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdi=
r=3D"false"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">2) Fig 1, IMO,=
 needs additional information about which AS/ ASes are used for Ingress and=
 Egress SR Domains (Guess AS1 and AS2 respectively, but it has to be shown)=
. Current version looks a bit confusing, for example, why we need AS3 on Fi=
g.1?</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"=
 data-setdir=3D"false">3) If new Tunnel Encapsulation is defined as SR Tunn=
el, will ietf-idr-tunnel-encaps be updated accordingly?&nbsp; 15th version =
does not have it <span>so far</span>.</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"=
false"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><div dir=3D"ltr" da=
ta-setdir=3D"false">4) Part 3. SR Domain GW Auto-Discovery says: "&nbsp;<sp=
an><pre>Each GW is configured with an identifier for the SR domain."<span><=
/span></pre></span><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">What is this iden=
tifier? I was not able to see its definition/reference or missed it.</div><=
div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdi=
r=3D"false">5) May be it would be good to explicitly mention in Part 3 that=
 it is a BGP based AD?</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br></di=
v><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">6) I would also swap the order of =
Part 4 and 5 (make Part 5 as Part 4 and vice versa), because, IMO, the defi=
nition of how we will assign and transfer the SID for those GWs for prefix =
X is much more important than usage of BGP-EPE in this scenario.</div><div =
dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D=
"false">7) Sorry, i didn't&nbsp; get the idea of the last paragraph in exis=
ting Part 5: "</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><div><pre>Altern=
atively, if the GWs for a given SR domain are configured to
allow remote GWs to perform SR TE through that SR domain for a prefix X, th=
en each GW computes an SR TE path through that SR domain to X from each of =
the currently active GWs, and places each in an MPLS label stack sub-TLV [I=
-D.ietf-idr-tunnel-encaps] in the SR tunnel instance for that GW."</pre></d=
iv><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">Could you pls consider to re-phra=
se it in more simple manner?</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">&n=
bsp;<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">8) Would you consider =
the case when we could have different SR domains, i.e., SR-MPLS and SRv6?</=
div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-=
setdir=3D"false">Thank you.</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br=
></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">SY,</div><div dir=3D"ltr" dat=
a-setdir=3D"false">Boris<br></div></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"fal=
se"><br></div></div></div></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><div=
><h3>[bess] FURTHER REMINDER Re: WG Last Call, IPR and Implementation Poll =
for draft-ietf-bess-datacenter-gateway-04</h3>
    <p id=3D"ydp497ff886msg-info" class=3D"ydp497ff886msg-header">
      <span id=3D"ydp497ff886msg-from" class=3D"ydp497ff886pipe">"Bocci, Ma=
tthew (Nokia - GB)" &lt;matthew.bocci@nokia.com&gt;</span>
      <span id=3D"ydp497ff886msg-date" class=3D"ydp497ff886pipe">Thu, 12 Ma=
rch  2020 10:51 UTC</span><a id=3D"ydp497ff886toggle-msg-header" class=3D"y=
dp497ff886toggle" href=3D"https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/bess/#" =
rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">Show header</a>
    </p>
   =20
   =20
     =20
          <pre class=3D"ydp497ff886wordwrap">Folks

I=E2=80=99m keeping the WG last call running for another two weeks (until 2=
5th March).

Please read the draft and indicate to the list if you have any comments. Ev=
en if you do not have comments, please indicate if you do or do not support=
 publication.

I will also advertise the WG last call to the SPRING list.

Thanks

Matthew
</pre></div><div><br></div></div></div></body></html>
------=_Part_3360129_1150439945.1584266420177--


From nobody Wed Mar 18 12:24:28 2020
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Subject: [bess] Genart last call review of draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-05
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Reviewer: Joel Halpern
Review result: Ready with Issues

I am the assigned Gen-ART reviewer for this draft. The General Area
Review Team (Gen-ART) reviews all IETF documents being processed
by the IESG for the IETF Chair.  Please treat these comments just
like any other last call comments.

For more information, please see the FAQ at

<https://trac.ietf.org/trac/gen/wiki/GenArtfaq>.

Document: draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-05
Reviewer: Joel Halpern
Review Date: 2020-03-18
IETF LC End Date: 2020-03-12
IESG Telechat date: Not scheduled for a telechat

Summary: This document is ready for publication as a Proposed Standard.  I
would recommend that the minor issues below be addressed before approval for
publication.

Major issues: N/A

Minor issues:
    Section 1 seems to have some language oddities.   The first paragraph
    appears to be technically correct that  RFC 4761 and 6074 both describe
    using BGP for auto-discovery.  As written, the text seems to imply that the
    same thing is defined in two places.  This is going to confuse readers and
    tempt them into trying to understand the wrong problem.  Please either
    simplify or explain. (I believe the distinction in the RFCs is about use
    with LDP.  While the text refers to that, the English construction is not
    clear.) Section 1.1  paragraph 4 is a duplicate of the latter half of
    paragraph 3.

   VE (VPLS Edge) is defined in section 1.1 as being about a device.  The
   introductory text then starts talking about VE NLRI and VE-IDs.  It looks
   like the point is merely to setup the definition for  CE-NLRI.  If so, the
   text could be restructured to say:
     BGP VPLS NLRI as specified in section 3.2.2 in [RFC4761] includes a number
     of fields.  This document refers to the VE-ID, VE offset, .... from that
     RFC.

   This document should reference RFC 8174 as part of BCP 14.  And should use
   upper case usage (MUST, SHOULD, ...) consistently.  It currently mixes upper
   and lower case usage in different places.  Even though some of each usage
   are clearly normative.

    It is unclear why discarding CE-ID=0 (which is defined to be invalid) is a
    should rather than a MUST.

    The beginning of section 3.3.1 seems to say that the L2-info community may
    be omitted (e.g. is optional).  Then the text says that it must (presumably
    upper case) be present.   As written, this is quite confusing. Reading
    later, it appears that this is intended to support backwards compatibility.
     If so, then the sentence about handling their absence should say "Although
    required, this document specifies mechanisms for dealing with their absence
    to support backwards compatibility."  Alternatively, it seems that the
    L2-info is allways required, but that the L2-pref is not required unless
    the VPLS advertisement is inter-AS.  If that is the case, say that.

Nits/editorial comments:
    I found myself misreading the definition of multi-homing: "redundant
    connectivity to one or more sites".  What is there is technically correct. 
    It would help I think if this were split into two pieces: multi-homing is
    when the provider provides redundant VPLS connectivity to a customer site. 
    If the customer has more than one site, the service is considered to be
    multi-homed if at least one site is multi-homed.

   Section 3.3.1, the two new flags in the L2-info community are presumably
   defined in this document rather than proposed.   Or at least, that is how
   they need to be described once this document is approved.



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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/N3q4PpL9BmjAEVjfSaFys0Sio20>
Subject: [bess] Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
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Based on Basil's comment on needing an identifier to differentiate SDWAN in=
stances, I added a section to  draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . Want to =
hear people's feedback.

3.1    Requirements
3.1.1 Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations
The term "network segmentation" is used extensively in SDWAN deployment. In=
 general (and in this document), the "Network Segmentation" is referring to=
 the process of dividing the network into logical sub-networks using isolat=
ion techniques on a forwarding device such as a switch, router, or firewall=
. For a homogeneous network, such as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, VRF or VL=
AN are used to separate network segments.
As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks, it =
is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN network in=
stances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do not ha=
ve their own assigned AS numbers, a very easy way is to use Private AS numb=
ers, in the range of 64512 to 65535, to differentiate different SDWAN segme=
ntations. When using BGP to control the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numb=
ers are carried by the BGP UPDATE messages to their corresponding RRs.

Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description.

Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used?

Thank you very much.

Linda Dunbar

From: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>
Sent: Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; bess@ietf.org
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
Subject: RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descript=
ion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segmen=
tation



Hi Linda;

The SD-WAN Segment is part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there coul=
d be more than one Segment over a single underlay depending on the design a=
nd the business requirements.

Each Segment represents a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I su=
ggested that we may need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update messag=
es in order to identify and build the routing the table for each Segment (b=
ased on the Segment ID).

Hope this helps.

Regards;

Basil


From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewe=
i.com>>
Sent: February-03-20 10:40 AM
To: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>; bess@ie=
tf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage des=
cription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based S=
egmentation

Basil,

Thank you very much for the comments.
Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision.

As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be inc=
luded in the BGP UPDATE), does the "Segment" mean the different Underlay?
In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to Publ=
ic Internet.
Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN "segments"?
If not, can you elaborate more?

[cid:image001.png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0]


Thanks, Linda

From: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>
Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.=
com>>; bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descript=
ion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segmen=
tation


Hello Linda;

I haven't gone through the entire document; however, I have the following q=
uick comments


  1.  Regarding the following paragraph:


  1.  Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over di=
fferent underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overlay p=
aths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks over w=
hich traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, e.=
g. over untrusted public networks.

The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either encrypted or u=
necrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is NOT encrypted=
 is not always correct). I would change the parpagaph to the following (for=
 clarity):


  1.  Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over di=
fferent underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overlay p=
aths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks over w=
hich traffic can traverse with or without encryption, others require encryp=
tion, e.g. over untrusted public networks.



  1.  Another thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each Segment=
 (at the SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will map the Appli=
cation Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a "routing domain", the BG=
P update will be exchanged with the memebers of a particular Segment.



As such: Should we include the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP update=
 messages? Perhaps we need to further discuss this in details.

Any feedback is welcomed and it's highly appreciated.

Regards;

Basil


From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewe=
i.com>>
Sent: January-31-20 5:17 PM
To: bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descrip=
tion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segme=
ntation

BESS participants:

"SDWAN" networks is characterized by:

  1.  Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over di=
fferent underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overlay p=
aths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks over w=
hich traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, e.=
g. over untrusted public networks.
  2.  Enable direct Internet access from remote sites, instead hauling all =
traffic to Corporate HQ for centralized policy control.
  3.  Some traffic are routed based on application IDs instead of based on =
destination IP addresses.


https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/<https:/=
/nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdatatracker.ie=
tf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&data=3D02%7C01%7Clinda.=
dunbar%40futurewei.com%7Ca9128cd6280b43a3456408d7ac10f64a%7C0fee8ff2a3b2401=
89c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637167061164641902&sdata=3Dvcl8z6cEeSYXXhp%2Fzu=
ZjQ7bIfSTnzPSjYiWnENbs27g%3D&reserved=3D0> describes examples of using BGP =
UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Application Based Segmentation,  assum=
ing that the applications are assigned with unique IP addresses.
In the Figure below, the following BGP Updates can be advertised to ensure =
that Payment Application only communicates with the Payment Gateway:

[cid:image002.png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0]

BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topology (only propagated to=
 Payment GW node:

-        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:

        *   30.1.1.x/24

-        Tunnel Encap Path Attribute

        *   IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW ->C-PE2


BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be reached by Purple:

-        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:

        *   10.1.x.x
        *   12.4.x.x

-        TunnelEncap Path Attribute:

        *   Any node to C-PE2


Your feedback is greatly appreciated.

Thank you very much.

Linda Dunbar
________________________________
External Email: Please use caution when opening links and attachments / Cou=
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________________________________
External Email: Please use caution when opening links and attachments / Cou=
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</head>
<body lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"#0563C1" vlink=3D"#954F72">
<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Based on Basil&#8217;s comment on needing an identif=
ier to differentiate SDWAN instances, I added a section to &nbsp;draft-dunb=
ar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . Want to hear people&#8217;s feedback.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<h2 style=3D"margin-left:45.0pt;text-indent:-.5in;mso-list:l6 level2 lfo14"=
><a name=3D"_Toc31377653"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Igno=
re">3.1<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]>Requirements</a><o:p></o:p></h2>
<h3 style=3D"margin-left:.75in;text-indent:-.5in;mso-list:l6 level3 lfo14">=
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">3.1.1</span><![endif]>=
 Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations<o:p></o:p></h3>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The term &#8220;network segmentation&#8221; is used =
extensively in SDWAN deployment. In general (and in this document), the &#8=
220;Network Segmentation&#8221; is referring to the process of dividing the=
 network into logical sub-networks using isolation techniques
 on a forwarding device such as a switch, router, or firewall. For a homoge=
neous network, such as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, VRF or VLAN are used to=
 separate network segments.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple=
 types of networks, it is important to have distinct identifiers to differe=
ntiate SDWAN network instances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN net=
work segments do not have their own
 assigned AS numbers, a very easy way is to use Private AS numbers, in the =
range of 64512 to 65535, to differentiate different SDWAN segmentations. Wh=
en using BGP to control the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numbers are carr=
ied by the BGP UPDATE messages to
 their corresponding RRs.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description.=
 <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used=
? <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you very much. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda Dunbar<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;basil.najem@bell.ca&gt=
; <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;linda.dunbar@futurewei.com&gt;; bess@ietf.org<b=
r>
<b>Cc:</b> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hi Lind=
a;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">The SD-=
WAN Segment is part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there could be mo=
re than one Segment over a single underlay depending on the design and the =
business requirements.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Each Se=
gment represents a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I suggested=
 that we may need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update messages in o=
rder to identify and build the routing
 the table for each Segment (based on the Segment ID).<o:p></o:p></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hope th=
is helps.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Regards=
;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Basil</=
span><b><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:lind=
a.dunbar@futurewei.com">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> February-03-20 10:40 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca">basil.na=
jem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-us=
age description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application =
Based Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Basil, <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you very much for the comments. <o:p></o:p></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Your suggested wording change will be incorporated i=
n the next revision.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of =
a SDWAN node (to be included in the BGP UPDATE), does the &#8220;Segment&#8=
221; mean the different Underlay?
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPL=
S network and 1 to Public Internet.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN &#8220;segments&#8221;? =
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">If not, can you elaborate more? <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><img border=3D"0" width=3D"390" height=3D"305" style=
=3D"width:4.0625in;height:3.1736in" id=3D"_x0000_i1025" src=3D"cid:image001=
.png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0"><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks, Linda<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basi=
l.najem@bell.ca">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">l=
inda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hello L=
inda;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">I haven=
&#8217;t gone through the entire document; however, I have the following qu=
ick comments<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<ol style=3D"margin-top:0in" start=3D"1" type=3D"A">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:#1F497D;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo2"><sp=
an lang=3D"EN-CA">Regarding the following paragraph:<o:p></o:p></span></li>=
</ol>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<ol start=3D"1" type=3D"1">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-left:.25in;=
mso-list:l3 level1 lfo4">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span style=3D"font-size:=
12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D">The traffic =
that traverses the privet networks can be either encrypted or unecrypted (i=
n other words, the assumption that the traffic is
 NOT encrypted is not always correct). I would change the parpagaph to the =
following (for clarity):<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<ol start=3D"1" type=3D"1">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-left:.25in;=
mso-list:l7 level1 lfo6">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse <span style=3D"color:red">with or </span>withou=
t encryption, others require encryption, e.g. over untrusted public network=
s.
<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<ol style=3D"margin-top:0in" start=3D"2" type=3D"A">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:#1F497D;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo2"><sp=
an style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif">Anot=
her thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each Segment (at the S=
D-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will
 map the Application Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a &#8220;rou=
ting domain&#8221;, the BGP update will be exchanged with the memebers of a=
 particular Segment.
<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&=
quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&=
quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D;background:yellow;mso-highlight:y=
ellow">As such: Should we include the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP=
 update messages? Perhaps we need to further discuss
 this in details.</span><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;A=
rial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Any feedback is welcomed and it&#8217;s=
 highly appreciated.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Regards;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Basil<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:lind=
a.dunbar@futurewei.com">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> January-31-20 5:17 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage =
description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Base=
d Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">BESS participants:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto">&#8220;SDWAN&#8221=
; networks is characterized by:
<o:p></o:p></p>
<ol start=3D"1" type=3D"1">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-left:.25in;=
mso-list:l5 level1 lfo8">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:=
auto;margin-left:.25in;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo8">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Enable direct Internet =
access from remote sites, instead hauling all traffic to Corporate HQ for c=
entralized policy control.
<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:=
auto;margin-left:.25in;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo8">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Some traffic are routed=
 based on application IDs instead of based on destination IP addresses.
<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outloo=
k.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdatatracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-b=
gp-sdwan-usage%2F&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Clinda.dunbar%40futurewei.com%7Ca9128=
cd6280b43a3456408d7ac10f64a%7C0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C63=
7167061164641902&amp;sdata=3Dvcl8z6cEeSYXXhp%2FzuZjQ7bIfSTnzPSjYiWnENbs27g%=
3D&amp;reserved=3D0"><span style=3D"color:blue">https://datatracker.ietf.or=
g/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/</span></a>
 describes examples of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Appli=
cation Based Segmentation, &nbsp;assuming that the applications are assigne=
d with unique IP addresses.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">In the Figure below, the following BGP Updates can b=
e advertised to ensure that Payment Application only communicates with the =
Payment Gateway:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><img border=3D"0" width=3D"538" height=3D"218" style=
=3D"width:5.6041in;height:2.2708in" id=3D"Picture_x0020_1" src=3D"cid:image=
002.png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0"><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topol=
ogy (only propagated to Payment GW node:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormalCxSpMiddle" style=3D"margin-left:62.65pt;mso-add-space=
:auto;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l4 level1 lfo10">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;=
,serif"><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">-<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Ti=
mes New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Att=
ribute: </span>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:black;mso-list:l0 level3 lfo12">30.1=
.1.x/24<o:p></o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"MsoNormalCxSpMiddle" style=3D"margin-left:62.65pt;mso-add-space=
:auto;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l4 level1 lfo10">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;=
,serif"><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">-<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Ti=
mes New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"color:black">Tunnel Encap Pat=
h Attribute</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:black;mso-list:l0 level3 lfo12">IPse=
c Attributes for PaymentGW -&gt;C-PE2<o:p></o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"MsoNormalCxSpMiddle" style=3D"margin-left:134.65pt;mso-add-spac=
e:auto"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be =
reached by Purple:<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormalCxSpMiddle" style=3D"margin-left:62.65pt;mso-add-space=
:auto;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo12">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;=
,serif"><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">-<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Ti=
mes New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Att=
ribute:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-list:l0 level3 lfo12"><span style=3D"c=
olor:black">10.1.x.x</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D=
"mso-list:l0 level3 lfo12"><span style=3D"color:black">12.4.x.x</span><o:p>=
</o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"MsoNormalCxSpMiddle" style=3D"margin-left:62.65pt;mso-add-space=
:auto;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l4 level1 lfo10">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;=
,serif;color:black"><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">-<span style=3D"font:7.=
0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"color:black">TunnelEncap Path=
 Attribute:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:black;mso-list:l4 level3 lfo10">Any =
node to C-PE2<o:p></o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Your feedback is greatly appreciated. <o:p></o:p></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you very much. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda Dunbar<o:p></o:p></p>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center">
</span></div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><strong><i><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-famil=
y:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue">External Email:</span></i></st=
rong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,san=
s-serif;color:blue"> Please use caution when opening links
 and attachments / </span></em><strong><i><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;fo=
nt-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue">Courriel externe:</spa=
n></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri=
&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue"> Soyez prudent avec les liens
 et documents joints </span></em><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-famil=
y:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center">
</span></div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><strong><i><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-famil=
y:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue">External Email:</span></i></st=
rong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,san=
s-serif;color:blue"> Please use caution when opening links
 and attachments / </span></em><strong><i><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;fo=
nt-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue">Courriel externe:</spa=
n></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri=
&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue"> Soyez prudent avec les liens
 et documents joints </span></em><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-famil=
y:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
To: "idr@ietf.org" <idr@ietf.org>
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Thread-Topic: Is there any problem of using  Private AS as  "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for  draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/VgaYCZTh--v9axsoAUO7bN1XpIo>
Subject: [bess] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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BGP Experts,

Do you know if  there is any problem of using  Private AS as  "Identifier" =
to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation? Here is the discussion in BESS WG. Wa=
nt to get IDR WG feedbacks for this question.

Thank you.
Linda

From: Linda Dunbar
Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM
To: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>; bess@ietf.org
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
Subject: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to differ=
entiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?

Based on Basil's comment on needing an identifier to differentiate SDWAN in=
stances, I added a section to  draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . Want to =
hear people's feedback.

3.1    Requirements
3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations
The term "network segmentation" is used extensively in SDWAN deployment. In=
 general (and in this document), the "Network Segmentation" is referring to=
 the process of dividing the network into logical sub-networks using isolat=
ion techniques on a forwarding device such as a switch, router, or firewall=
. For a homogeneous network, such as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, VRF or VL=
AN are used to separate network segments.
As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks, it =
is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN network in=
stances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do not ha=
ve their own assigned AS numbers, a very easy way is to use Private AS numb=
ers, in the range of 64512 to 65535, to differentiate different SDWAN segme=
ntations. When using BGP to control the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numb=
ers are carried by the BGP UPDATE messages to their corresponding RRs.

Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description.

Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used?

Thank you very much.

Linda Dunbar

From: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>
Sent: Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.=
com>>; bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descript=
ion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segmen=
tation



Hi Linda;

The SD-WAN Segment is part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there coul=
d be more than one Segment over a single underlay depending on the design a=
nd the business requirements.

Each Segment represents a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I su=
ggested that we may need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update messag=
es in order to identify and build the routing the table for each Segment (b=
ased on the Segment ID).

Hope this helps.

Regards;

Basil


From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewe=
i.com>>
Sent: February-03-20 10:40 AM
To: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>; bess@ie=
tf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage des=
cription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based S=
egmentation

Basil,

Thank you very much for the comments.
Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision.

As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be inc=
luded in the BGP UPDATE), does the "Segment" mean the different Underlay?
In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to Publ=
ic Internet.
Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN "segments"?
If not, can you elaborate more?

[cid:image001.png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0]


Thanks, Linda

From: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>
Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.=
com>>; bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descript=
ion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segmen=
tation


Hello Linda;

I haven't gone through the entire document; however, I have the following q=
uick comments


  1.  Regarding the following paragraph:


  1.  Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over di=
fferent underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overlay p=
aths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks over w=
hich traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, e.=
g. over untrusted public networks.

The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either encrypted or u=
necrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is NOT encrypted=
 is not always correct). I would change the parpagaph to the following (for=
 clarity):


  1.  Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over di=
fferent underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overlay p=
aths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks over w=
hich traffic can traverse with or without encryption, others require encryp=
tion, e.g. over untrusted public networks.



  1.  Another thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each Segment=
 (at the SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will map the Appli=
cation Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a "routing domain", the BG=
P update will be exchanged with the memebers of a particular Segment.



As such: Should we include the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP update=
 messages? Perhaps we need to further discuss this in details.

Any feedback is welcomed and it's highly appreciated.

Regards;

Basil


From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewe=
i.com>>
Sent: January-31-20 5:17 PM
To: bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descrip=
tion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segme=
ntation

BESS participants:

"SDWAN" networks is characterized by:

  1.  Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over di=
fferent underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overlay p=
aths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks over w=
hich traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, e.=
g. over untrusted public networks.
  2.  Enable direct Internet access from remote sites, instead hauling all =
traffic to Corporate HQ for centralized policy control.
  3.  Some traffic are routed based on application IDs instead of based on =
destination IP addresses.


https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/<https:/=
/nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdatatracker.ie=
tf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&data=3D02%7C01%7Clinda.=
dunbar%40futurewei.com%7Ca9128cd6280b43a3456408d7ac10f64a%7C0fee8ff2a3b2401=
89c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637167061164641902&sdata=3Dvcl8z6cEeSYXXhp%2Fzu=
ZjQ7bIfSTnzPSjYiWnENbs27g%3D&reserved=3D0> describes examples of using BGP =
UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Application Based Segmentation,  assum=
ing that the applications are assigned with unique IP addresses.
In the Figure below, the following BGP Updates can be advertised to ensure =
that Payment Application only communicates with the Payment Gateway:

[cid:image002.png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0]

BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topology (only propagated to=
 Payment GW node:

-        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:

        *   30.1.1.x/24

-        Tunnel Encap Path Attribute

        *   IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW ->C-PE2


BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be reached by Purple:

-        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:

        *   10.1.x.x
        *   12.4.x.x

-        TunnelEncap Path Attribute:

        *   Any node to C-PE2


Your feedback is greatly appreciated.

Thank you very much.

Linda Dunbar
________________________________
External Email: Please use caution when opening links and attachments / Cou=
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________________________________
External Email: Please use caution when opening links and attachments / Cou=
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</head>
<body lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"#0563C1" vlink=3D"#954F72">
<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">BGP Experts, <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Do you know if &nbsp;there is any problem of using&n=
bsp; Private AS as&nbsp; &quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Seg=
mentation? Here is the discussion in BESS WG. Want to get IDR WG feedbacks =
for this question.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;basil.najem@bell.ca&gt;; bess@ietf.org<br>
<b>Cc:</b> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot;Identifie=
r&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwa=
n-usage?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Based on Basil&#8217;s comment on needing an identif=
ier to differentiate SDWAN instances, I added a section to &nbsp;draft-dunb=
ar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . Want to hear people&#8217;s feedback.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<h2 style=3D"margin-left:45.0pt;text-indent:-.5in;mso-list:l6 level2 lfo2">=
<a name=3D"_Toc31377653"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignor=
e">3.1<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;
</span></span><![endif]>Requirements</a><o:p></o:p></h2>
<h3 style=3D"margin-left:.75in;text-indent:-.5in;mso-list:l6 level3 lfo2"><=
![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">3.1.1</span><![endif]>S=
upporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations<o:p></o:p></h3>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The term &#8220;network segmentation&#8221; is used =
extensively in SDWAN deployment. In general (and in this document), the &#8=
220;Network Segmentation&#8221; is referring to the process of dividing the=
 network into logical sub-networks using isolation techniques
 on a forwarding device such as a switch, router, or firewall. For a homoge=
neous network, such as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, VRF or VLAN are used to=
 separate network segments.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple=
 types of networks, it is important to have distinct identifiers to differe=
ntiate SDWAN network instances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN net=
work segments do not have their own
 assigned AS numbers, a very easy way is to use Private AS numbers, in the =
range of 64512 to 65535, to differentiate different SDWAN segmentations. Wh=
en using BGP to control the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numbers are carr=
ied by the BGP UPDATE messages to
 their corresponding RRs.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description.=
 <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used=
? <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you very much. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda Dunbar<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basi=
l.najem@bell.ca">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">l=
inda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hi Lind=
a;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">The SD-=
WAN Segment is part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there could be mo=
re than one Segment over a single underlay depending on the design and the =
business requirements.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Each Se=
gment represents a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I suggested=
 that we may need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update messages in o=
rder to identify and build the routing
 the table for each Segment (based on the Segment ID).<o:p></o:p></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hope th=
is helps.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Regards=
;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Basil</=
span><b><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></b></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:lind=
a.dunbar@futurewei.com">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> February-03-20 10:40 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca">basil.na=
jem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-us=
age description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application =
Based Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Basil, <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you very much for the comments. <o:p></o:p></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Your suggested wording change will be incorporated i=
n the next revision.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of =
a SDWAN node (to be included in the BGP UPDATE), does the &#8220;Segment&#8=
221; mean the different Underlay?
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPL=
S network and 1 to Public Internet.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN &#8220;segments&#8221;? =
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">If not, can you elaborate more? <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><img border=3D"0" width=3D"390" height=3D"305" style=
=3D"width:4.0625in;height:3.1736in" id=3D"_x0000_i1041" src=3D"cid:image001=
.png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0"><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks, Linda<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basi=
l.najem@bell.ca">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">l=
inda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hello L=
inda;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">I haven=
&#8217;t gone through the entire document; however, I have the following qu=
ick comments<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<ol style=3D"margin-top:0in" start=3D"1" type=3D"A">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:#1F497D;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo3"><sp=
an lang=3D"EN-CA">Regarding the following paragraph:<o:p></o:p></span></li>=
</ol>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<ol start=3D"1" type=3D"1">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-left:.25in;=
mso-list:l3 level1 lfo4">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span style=3D"font-size:=
12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D">The traffic =
that traverses the privet networks can be either encrypted or unecrypted (i=
n other words, the assumption that the traffic is
 NOT encrypted is not always correct). I would change the parpagaph to the =
following (for clarity):<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<ol start=3D"1" type=3D"1">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-left:.25in;=
mso-list:l7 level1 lfo5">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse <span style=3D"color:red">with or </span>withou=
t encryption, others require encryption, e.g. over untrusted public network=
s.
<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<ol style=3D"margin-top:0in" start=3D"2" type=3D"A">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:#1F497D;mso-list:l2 level1 lfo3"><sp=
an style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif">Anot=
her thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each Segment (at the S=
D-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will
 map the Application Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a &#8220;rou=
ting domain&#8221;, the BGP update will be exchanged with the memebers of a=
 particular Segment.
<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&=
quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&=
quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D;background:yellow;mso-highlight:y=
ellow">As such: Should we include the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP=
 update messages? Perhaps we need to further discuss
 this in details.</span><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;A=
rial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Any feedback is welcomed and it&#8217;s=
 highly appreciated.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Regards;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Basil<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:lind=
a.dunbar@futurewei.com">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> January-31-20 5:17 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage =
description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Base=
d Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">BESS participants:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto">&#8220;SDWAN&#8221=
; networks is characterized by:
<o:p></o:p></p>
<ol start=3D"1" type=3D"1">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-left:.25in;=
mso-list:l5 level1 lfo6">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:=
auto;margin-left:.25in;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo6">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Enable direct Internet =
access from remote sites, instead hauling all traffic to Corporate HQ for c=
entralized policy control.
<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:=
auto;margin-left:.25in;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo6">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Some traffic are routed=
 based on application IDs instead of based on destination IP addresses.
<o:p></o:p></span></li></ol>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outloo=
k.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdatatracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-b=
gp-sdwan-usage%2F&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Clinda.dunbar%40futurewei.com%7Ca9128=
cd6280b43a3456408d7ac10f64a%7C0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C63=
7167061164641902&amp;sdata=3Dvcl8z6cEeSYXXhp%2FzuZjQ7bIfSTnzPSjYiWnENbs27g%=
3D&amp;reserved=3D0"><span style=3D"color:blue">https://datatracker.ietf.or=
g/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/</span></a>
 describes examples of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Appli=
cation Based Segmentation, &nbsp;assuming that the applications are assigne=
d with unique IP addresses.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">In the Figure below, the following BGP Updates can b=
e advertised to ensure that Payment Application only communicates with the =
Payment Gateway:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><img border=3D"0" width=3D"538" height=3D"218" style=
=3D"width:5.6041in;height:2.2708in" id=3D"_x0000_i1042" src=3D"cid:image002=
.png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0"><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topol=
ogy (only propagated to Payment GW node:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormalCxSpMiddle" style=3D"margin-left:62.65pt;mso-add-space=
:auto;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l4 level1 lfo7">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;=
,serif"><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">-<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Ti=
mes New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Att=
ribute: </span>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:black;mso-list:l0 level3 lfo8">30.1.=
1.x/24<o:p></o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"MsoNormalCxSpMiddle" style=3D"margin-left:62.65pt;mso-add-space=
:auto;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l4 level1 lfo7">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;=
,serif"><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">-<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Ti=
mes New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"color:black">Tunnel Encap Pat=
h Attribute</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:black;mso-list:l0 level3 lfo8">IPsec=
 Attributes for PaymentGW -&gt;C-PE2<o:p></o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"MsoNormalCxSpMiddle" style=3D"margin-left:134.65pt;mso-add-spac=
e:auto"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be =
reached by Purple:<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormalCxSpMiddle" style=3D"margin-left:62.65pt;mso-add-space=
:auto;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo8">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;=
,serif"><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">-<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Ti=
mes New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Att=
ribute:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-list:l0 level3 lfo8"><span style=3D"co=
lor:black">10.1.x.x</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"=
mso-list:l0 level3 lfo8"><span style=3D"color:black">12.4.x.x</span><o:p></=
o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"MsoNormalCxSpMiddle" style=3D"margin-left:62.65pt;mso-add-space=
:auto;text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l4 level1 lfo7">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;=
,serif;color:black"><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">-<span style=3D"font:7.=
0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
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From: Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>, "idr@ietf.org" <idr@ietf.org>
CC: "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
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Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 23:44:43 +0000
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/7jlE19I4qhiXi07RPbj4lGvS9qA>
Subject: Re: [bess] [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
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Hi Linda,

    It seems that a label may be used as an "Identifier" to differentiate S=
D-WAN Segmentation.

Best Regards,
Huaimo
________________________________
From: Idr <idr-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@fu=
turewei.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM
To: idr@ietf.org <idr@ietf.org>
Cc: bess@ietf.org <bess@ietf.org>
Subject: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier"=
 to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage=
?


BGP Experts,



Do you know if  there is any problem of using  Private AS as  "Identifier" =
to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation? Here is the discussion in BESS WG. Wa=
nt to get IDR WG feedbacks for this question.



Thank you.

Linda



From: Linda Dunbar
Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM
To: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>; bess@ietf.org
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
Subject: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to differ=
entiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?



Based on Basil=92s comment on needing an identifier to differentiate SDWAN =
instances, I added a section to  draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . Want t=
o hear people=92s feedback.



3.1    Requirements
3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations

The term =93network segmentation=94 is used extensively in SDWAN deployment=
. In general (and in this document), the =93Network Segmentation=94 is refe=
rring to the process of dividing the network into logical sub-networks usin=
g isolation techniques on a forwarding device such as a switch, router, or =
firewall. For a homogeneous network, such as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, V=
RF or VLAN are used to separate network segments.

As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks, it =
is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN network in=
stances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do not ha=
ve their own assigned AS numbers, a very easy way is to use Private AS numb=
ers, in the range of 64512 to 65535, to differentiate different SDWAN segme=
ntations. When using BGP to control the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numb=
ers are carried by the BGP UPDATE messages to their corresponding RRs.



Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description.



Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used?



Thank you very much.



Linda Dunbar



From: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>
Sent: Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.=
com>>; bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descript=
ion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segmen=
tation







Hi Linda;



The SD-WAN Segment is part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there coul=
d be more than one Segment over a single underlay depending on the design a=
nd the business requirements.



Each Segment represents a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I su=
ggested that we may need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update messag=
es in order to identify and build the routing the table for each Segment (b=
ased on the Segment ID).



Hope this helps.



Regards;



Basil





From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewe=
i.com>>
Sent: February-03-20 10:40 AM
To: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>; bess@ie=
tf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage des=
cription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based S=
egmentation



Basil,



Thank you very much for the comments.

Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision.



As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be inc=
luded in the BGP UPDATE), does the =93Segment=94 mean the different Underla=
y?

In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to Publ=
ic Internet.

Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN =93segments=94?

If not, can you elaborate more?



[cid:image001..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0]





Thanks, Linda



From: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>
Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.=
com>>; bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descript=
ion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segmen=
tation





Hello Linda;



I haven=92t gone through the entire document; however, I have the following=
 quick comments



  1.  Regarding the following paragraph:



  1.  Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over di=
fferent underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overlay p=
aths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks over w=
hich traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, e.=
g. over untrusted public networks.



The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either encrypted or u=
necrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is NOT encrypted=
 is not always correct). I would change the parpagaph to the following (for=
 clarity):



  1.  Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over di=
fferent underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overlay p=
aths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks over w=
hich traffic can traverse with or without encryption, others require encryp=
tion, e.g. over untrusted public networks.





  1.  Another thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each Segment=
 (at the SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will map the Appli=
cation Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a =93routing domain=94, th=
e BGP update will be exchanged with the memebers of a particular Segment.



As such: Should we include the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP update=
 messages? Perhaps we need to further discuss this in details.



Any feedback is welcomed and it=92s highly appreciated.



Regards;



Basil





From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewe=
i.com>>
Sent: January-31-20 5:17 PM
To: bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descrip=
tion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segme=
ntation



BESS participants:



=93SDWAN=94 networks is characterized by:

  1.  Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over di=
fferent underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overlay p=
aths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks over w=
hich traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, e.=
g. over untrusted public networks.
  2.  Enable direct Internet access from remote sites, instead hauling all =
traffic to Corporate HQ for centralized policy control.
  3.  Some traffic are routed based on application IDs instead of based on =
destination IP addresses.





https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/<https:/=
/nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdatatracker.ie=
tf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&data=3D02%7C01%7Chuaimo=
.chen%40futurewei.com%7C6a93b40e311047eaceeb08d7cc2a39e0%7C0fee8ff2a3b24018=
9c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637202354082601405&sdata=3DEBCBw7BsPNKbPQ3OGzJxR=
W%2BlLuGAOHUZgseJt01ZqfU%3D&reserved=3D0> describes examples of using BGP U=
PDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Application Based Segmentation,  assumi=
ng that the applications are assigned with unique IP addresses.

In the Figure below, the following BGP Updates can be advertised to ensure =
that Payment Application only communicates with the Payment Gateway:



[cid:image002..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0]



BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topology (only propagated to=
 Payment GW node:

-        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:

        *   30.1.1.x/24

-        Tunnel Encap Path Attribute

        *   IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW ->C-PE2



BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be reached by Purple:

-        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:

        *   10.1.x.x
        *   12.4.x.x

-        TunnelEncap Path Attribute:

        *   Any node to C-PE2





Your feedback is greatly appreciated.



Thank you very much.



Linda Dunbar

________________________________

External Email: Please use caution when opening links and attachments / Cou=
rriel externe: Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints

________________________________

External Email: Please use caution when opening links and attachments / Cou=
rriel externe: Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints

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<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3DWindows-1=
252">
<style type=3D"text/css" style=3D"display:none;"> P {margin-top:0;margin-bo=
ttom:0;} </style>
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<body dir=3D"ltr">
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
Hi Linda,</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
&nbsp; &nbsp; It seems that a label may be used as an&nbsp;&quot;Identifier=
&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation.</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
<div>
<div id=3D"appendonsend"></div>
<div style=3D"font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12p=
t; color:rgb(0,0,0)">
Best Regards,</div>
<div style=3D"font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12p=
t; color:rgb(0,0,0)">
Huaimo</div>
<hr tabindex=3D"-1" style=3D"display:inline-block; width:98%">
<div id=3D"divRplyFwdMsg" dir=3D"ltr"><font face=3D"Calibri, sans-serif" co=
lor=3D"#000000" style=3D"font-size:11pt"><b>From:</b> Idr &lt;idr-bounces@i=
etf.org&gt; on behalf of Linda Dunbar &lt;linda.dunbar@futurewei.com&gt;<br=
>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> idr@ietf.org &lt;idr@ietf.org&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> bess@ietf.org &lt;bess@ietf.org&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot=
;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bes=
s-bgp-sdwan-usage?</font>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
</div>
<div lang=3D"EN-US">
<div class=3D"x_WordSection1">
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
BGP Experts, </p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Do you know if &nbsp;there is any problem of using&nbsp; Private AS as&nbsp=
; &quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation? Here is the =
discussion in BESS WG. Want to get IDR WG feedbacks for this question.
</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Thank you. </p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Linda</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0i=
n 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;basil.najem@bell.ca&gt;; bess@ietf.org<br>
<b>Cc:</b> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot;Identifie=
r&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwa=
n-usage?</p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Based on Basil=92s comment on needing an identifier to differentiate SDWAN =
instances, I added a section to &nbsp;draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . W=
ant to hear people=92s feedback.
</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<h2 style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 12pt 30.6pt; text-indent: -0.3in; line-height:=
 12pt; break-after: avoid; font-size: 12pt; font-family: &quot;Courier New&=
quot;; font-weight: normal;margin-left:45.0pt; text-indent:-.5in">
<a name=3D"x__Toc31377653"><span style=3D"">3.1<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &q=
uot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span>Requirements</a></h2>
<h3 style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 12pt 26.1pt; text-indent: -0.3in; line-height:=
 12pt; break-after: avoid; font-size: 12pt; font-family: &quot;Courier New&=
quot;; font-weight: normal;margin-left:.75in; text-indent:-.5in">
<span style=3D"">3.1.1</span>Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations</h3>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
The term =93network segmentation=94 is used extensively in SDWAN deployment=
. In general (and in this document), the =93Network Segmentation=94 is refe=
rring to the process of dividing the network into logical sub-networks usin=
g isolation techniques on a forwarding device
 such as a switch, router, or firewall. For a homogeneous network, such as =
MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, VRF or VLAN are used to separate network segme=
nts.
</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks, it =
is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN network in=
stances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do not ha=
ve their own assigned AS numbers,
 a very easy way is to use Private AS numbers, in the range of 64512 to 655=
35, to differentiate different SDWAN segmentations. When using BGP to contr=
ol the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numbers are carried by the BGP UPDATE=
 messages to their corresponding
 RRs.</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description. </p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used? </p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Thank you very much. </p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Linda Dunbar</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0i=
n 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca">basil.=
najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">l=
inda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
</p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hi Linda;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">The SD-WAN Segment is part of =
the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there could be more than one Segment ove=
r a single underlay depending on the design and the business requirements.<=
/span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Each Segment represents a sing=
le and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I suggested that we may need to in=
clude the Segment ID in the BGP update messages in order to identify and bu=
ild the routing the table for each Segment
 (based on the Segment ID).</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hope this helps.</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Regards;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Basil</span><b><span lang=3D"E=
N-CA" style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D"></span></b></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0i=
n 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com"=
>linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> February-03-20 10:40 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca">basil.na=
jem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-us=
age description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application =
Based Segmentation
</p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Basil, </p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Thank you very much for the comments. </p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision. </=
p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be inc=
luded in the BGP UPDATE), does the =93Segment=94 mean the different Underla=
y?
</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to Publ=
ic Internet.
</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN =93segments=94? </p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
If not, can you elaborate more? </p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<img border=3D"0" width=3D"390" height=3D"305" id=3D"x__x0000_i1041" style=
=3D"width:4.0625in; height:3.1736in" data-outlook-trace=3D"F:0|T:1" src=3D"=
cid:image001..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0"></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Thanks, Linda</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0i=
n 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca">basil.=
najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">l=
inda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
</p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hello Linda;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">I haven=92t gone through the e=
ntire document; however, I have the following quick comments</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<ol start=3D"1" type=3D"A" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<li class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11p=
t; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;color:#1F497D">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA">Regarding the following paragraph:</span></li></ol>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<ol start=3D"1" type=3D"1" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;">
<li class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11p=
t; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-left:.25in">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span></li></ol>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-left:.5in">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either=
 encrypted or unecrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic i=
s NOT encrypted is not always correct). I would
 change the parpagaph to the following (for clarity):</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<ol start=3D"1" type=3D"1" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;">
<li class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11p=
t; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-left:.25in">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse <span style=3D"color:red">with or </span>withou=
t encryption, others require encryption, e.g. over untrusted public network=
s.
</span></li></ol>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<ol start=3D"2" type=3D"A" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<li class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11p=
t; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;color:#1F497D">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif">=
Another thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each Segment (at t=
he SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will map the Application=
 Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a
 =93routing domain=94, the BGP update will be exchanged with the memebers o=
f a particular Segment.
</span></li></ol>
<p class=3D"x_MsoListParagraph" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; fo=
nt-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoListParagraph" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt 0.5in; fo=
nt-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D; background:yellow">As such: Should we include the Segment ID=
 as an attribute in the BGP update messages? Perhaps we need to further dis=
cuss this in details.</span><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&q=
uot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; color:#1F497D"></span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">Any feedback is welcomed and it=92s highly appreciated.</spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">Regards;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">Basil</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0i=
n 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com"=
>linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> January-31-20 5:17 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage =
description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Base=
d Segmentation
</p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
BESS participants:</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
=93SDWAN=94 networks is characterized by: </p>
<ol start=3D"1" type=3D"1" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;">
<li class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11p=
t; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-left:.25in">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span></li><li class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; fo=
nt-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-left:.25in">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Enable direct Internet =
access from remote sites, instead hauling all traffic to Corporate HQ for c=
entralized policy control.
</span></li><li class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; fo=
nt-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-left:.25in">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Some traffic are routed=
 based on application IDs instead of based on destination IP addresses.
</span></li></ol>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<a href=3D"https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2=
F%2Fdatatracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&amp;d=
ata=3D02%7C01%7Chuaimo.chen%40futurewei.com%7C6a93b40e311047eaceeb08d7cc2a3=
9e0%7C0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637202354082601405&amp;sda=
ta=3DEBCBw7BsPNKbPQ3OGzJxRW%2BlLuGAOHUZgseJt01ZqfU%3D&amp;reserved=3D0" ori=
ginalsrc=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-us=
age/" shash=3D"wA5R0KRlA3hmque9aLx0bVhQL32utqoq9vtMyR7fAowZCKYQbqcG2wM/Q1VC=
IgAxowrz3u4J9i&#43;rGNNMhTSEtgRYrjxp20hKON/9kODxg13AgTDDoY4Uy7BvlKCLank5ANB=
ANZ1OvaikVta8x&#43;AiXkb2yD0BkLrssjxruihuVYU=3D"><span style=3D"color:blue"=
>https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/</span>=
</a>
 describes examples of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Appli=
cation Based Segmentation, &nbsp;assuming that the applications are assigne=
d with unique IP addresses.</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
In the Figure below, the following BGP Updates can be advertised to ensure =
that Payment Application only communicates with the Payment Gateway:</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<img border=3D"0" width=3D"538" height=3D"218" id=3D"x__x0000_i1042" style=
=3D"width:5.6041in; height:2.2708in" data-outlook-trace=3D"F:0|T:1" src=3D"=
cid:image002..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0"></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topology (only propagated to=
 Payment GW node:</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormalCxSpMiddle" style=3D"margin-left:62.65pt; text-inden=
t:-.25in">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif"><span style=
=3D"">-<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute: </=
span></p>
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<li class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11p=
t; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;color:black">
30.1.1.x/24</li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormalCxSpMiddle" style=3D"margin-left:62.65pt; text-inden=
t:-.25in">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif"><span style=
=3D"">-<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><span style=3D"color:black">Tunnel Encap Path Attribut=
e</span></p>
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<li class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11p=
t; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;color:black">
IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW -&gt;C-PE2</li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormalCxSpMiddle" style=3D"margin-left:134.65pt"><span sty=
le=3D"font-size:10.5pt">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be reached by Purple:<span=
 style=3D"font-size:12.0pt"></span></p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormalCxSpMiddle" style=3D"margin-left:62.65pt; text-inden=
t:-.25in">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif"><span style=
=3D"">-<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute:</s=
pan></p>
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<li class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11p=
t; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"color:black">10.1.x.x</span></li><li class=3D"x_MsoNormal" s=
tyle=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sa=
ns-serif;">
<span style=3D"color:black">12.4.x.x</span></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormalCxSpMiddle" style=3D"margin-left:62.65pt; text-inden=
t:-.25in">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif; color:black">=
<span style=3D"">-<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><span style=3D"color:black">TunnelEncap Path Attribute=
:</span></p>
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<li class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11p=
t; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;color:black">
Any node to C-PE2</li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Your feedback is greatly appreciated. </p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Thank you very much. </p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Linda Dunbar</p>
<div class=3D"x_MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001=
pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;text-align:center">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,se=
rif">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center">
</span></div>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<strong><i><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt; font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,=
sans-serif; color:blue">External Email:</span></i></strong><em><span style=
=3D"font-size:9.0pt; font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif; color:blue=
"> Please use caution when opening links and attachments
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erif; color:blue"> Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents
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<div class=3D"x_MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001=
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<strong><i><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt; font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,=
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From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
To: Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>, "idr@ietf.org" <idr@ietf.org>
CC: "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
Thread-Index: AQHV/khfSWGs6O2sgE+mZRAOrSpJtqhQ6i4A
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 04:54:50 +0000
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/AqqTe2FY4sieIqAgoXEjvbdUrrQ>
Subject: Re: [bess] [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
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Huaimo,

Thank you very much for the suggestion.
Do you mean using the similar approach as VPN Label carried by NLRI Path At=
tribute [RFC8277] for SDWAN Segmentation Identifier?
If yes, the UPDATE message should not use the MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) to avo=
id confusion, right?

Linda

From: Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:45 PM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org
Cc: bess@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identif=
ier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-u=
sage?

Hi Linda,

    It seems that a label may be used as an "Identifier" to differentiate S=
D-WAN Segmentation.

Best Regards,
Huaimo
________________________________
From: Idr <idr-bounces@ietf.org<mailto:idr-bounces@ietf.org>> on behalf of =
Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>=
>
Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM
To: idr@ietf.org<mailto:idr@ietf.org> <idr@ietf.org<mailto:idr@ietf.org>>
Cc: bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org> <bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org=
>>
Subject: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier"=
 to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage=
?


BGP Experts,



Do you know if  there is any problem of using  Private AS as  "Identifier" =
to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation? Here is the discussion in BESS WG. Wa=
nt to get IDR WG feedbacks for this question.



Thank you.

Linda



From: Linda Dunbar
Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM
To: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>; bess@ie=
tf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to differ=
entiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?



Based on Basil's comment on needing an identifier to differentiate SDWAN in=
stances, I added a section to  draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . Want to =
hear people's feedback.



3.1    Requirements
3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations

The term "network segmentation" is used extensively in SDWAN deployment. In=
 general (and in this document), the "Network Segmentation" is referring to=
 the process of dividing the network into logical sub-networks using isolat=
ion techniques on a forwarding device such as a switch, router, or firewall=
. For a homogeneous network, such as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, VRF or VL=
AN are used to separate network segments.

As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks, it =
is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN network in=
stances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do not ha=
ve their own assigned AS numbers, a very easy way is to use Private AS numb=
ers, in the range of 64512 to 65535, to differentiate different SDWAN segme=
ntations. When using BGP to control the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numb=
ers are carried by the BGP UPDATE messages to their corresponding RRs.



Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description.



Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used?



Thank you very much.



Linda Dunbar



From: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>
Sent: Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.=
com>>; bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descript=
ion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segmen=
tation







Hi Linda;



The SD-WAN Segment is part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there coul=
d be more than one Segment over a single underlay depending on the design a=
nd the business requirements.



Each Segment represents a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I su=
ggested that we may need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update messag=
es in order to identify and build the routing the table for each Segment (b=
ased on the Segment ID).



Hope this helps.



Regards;



Basil





From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewe=
i.com>>
Sent: February-03-20 10:40 AM
To: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>; bess@ie=
tf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage des=
cription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based S=
egmentation



Basil,



Thank you very much for the comments.

Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision.



As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be inc=
luded in the BGP UPDATE), does the "Segment" mean the different Underlay?

In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to Publ=
ic Internet.

Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN "segments"?

If not, can you elaborate more?



[cid:image001..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0]





Thanks, Linda



From: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>
Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.=
com>>; bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descript=
ion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segmen=
tation





Hello Linda;



I haven't gone through the entire document; however, I have the following q=
uick comments



  1.  Regarding the following paragraph:



1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over=
 different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overla=
y paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks ove=
r which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption,=
 e.g. over untrusted public networks.



The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either encrypted or u=
necrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is NOT encrypted=
 is not always correct). I would change the parpagaph to the following (for=
 clarity):



1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over=
 different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overla=
y paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks ove=
r which traffic can traverse with or without encryption, others require enc=
ryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.





  1.  Another thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each Segment=
 (at the SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will map the Appli=
cation Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a "routing domain", the BG=
P update will be exchanged with the memebers of a particular Segment.



As such: Should we include the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP update=
 messages? Perhaps we need to further discuss this in details.



Any feedback is welcomed and it's highly appreciated.



Regards;



Basil





From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewe=
i.com>>
Sent: January-31-20 5:17 PM
To: bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descrip=
tion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segme=
ntation



BESS participants:



"SDWAN" networks is characterized by:

1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over=
 different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overla=
y paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks ove=
r which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption,=
 e.g. over untrusted public networks.

2.       Enable direct Internet access from remote sites, instead hauling a=
ll traffic to Corporate HQ for centralized policy control.

3.       Some traffic are routed based on application IDs instead of based =
on destination IP addresses.





https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/<https:/=
/nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdatatracker.ie=
tf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&data=3D02%7C01%7Clinda.=
dunbar%40futurewei.com%7Caf554cc9ce6b44b8267608d7cc5f7fcb%7C0fee8ff2a3b2401=
89c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637202582862902790&sdata=3DFBCyAo0FjPczNS3BJsMO=
veEck0RbWEST7%2FSDolaeJVw%3D&reserved=3D0> describes examples of using BGP =
UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Application Based Segmentation,  assum=
ing that the applications are assigned with unique IP addresses.

In the Figure below, the following BGP Updates can be advertised to ensure =
that Payment Application only communicates with the Payment Gateway:



[cid:image002..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0]



BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topology (only propagated to=
 Payment GW node:

-        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:

        *   30.1.1.x/24

-        Tunnel Encap Path Attribute

        *   IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW ->C-PE2



BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be reached by Purple:

-        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:

        *   10.1.x.x
        *   12.4.x.x

-        TunnelEncap Path Attribute:

        *   Any node to C-PE2





Your feedback is greatly appreciated.



Thank you very much.



Linda Dunbar

________________________________

External Email: Please use caution when opening links and attachments / Cou=
rriel externe: Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints

________________________________

External Email: Please use caution when opening links and attachments / Cou=
rriel externe: Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints

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</head>
<body lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">
<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Huaimo, <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you very much for the suggestion. <o:p></o:p><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Do you mean using the similar approach as VPN Label =
carried by NLRI Path Attribute [RFC8277] for SDWAN Segmentation Identifier?=
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">If yes, the UPDATE message should not use the MPLS V=
PN SAFI (=3D128) to avoid confusion, right?
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;huaimo.chen@futurewei.c=
om&gt; <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:45 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;linda.dunbar@futurewei.com&gt;; idr@ietf.org<br=
>
<b>Cc:</b> bess@ietf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Hi Lind=
a,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">&nbsp; =
&nbsp; It seems that a label may be used as an&nbsp;&quot;Identifier&quot; =
to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Best Re=
gards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Huaimo<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center">
<hr size=3D"2" width=3D"98%" align=3D"center">
</div>
<div id=3D"divRplyFwdMsg">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"color:black">From:</span></b><span=
 style=3D"color:black"> Idr &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:idr-bounces@ietf.org">idr=
-bounces@ietf.org</a>&gt; on behalf of Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:l=
inda.dunbar@futurewei.com">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org">idr@ietf.org</a> &lt;<a href=3D"=
mailto:idr@ietf.org">idr@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a> &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot=
;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bes=
s-bgp-sdwan-usage?</span>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">BGP Experts, <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Do you know if &nbsp;there is any problem of using&=
nbsp; Private AS as&nbsp; &quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Se=
gmentation? Here is the discussion in BESS WG. Want to get IDR WG feedbacks=
 for this question.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Thank you. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Linda<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca">basil.na=
jem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot;Identifie=
r&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwa=
n-usage?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Based on Basil&#8217;s comment on needing an identi=
fier to differentiate SDWAN instances, I added a section to &nbsp;draft-dun=
bar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . Want to hear people&#8217;s feedback.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<h2 style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;m=
argin-left:45.0pt;text-indent:-.5in;line-height:12.0pt;break-after: avoid">
<a name=3D"x__Toc31377653"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quo=
t;Courier New&quot;;font-weight:normal">3.1</span></a><span style=3D"mso-bo=
okmark:x__Toc31377653"><span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tim=
es New Roman&quot;,serif;font-weight:normal">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><span style=3D"mso-bookmark:x__Toc31377653"><span style=3D"fo=
nt-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;font-weight:normal">Requ=
irements</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cou=
rier New&quot;;font-weight:normal"><o:p></o:p></span></h2>
<h3 style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;m=
argin-left:.75in;text-indent:-.5in;line-height:12.0pt;break-after: avoid">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;font-we=
ight:normal">3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations<o:p></o:p></span>=
</h3>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">The term &#8220;network segmentation&#8221; is used=
 extensively in SDWAN deployment. In general (and in this document), the &#=
8220;Network Segmentation&#8221; is referring to the process of dividing th=
e network into logical sub-networks using isolation techniques
 on a forwarding device such as a switch, router, or firewall. For a homoge=
neous network, such as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, VRF or VLAN are used to=
 separate network segments.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multipl=
e types of networks, it is important to have distinct identifiers to differ=
entiate SDWAN network instances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN ne=
twork segments do not have their own
 assigned AS numbers, a very easy way is to use Private AS numbers, in the =
range of 64512 to 65535, to differentiate different SDWAN segmentations. Wh=
en using BGP to control the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numbers are carr=
ied by the BGP UPDATE messages to
 their corresponding RRs.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description=
. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be use=
d? <o:p>
</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Thank you very much. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Linda Dunbar<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bas=
il.najem@bell.ca">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">l=
inda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hi Lin=
da;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">The SD=
-WAN Segment is part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there could be m=
ore than one Segment over a single underlay depending on the design and the=
 business requirements.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Each S=
egment represents a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I suggeste=
d that we may need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update messages in =
order to identify and build the routing
 the table for each Segment (based on the Segment ID).</span><o:p></o:p></p=
>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hope t=
his helps.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Regard=
s;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Basil<=
/span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o=
:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:lin=
da.dunbar@futurewei.com">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> February-03-20 10:40 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca">basil.na=
jem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-us=
age description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application =
Based Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Basil, <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Thank you very much for the comments. <o:p></o:p></=
p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Your suggested wording change will be incorporated =
in the next revision.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of=
 a SDWAN node (to be included in the BGP UPDATE), does the &#8220;Segment&#=
8221; mean the different Underlay?
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MP=
LS network and 1 to Public Internet.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN &#8220;segments&#8221;?=
 <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">If not, can you elaborate more? <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><img border=3D"0" width=3D"390" height=3D"305" styl=
e=3D"width:4.0625in;height:3.1736in" id=3D"x__x005f_x0000_i1041" src=3D"cid=
:image001..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0"><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Thanks, Linda<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bas=
il.najem@bell.ca">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">l=
inda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hello =
Linda;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">I have=
n&#8217;t gone through the entire document; however, I have the following q=
uick comments</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<ol style=3D"margin-top:0in" start=3D"1" type=3D"A">
<li class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"color:#1F497D;margin-top:0in;margin-botto=
m:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;mso-list:l6 level1 lfo1">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA">Regarding the following paragraph:</span><o:p></o:p></=
li></ol>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span la=
ng=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;=
mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">1.<span style=3D"font:=
7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;"=
>Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over differe=
nt underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overlay paths =
between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are
 private networks over which traffic can traverse without encryption, other=
s require encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;co=
lor:#1F497D">The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either e=
ncrypted or unecrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is =
NOT encrypted is not always correct). I would
 change the parpagaph to the following (for clarity):</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;=
mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">1.<span style=3D"font:=
7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;"=
>Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over differe=
nt underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overlay paths =
between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are
 private networks over which traffic can traverse <span style=3D"color:red"=
>with or
</span>without encryption, others require encryption, e.g. over untrusted p=
ublic networks.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<ol style=3D"margin-top:0in" start=3D"2" type=3D"A">
<li class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"color:#1F497D;margin-top:0in;margin-botto=
m:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo4">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif">A=
nother thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each Segment (at th=
e SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will map the Application =
Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a
 &#8220;routing domain&#8221;, the BGP update will be exchanged with the me=
mebers of a particular Segment.
</span><o:p></o:p></li></ol>
<p class=3D"xmsolistparagraph" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span style=3D"fo=
nt-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D">&nbs=
p;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsolistparagraph" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span style=3D"fo=
nt-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D;backg=
round:yellow">As such: Should we include the Segment ID as an attribute in =
the BGP update messages? Perhaps we need to further
 discuss this in details.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">Any feedback is welcomed and it&#8217;s highly appreciated.</span><o:p=
></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">Regards;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">Basil</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span la=
ng=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><b>From:=
</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">linda.d=
unbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> January-31-20 5:17 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage =
description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Base=
d Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span la=
ng=3D"EN-CA">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">BESS par=
ticipants:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&#8220;S=
DWAN&#8221; networks is characterized by:
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;=
mso-list:l2 level1 lfo5">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">1.<span style=3D"font:=
7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;"=
>Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over differe=
nt underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overlay paths =
between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are
 private networks over which traffic can traverse without encryption, other=
s require encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;=
mso-list:l2 level1 lfo5">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">2.<span style=3D"font:=
7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;"=
>Enable direct Internet access from remote sites, instead hauling all traff=
ic to Corporate HQ for centralized policy control.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;=
mso-list:l2 level1 lfo5">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">3.<span style=3D"font:=
7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;"=
>Some traffic are routed based on application IDs instead of based on desti=
nation IP addresses.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><a href=
=3D"https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdat=
atracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&amp;data=3D0=
2%7C01%7Clinda.dunbar%40futurewei.com%7Caf554cc9ce6b44b8267608d7cc5f7fcb%7C=
0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637202582862902790&amp;sdata=3DF=
BCyAo0FjPczNS3BJsMOveEck0RbWEST7%2FSDolaeJVw%3D&amp;reserved=3D0">https://d=
atatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/</a>
 describes examples of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Appli=
cation Based Segmentation, &nbsp;assuming that the applications are assigne=
d with unique IP addresses.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">In the F=
igure below, the following BGP Updates can be advertised to ensure that Pay=
ment Application only communicates with the Payment Gateway:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><img bor=
der=3D"0" width=3D"538" height=3D"218" style=3D"width:5.6041in;height:2.270=
8in" id=3D"x__x005f_x0000_i1042" src=3D"cid:image002..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0=
"><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">BGP UPDA=
TE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topology (only propagated to Payment=
 GW node:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25i=
n">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute: </span><o:p></o:=
p></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"color:black;margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:=
0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;mso-list:l3 level3 lfo6">
30.1.1.x/24<o:p></o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25i=
n">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"color:black">Tunnel Encap Path Attribute</span><o:p><=
/o:p></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"color:black;margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:=
0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;mso-list:l4 level3 lfo7">
IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW -&gt;C-PE2<o:p></o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:134.65pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">BGP UPDA=
TE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be reached by Purple:<o:p></o:p></=
p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25i=
n">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute:</span><o:p></o:p=
></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-b=
ottom:.0001pt;mso-list:l8 level3 lfo8">
<span style=3D"color:black">10.1.x.x</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=3D"xms=
onormal" style=3D"margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;ms=
o-list:l8 level3 lfo8">
<span style=3D"color:black">12.4.x.x</span><o:p></o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25i=
n">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif;color:black">-=
</span><span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quo=
t;,serif;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"color:black">TunnelEncap Path Attribute:</span><o:p><=
/o:p></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"color:black;margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:=
0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;mso-list:l7 level3 lfo9">
Any node to C-PE2<o:p></o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">Your fee=
dback is greatly appreciated.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">Thank yo=
u very much.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">Linda Du=
nbar<o:p></o:p></p>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center">
</span></div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><strong>=
<i><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-seri=
f;color:blue">External Email:</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-si=
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rif;color:blue">Courriel externe:</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"fon=
t-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue">
 Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints </span></em><o:p></o:p></=
p>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center">
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<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><strong>=
<i><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-seri=
f;color:blue">External Email:</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-si=
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t-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue">
 Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints </span></em><o:p></o:p></=
p>
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From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/351fY9Oh4cVNUO0IqdCDE4U81dk>
Subject: [bess] Request for WG Adoption for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage-05
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Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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Matthew and Stephane,

We've had lots of discussion on the draft via the mailing list and the IETF=
 105, 106 .  We have made changes to the draft to address comments from the=
 discussion.

Can you please call WG Adoption for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage-05?
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/


Thank you very much.
Linda Dunbar

From: Linda Dunbar
Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:55 PM
To: Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org
Cc: bess@ietf.org
Subject: RE: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identif=
ier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-u=
sage?

Huaimo,

Thank you very much for the suggestion.
Do you mean using the similar approach as VPN Label carried by NLRI Path At=
tribute [RFC8277] for SDWAN Segmentation Identifier?
If yes, the UPDATE message should not use the MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) to avo=
id confusion, right?

Linda

From: Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com<mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.c=
om>>
Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:45 PM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.=
com>>; idr@ietf.org<mailto:idr@ietf.org>
Cc: bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identif=
ier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-u=
sage?

Hi Linda,

    It seems that a label may be used as an "Identifier" to differentiate S=
D-WAN Segmentation.

Best Regards,
Huaimo
________________________________
From: Idr <idr-bounces@ietf.org<mailto:idr-bounces@ietf.org>> on behalf of =
Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>=
>
Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM
To: idr@ietf.org<mailto:idr@ietf.org> <idr@ietf.org<mailto:idr@ietf.org>>
Cc: bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org> <bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org=
>>
Subject: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier"=
 to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage=
?


BGP Experts,



Do you know if  there is any problem of using  Private AS as  "Identifier" =
to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation? Here is the discussion in BESS WG. Wa=
nt to get IDR WG feedbacks for this question.



Thank you.

Linda



From: Linda Dunbar
Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM
To: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>; bess@ie=
tf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to differ=
entiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?



Based on Basil's comment on needing an identifier to differentiate SDWAN in=
stances, I added a section to  draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . Want to =
hear people's feedback.



3.1    Requirements
3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations

The term "network segmentation" is used extensively in SDWAN deployment. In=
 general (and in this document), the "Network Segmentation" is referring to=
 the process of dividing the network into logical sub-networks using isolat=
ion techniques on a forwarding device such as a switch, router, or firewall=
. For a homogeneous network, such as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, VRF or VL=
AN are used to separate network segments.

As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks, it =
is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN network in=
stances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do not ha=
ve their own assigned AS numbers, a very easy way is to use Private AS numb=
ers, in the range of 64512 to 65535, to differentiate different SDWAN segme=
ntations. When using BGP to control the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numb=
ers are carried by the BGP UPDATE messages to their corresponding RRs.



Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description.



Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used?



Thank you very much.



Linda Dunbar



From: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>
Sent: Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.=
com>>; bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descript=
ion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segmen=
tation







Hi Linda;



The SD-WAN Segment is part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there coul=
d be more than one Segment over a single underlay depending on the design a=
nd the business requirements.



Each Segment represents a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I su=
ggested that we may need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update messag=
es in order to identify and build the routing the table for each Segment (b=
ased on the Segment ID).



Hope this helps.



Regards;



Basil





From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewe=
i.com>>
Sent: February-03-20 10:40 AM
To: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>; bess@ie=
tf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage des=
cription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based S=
egmentation



Basil,



Thank you very much for the comments.

Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision.



As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be inc=
luded in the BGP UPDATE), does the "Segment" mean the different Underlay?

In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to Publ=
ic Internet.

Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN "segments"?

If not, can you elaborate more?



[cid:image001..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0]





Thanks, Linda



From: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>
Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.=
com>>; bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descript=
ion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segmen=
tation





Hello Linda;



I haven't gone through the entire document; however, I have the following q=
uick comments



  1.  Regarding the following paragraph:



1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over=
 different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overla=
y paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks ove=
r which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption,=
 e.g. over untrusted public networks.



The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either encrypted or u=
necrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is NOT encrypted=
 is not always correct). I would change the parpagaph to the following (for=
 clarity):



1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over=
 different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overla=
y paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks ove=
r which traffic can traverse with or without encryption, others require enc=
ryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.





  1.  Another thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each Segment=
 (at the SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will map the Appli=
cation Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a "routing domain", the BG=
P update will be exchanged with the memebers of a particular Segment.



As such: Should we include the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP update=
 messages? Perhaps we need to further discuss this in details.



Any feedback is welcomed and it's highly appreciated.



Regards;



Basil





From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewe=
i.com>>
Sent: January-31-20 5:17 PM
To: bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descrip=
tion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segme=
ntation



BESS participants:



"SDWAN" networks is characterized by:

1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over=
 different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overla=
y paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks ove=
r which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption,=
 e.g. over untrusted public networks.

2.       Enable direct Internet access from remote sites, instead hauling a=
ll traffic to Corporate HQ for centralized policy control.

3.       Some traffic are routed based on application IDs instead of based =
on destination IP addresses.





https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/<https:/=
/nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdatatracker.ie=
tf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&data=3D02%7C01%7Clinda.=
dunbar%40futurewei.com%7Caf554cc9ce6b44b8267608d7cc5f7fcb%7C0fee8ff2a3b2401=
89c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637202582862902790&sdata=3DFBCyAo0FjPczNS3BJsMO=
veEck0RbWEST7%2FSDolaeJVw%3D&reserved=3D0> describes examples of using BGP =
UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Application Based Segmentation,  assum=
ing that the applications are assigned with unique IP addresses.

In the Figure below, the following BGP Updates can be advertised to ensure =
that Payment Application only communicates with the Payment Gateway:



[cid:image002..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0]



BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topology (only propagated to=
 Payment GW node:

-        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:

        *   30.1.1.x/24

-        Tunnel Encap Path Attribute

        *   IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW ->C-PE2



BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be reached by Purple:

-        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:

        *   10.1.x.x
        *   12.4.x.x

-        TunnelEncap Path Attribute:

        *   Any node to C-PE2





Your feedback is greatly appreciated.



Thank you very much.



Linda Dunbar

________________________________

External Email: Please use caution when opening links and attachments / Cou=
rriel externe: Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints

________________________________

External Email: Please use caution when opening links and attachments / Cou=
rriel externe: Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints

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</head>
<body lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">
<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Matthew and Stephane, <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We&#8217;ve had lots of discussion on the draft via =
the mailing list and the IETF 105, 106 . &nbsp;We have made changes to the =
draft to address comments from the discussion.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Can you please call WG Adoption for draft-dunbar-bes=
s-bgp-sdwan-usage-05?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-du=
nbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-b=
ess-bgp-sdwan-usage/</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you very much. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda Dunbar<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:55 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;huaimo.chen@futurewei.com&gt;; idr@ietf.org<br>
<b>Cc:</b> bess@ietf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Huaimo, <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you very much for the suggestion. <o:p></o:p><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Do you mean using the similar approach as VPN Label =
carried by NLRI Path Attribute [RFC8277] for SDWAN Segmentation Identifier?=
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">If yes, the UPDATE message should not use the MPLS V=
PN SAFI (=3D128) to avoid confusion, right?
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaim=
o.chen@futurewei.com">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:45 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">l=
inda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org">idr@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Hi Lind=
a,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">&nbsp; =
&nbsp; It seems that a label may be used as an&nbsp;&quot;Identifier&quot; =
to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Best Re=
gards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Huaimo<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center">
<hr size=3D"2" width=3D"98%" align=3D"center">
</div>
<div id=3D"divRplyFwdMsg">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"color:black">From:</span></b><span=
 style=3D"color:black"> Idr &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:idr-bounces@ietf.org">idr=
-bounces@ietf.org</a>&gt; on behalf of Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:l=
inda.dunbar@futurewei.com">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org">idr@ietf.org</a> &lt;<a href=3D"=
mailto:idr@ietf.org">idr@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a> &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot=
;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bes=
s-bgp-sdwan-usage?</span>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">BGP Experts, <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Do you know if &nbsp;there is any problem of using&=
nbsp; Private AS as&nbsp; &quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Se=
gmentation? Here is the discussion in BESS WG. Want to get IDR WG feedbacks=
 for this question.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Thank you. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Linda<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca">basil.na=
jem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot;Identifie=
r&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwa=
n-usage?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Based on Basil&#8217;s comment on needing an identi=
fier to differentiate SDWAN instances, I added a section to &nbsp;draft-dun=
bar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . Want to hear people&#8217;s feedback.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<h2 style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;m=
argin-left:45.0pt;text-indent:-.5in;line-height:12.0pt;break-after: avoid">
<a name=3D"x__Toc31377653"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quo=
t;Courier New&quot;;font-weight:normal">3.1</span></a><span style=3D"mso-bo=
okmark:x__Toc31377653"><span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tim=
es New Roman&quot;,serif;font-weight:normal">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><span style=3D"mso-bookmark:x__Toc31377653"><span style=3D"fo=
nt-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;font-weight:normal">Requ=
irements</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cou=
rier New&quot;;font-weight:normal"><o:p></o:p></span></h2>
<h3 style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;m=
argin-left:.75in;text-indent:-.5in;line-height:12.0pt;break-after: avoid">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;font-we=
ight:normal">3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations<o:p></o:p></span>=
</h3>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">The term &#8220;network segmentation&#8221; is used=
 extensively in SDWAN deployment. In general (and in this document), the &#=
8220;Network Segmentation&#8221; is referring to the process of dividing th=
e network into logical sub-networks using isolation techniques
 on a forwarding device such as a switch, router, or firewall. For a homoge=
neous network, such as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, VRF or VLAN are used to=
 separate network segments.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multipl=
e types of networks, it is important to have distinct identifiers to differ=
entiate SDWAN network instances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN ne=
twork segments do not have their own
 assigned AS numbers, a very easy way is to use Private AS numbers, in the =
range of 64512 to 65535, to differentiate different SDWAN segmentations. Wh=
en using BGP to control the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numbers are carr=
ied by the BGP UPDATE messages to
 their corresponding RRs.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description=
. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be use=
d? <o:p>
</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Thank you very much. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Linda Dunbar<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bas=
il.najem@bell.ca">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">l=
inda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hi Lin=
da;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">The SD=
-WAN Segment is part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there could be m=
ore than one Segment over a single underlay depending on the design and the=
 business requirements.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Each S=
egment represents a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I suggeste=
d that we may need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update messages in =
order to identify and build the routing
 the table for each Segment (based on the Segment ID).</span><o:p></o:p></p=
>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hope t=
his helps.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Regard=
s;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Basil<=
/span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o=
:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:lin=
da.dunbar@futurewei.com">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> February-03-20 10:40 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca">basil.na=
jem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-us=
age description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application =
Based Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Basil, <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Thank you very much for the comments. <o:p></o:p></=
p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Your suggested wording change will be incorporated =
in the next revision.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of=
 a SDWAN node (to be included in the BGP UPDATE), does the &#8220;Segment&#=
8221; mean the different Underlay?
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MP=
LS network and 1 to Public Internet.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN &#8220;segments&#8221;?=
 <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">If not, can you elaborate more? <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><img border=3D"0" width=3D"390" height=3D"305" styl=
e=3D"width:4.0625in;height:3.177in" id=3D"x__x005f_x0000_i1041" src=3D"cid:=
image001..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0"><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Thanks, Linda<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bas=
il.najem@bell.ca">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">l=
inda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hello =
Linda;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">I have=
n&#8217;t gone through the entire document; however, I have the following q=
uick comments</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<ol style=3D"margin-top:0in" start=3D"1" type=3D"A">
<li class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"color:#1F497D;margin-top:0in;margin-botto=
m:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;mso-list:l6 level1 lfo1">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA">Regarding the following paragraph:</span><o:p></o:p></=
li></ol>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span la=
ng=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;=
mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">1.<span style=3D"font:=
7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;"=
>Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over differe=
nt underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overlay paths =
between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are
 private networks over which traffic can traverse without encryption, other=
s require encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;co=
lor:#1F497D">The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either e=
ncrypted or unecrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is =
NOT encrypted is not always correct). I would
 change the parpagaph to the following (for clarity):</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;=
mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">1.<span style=3D"font:=
7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;"=
>Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over differe=
nt underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overlay paths =
between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are
 private networks over which traffic can traverse <span style=3D"color:red"=
>with or
</span>without encryption, others require encryption, e.g. over untrusted p=
ublic networks.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<ol style=3D"margin-top:0in" start=3D"2" type=3D"A">
<li class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"color:#1F497D;margin-top:0in;margin-botto=
m:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo4">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif">A=
nother thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each Segment (at th=
e SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will map the Application =
Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a
 &#8220;routing domain&#8221;, the BGP update will be exchanged with the me=
mebers of a particular Segment.
</span><o:p></o:p></li></ol>
<p class=3D"xmsolistparagraph" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span style=3D"fo=
nt-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D">&nbs=
p;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsolistparagraph" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span style=3D"fo=
nt-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D;backg=
round:yellow">As such: Should we include the Segment ID as an attribute in =
the BGP update messages? Perhaps we need to further
 discuss this in details.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">Any feedback is welcomed and it&#8217;s highly appreciated.</span><o:p=
></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">Regards;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F4=
97D">Basil</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span st=
yle=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span la=
ng=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><b>From:=
</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">linda.d=
unbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> January-31-20 5:17 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage =
description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Base=
d Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span la=
ng=3D"EN-CA">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">BESS par=
ticipants:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&#8220;S=
DWAN&#8221; networks is characterized by:
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;=
mso-list:l2 level1 lfo5">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">1.<span style=3D"font:=
7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;"=
>Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over differe=
nt underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overlay paths =
between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are
 private networks over which traffic can traverse without encryption, other=
s require encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;=
mso-list:l2 level1 lfo5">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">2.<span style=3D"font:=
7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;"=
>Enable direct Internet access from remote sites, instead hauling all traff=
ic to Corporate HQ for centralized policy control.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in;=
mso-list:l2 level1 lfo5">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">3.<span style=3D"font:=
7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;"=
>Some traffic are routed based on application IDs instead of based on desti=
nation IP addresses.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><a href=
=3D"https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdat=
atracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&amp;data=3D0=
2%7C01%7Clinda.dunbar%40futurewei.com%7Caf554cc9ce6b44b8267608d7cc5f7fcb%7C=
0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637202582862902790&amp;sdata=3DF=
BCyAo0FjPczNS3BJsMOveEck0RbWEST7%2FSDolaeJVw%3D&amp;reserved=3D0">https://d=
atatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/</a>
 describes examples of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Appli=
cation Based Segmentation, &nbsp;assuming that the applications are assigne=
d with unique IP addresses.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">In the F=
igure below, the following BGP Updates can be advertised to ensure that Pay=
ment Application only communicates with the Payment Gateway:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><img bor=
der=3D"0" width=3D"538" height=3D"218" style=3D"width:5.6041in;height:2.270=
8in" id=3D"x__x005f_x0000_i1042" src=3D"cid:image002..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0=
"><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">BGP UPDA=
TE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topology (only propagated to Payment=
 GW node:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25i=
n">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute: </span><o:p></o:=
p></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"color:black;margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:=
0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;mso-list:l3 level3 lfo6">
30.1.1.x/24<o:p></o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25i=
n">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"color:black">Tunnel Encap Path Attribute</span><o:p><=
/o:p></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"color:black;margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:=
0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;mso-list:l4 level3 lfo7">
IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW -&gt;C-PE2<o:p></o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:134.65pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">BGP UPDA=
TE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be reached by Purple:<o:p></o:p></=
p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25i=
n">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute:</span><o:p></o:p=
></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-b=
ottom:.0001pt;mso-list:l8 level3 lfo8">
<span style=3D"color:black">10.1.x.x</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=3D"xms=
onormal" style=3D"margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;ms=
o-list:l8 level3 lfo8">
<span style=3D"color:black">12.4.x.x</span><o:p></o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;ma=
rgin-bottom:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25i=
n">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif;color:black">-=
</span><span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quo=
t;,serif;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"color:black">TunnelEncap Path Attribute:</span><o:p><=
/o:p></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"color:black;margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:=
0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;mso-list:l7 level3 lfo9">
Any node to C-PE2<o:p></o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">Your fee=
dback is greatly appreciated.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">Thank yo=
u very much.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">Linda Du=
nbar<o:p></o:p></p>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center">
</span></div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><strong>=
<i><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-seri=
f;color:blue">External Email:</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-si=
ze:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue">
 Please use caution when opening links and attachments / </span></em><stron=
g><i><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-se=
rif;color:blue">Courriel externe:</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"fon=
t-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue">
 Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints </span></em><o:p></o:p></=
p>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center">
</span></div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><strong>=
<i><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-seri=
f;color:blue">External Email:</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-si=
ze:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue">
 Please use caution when opening links and attachments / </span></em><stron=
g><i><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-se=
rif;color:blue">Courriel externe:</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"fon=
t-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue">
 Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints </span></em><o:p></o:p></=
p>
</div>
</div>
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From: "Mankamana Mishra (mankamis)" <mankamis@cisco.com>
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>, "bess-chairs@ietf.org" <bess-chairs@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: Request for WG Adoption for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage-05
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Subject: Re: [bess] Request for WG Adoption for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage-05
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To: slitkows.ietf@gmail.com, 'BESS' <bess@ietf.org>
Cc: bess-chairs@ietf.org
References: <041f01d5ecb0$954a9570$bfdfc050$@gmail.com>
From: Eric C Rosen <erosen52@gmail.com>
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Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2020 09:38:21 -0400
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Subject: Re: [bess] WGLC, IPR and implementation poll for draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast-04
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I am unaware of any undisclosed IPR applicable to this document.

On 2/26/20 9:25 AM, slitkows.ietf@gmail.com wrote:
>
> Hi WG,
>
> This email starts a two weeks Working GroupLast Call on 
> draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast-04 [2]
>
> Please review the draft and send any comments to the BESS list. Also, 
> please indicate if you support publishing the draft as a standards 
> track RFC.
>
> This poll runs until 11th March 2020.
>
> We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies 
> to this Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance 
> with IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).
>
> If you are listed as an Author or a Contributor of this Document 
> please respond to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware 
> of any relevant undisclosed IPR. The Document won't progress without 
> answers from all the Authors and Contributors.
>
> There is currently one IPR disclosed.
>
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/search/?submit=draft&id=draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast
>
> We are also polling for any existing implementation as per [1]. Please 
> indicate if you are aware of any implementations.
>
>  Thank you,
>
> Stephane
>
> [1]https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw
>
> [2] https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast/
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess

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    <p>I am unaware of any undisclosed IPR applicable to this document.<br>
    </p>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2/26/20 9:25 AM,
      <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:slitkows.ietf@gmail.com">slitkows.ietf@gmail.com</a> wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
      cite="mid:041f01d5ecb0$954a9570$bfdfc050$@gmail.com">
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      <div class="WordSection1">
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black" lang="EN-US">Hi
            WG,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black" lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black" lang="EN-US">This
            email starts a two weeks Working Group<span
              class="apple-converted-space"> Last Call </span>on </span><span
            lang="EN-GB">draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast-04 [2]</span><span
            style="color:black" lang="EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black" lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black" lang="EN-US">Please
            review the draft and send any comments to the BESS list.
            Also, please indicate if you support publishing the draft as
            a standards track RFC.</span><span lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black" lang="EN-US"> </span><span
            style="color:black" lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0,
          0);font-variant-caps: normal;orphans:
          auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust:
          auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px"><span
            style="color:black" lang="EN-US">This poll runs until 11th
            March 2020.</span><span style="color:black" lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0,
          0);font-variant-caps: normal;orphans:
          auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust:
          auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px"><span
            style="color:black" lang="EN-US"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p
class="gmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintext0"><span
            style="font-size:12.0pt" lang="EN-US">We are also polling
            for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to this
            Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in
            compliance with IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669
            and 5378 for more details).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p
class="gmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintext0"><span
            style="font-size:12.0pt" lang="EN-US">If you are listed as
            an Author or a Contributor of this Document please respond
            to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of
            any relevant undisclosed IPR. The Document won't progress
            without answers from all the Authors and Contributors. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p
class="gmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintext"><span
            style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-US">There is
            currently one IPR disclosed.  <o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p
class="gmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintext"><a
href="https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/search/?submit=draft&amp;id=draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast"
            moz-do-not-send="true"><span lang="EN-US">https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/search/?submit=draft&amp;id=draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast</span></a><o:p></o:p></p>
        <p
class="gmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintext"><span
            style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
        <p
class="gmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintext"><span
            style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-US">We are
            also polling for any existing implementation as per [1].
            Please indicate if you are aware of any implementations.</span><span
            style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p
class="gmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintext"
          style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps:
          normal;orphans: auto;text-align:start;widows:
          auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width:
          0px;word-spacing:0px"><span
            style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-US"> Thank
            you,</span><span style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black"
            lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p
class="gmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintext"
          style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps:
          normal;orphans: auto;text-align:start;widows:
          auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width:
          0px;word-spacing:0px"><span
            style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-US">Stephane</span><span
            style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black" lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0,
          0);font-variant-caps: normal;orphans:
          auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust:
          auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px"><span
            style="color:black" lang="EN-US"> </span><span
            style="color:black" lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0,
          0);font-variant-caps: normal;orphans:
          auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust:
          auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px"><span
            style="color:black" lang="EN-GB">[1]<span
              class="apple-converted-space"> </span></span><span
            style="color:black" lang="EN-US"><a
href="https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw"
              target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                style="color:#044A91">https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw</span></a></span><span
            style="color:black" lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-GB">[2]
          </span><a
            href="https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast/"
            moz-do-not-send="true"><span lang="EN-GB">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast/</span></a><span
            style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-GB"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt" lang="EN-GB"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
      </div>
      <br>
      <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
      <pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">_______________________________________________
BESS mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:BESS@ietf.org">BESS@ietf.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a>
</pre>
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From: Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>, "idr@ietf.org" <idr@ietf.org>
CC: "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/NG87eNAUMdnpF18krisMwSuHUBk>
Subject: Re: [bess] [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
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Hi Linda,

    It seems that using another SAFI is a possible solution.

Best Regards,
Huaimo
________________________________
From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
Sent: Friday, March 20, 2020 12:54 AM
To: Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org <idr@ietf.org>
Cc: bess@ietf.org <bess@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identif=
ier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-u=
sage?


Huaimo,



Thank you very much for the suggestion.

Do you mean using the similar approach as VPN Label carried by NLRI Path At=
tribute [RFC8277] for SDWAN Segmentation Identifier?

If yes, the UPDATE message should not use the MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) to avo=
id confusion, right?



Linda



From: Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:45 PM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org
Cc: bess@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identif=
ier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-u=
sage?



Hi Linda,



    It seems that a label may be used as an "Identifier" to differentiate S=
D-WAN Segmentation.



Best Regards,

Huaimo

________________________________

From: Idr <idr-bounces@ietf.org<mailto:idr-bounces@ietf.org>> on behalf of =
Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>=
>
Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM
To: idr@ietf.org<mailto:idr@ietf.org> <idr@ietf.org<mailto:idr@ietf.org>>
Cc: bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org> <bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org=
>>
Subject: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier"=
 to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage=
?



BGP Experts,



Do you know if  there is any problem of using  Private AS as  "Identifier" =
to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation? Here is the discussion in BESS WG. Wa=
nt to get IDR WG feedbacks for this question.



Thank you.

Linda



From: Linda Dunbar
Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM
To: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>; bess@ie=
tf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to differ=
entiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?



Based on Basil=92s comment on needing an identifier to differentiate SDWAN =
instances, I added a section to  draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . Want t=
o hear people=92s feedback.



3.1    Requirements
3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations

The term =93network segmentation=94 is used extensively in SDWAN deployment=
. In general (and in this document), the =93Network Segmentation=94 is refe=
rring to the process of dividing the network into logical sub-networks usin=
g isolation techniques on a forwarding device such as a switch, router, or =
firewall. For a homogeneous network, such as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, V=
RF or VLAN are used to separate network segments.

As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks, it =
is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN network in=
stances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do not ha=
ve their own assigned AS numbers, a very easy way is to use Private AS numb=
ers, in the range of 64512 to 65535, to differentiate different SDWAN segme=
ntations. When using BGP to control the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numb=
ers are carried by the BGP UPDATE messages to their corresponding RRs.



Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description.



Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used?



Thank you very much.



Linda Dunbar



From: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>
Sent: Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.=
com>>; bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descript=
ion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segmen=
tation







Hi Linda;



The SD-WAN Segment is part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there coul=
d be more than one Segment over a single underlay depending on the design a=
nd the business requirements.



Each Segment represents a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I su=
ggested that we may need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update messag=
es in order to identify and build the routing the table for each Segment (b=
ased on the Segment ID).



Hope this helps.



Regards;



Basil





From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewe=
i.com>>
Sent: February-03-20 10:40 AM
To: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>; bess@ie=
tf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage des=
cription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based S=
egmentation



Basil,



Thank you very much for the comments.

Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision.



As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be inc=
luded in the BGP UPDATE), does the =93Segment=94 mean the different Underla=
y?

In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to Publ=
ic Internet.

Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN =93segments=94?

If not, can you elaborate more?



[cid:image001..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0]





Thanks, Linda



From: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>
Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.=
com>>; bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descript=
ion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segmen=
tation





Hello Linda;



I haven=92t gone through the entire document; however, I have the following=
 quick comments



  1.  Regarding the following paragraph:



1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over=
 different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overla=
y paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks ove=
r which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption,=
 e.g. over untrusted public networks.



The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either encrypted or u=
necrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is NOT encrypted=
 is not always correct). I would change the parpagaph to the following (for=
 clarity):



1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over=
 different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overla=
y paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks ove=
r which traffic can traverse with or without encryption, others require enc=
ryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.





  1.  Another thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each Segment=
 (at the SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will map the Appli=
cation Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a =93routing domain=94, th=
e BGP update will be exchanged with the memebers of a particular Segment.



As such: Should we include the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP update=
 messages? Perhaps we need to further discuss this in details.



Any feedback is welcomed and it=92s highly appreciated.



Regards;



Basil





From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewe=
i.com>>
Sent: January-31-20 5:17 PM
To: bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descrip=
tion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segme=
ntation



BESS participants:



=93SDWAN=94 networks is characterized by:

1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over=
 different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overla=
y paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks ove=
r which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption,=
 e.g. over untrusted public networks.

2.       Enable direct Internet access from remote sites, instead hauling a=
ll traffic to Corporate HQ for centralized policy control.

3.       Some traffic are routed based on application IDs instead of based =
on destination IP addresses.





https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/<https:/=
/nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdatatracker.ie=
tf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&data=3D02%7C01%7Chuaimo=
.chen%40futurewei.com%7C8a02ffe78a7144f9d47308d7cc8ad29d%7C0fee8ff2a3b24018=
9c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637202768953162260&sdata=3DgqmAC4lw3AYyM0tr%2BLM=
V%2BujiSTqOIwF51iO76ucZNFA%3D&reserved=3D0> describes examples of using BGP=
 UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Application Based Segmentation,  assu=
ming that the applications are assigned with unique IP addresses.

In the Figure below, the following BGP Updates can be advertised to ensure =
that Payment Application only communicates with the Payment Gateway:



[cid:image002..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0]



BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topology (only propagated to=
 Payment GW node:

-        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:

        *   30.1.1.x/24

-        Tunnel Encap Path Attribute

        *   IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW ->C-PE2



BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be reached by Purple:

-        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:

        *   10.1.x.x
        *   12.4.x.x

-        TunnelEncap Path Attribute:

        *   Any node to C-PE2





Your feedback is greatly appreciated.



Thank you very much.



Linda Dunbar

________________________________

External Email: Please use caution when opening links and attachments / Cou=
rriel externe: Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints

________________________________

External Email: Please use caution when opening links and attachments / Cou=
rriel externe: Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints

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<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
&nbsp; &nbsp; It seems that using another SAFI is a possible solution.</div=
>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size=
: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
<div id=3D"appendonsend"></div>
<div style=3D"font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12p=
t; color:rgb(0,0,0)">
Best Regards,</div>
<div style=3D"font-family:Calibri,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12p=
t; color:rgb(0,0,0)">
Huaimo</div>
<hr tabindex=3D"-1" style=3D"display:inline-block; width:98%">
<div id=3D"divRplyFwdMsg" dir=3D"ltr"><font face=3D"Calibri, sans-serif" co=
lor=3D"#000000" style=3D"font-size:11pt"><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;lind=
a.dunbar@futurewei.com&gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, March 20, 2020 12:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;huaimo.chen@futurewei.com&gt;; idr@ietf.org &lt;=
idr@ietf.org&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> bess@ietf.org &lt;bess@ietf.org&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?</font>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
</div>
<div lang=3D"EN-US">
<div class=3D"x_WordSection1">
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Huaimo, </p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Thank you very much for the suggestion. </p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Do you mean using the similar approach as VPN Label carried by NLRI Path At=
tribute [RFC8277] for SDWAN Segmentation Identifier?</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
If yes, the UPDATE message should not use the MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) to avo=
id confusion, right?
</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Linda</p>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0i=
n 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<b>From:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;huaimo.chen@futurewei.com&gt; <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:45 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;linda.dunbar@futurewei.com&gt;; idr@ietf.org<br=
>
<b>Cc:</b> bess@ietf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?</p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<div>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; color:black">Hi Linda,</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; color:black">&nbsp; &nbsp; It seems that a=
 label may be used as an&nbsp;&quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WA=
N Segmentation.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; color:black">Best Regards,</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; color:black">Huaimo</span></p>
</div>
<div class=3D"x_MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001=
pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;text-align:center">
<hr size=3D"2" width=3D"98%" align=3D"center">
</div>
<div id=3D"x_divRplyFwdMsg">
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<b><span style=3D"color:black">From:</span></b><span style=3D"color:black">=
 Idr &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:idr-bounces@ietf.org">idr-bounces@ietf.org</a>&g=
t; on behalf of Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.c=
om">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org">idr@ietf.org</a> &lt;<a href=3D"=
mailto:idr@ietf.org">idr@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a> &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot=
;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bes=
s-bgp-sdwan-usage?</span>
</p>
<div>
<p class=3D"x_MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
BGP Experts, </p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Do you know if &nbsp;there is any problem of using&nbsp; Private AS as&nbsp=
; &quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation? Here is the =
discussion in BESS WG. Want to get IDR WG feedbacks for this question.
</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Thank you. </p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Linda</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0i=
n 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca">basil.na=
jem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot;Identifie=
r&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwa=
n-usage?</p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Based on Basil=92s comment on needing an identifier to differentiate SDWAN =
instances, I added a section to &nbsp;draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . W=
ant to hear people=92s feedback.
</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<h2 style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 18pt; font-fam=
ily: Calibri, sans-serif; font-weight: bold;margin-right:0in; margin-bottom=
:12.0pt; margin-left:45.0pt; text-indent:-.5in; line-height:12.0pt; break-a=
fter:avoid">
<a name=3D"x_x__Toc31377653"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&=
quot;Courier New&quot;; font-weight:normal">3.1</span></a><span style=3D"">=
<span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt; font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,ser=
if; font-weight:normal">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><span style=3D""><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family=
:&quot;Courier New&quot;; font-weight:normal">Requirements</span></span><sp=
an style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;; font-wei=
ght:normal"></span></h2>
<h3 style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 13.5pt; font-f=
amily: Calibri, sans-serif; font-weight: bold;margin-right:0in; margin-bott=
om:12.0pt; margin-left:.75in; text-indent:-.5in; line-height:12.0pt; break-=
after:avoid">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;; font-=
weight:normal">3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations</span></h3>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
The term =93network segmentation=94 is used extensively in SDWAN deployment=
. In general (and in this document), the =93Network Segmentation=94 is refe=
rring to the process of dividing the network into logical sub-networks usin=
g isolation techniques on a forwarding device
 such as a switch, router, or firewall. For a homogeneous network, such as =
MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, VRF or VLAN are used to separate network segme=
nts.
</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks, it =
is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN network in=
stances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do not ha=
ve their own assigned AS numbers,
 a very easy way is to use Private AS numbers, in the range of 64512 to 655=
35, to differentiate different SDWAN segmentations. When using BGP to contr=
ol the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numbers are carried by the BGP UPDATE=
 messages to their corresponding
 RRs.</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description. </p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used? </p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Thank you very much. </p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Linda Dunbar</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0i=
n 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca">basil.=
najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">l=
inda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
</p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hi Linda;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">The SD-WAN Segment is part of =
the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there could be more than one Segment ove=
r a single underlay depending on the design and the business requirements.<=
/span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Each Segment represents a sing=
le and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I suggested that we may need to in=
clude the Segment ID in the BGP update messages in order to identify and bu=
ild the routing the table for each Segment
 (based on the Segment ID).</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hope this helps.</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Regards;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Basil</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0i=
n 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com"=
>linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> February-03-20 10:40 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca">basil.na=
jem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-us=
age description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application =
Based Segmentation
</p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Basil, </p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Thank you very much for the comments. </p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision. </=
p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be inc=
luded in the BGP UPDATE), does the =93Segment=94 mean the different Underla=
y?
</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to Publ=
ic Internet.
</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN =93segments=94? </p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
If not, can you elaborate more? </p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<img border=3D"0" width=3D"390" height=3D"305" id=3D"x_x__x005f_x0000_i1041=
" style=3D"width:4.0625in; height:3.1736in" data-outlook-trace=3D"F:0|T:1" =
src=3D"cid:image001..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0"></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
Thanks, Linda</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0i=
n 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca">basil.=
najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">l=
inda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
</p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hello Linda;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">I haven=92t gone through the e=
ntire document; however, I have the following quick comments</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<ol start=3D"1" type=3D"A" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<li class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fo=
nt-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;color:#1F497D; margin-top:0=
in; margin-bottom:0in; margin-bottom:.0001pt">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA">Regarding the following paragraph:</span></li></ol>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-right:0in; margin-bot=
tom:0in; margin-left:.75in; margin-bottom:.0001pt; text-indent:-.25in">
<span style=3D"">1.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </span></span><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing =
overlay paths over different underlay networks. Very often there are multip=
le parallel overlay
 paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks over=
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-right:0in; margin-bot=
tom:0in; margin-left:.5in; margin-bottom:.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either=
 encrypted or unecrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic i=
s NOT encrypted is not always correct). I would
 change the parpagaph to the following (for clarity):</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-right:0in; margin-bot=
tom:0in; margin-left:.75in; margin-bottom:.0001pt; text-indent:-.25in">
<span style=3D"">1.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </span></span><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing =
overlay paths over different underlay networks. Very often there are multip=
le parallel overlay
 paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks over=
 which traffic can traverse
<span style=3D"color:red">with or </span>without encryption, others require=
 encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<ol start=3D"2" type=3D"A" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<li class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fo=
nt-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;color:#1F497D; margin-top:0=
in; margin-bottom:0in; margin-bottom:.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif">=
Another thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each Segment (at t=
he SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will map the Application=
 Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a
 =93routing domain=94, the BGP update will be exchanged with the memebers o=
f a particular Segment.
</span></li></ol>
<p class=3D"x_xmsolistparagraph" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-si=
ze: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-left:.5in">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsolistparagraph" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-si=
ze: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-left:.5in">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D; background:yellow">As such: Should we include the Segment ID=
 as an attribute in the BGP update messages? Perhaps we need to further dis=
cuss this in details.</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">Any feedback is welcomed and it=92s highly appreciated.</spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">Regards;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; =
color:#1F497D">Basil</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
<span style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none; border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0i=
n 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
<b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com"=
>linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> January-31-20 5:17 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage =
description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Base=
d Segmentation
</p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
BESS participants:</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
=93SDWAN=94 networks is characterized by: </p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-right:0in; margin-bot=
tom:0in; margin-left:.75in; margin-bottom:.0001pt; text-indent:-.25in">
<span style=3D"">1.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </span></span><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing =
overlay paths over different underlay networks. Very often there are multip=
le parallel overlay
 paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks over=
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-right:0in; margin-bot=
tom:0in; margin-left:.75in; margin-bottom:.0001pt; text-indent:-.25in">
<span style=3D"">2.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </span></span><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Enable direct Internet access from remote sites,=
 instead hauling all traffic to Corporate HQ for centralized policy control=
.
</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-right:0in; margin-bot=
tom:0in; margin-left:.75in; margin-bottom:.0001pt; text-indent:-.25in">
<span style=3D"">3.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </span></span><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Some traffic are routed based on application IDs=
 instead of based on destination IP addresses.
</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
<a href=3D"https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2=
F%2Fdatatracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&amp;d=
ata=3D02%7C01%7Chuaimo.chen%40futurewei.com%7C8a02ffe78a7144f9d47308d7cc8ad=
29d%7C0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637202768953162260&amp;sda=
ta=3DgqmAC4lw3AYyM0tr%2BLMV%2BujiSTqOIwF51iO76ucZNFA%3D&amp;reserved=3D0" o=
riginalsrc=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-=
usage/" shash=3D"cjvw7txDWTuG/8BK20CBYs/l/HUTiCsXsa3Fr0NbH9zZW9kLlyvhGuBRV2=
vJGL/iL/hwIFTwRoVY4ZInnosb5Lb2qm1whNcdDHOebt3oQYb1rJg1G0Abcc9UsL64R3Y5Jjv8y=
zVFD0y1IjJ0y6oo&#43;Cw2GK/dWQpVhS26d1pfxtM=3D">https://datatracker.ietf.org=
/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/</a>
 describes examples of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Appli=
cation Based Segmentation, &nbsp;assuming that the applications are assigne=
d with unique IP addresses.</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
In the Figure below, the following BGP Updates can be advertised to ensure =
that Payment Application only communicates with the Payment Gateway:</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
<img border=3D"0" width=3D"538" height=3D"218" id=3D"x_x__x005f_x0000_i1042=
" style=3D"width:5.6041in; height:2.2708in" data-outlook-trace=3D"F:0|T:1" =
src=3D"cid:image002..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0"></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topology (only propagated to=
 Payment GW node:</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-right:0in; margin-bot=
tom:0in; margin-left:62.65pt; margin-bottom:.0001pt; text-indent:-.25in">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7.0pt; font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute: </span></p>
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<li class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fo=
nt-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;color:black; margin-top:0in=
; margin-bottom:0in; margin-bottom:.0001pt">
30.1.1.x/24</li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-right:0in; margin-bot=
tom:0in; margin-left:62.65pt; margin-bottom:.0001pt; text-indent:-.25in">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7.0pt; font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"color:black">Tunnel Encap Path Attribute</span></p>
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<li class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fo=
nt-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;color:black; margin-top:0in=
; margin-bottom:0in; margin-bottom:.0001pt">
IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW -&gt;C-PE2</li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-right:0in; margin-bot=
tom:0in; margin-left:134.65pt; margin-bottom:.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be reached by Purple:</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-right:0in; margin-bot=
tom:0in; margin-left:62.65pt; margin-bottom:.0001pt; text-indent:-.25in">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7.0pt; font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute:</span></p>
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<li class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fo=
nt-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-top:0in; margin-bott=
om:0in; margin-bottom:.0001pt">
<span style=3D"color:black">10.1.x.x</span></li><li class=3D"x_xmsonormal" =
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family:=
 Calibri, sans-serif;margin-top:0in; margin-bottom:0in; margin-bottom:.0001=
pt">
<span style=3D"color:black">12.4.x.x</span></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin-right:0in; margin-bot=
tom:0in; margin-left:62.65pt; margin-bottom:.0001pt; text-indent:-.25in">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif; color:black">=
-</span><span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt; font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&q=
uot;,serif; color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"color:black">TunnelEncap Path Attribute:</span></p>
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<ul type=3D"disc" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0in;margin-top:0in">
<li class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fo=
nt-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;color:black; margin-top:0in=
; margin-bottom:0in; margin-bottom:.0001pt">
Any node to C-PE2</li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
Your feedback is greatly appreciated. </p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
001pt">
Thank you very much. </p>
<p class=3D"x_xmsonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; fon=
t-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0=
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&nbsp;</p>
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Linda Dunbar</p>
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From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
To: Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>, "idr@ietf.org" <idr@ietf.org>
CC: "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-safi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI 
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Subject: [bess] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-safi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI
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IDR experts:

SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks. A SDWA=
N edge node may need to map client traffic to different SDWAN network insta=
nces (or segmentations).
It might not be feasible to use the AS number in the BGP message to differe=
ntiate the SDWAN network instances as multiple SDWAN instances may share th=
e same AS number.

We would like to hear feedback from IDR group on using similar method as  B=
inding MPLS Labels to Address Prefixes [RFC8277] to bind SDWAN Instance ID =
to  prefixes.

When  MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) is present, MPLS label is carried by NLRI [RFC=
8277] as:

      0                   1                   2                   3
      0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
     +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
     |    Length     |                 Label                 |Rsrv |S|
     +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
     |                          Prefix                               ~
     ~                                                               |
     +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+

                       Figure 2: NLRI with One Label

We would like to  propose the SDWAN Instance ID being encoded in the Label =
field as follows when SDWAN SAFI (=3D74 allocated by IANA) is used,:

      0                   1                   2                   3
      0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
     +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
     |    Length     |      SDWAN Instance ID (Label)        |Rsrv |S|
     +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
     |                          Prefix                               ~
     ~                                                               |
     +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+

                        NLRI with SDWAN Instance ID.

Greatly appreciate any comments or other suggestions.

Thank you,
Linda Dunbar

From: Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>
Sent: Monday, March 23, 2020 9:14 AM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org
Cc: bess@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identif=
ier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-u=
sage?

Hi Linda,

    It seems that using another SAFI is a possible solution.

Best Regards,
Huaimo
________________________________
From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewe=
i.com>>
Sent: Friday, March 20, 2020 12:54 AM
To: Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com<mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com=
>>; idr@ietf.org<mailto:idr@ietf.org> <idr@ietf.org<mailto:idr@ietf.org>>
Cc: bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org> <bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org=
>>
Subject: RE: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identif=
ier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-u=
sage?


Huaimo,



Thank you very much for the suggestion.

Do you mean using the similar approach as VPN Label carried by NLRI Path At=
tribute [RFC8277] for SDWAN Segmentation Identifier?

If yes, the UPDATE message should not use the MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) to avo=
id confusion, right?



Linda



From: Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com<mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.c=
om>>
Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:45 PM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.=
com>>; idr@ietf.org<mailto:idr@ietf.org>
Cc: bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identif=
ier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-u=
sage?



Hi Linda,



    It seems that a label may be used as an "Identifier" to differentiate S=
D-WAN Segmentation.



Best Regards,

Huaimo

________________________________

From: Idr <idr-bounces@ietf.org<mailto:idr-bounces@ietf.org>> on behalf of =
Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>=
>
Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM
To: idr@ietf.org<mailto:idr@ietf.org> <idr@ietf.org<mailto:idr@ietf.org>>
Cc: bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org> <bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org=
>>
Subject: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier"=
 to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage=
?



BGP Experts,



Do you know if  there is any problem of using  Private AS as  "Identifier" =
to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation? Here is the discussion in BESS WG. Wa=
nt to get IDR WG feedbacks for this question.



Thank you.

Linda



From: Linda Dunbar
Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM
To: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>; bess@ie=
tf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to differ=
entiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?



Based on Basil's comment on needing an identifier to differentiate SDWAN in=
stances, I added a section to  draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . Want to =
hear people's feedback.



3.1    Requirements
3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations

The term "network segmentation" is used extensively in SDWAN deployment. In=
 general (and in this document), the "Network Segmentation" is referring to=
 the process of dividing the network into logical sub-networks using isolat=
ion techniques on a forwarding device such as a switch, router, or firewall=
. For a homogeneous network, such as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, VRF or VL=
AN are used to separate network segments.

As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks, it =
is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN network in=
stances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do not ha=
ve their own assigned AS numbers, a very easy way is to use Private AS numb=
ers, in the range of 64512 to 65535, to differentiate different SDWAN segme=
ntations. When using BGP to control the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numb=
ers are carried by the BGP UPDATE messages to their corresponding RRs.



Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description.



Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used?



Thank you very much.



Linda Dunbar



From: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>
Sent: Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.=
com>>; bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descript=
ion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segmen=
tation







Hi Linda;



The SD-WAN Segment is part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there coul=
d be more than one Segment over a single underlay depending on the design a=
nd the business requirements.



Each Segment represents a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I su=
ggested that we may need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update messag=
es in order to identify and build the routing the table for each Segment (b=
ased on the Segment ID).



Hope this helps.



Regards;



Basil





From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewe=
i.com>>
Sent: February-03-20 10:40 AM
To: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>; bess@ie=
tf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage des=
cription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based S=
egmentation



Basil,



Thank you very much for the comments.

Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision.



As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be inc=
luded in the BGP UPDATE), does the "Segment" mean the different Underlay?

In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to Publ=
ic Internet.

Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN "segments"?

If not, can you elaborate more?



[cid:image001..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0]





Thanks, Linda



From: Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca<mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca>>
Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.=
com>>; bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descript=
ion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segmen=
tation





Hello Linda;



I haven't gone through the entire document; however, I have the following q=
uick comments



  1.  Regarding the following paragraph:



1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over=
 different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overla=
y paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks ove=
r which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption,=
 e.g. over untrusted public networks.



The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either encrypted or u=
necrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is NOT encrypted=
 is not always correct). I would change the parpagaph to the following (for=
 clarity):



1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over=
 different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overla=
y paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks ove=
r which traffic can traverse with or without encryption, others require enc=
ryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.





  1.  Another thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each Segment=
 (at the SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will map the Appli=
cation Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a "routing domain", the BG=
P update will be exchanged with the memebers of a particular Segment.



As such: Should we include the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP update=
 messages? Perhaps we need to further discuss this in details.



Any feedback is welcomed and it's highly appreciated.



Regards;



Basil





From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com<mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewe=
i.com>>
Sent: January-31-20 5:17 PM
To: bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org<mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp=
-sdwan-usage@ietf.org>
Subject: [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage descrip=
tion of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segme=
ntation



BESS participants:



"SDWAN" networks is characterized by:

1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths over=
 different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel overla=
y paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private networks ove=
r which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption,=
 e.g. over untrusted public networks.

2.       Enable direct Internet access from remote sites, instead hauling a=
ll traffic to Corporate HQ for centralized policy control.

3.       Some traffic are routed based on application IDs instead of based =
on destination IP addresses.





https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/<https:/=
/nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdatatracker.ie=
tf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&data=3D02%7C01%7Clinda.=
dunbar%40futurewei.com%7C99acf950b82f4213da7f08d7cf34789d%7C0fee8ff2a3b2401=
89c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637205696587614498&sdata=3D0MdUmWEie3Fd4y3UCVJ4=
HBdY0oxiBY4xiTK5%2FiMaAkQ%3D&reserved=3D0> describes examples of using BGP =
UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Application Based Segmentation,  assum=
ing that the applications are assigned with unique IP addresses.

In the Figure below, the following BGP Updates can be advertised to ensure =
that Payment Application only communicates with the Payment Gateway:



[cid:image002..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0]



BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topology (only propagated to=
 Payment GW node:

-        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:

        *   30.1.1.x/24

-        Tunnel Encap Path Attribute

        *   IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW ->C-PE2



BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be reached by Purple:

-        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:

        *   10.1.x.x
        *   12.4.x.x

-        TunnelEncap Path Attribute:

        *   Any node to C-PE2





Your feedback is greatly appreciated.



Thank you very much.



Linda Dunbar

________________________________

External Email: Please use caution when opening links and attachments / Cou=
rriel externe: Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints

________________________________

External Email: Please use caution when opening links and attachments / Cou=
rriel externe: Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints

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</head>
<body lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">
<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">IDR experts:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple ty=
pes of networks. A SDWAN edge node may need to map client traffic to differ=
ent SDWAN network instances (or segmentations).<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">It might not be feasible to use the AS number in the=
 BGP message to differentiate the SDWAN network instances as multiple SDWAN=
 instances may share the same AS number.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We would like to hear feedback from IDR group on usi=
ng similar method as &nbsp;Binding MPLS Labels to Address Prefixes [RFC8277=
] to bind SDWAN Instance ID to &nbsp;prefixes.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">When &nbsp;MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) is present, MPLS l=
abel is carried by NLRI [RFC8277] as:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<div style=3D"mso-element:para-border-div;border:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;paddin=
g:8.0pt 8.0pt 8.0pt 8.0pt;background:#FFFDF5">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#FFFDF5;word=
-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 0&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 1&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp=
;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 2&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 3<o:p></=
o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#FFFDF5;word=
-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 =
9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#FFFDF5;word=
-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#=
43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;=
-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#=
43;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#FFFDF5;word=
-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Length&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Label&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |Rsrv |S|<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#FFFDF5;word=
-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#=
43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;=
-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#=
43;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#FFFDF5;word=
-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Prefix&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;~<o:p=
></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#FFFDF5;word=
-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; ~&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#FFFDF5;word=
-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#=
43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;=
-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#=
43;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#FFFDF5;word=
-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#FFFDF5;word=
-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Figure 2: N=
LRI with One Label<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We would like to &nbsp;propose the SDWAN Instance ID=
 being encoded in the Label field as follows when SDWAN SAFI (=3D74 allocat=
ed by IANA) is used,:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 0&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 1&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp=
;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 2&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 3<o:p></o:p></=
span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 =
2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#=
43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;=
-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Length&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
 |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; SDWAN Instance ID (Label)&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp=
;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |Rsrv |S|<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#=
43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;=
-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Prefix&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; ~<o:p></o:p=
></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; ~&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#=
43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;=
-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;-&#43;<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; &nbsp;NLRI with SDWAN Instance ID. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Greatly appreciate any comments or other suggestions=
. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda Dunbar<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;huaimo.chen@futurewei.c=
om&gt; <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, March 23, 2020 9:14 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;linda.dunbar@futurewei.com&gt;; idr@ietf.org<br=
>
<b>Cc:</b> bess@ietf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Hi Lind=
a,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">&nbsp; =
&nbsp; It seems that using another SAFI is a possible solution.<o:p></o:p><=
/span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Best Re=
gards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Huaimo<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center">
<hr size=3D"2" width=3D"98%" align=3D"center">
</div>
<div id=3D"divRplyFwdMsg">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"color:black">From:</span></b><span=
 style=3D"color:black"> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@fut=
urewei.com">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, March 20, 2020 12:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com">hua=
imo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org">idr@ietf.org</a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:idr@=
ietf.org">idr@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a> &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?</span>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Huaimo, <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Thank you very much for the suggestion. <o:p></o:p>=
</p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Do you mean using the similar approach as VPN Label=
 carried by NLRI Path Attribute [RFC8277] for SDWAN Segmentation Identifier=
?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">If yes, the UPDATE message should not use the MPLS =
VPN SAFI (=3D128) to avoid confusion, right?
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">Linda<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><b>From:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huai=
mo.chen@futurewei.com">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:45 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">l=
inda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org">idr@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Hi Lin=
da,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">&nbsp;=
 &nbsp; It seems that a label may be used as an&nbsp;&quot;Identifier&quot;=
 to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">&nbsp;=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Best R=
egards,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Huaimo=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center">
<hr size=3D"2" width=3D"98%" align=3D"center">
</div>
<div id=3D"x_divRplyFwdMsg">
<p class=3D"xmsonormal"><b><span style=3D"color:black">From:</span></b><spa=
n style=3D"color:black"> Idr &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:idr-bounces@ietf.org">id=
r-bounces@ietf.org</a>&gt; on behalf of Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:=
linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org">idr@ietf.org</a> &lt;<a href=3D"=
mailto:idr@ietf.org">idr@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a> &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot=
;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bes=
s-bgp-sdwan-usage?</span>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"xmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">BGP Experts, <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">Do you know if &nbsp;there is any problem of using=
&nbsp; Private AS as&nbsp; &quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN S=
egmentation? Here is the discussion in BESS WG. Want to get IDR WG feedback=
s for this question.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">Thank you. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">Linda<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca">basil.na=
jem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot;Identifie=
r&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwa=
n-usage?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">Based on Basil&#8217;s comment on needing an ident=
ifier to differentiate SDWAN instances, I added a section to &nbsp;draft-du=
nbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . Want to hear people&#8217;s feedback.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<h2 style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt=
;margin-left:45.0pt;text-indent:-.5in;line-height:12.0pt;break-after:avoid"=
>
<a name=3D"x_x__Toc31377653"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&q=
uot;Courier New&quot;;font-weight:normal">3.1</span></a><span style=3D"mso-=
bookmark:x_x__Toc31377653"></span><span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-famil=
y:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif;font-weight:normal">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;=
font-weight:normal">Requirements</span><o:p></o:p></h2>
<h3 style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt=
;margin-left:.75in;text-indent:-.5in;line-height:12.0pt;break-after:avoid">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;font-we=
ight:normal">3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations</span><o:p></o:p>=
</h3>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">The term &#8220;network segmentation&#8221; is use=
d extensively in SDWAN deployment. In general (and in this document), the &=
#8220;Network Segmentation&#8221; is referring to the process of dividing t=
he network into logical sub-networks using isolation techniques
 on a forwarding device such as a switch, router, or firewall. For a homoge=
neous network, such as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, VRF or VLAN are used to=
 separate network segments.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multip=
le types of networks, it is important to have distinct identifiers to diffe=
rentiate SDWAN network instances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN n=
etwork segments do not have their
 own assigned AS numbers, a very easy way is to use Private AS numbers, in =
the range of 64512 to 65535, to differentiate different SDWAN segmentations=
. When using BGP to control the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numbers are =
carried by the BGP UPDATE messages
 to their corresponding RRs.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">Greatly appreciate any feedback on this descriptio=
n. <o:p>
</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be us=
ed? <o:p>
</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">Thank you very much. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">Linda Dunbar<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ba=
sil.najem@bell.ca">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">l=
inda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp=
;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp=
;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hi Li=
nda;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp=
;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">The S=
D-WAN Segment is part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there could be =
more than one Segment over a single underlay depending on the design and th=
e business requirements.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp=
;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Each =
Segment represents a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I suggest=
ed that we may need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update messages in=
 order to identify and build the routing
 the table for each Segment (based on the Segment ID).</span><o:p></o:p></p=
>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp=
;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hope =
this helps.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp=
;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Regar=
ds;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp=
;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Basil=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></=
o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp=
;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:li=
nda.dunbar@futurewei.com">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> February-03-20 10:40 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca">basil.na=
jem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-us=
age description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application =
Based Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">Basil, <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">Thank you very much for the comments. <o:p></o:p><=
/p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">Your suggested wording change will be incorporated=
 in the next revision.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID o=
f a SDWAN node (to be included in the BGP UPDATE), does the &#8220;Segment&=
#8221; mean the different Underlay?
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to M=
PLS network and 1 to Public Internet.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN &#8220;segments&#8221;=
? <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">If not, can you elaborate more? <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><img border=3D"0" width=3D"390" height=3D"305" sty=
le=3D"width:4.0625in;height:3.177in" id=3D"x_x__x005f_x0000_i1041" src=3D"c=
id:image001..png@01D5FDE3.587A47F0"><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">Thanks, Linda<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ba=
sil.najem@bell.ca">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">l=
inda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp=
;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hello=
 Linda;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp=
;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">I hav=
en&#8217;t gone through the entire document; however, I have the following =
quick comments</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp=
;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<ol style=3D"margin-top:0in" start=3D"1" type=3D"A">
<li class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"color:#1F497D;margin-top:0in;margin-bott=
om:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;mso-list:l5 level1 lfo1">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA">Regarding the following paragraph:</span><o:p></o:p></=
li></ol>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span l=
ang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;m=
argin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in=
">
1.<span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,se=
rif">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F=
497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;m=
argin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;co=
lor:#1F497D">The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either e=
ncrypted or unecrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is =
NOT encrypted is not always correct). I would
 change the parpagaph to the following (for clarity):</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F=
497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;m=
argin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in=
">
1.<span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,se=
rif">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse <span style=3D"color:red">with or </span>withou=
t encryption, others require encryption, e.g. over untrusted public network=
s.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F=
497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F=
497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<ol style=3D"margin-top:0in" start=3D"2" type=3D"A">
<li class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"color:#1F497D;margin-top:0in;margin-bott=
om:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;mso-list:l3 level1 lfo2">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif">A=
nother thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each Segment (at th=
e SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will map the Application =
Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a
 &#8220;routing domain&#8221;, the BGP update will be exchanged with the me=
mebers of a particular Segment.
</span><o:p></o:p></li></ol>
<p class=3D"xxmsolistparagraph" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span style=3D"f=
ont-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D">&nb=
sp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsolistparagraph" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span style=3D"f=
ont-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D;back=
ground:yellow">As such: Should we include the Segment ID as an attribute in=
 the BGP update messages? Perhaps we need to further
 discuss this in details.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F=
497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F=
497D">Any feedback is welcomed and it&#8217;s highly appreciated.</span><o:=
p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F=
497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F=
497D">Regards;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F=
497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F=
497D">Basil</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span s=
tyle=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span l=
ang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><b>From=
:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">linda.=
dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> January-31-20 5:17 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org">dr=
aft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage =
description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Base=
d Segmentation
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span l=
ang=3D"EN-CA">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">BESS pa=
rticipants:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<=
o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&#8220;=
SDWAN&#8221; networks is characterized by:
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;m=
argin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in=
">
1.<span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,se=
rif">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;m=
argin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in=
">
2.<span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,se=
rif">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Enable direct Internet =
access from remote sites, instead hauling all traffic to Corporate HQ for c=
entralized policy control.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;m=
argin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25in=
">
3.<span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,se=
rif">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Some traffic are routed=
 based on application IDs instead of based on destination IP addresses.
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<=
o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<=
o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><a href=
=3D"https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdat=
atracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&amp;data=3D0=
2%7C01%7Clinda.dunbar%40futurewei.com%7C99acf950b82f4213da7f08d7cf34789d%7C=
0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637205696587614498&amp;sdata=3D0=
MdUmWEie3Fd4y3UCVJ4HBdY0oxiBY4xiTK5%2FiMaAkQ%3D&amp;reserved=3D0">https://d=
atatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/</a>
 describes examples of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Appli=
cation Based Segmentation, &nbsp;assuming that the applications are assigne=
d with unique IP addresses.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">In the =
Figure below, the following BGP Updates can be advertised to ensure that Pa=
yment Application only communicates with the Payment Gateway:<o:p></o:p></p=
>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<=
o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><img bo=
rder=3D"0" width=3D"538" height=3D"218" style=3D"width:5.6041in;height:2.27=
08in" id=3D"x_x__x005f_x0000_i1042" src=3D"cid:image002..png@01D5FDE3.587A4=
7F0"><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<=
o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">BGP UPD=
ATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topology (only propagated to Paymen=
t GW node:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;m=
argin-bottom:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25=
in">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute: </span><o:p></o:=
p></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"color:black;margin-top:0in;margin-bottom=
:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;mso-list:l2 level3 lfo3">
30.1.1.x/24<o:p></o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;m=
argin-bottom:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25=
in">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"color:black">Tunnel Encap Path Attribute</span><o:p><=
/o:p></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"color:black;margin-top:0in;margin-bottom=
:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;mso-list:l0 level3 lfo4">
IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW -&gt;C-PE2<o:p></o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;m=
argin-bottom:0in;margin-left:134.65pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">BGP UPD=
ATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be reached by Purple:<o:p></o:p><=
/p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;m=
argin-bottom:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25=
in">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute:</span><o:p></o:p=
></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-=
bottom:.0001pt;mso-list:l1 level3 lfo5">
<span style=3D"color:black">10.1.x.x</span><o:p></o:p></li><li class=3D"xxm=
sonormal" style=3D"margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;m=
so-list:l1 level3 lfo5">
<span style=3D"color:black">12.4.x.x</span><o:p></o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;m=
argin-bottom:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:.0001pt;text-indent:-.25=
in">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif;color:black">-=
</span><span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quo=
t;,serif;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"color:black">TunnelEncap Path Attribute:</span><o:p><=
/o:p></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"color:black;margin-top:0in;margin-bottom=
:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;mso-list:l4 level3 lfo6">
Any node to C-PE2<o:p></o:p></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<=
o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<=
o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">Your fe=
edback is greatly appreciated.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<=
o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">Thank y=
ou very much.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">&nbsp;<=
o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">Linda D=
unbar<o:p></o:p></p>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center">
</span></div>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><strong=
><i><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-ser=
if;color:blue">External Email:</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue">
 Please use caution when opening links and attachments / </span></em><stron=
g><i><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-se=
rif;color:blue">Courriel externe:</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"fon=
t-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue">
 Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints </span></em><o:p></o:p></=
p>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center">
</span></div>
<p class=3D"xxmsonormal" style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><strong=
><i><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-ser=
if;color:blue">External Email:</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue">
 Please use caution when opening links and attachments / </span></em><stron=
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t-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue">
 Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints </span></em><o:p></o:p></=
p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
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From: Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2020 20:27:34 +0100
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To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
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Subject: Re: [bess] [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-safi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI
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Hi Linda,

I think you are mixing data plane and control plane.

In SDWAN data plane is of no issue as you are interconnecting sites in a
given VPN over mesh of secure tunnels.

You are asking how to keep control plane separate between VPN instances.
This is precisely what RFC4364 does already and RT import/export is used to
indicate the instance which given set of reachability belongs. Why to
reinvent the wheel and do something new just for the heck of it :) ?

To be original you can at best invent a different name to Route target(s)
carried in the SAFI 128 but let's keep the mechanism the same. That would
be my suggestion.

Kind regards,
R.

PS. While this is obvious for some many folks are still confused. RFC4364
does not need to run over MPLS data plane. It can run over IPSec or over
DTLS or over UDP/IP just fine.

On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 6:47 PM Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
wrote:

> IDR experts:
>
>
>
> SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks. A
> SDWAN edge node may need to map client traffic to different SDWAN network
> instances (or segmentations).
>
> It might not be feasible to use the AS number in the BGP message to
> differentiate the SDWAN network instances as multiple SDWAN instances may
> share the same AS number.
>
>
>
> We would like to hear feedback from IDR group on using similar method as
>  Binding MPLS Labels to Address Prefixes [RFC8277] to bind SDWAN Instance
> ID to  prefixes.
>
>
>
> When  MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) is present, MPLS label is carried by NLRI
> [RFC8277] as:
>
>
>
>       0                   1                   2                   3
>
>       0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
>
>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>      |    Length     |                 Label                 |Rsrv |S|
>
>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>      |                          Prefix                               ~
>
>      ~                                                               |
>
>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>
>
>                        Figure 2: NLRI with One Label
>
>
>
> We would like to  propose the SDWAN Instance ID being encoded in the Labe=
l
> field as follows when SDWAN SAFI (=3D74 allocated by IANA) is used,:
>
>
>
>       0                   1                   2                   3
>
>       0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
>
>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>      |    Length     |      SDWAN Instance ID (Label)        |Rsrv |S|
>
>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>      |                          Prefix                               ~
>
>      ~                                                               |
>
>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>
>
>                         NLRI with SDWAN Instance ID.
>
>
>
> Greatly appreciate any comments or other suggestions..
>
>
>
> Thank you,
>
> Linda Dunbar
>
>
>
> *From:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>
> *Sent:* Monday, March 23, 2020 9:14 AM
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org
> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>
>
>
> Hi Linda,
>
>
>
>     It seems that using another SAFI is a possible solution.
>
>
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Huaimo
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> *Sent:* Friday, March 20, 2020 12:54 AM
> *To:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org <idr@ietf.org=
>
> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org <bess@ietf.org>
> *Subject:* RE: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>
>
>
> Huaimo,
>
>
>
> Thank you very much for the suggestion.
>
> Do you mean using the similar approach as VPN Label carried by NLRI Path
> Attribute [RFC8277] for SDWAN Segmentation Identifier?
>
> If yes, the UPDATE message should not use the MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) to
> avoid confusion, right?
>
>
>
> Linda
>
>
>
> *From:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>
> *Sent:* Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:45 PM
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org
> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>
>
>
> Hi Linda,
>
>
>
>     It seems that a label may be used as an "Identifier" to differentiate
> SD-WAN Segmentation.
>
>
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Huaimo
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* Idr <idr-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Linda Dunbar <
> linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> *Sent:* Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM
> *To:* idr@ietf.org <idr@ietf.org>
> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org <bess@ietf.org>
> *Subject:* [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>
>
>
> BGP Experts,
>
>
>
> Do you know if  there is any problem of using  Private AS as  "Identifier=
"
> to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation? Here is the discussion in BESS WG.
> Want to get IDR WG feedbacks for this question.
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
> Linda
>
>
>
> *From:* Linda Dunbar
> *Sent:* Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM
> *To:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>; bess@ietf.org
> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to
> differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>
>
>
> Based on Basil=E2=80=99s comment on needing an identifier to differentiat=
e SDWAN
> instances, I added a section to  draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . Want
> to hear people=E2=80=99s feedback.
>
>
> 3.1    Requirements 3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations
>
> The term =E2=80=9Cnetwork segmentation=E2=80=9D is used extensively in SD=
WAN deployment.
> In general (and in this document), the =E2=80=9CNetwork Segmentation=E2=
=80=9D is referring
> to the process of dividing the network into logical sub-networks using
> isolation techniques on a forwarding device such as a switch, router, or
> firewall. For a homogeneous network, such as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network,
> VRF or VLAN are used to separate network segments.
>
> As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks, i=
t
> is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN network
> instances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do no=
t
> have their own assigned AS numbers, a very easy way is to use Private AS
> numbers, in the range of 64512 to 65535, to differentiate different SDWAN
> segmentations.. When using BGP to control the SDWAN networks, the Private
> AS numbers are carried by the BGP UPDATE messages to their corresponding
> RRs.
>
>
>
> Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description.
>
>
>
> Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used?
>
>
>
> Thank you very much.
>
>
>
> Linda Dunbar
>
>
>
> *From:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>
> *Sent:* Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; bess@ietf.org
> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
> *Subject:* RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage
> description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application
> Based Segmentation
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi Linda;
>
>
>
> The SD-WAN Segment is part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there
> could be more than one Segment over a single underlay depending on the
> design and the business requirements.
>
>
>
> Each Segment represents a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I
> suggested that we may need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update
> messages in order to identify and build the routing the table for each
> Segment (based on the Segment ID).
>
>
>
> Hope this helps.
>
>
>
> Regards;
>
>
>
> Basil
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> *Sent:* February-03-20 10:40 AM
> *To:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>; bess@ietf.org
> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
> *Subject:* [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage
> description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application
> Based Segmentation
>
>
>
> Basil,
>
>
>
> Thank you very much for the comments.
>
> Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision.
>
>
>
> As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be
> included in the BGP UPDATE), does the =E2=80=9CSegment=E2=80=9D mean the =
different
> Underlay?
>
> In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to
> Public Internet.
>
> Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN =E2=80=9Csegments=E2=80=9D?
>
> If not, can you elaborate more?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Thanks, Linda
>
>
>
> *From:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>
> *Sent:* Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; bess@ietf.org
> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
> *Subject:* RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage
> description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application
> Based Segmentation
>
>
>
>
>
> Hello Linda;
>
>
>
> I haven=E2=80=99t gone through the entire document; however, I have the f=
ollowing
> quick comments
>
>
>
>    1. Regarding the following paragraph:
>
>
>
> 1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths
> over different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel
> overlay paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private
> networks over which traffic can traverse without encryption, others requi=
re
> encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
>
>
>
> The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either encrypted or
> unecrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is NOT
> encrypted is not always correct). I would change the parpagaph to the
> following (for clarity):
>
>
>
> 1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths
> over different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel
> overlay paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private
> networks over which traffic can traverse with or without encryption,
> others require encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
>
>
>
>
>
>    1. Another thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each
>    Segment (at the SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will m=
ap
>    the Application Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a =E2=80=9Cr=
outing
>    domain=E2=80=9D, the BGP update will be exchanged with the memebers of=
 a particular
>    Segment.
>
>
>
> As such: Should we include the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP
> update messages? Perhaps we need to further discuss this in details.
>
>
>
> Any feedback is welcomed and it=E2=80=99s highly appreciated.
>
>
>
> Regards;
>
>
>
> Basil
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> *Sent:* January-31-20 5:17 PM
> *To:* bess@ietf.org
> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
> *Subject:* [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage
> description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application
> Based Segmentation
>
>
>
> BESS participants:
>
>
>
> =E2=80=9CSDWAN=E2=80=9D networks is characterized by:
>
> 1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths
> over different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel
> overlay paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private
> networks over which traffic can traverse without encryption, others requi=
re
> encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
>
> 2.       Enable direct Internet access from remote sites, instead hauling
> all traffic to Corporate HQ for centralized policy control.
>
> 3.       Some traffic are routed based on application IDs instead of
> based on destination IP addresses.
>
>
>
>
>
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/
> <https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdata=
tracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&data=3D02%7C0=
1%7Clinda.dunbar%40futurewei.com%7C99acf950b82f4213da7f08d7cf34789d%7C0fee8=
ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637205696587614498&sdata=3D0MdUmWEie3=
Fd4y3UCVJ4HBdY0oxiBY4xiTK5%2FiMaAkQ%3D&reserved=3D0>
> describes examples of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN
> Application Based Segmentation,  assuming that the applications are
> assigned with unique IP addresses.
>
> In the Figure below, the following BGP Updates can be advertised to ensur=
e
> that Payment Application only communicates with the Payment Gateway:
>
>
>
>
>
> BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topology (only propagated
> to Payment GW node:
>
> -        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:
>
>    - 30.1.1.x/24
>
> -        Tunnel Encap Path Attribute
>
>    - IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW ->C-PE2
>
>
>
> BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be reached by Purple:
>
> -        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:
>
>    - 10.1.x.x
>          - 12.4.x.x
>
> -        TunnelEncap Path Attribute:
>
>    - Any node to C-PE2
>
>
>
>
>
> Your feedback is greatly appreciated.
>
>
>
> Thank you very much.
>
>
>
> Linda Dunbar
> ------------------------------
>
> *External Email:** Please use caution when opening links and attachments
> / **Courriel externe:** Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints =
*
> ------------------------------
>
> *External Email:** Please use caution when opening links and attachments
> / **Courriel externe:** Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints =
*
> _______________________________________________
> Idr mailing list
> Idr@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/idr
>

--0000000000003b549d05a18aa126
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr">Hi Linda,<div><br></div><div>I think you are mixing data p=
lane and control plane.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>In SDWAN=C2=A0data p=
lane is of no issue as you are interconnecting sites in a given VPN over me=
sh of secure tunnels.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>You are asking how to =
keep control plane separate=C2=A0between VPN instances. This is precisely w=
hat RFC4364 does already and RT import/export is used to indicate the insta=
nce which given set of reachability belongs. Why to reinvent the wheel and =
do something new just for the heck of it :) ?=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><di=
v>To be original you can at best invent=C2=A0a different name to Route targ=
et(s) carried in the SAFI 128 but let&#39;s keep the mechanism=C2=A0the sam=
e. That would be my suggestion.</div><div><br></div><div>Kind regards,</div=
><div>R.</div><div><br></div><div>PS. While this is obvious for some many f=
olks are still confused. RFC4364 does not need to run over MPLS data plane.=
 It can run over IPSec or over DTLS or over UDP/IP just fine.=C2=A0</div></=
div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On=
 Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 6:47 PM Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunb=
ar@futurewei.com">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><block=
quote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1=
px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-US">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">IDR experts:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple ty=
pes of networks. A SDWAN edge node may need to map client traffic to differ=
ent SDWAN network instances (or segmentations).<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">It might not be feasible to use the AS number in the=
 BGP message to differentiate the SDWAN network instances as multiple SDWAN=
 instances may share the same AS number.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We would like to hear feedback from IDR group on usi=
ng similar method as =C2=A0Binding MPLS Labels to Address Prefixes [RFC8277=
] to bind SDWAN Instance ID to =C2=A0prefixes.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">When =C2=A0MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) is present, MPLS l=
abel is carried by NLRI [RFC8277] as:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div style=3D"border:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:8pt;background:rgb(=
255,253,245)">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 1=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 2=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 3<u><=
/u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 =
9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Length=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Label=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |Rsrv |S|<u></u><=
u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Prefix=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
~<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ~=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all;border:none;padding:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Figure 2: N=
LRI with One Label<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We would like to =C2=A0propose the SDWAN Instance ID=
 being encoded in the Label field as follows when SDWAN SAFI (=3D74 allocat=
ed by IANA) is used,:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 1=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 2=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 3<u></u><u>=
</u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 =
2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Length=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 SDWAN Instance ID (Label)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |Rsrv |S|<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Prefix=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ~<u></u>=
<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ~=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0|<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0NLRI with SDWAN Instance ID. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Greatly appreciate any comments or other suggestions=
.. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you,<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda Dunbar<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaim=
o.chen@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt; <=
br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, March 23, 2020 9:14 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;; <a href=3D"mailto:idr@=
ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Hi Linda,=
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black"><u></u>=
=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 It seems that using another SAFI is a possible solution.<u></u><u></=
u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black"><u></u>=
=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Best Rega=
rds,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Huaimo<u>=
</u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center">
<hr size=3D"2" width=3D"98%" align=3D"center">
</div>
<div id=3D"gmail-m_4680921541555540591divRplyFwdMsg">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"color:black">From:</span></b><span=
 style=3D"color:black"> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@fut=
urewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, March 20, 2020 12:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a> &lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</=
a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?</span>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p>Huaimo, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you very much for the suggestion. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Do you mean using the similar approach as VPN Label carried by NLRI Path=
 Attribute [RFC8277] for SDWAN Segmentation Identifier?<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>If yes, the UPDATE message should not use the MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) to =
avoid confusion, right?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com=
" target=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:45 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Hi Linda,</span><u></u><u></u=
></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0 =C2=A0 It seems that a=
 label may be used as an=C2=A0&quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WA=
N Segmentation.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Best Regards,</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Huaimo</span><u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center">
<hr size=3D"2" width=3D"98%" align=3D"center">
</div>
<div id=3D"gmail-m_4680921541555540591x_divRplyFwdMsg">
<p><b><span style=3D"color:black">From:</span></b><span style=3D"color:blac=
k"> Idr &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:idr-bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr-b=
ounces@ietf.org</a>&gt; on behalf of Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:lin=
da.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&g=
t;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</=
a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a>&g=
t;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</=
a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot=
;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bes=
s-bgp-sdwan-usage?</span>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p>BGP Experts, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Do you know if =C2=A0there is any problem of using=C2=A0 Private AS as=
=C2=A0 &quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation? Here is=
 the discussion in BESS WG. Want to get IDR WG feedbacks for this question.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" target=
=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot;Identifie=
r&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwa=
n-usage?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Based on Basil=E2=80=99s comment on needing an identifier to differentia=
te SDWAN instances, I added a section to =C2=A0draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-=
usage . Want to hear people=E2=80=99s feedback.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<h2 style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:45pt;line-heig=
ht:12pt;break-after:avoid">
<a name=3D"m_4680921541555540591_x_x__Toc31377653"><span style=3D"font-size=
:12pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;font-weight:normal">3.1</span></a=
><span></span><span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roma=
n&quot;,serif;font-weight:normal">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;fo=
nt-weight:normal">Requirements</span><u></u><u></u></h2>
<h3 style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:0.75in;line-he=
ight:12pt;break-after:avoid">
<span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;font-weig=
ht:normal">3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations</span><u></u><u></u=
></h3>
<p>The term =E2=80=9Cnetwork segmentation=E2=80=9D is used extensively in S=
DWAN deployment. In general (and in this document), the =E2=80=9CNetwork Se=
gmentation=E2=80=9D is referring to the process of dividing the network int=
o logical sub-networks using isolation techniques
 on a forwarding device such as a switch, router, or firewall. For a homoge=
neous network, such as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, VRF or VLAN are used to=
 separate network segments.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks, =
it is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN network=
 instances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do not=
 have their
 own assigned AS numbers, a very easy way is to use Private AS numbers, in =
the range of 64512 to 65535, to differentiate different SDWAN segmentations=
.. When using BGP to control the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numbers are=
 carried by the BGP UPDATE messages
 to their corresponding RRs.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description. <u></u>
<u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used? <u></u>
<u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you very much. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Linda Dunbar<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" tar=
get=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Hi Linda;</span><u><=
/u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">The SD-WAN Segment i=
s part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there could be more than one S=
egment over a single underlay depending on the design and the business requ=
irements.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Each Segment represe=
nts a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I suggested that we may =
need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update messages in order to ident=
ify and build the routing
 the table for each Segment (based on the Segment ID).</span><u></u><u></u>=
</p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Hope this helps.</sp=
an><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Regards;</span><u></=
u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Basil</span><u></u><=
u></u></p>
<p><span style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.c=
om" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> February-03-20 10:40 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" target=
=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-us=
age description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application =
Based Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Basil, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you very much for the comments. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be =
included in the BGP UPDATE), does the =E2=80=9CSegment=E2=80=9D mean the di=
fferent Underlay?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to P=
ublic Internet.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN =E2=80=9Csegments=E2=80=9D? <u></u><u></u></=
p>
<p>If not, can you elaborate more? <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p><img border=3D"0" width=3D"390" height=3D"305" style=3D"width: 4.0625in;=
 height: 3.177in;" id=3D"gmail-m_4680921541555540591x_x__x005f_x0000_i1041"=
><u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thanks, Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" tar=
get=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Hello Linda;</span><=
u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">I haven=E2=80=99t go=
ne through the entire document; however, I have the following quick comment=
s</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<ol style=3D"margin-top:0in" start=3D"1" type=3D"A">
<li style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125);margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA">Regarding the following paragraph:</span><u></u><u></u=
></li></ol>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rg=
b(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
1.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.5in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,=
125)">The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either encrypte=
d or unecrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is NOT enc=
rypted is not always correct). I would
 change the parpagaph to the following (for clarity):</span><u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
1.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse <span style=3D"color:red">with or </span>withou=
t encryption, others require encryption, e.g. over untrusted public network=
s.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<ol style=3D"margin-top:0in" start=3D"2" type=3D"A">
<li style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125);margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif">Another thing t=
hat we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each Segment (at the SD-WAN Edge)=
 MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will map the Application Flow to the Se=
gment. Since the Segment is a
 =E2=80=9Crouting domain=E2=80=9D, the BGP update will be exchanged with th=
e memebers of a particular Segment.
</span><u></u><u></u></li></ol>
<p style=3D"margin-left:0.5in"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:Ar=
ial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-left:0.5in"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:Ar=
ial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);background:yellow">As such: Should we i=
nclude the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP update messages? Perhaps w=
e need to further
 discuss this in details.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Any feedback is welcomed and it=
=E2=80=99s highly appreciated.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Regards;</span><u></u><u></u></p=
>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Basil</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=
=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rg=
b(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futur=
ewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> January-31-20 5:17 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage =
description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Base=
d Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span lang=3D"EN-CA">=C2=A0</span><u><=
/u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">BESS participants:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=E2=80=9CSDWAN=E2=80=9D networks is ch=
aracterized by:
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
1.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
2.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Enable direct Internet =
access from remote sites, instead hauling all traffic to Corporate HQ for c=
entralized policy control.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
3.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Some traffic are routed=
 based on application IDs instead of based on destination IP addresses.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><a href=3D"https://nam11.safelinks.pro=
tection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdatatracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft=
-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Clinda.dunbar%40futurew=
ei.com%7C99acf950b82f4213da7f08d7cf34789d%7C0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fed=
c%7C1%7C0%7C637205696587614498&amp;sdata=3D0MdUmWEie3Fd4y3UCVJ4HBdY0oxiBY4x=
iTK5%2FiMaAkQ%3D&amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ie=
tf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/</a>
 describes examples of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Appli=
cation Based Segmentation, =C2=A0assuming that the applications are assigne=
d with unique IP addresses.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">In the Figure below, the following BGP=
 Updates can be advertised to ensure that Payment Application only communic=
ates with the Payment Gateway:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><img border=3D"0" width=3D"538" height=
=3D"218" style=3D"width: 5.6041in; height: 2.2708in;" id=3D"gmail-m_4680921=
541555540591x_x__x005f_x0000_i1042"><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the=
 RED P2P topology (only propagated to Payment GW node:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute: </span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li style=3D"color:black;margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
30.1.1.x/24<u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">Tunnel Encap Path Attribute</span><u></u=
><u></u></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li style=3D"color:black;margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW -&gt;C-PE2<u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:134.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the=
 routes to be reached by Purple:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute:</span><u></u><u>=
</u></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li style=3D"margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"color:black">10.1.x.x</span><u></u><u></u></li><li style=3D"=
margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"color:black">12.4.x.x</span><u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif;color:black">-=
</span><span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;=
,serif;color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">TunnelEncap Path Attribute:</span><u></u=
><u></u></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li style=3D"color:black;margin-top:0in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
Any node to C-PE2<u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">Your feedback is greatly appreciated.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">Thank you very much.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">Linda Dunbar<u></u><u></u></p>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center">
</span></div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><strong><i><span style=3D"font-size:9p=
t;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:blue">External Email:</span></i></st=
rong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:=
blue">
 Please use caution when opening links and attachments / </span></em><stron=
g><i><span style=3D"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:blue=
">Courriel externe:</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9pt;fon=
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From: "Ali Sajassi (sajassi)" <sajassi@cisco.com>
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From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
To: Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
CC: Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>, "idr@ietf.org" <idr@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-safi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI
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Subject: Re: [bess] [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-safi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI
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From: Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2020 09:32:09 +0100
Message-ID: <CAOj+MMGm3fB_XVkVp11qc2mRop-EQEyW50U7iSmHX=nEviYmOQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
Cc: Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>, "idr@ietf.org" <idr@ietf.org>,  "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [bess] [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-safi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI
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Hi Linda,

Nope you do not need VRFs. RT construct works at the control plane level.
VRF may be useful for traffic separation purposes on multitenant CPEs or if
you would like to relax requirements for unique IP across SDWAN sites - but
not a must otherwise.

My main point was  that BGP SAFI 128 gives you for free transport for
multiple routing contexts so why not leverage it as is?

Moreover you may suddenly also discover that RTC (RFC4684) is your
SDWAN friend too.

Many thx,
R.




On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 5:15 AM Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
wrote:

> Robert,
>
>
>
> Thank you very much for the feedback.
>
>
>
> If using your suggested Route Target approach to represent the SDWAN
> Instance ID, does it mean that a SDWAN Edge has to use the same approach =
to
> configure the VRF for SDWAN instances?
>
> If the edge node supports both traditional VPN and SDWAN, will it cause
> confusion for RT to represent both?
>
>
>
> RT is encoded in the Extended_Communities Path Attribute, SAFI 128 is
> encoded in the MP_REACH_NLRI Path Attribute.
>
>
>
> What do you mean by saying =E2=80=9Cdifferent name to Route target(s) car=
ried in
> the SAFI 128=E2=80=9D?
>
> Do you mean having a different name (say SDWAN_Target) in
> Extended_Communities Path Attribute, and have MP_REACH_NLRI Path Attribut=
e
> including the SAFI 128?
>
>
>
> SDWAN Instance ID is for the control Plane, not to be carried by the data
> packets. SAFI 128 for VPN has the Label encoded in the NLRI field that is
> to be carried by the data packets. But SDWAN Instance ID is not carried b=
y
> the Data Packets. Is it correct?
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
> Linda
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
> *Sent:* Monday, March 23, 2020 2:28 PM
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> *Cc:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org; bess@ietf.or=
g
> *Subject:* Re: [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-safi
> using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI
>
>
>
> Hi Linda,
>
>
>
> I think you are mixing data plane and control plane.
>
>
>
> In SDWAN data plane is of no issue as you are interconnecting sites in a
> given VPN over mesh of secure tunnels.
>
>
>
> You are asking how to keep control plane separate between VPN instances.
> This is precisely what RFC4364 does already and RT import/export is used =
to
> indicate the instance which given set of reachability belongs. Why to
> reinvent the wheel and do something new just for the heck of it :) ?
>
>
>
> To be original you can at best invent a different name to Route target(s)
> carried in the SAFI 128 but let's keep the mechanism the same. That would
> be my suggestion.
>
>
>
> Kind regards,
>
> R.
>
>
>
> PS. While this is obvious for some many folks are still confused. RFC4364
> does not need to run over MPLS data plane. It can run over IPSec or over
> DTLS or over UDP/IP just fine.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 6:47 PM Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> wrote:
>
> IDR experts:
>
>
>
> SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks. A
> SDWAN edge node may need to map client traffic to different SDWAN network
> instances (or segmentations).
>
> It might not be feasible to use the AS number in the BGP message to
> differentiate the SDWAN network instances as multiple SDWAN instances may
> share the same AS number.
>
>
>
> We would like to hear feedback from IDR group on using similar method as
>  Binding MPLS Labels to Address Prefixes [RFC8277] to bind SDWAN Instance
> ID to  prefixes.
>
>
>
> When  MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) is present, MPLS label is carried by NLRI
> [RFC8277] as:
>
>
>
>       0                   1                   2                   3
>
>       0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
>
>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>      |    Length     |                 Label                 |Rsrv |S|
>
>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>      |                          Prefix                               ~
>
>      ~                                                               |
>
>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>
>
>                        Figure 2: NLRI with One Label
>
>
>
> We would like to  propose the SDWAN Instance ID being encoded in the Labe=
l
> field as follows when SDWAN SAFI (=3D74 allocated by IANA) is used,:
>
>
>
>       0                   1                   2                   3
>
>       0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
>
>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>      |    Length     |      SDWAN Instance ID (Label)        |Rsrv |S|
>
>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>      |                          Prefix                               ~
>
>      ~                                                               |
>
>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>
>
>                         NLRI with SDWAN Instance ID.
>
>
>
> Greatly appreciate any comments or other suggestions..
>
>
>
> Thank you,
>
> Linda Dunbar
>
>
>
> *From:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>
> *Sent:* Monday, March 23, 2020 9:14 AM
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org
> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>
>
>
> Hi Linda,
>
>
>
>     It seems that using another SAFI is a possible solution.
>
>
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Huaimo
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> *Sent:* Friday, March 20, 2020 12:54 AM
> *To:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org <idr@ietf.org=
>
> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org <bess@ietf.org>
> *Subject:* RE: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>
>
>
> Huaimo,
>
>
>
> Thank you very much for the suggestion.
>
> Do you mean using the similar approach as VPN Label carried by NLRI Path
> Attribute [RFC8277] for SDWAN Segmentation Identifier?
>
> If yes, the UPDATE message should not use the MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) to
> avoid confusion, right?
>
>
>
> Linda
>
>
>
> *From:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>
> *Sent:* Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:45 PM
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org
> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>
>
>
> Hi Linda,
>
>
>
>     It seems that a label may be used as an "Identifier" to differentiate
> SD-WAN Segmentation.
>
>
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Huaimo
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* Idr <idr-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Linda Dunbar <
> linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> *Sent:* Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM
> *To:* idr@ietf.org <idr@ietf.org>
> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org <bess@ietf.org>
> *Subject:* [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>
>
>
> BGP Experts,
>
>
>
> Do you know if  there is any problem of using  Private AS as  "Identifier=
"
> to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation? Here is the discussion in BESS WG.
> Want to get IDR WG feedbacks for this question.
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
> Linda
>
>
>
> *From:* Linda Dunbar
> *Sent:* Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM
> *To:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>; bess@ietf.org
> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to
> differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>
>
>
> Based on Basil=E2=80=99s comment on needing an identifier to differentiat=
e SDWAN
> instances, I added a section to  draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . Want
> to hear people=E2=80=99s feedback.
>
>
> 3.1    Requirements 3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations
>
> The term =E2=80=9Cnetwork segmentation=E2=80=9D is used extensively in SD=
WAN deployment.
> In general (and in this document), the =E2=80=9CNetwork Segmentation=E2=
=80=9D is referring
> to the process of dividing the network into logical sub-networks using
> isolation techniques on a forwarding device such as a switch, router, or
> firewall. For a homogeneous network, such as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network,
> VRF or VLAN are used to separate network segments.
>
> As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks, i=
t
> is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN network
> instances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do no=
t
> have their own assigned AS numbers, a very easy way is to use Private AS
> numbers, in the range of 64512 to 65535, to differentiate different SDWAN
> segmentations.. When using BGP to control the SDWAN networks, the Private
> AS numbers are carried by the BGP UPDATE messages to their corresponding
> RRs.
>
>
>
> Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description.
>
>
>
> Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used?
>
>
>
> Thank you very much.
>
>
>
> Linda Dunbar
>
>
>
> *From:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>
> *Sent:* Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; bess@ietf.org
> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
> *Subject:* RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage
> description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application
> Based Segmentation
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi Linda;
>
>
>
> The SD-WAN Segment is part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there
> could be more than one Segment over a single underlay depending on the
> design and the business requirements.
>
>
>
> Each Segment represents a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I
> suggested that we may need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update
> messages in order to identify and build the routing the table for each
> Segment (based on the Segment ID).
>
>
>
> Hope this helps.
>
>
>
> Regards;
>
>
>
> Basil
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> *Sent:* February-03-20 10:40 AM
> *To:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>; bess@ietf.org
> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
> *Subject:* [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage
> description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application
> Based Segmentation
>
>
>
> Basil,
>
>
>
> Thank you very much for the comments.
>
> Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision.
>
>
>
> As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be
> included in the BGP UPDATE), does the =E2=80=9CSegment=E2=80=9D mean the =
different
> Underlay?
>
> In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to
> Public Internet.
>
> Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN =E2=80=9Csegments=E2=80=9D?
>
> If not, can you elaborate more?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Thanks, Linda
>
>
>
> *From:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>
> *Sent:* Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; bess@ietf.org
> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
> *Subject:* RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage
> description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application
> Based Segmentation
>
>
>
>
>
> Hello Linda;
>
>
>
> I haven=E2=80=99t gone through the entire document; however, I have the f=
ollowing
> quick comments
>
>
>
>    1. Regarding the following paragraph:
>
>
>
> 1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths
> over different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel
> overlay paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private
> networks over which traffic can traverse without encryption, others requi=
re
> encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
>
>
>
> The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either encrypted or
> unecrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is NOT
> encrypted is not always correct). I would change the parpagaph to the
> following (for clarity):
>
>
>
> 1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths
> over different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel
> overlay paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private
> networks over which traffic can traverse with or without encryption,
> others require encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
>
>
>
>
>
>    1. Another thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each
>    Segment (at the SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will m=
ap
>    the Application Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a =E2=80=9Cr=
outing
>    domain=E2=80=9D, the BGP update will be exchanged with the memebers of=
 a particular
>    Segment.
>
>
>
> As such: Should we include the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP
> update messages? Perhaps we need to further discuss this in details.
>
>
>
> Any feedback is welcomed and it=E2=80=99s highly appreciated.
>
>
>
> Regards;
>
>
>
> Basil
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> *Sent:* January-31-20 5:17 PM
> *To:* bess@ietf.org
> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
> *Subject:* [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage
> description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application
> Based Segmentation
>
>
>
> BESS participants:
>
>
>
> =E2=80=9CSDWAN=E2=80=9D networks is characterized by:
>
> 1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths
> over different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel
> overlay paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private
> networks over which traffic can traverse without encryption, others requi=
re
> encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
>
> 2.       Enable direct Internet access from remote sites, instead hauling
> all traffic to Corporate HQ for centralized policy control.
>
> 3.       Some traffic are routed based on application IDs instead of
> based on destination IP addresses.
>
>
>
>
>
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/
> <https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdata=
tracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&data=3D02%7C0=
1%7Clinda.dunbar%40futurewei.com%7C6fce142531214362ed4c08d7cf6044aa%7C0fee8=
ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637205884697250108&sdata=3DSYcw4ORJca=
yiaqYuWRTUZi5zmv25X3b%2FBVm5TW0yhgg%3D&reserved=3D0>
> describes examples of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN
> Application Based Segmentation,  assuming that the applications are
> assigned with unique IP addresses.
>
> In the Figure below, the following BGP Updates can be advertised to ensur=
e
> that Payment Application only communicates with the Payment Gateway:
>
>
>
>
>
> BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topology (only propagated
> to Payment GW node:
>
> -        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:
>
>    - 30.1.1.x/24
>
> -        Tunnel Encap Path Attribute
>
>    - IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW ->C-PE2
>
>
>
> BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be reached by Purple:
>
> -        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:
>
>    - 10.1.x.x
>          - 12.4.x.x
>
> -        TunnelEncap Path Attribute:
>
>    - Any node to C-PE2
>
>
>
>
>
> Your feedback is greatly appreciated.
>
>
>
> Thank you very much.
>
>
>
> Linda Dunbar
> ------------------------------
>
> *External Email:** Please use caution when opening links and attachments
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--00000000000012a16f05a1959785
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr">Hi Linda,<div><br></div><div>Nope you do not need VRFs. RT=
 construct works at the control plane level. VRF may be useful for traffic =
separation purposes on multitenant=C2=A0CPEs or if you would like to relax =
requirements for unique IP across SDWAN sites - but not a must otherwise.=
=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>My main point was=C2=A0 that BGP SAFI 128 g=
ives you for free transport for multiple routing contexts so why not levera=
ge=C2=A0it as is?=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Moreover you may suddenly=
=C2=A0also discover that RTC (RFC4684) is your SDWAN=C2=A0friend too.=C2=A0=
</div><div><br></div><div>Many=C2=A0thx,<br>R.</div><div><br></div><div><br=
></div><div><br></div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr"=
 class=3D"gmail_attr">On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 5:15 AM Linda Dunbar &lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt=
; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px=
 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-US">
<div class=3D"gmail-m_4952540666890611967WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Robert, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you very much for the feedback. <u></u><u></u>=
</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">If using your suggested Route Target approach to rep=
resent the SDWAN Instance ID, does it mean that a SDWAN Edge has to use the=
 same approach to configure the VRF for SDWAN instances?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">If the edge node supports both traditional VPN and S=
DWAN, will it cause confusion for RT to represent both?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">RT is encoded in the Extended_Communities Path Attri=
bute, SAFI 128 is encoded in the MP_REACH_NLRI Path Attribute.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">What do you mean by saying =E2=80=9Cdifferent name t=
o Route target(s) carried in the SAFI 128=E2=80=9D? =C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Do you mean having a different name (say SDWAN_Targe=
t) in Extended_Communities Path Attribute, and have MP_REACH_NLRI Path Attr=
ibute including the SAFI 128?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">SDWAN Instance ID is for the control Plane, not to b=
e carried by the data packets. SAFI 128 for VPN has the Label encoded in th=
e NLRI field that is to be carried by the data packets. But SDWAN Instance =
ID is not carried by the Data Packets.
 Is it correct? <u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rob=
ert@raszuk.net" target=3D"_blank">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt; <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, March 23, 2020 2:28 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;; <a href=3D"mailto:idr@iet=
f.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org"=
 target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-s=
afi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI<u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Hi Linda,<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I think you are mixing data plane and control plane.=
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">In SDWAN=C2=A0data plane is of no issue as you are i=
nterconnecting sites in a given VPN over mesh of secure tunnels.=C2=A0<u></=
u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">You are asking how to keep control plane separate=C2=
=A0between VPN instances. This is precisely what RFC4364 does already and R=
T import/export is used to indicate the instance which given set of reachab=
ility belongs. Why to reinvent the wheel
 and do something new just for the heck of it :) ?=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">To be original you can at best invent=C2=A0a differe=
nt name to Route target(s) carried in the SAFI 128 but let&#39;s keep the m=
echanism=C2=A0the same. That would be my suggestion.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Kind regards,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">R.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">PS. While this is obvious for some many folks are st=
ill confused. RFC4364 does not need to run over MPLS data plane. It can run=
 over IPSec or over DTLS or over UDP/IP just fine.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 6:47 PM Linda Dunbar &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@f=
uturewei.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;b=
order-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-left:4=
.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">IDR experts:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple ty=
pes of networks. A SDWAN edge node may need to map client traffic to differ=
ent SDWAN network instances (or segmentations).<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">It might not be feasible to use the AS number in the=
 BGP message to differentiate the SDWAN network instances as multiple SDWAN=
 instances may share the same AS number.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We would like to hear feedback from IDR group on usi=
ng similar method as =C2=A0Binding MPLS Labels to Address Prefixes [RFC8277=
] to bind SDWAN Instance ID to =C2=A0prefixes.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">When =C2=A0MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) is present, MPLS l=
abel is carried by NLRI [RFC8277] as:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div style=3D"border:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:8pt">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 1=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 2=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 3</sp=
an><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 =
9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Length=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Label=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |Rsrv |S|</span><=
u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Prefix=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
~</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ~=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Figure 2: N=
LRI with One Label</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We would like to =C2=A0propose the SDWAN Instance ID=
 being encoded in the Label field as follows when SDWAN SAFI (=3D74 allocat=
ed by IANA) is used,:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 1=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 2=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 3</span><u>=
</u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 =
2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Length=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 SDWAN Instance ID (Label)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |Rsrv |S|</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Prefix=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ~</span>=
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ~=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0|</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0NLRI with SDWAN Instance ID.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Greatly appreciate any comments or other suggestions=
..
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you,<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda Dunbar<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaim=
o.chen@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, March 23, 2020 9:14 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Hi Linda,=
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0</s=
pan><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 It seems that using another SAFI is a possible solution.</span><u></=
u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0</s=
pan><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Best Rega=
rds,</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Huaimo</s=
pan><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center">
<hr size=3D"2" width=3D"98%" align=3D"center">
</div>
<div id=3D"gmail-m_4952540666890611967gmail-m_4680921541555540591divRplyFwd=
Msg">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"color:black">From:</span></b><span=
 style=3D"color:black"> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@fut=
urewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, March 20, 2020 12:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a> &lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</=
a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?</span>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p>Huaimo, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you very much for the suggestion. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Do you mean using the similar approach as VPN Label carried by NLRI Path=
 Attribute [RFC8277] for SDWAN Segmentation Identifier?<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>If yes, the UPDATE message should not use the MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) to =
avoid confusion, right?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com=
" target=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:45 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Hi Linda,</span><u></u><u></u=
></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0 =C2=A0 It seems that a=
 label may be used as an=C2=A0&quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WA=
N Segmentation.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Best Regards,</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Huaimo</span><u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center">
<hr size=3D"2" width=3D"98%" align=3D"center">
</div>
<div id=3D"gmail-m_4952540666890611967gmail-m_4680921541555540591x_divRplyF=
wdMsg">
<p><b><span style=3D"color:black">From:</span></b><span style=3D"color:blac=
k"> Idr &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:idr-bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr-b=
ounces@ietf.org</a>&gt; on behalf of Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:lin=
da.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&g=
t;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</=
a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a>&g=
t;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</=
a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot=
;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bes=
s-bgp-sdwan-usage?</span>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p>BGP Experts, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Do you know if =C2=A0there is any problem of using=C2=A0 Private AS as=
=C2=A0 &quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation? Here is=
 the discussion in BESS WG. Want to get IDR WG feedbacks for this question.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" target=
=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot;Identifie=
r&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwa=
n-usage?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Based on Basil=E2=80=99s comment on needing an identifier to differentia=
te SDWAN instances, I added a section to =C2=A0draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-=
usage . Want to hear people=E2=80=99s feedback.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<h2 style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:45pt;line-heig=
ht:12pt;break-after:avoid">
<a name=3D"m_4952540666890611967_m_4680921541555540591_x_x__Toc31377653"><s=
pan style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;font-weight=
:normal">3.1</span></a><span></span><span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-famil=
y:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif;font-weight:normal">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;fo=
nt-weight:normal">Requirements</span><u></u><u></u></h2>
<h3 style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:0.75in;line-he=
ight:12pt;break-after:avoid">
<span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;font-weig=
ht:normal">3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations</span><u></u><u></u=
></h3>
<p>The term =E2=80=9Cnetwork segmentation=E2=80=9D is used extensively in S=
DWAN deployment. In general (and in this document), the =E2=80=9CNetwork Se=
gmentation=E2=80=9D is referring to the process of dividing the network int=
o logical sub-networks using isolation techniques on a forwarding
 device such as a switch, router, or firewall. For a homogeneous network, s=
uch as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, VRF or VLAN are used to separate networ=
k segments.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks, =
it is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN network=
 instances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do not=
 have their own assigned AS numbers,
 a very easy way is to use Private AS numbers, in the range of 64512 to 655=
35, to differentiate different SDWAN segmentations.. When using BGP to cont=
rol the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numbers are carried by the BGP UPDAT=
E messages to their corresponding
 RRs.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used? <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you very much. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Linda Dunbar<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" tar=
get=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Hi Linda;</span><u><=
/u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">The SD-WAN Segment i=
s part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there could be more than one S=
egment over a single underlay depending on the design and the business requ=
irements.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Each Segment represe=
nts a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I suggested that we may =
need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update messages in order to ident=
ify and build the routing the table for each
 Segment (based on the Segment ID).</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Hope this helps.</sp=
an><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Regards;</span><u></=
u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Basil</span><u></u><=
u></u></p>
<p><span style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.c=
om" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> February-03-20 10:40 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" target=
=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-us=
age description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application =
Based Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Basil, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you very much for the comments. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision.=
 <u></u>
<u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be =
included in the BGP UPDATE), does the =E2=80=9CSegment=E2=80=9D mean the di=
fferent Underlay?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to P=
ublic Internet.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN =E2=80=9Csegments=E2=80=9D? <u></u><u></u></=
p>
<p>If not, can you elaborate more? <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p><u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thanks, Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" tar=
get=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Hello Linda;</span><=
u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">I haven=E2=80=99t go=
ne through the entire document; however, I have the following quick comment=
s</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<ol style=3D"margin-top:0in" start=3D"1" type=3D"A">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)"><span lang=3D"EN-CA"=
>Regarding the following paragraph:</span><u></u><u></u></li></ol>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rg=
b(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
1.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.5in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,=
125)">The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either encrypte=
d or unecrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is NOT enc=
rypted is not always correct). I would
 change the parpagaph to the following (for clarity):</span><u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
1.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse <span style=3D"color:red">with or </span>withou=
t encryption, others require encryption, e.g. over untrusted public network=
s.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<ol style=3D"margin-top:0in" start=3D"2" type=3D"A">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)"><span style=3D"font-=
size:12pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif">Another thing that we need to discu=
ss is the Segment ID; each Segment (at the SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. Th=
e SD-WAN Policy will
 map the Application Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a =E2=80=9Cr=
outing domain=E2=80=9D, the BGP update will be exchanged with the memebers =
of a particular Segment.
</span><u></u><u></u></li></ol>
<p style=3D"margin-left:0.5in"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:Ar=
ial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-left:0.5in"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:Ar=
ial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);background:yellow">As such: Should we i=
nclude the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP update messages? Perhaps w=
e need to further discuss this in details.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Any feedback is welcomed and it=
=E2=80=99s highly appreciated.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Regards;</span><u></u><u></u></p=
>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Basil</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=
=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rg=
b(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futur=
ewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> January-31-20 5:17 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage =
description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Base=
d Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span lang=3D"EN-CA">=C2=A0</span><u><=
/u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">BESS participants:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=E2=80=9CSDWAN=E2=80=9D networks is ch=
aracterized by:
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
1.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
2.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Enable direct Internet =
access from remote sites, instead hauling all traffic to Corporate HQ for c=
entralized policy control.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
3.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Some traffic are routed=
 based on application IDs instead of based on destination IP addresses.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><a href=3D"https://nam11.safelinks.pro=
tection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdatatracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft=
-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Clinda.dunbar%40futurew=
ei.com%7C6fce142531214362ed4c08d7cf6044aa%7C0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fed=
c%7C1%7C0%7C637205884697250108&amp;sdata=3DSYcw4ORJcayiaqYuWRTUZi5zmv25X3b%=
2FBVm5TW0yhgg%3D&amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ie=
tf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/</a>
 describes examples of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Appli=
cation Based Segmentation, =C2=A0assuming that the applications are assigne=
d with unique IP addresses.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">In the Figure below, the following BGP=
 Updates can be advertised to ensure that Payment Application only communic=
ates with the Payment Gateway:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the=
 RED P2P topology (only propagated to Payment GW node:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute: </span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:black">30.1.1.x/24<u></u><u></u></li=
></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">Tunnel Encap Path Attribute</span><u></u=
><u></u></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:black">IPsec Attributes for PaymentG=
W -&gt;C-PE2<u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:134.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the=
 routes to be reached by Purple:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute:</span><u></u><u>=
</u></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:black">10.1.x.x</span><u></u><=
u></u></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:black">12.4.x.x</sp=
an><u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif;color:black">-=
</span><span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;=
,serif;color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">TunnelEncap Path Attribute:</span><u></u=
><u></u></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:black">Any node to C-PE2<u></u><u></=
u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">Your feedback is greatly appreciated.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">Thank you very much. <u></u><u></u></p=
>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">Linda Dunbar<u></u><u></u></p>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center">
</span></div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><strong><i><span style=3D"font-size:9p=
t;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:blue">External Email:</span></i></st=
rong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:=
blue"> Please use caution
 when opening links and attachments / </span></em><strong><i><span style=3D=
"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:blue">Courriel externe:=
</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sa=
ns-serif;color:blue"> Soyez
 prudent avec les liens et documents joints </span></em><u></u><u></u></p>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center">
</span></div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><strong><i><span style=3D"font-size:9p=
t;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:blue">External Email:</span></i></st=
rong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:=
blue"> Please use caution
 when opening links and attachments / </span></em><strong><i><span style=3D=
"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:blue">Courriel externe:=
</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sa=
ns-serif;color:blue"> Soyez
 prudent avec les liens et documents joints </span></em><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">_______________________________________________<br>
Idr mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">Idr@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2=
F%2Fwww.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fidr&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Clinda.dunb=
ar%40futurewei.com%7C6fce142531214362ed4c08d7cf6044aa%7C0fee8ff2a3b240189c7=
53a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637205884697250108&amp;sdata=3DxGo7v5SPCdHr9a6DW8cK=
uzTgzyCoWQ5VRTZ2ylvI8ns%3D&amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https://www.=
ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/idr</a><u></u><u></u></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div>

--00000000000012a16f05a1959785--


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From: <slitkows.ietf@gmail.com>
To: "'BESS'" <bess@ietf.org>
Cc: <bess-chairs@ietf.org>
References: <041f01d5ecb0$954a9570$bfdfc050$@gmail.com>
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Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2020 10:11:50 +0100
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/UiLMwdisaiLmUIxapN1z0HQAevY>
Subject: Re: [bess] WGLC, IPR and implementation poll for draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast-04
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Hi,

=20

This WGLC is now closed.

There was an implementation claim, so document will be able to progress.

We will proceed with a review as a next step.

=20

Stephane

=20

=20

From: slitkows.ietf@gmail.com <slitkows.ietf@gmail.com>=20
Sent: mercredi 26 f=E9vrier 2020 15:25
To: 'BESS' <bess@ietf.org>
Cc: bess-chairs@ietf.org
Subject: WGLC, IPR and implementation poll for
draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast-04=20

=20

Hi WG,

=20

This email starts a two weeks Working Group Last Call on
draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast-04 [2]

=20

Please review the draft and send any comments to the BESS list. Also, =
please
indicate if you support publishing the draft as a standards track RFC.

=20

This poll runs until 11th March 2020.

=20

We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to
this Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with =
IETF
IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).

If you are listed as an Author or a Contributor of this Document please
respond to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any
relevant undisclosed IPR. The Document won't progress without answers =
from
all the Authors and Contributors.=20

There is currently one IPR disclosed. =20

=20
<https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/search/?submit=3Ddraft&id=3Ddraft-ietf-=
bess-ev
pn-irb-mcast>
https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/search/?submit=3Ddraft&id=3Ddraft-ietf-b=
ess-evp
n-irb-mcast

=20

We are also polling for any existing implementation as per [1]. Please
indicate if you are aware of any implementations.

 Thank you,

Stephane

=20

[1]
<https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw>
https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw

[2]  <https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast/>
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast/

=20


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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DFR =
link=3D"#0563C1" vlink=3D"#954F72"><div class=3DWordSection1><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Hi,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>This =
WGLC is now closed.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>There was an implementation =
claim, so document will be able to progress.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>We will =
proceed with a review as a next step.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Stephane<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:FR'>From:</span></b><span =
lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;mso-fareast-language:FR'> =
slitkows.ietf@gmail.com &lt;slitkows.ietf@gmail.com&gt; <br><b>Sent:</b> =
mercredi 26 f=E9vrier 2020 15:25<br><b>To:</b> 'BESS' =
&lt;bess@ietf.org&gt;<br><b>Cc:</b> =
bess-chairs@ietf.org<br><b>Subject:</b> WGLC, IPR and implementation =
poll for draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast-04 =
<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>Hi WG,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>This email =
starts a two weeks Working Group<span class=3Dapple-converted-space> =
Last Call&nbsp;</span>on </span><span =
lang=3DEN-GB>draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast-04 [2]</span><span =
lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'color:black'>Please review =
the draft and send any comments to the BESS list. Also, please indicate =
if you support publishing the draft as a standards track =
RFC.</span><span lang=3DEN-GB><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp;</span><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>This poll runs until 11th March 2020.</span><span =
lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps: =
normal;orphans: auto;text-align:start;widows: =
auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: =
0px;word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3Dgmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintex=
t0><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>We are also polling for =
knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to this Document, to =
ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules =
(see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more =
details).<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3Dgmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintex=
t0><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'>If you are listed as an =
Author or a Contributor of this Document please respond to this email =
and indicate whether or not you are aware of any relevant undisclosed =
IPR. The Document won't progress without answers from all the Authors =
and Contributors.&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3Dgmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintex=
t><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>There is =
currently one IPR disclosed.&nbsp;&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3Dgmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintex=
t><a =
href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/search/?submit=3Ddraft&amp;id=3D=
draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast"><span =
lang=3DEN-US>https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/search/?submit=3Ddraft&amp;=
id=3Ddraft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast</span></a><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3Dgmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintex=
t><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3Dgmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintex=
t><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>We are also =
polling for any existing implementation as per [1]. Please indicate if =
you are aware of any implementations.</span><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3Dgmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintex=
t style=3D'caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>&nbsp;Thank you,</span><span =
lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3Dgmail-m-3566480992569920863gmail-m-6487177298439282362msoplaintex=
t style=3D'caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Stephane</span><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps: =
normal;orphans: auto;text-align:start;widows: =
auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: =
0px;word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp;</span><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps: normal;orphans: =
auto;text-align:start;widows: auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px'><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'color:black'>[1]<span =
class=3Dapple-converted-space>&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'color:black'><a =
href=3D"https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdk=
jqDpw" target=3D"_blank"><span =
style=3D'color:#044A91'>https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1t=
Tqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw</span></a></span><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>[2] </span><a =
href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast/"=
><span =
lang=3DEN-GB>https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mc=
ast/</span></a><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div></body></htm=
l>
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From: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
To: Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
CC: Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>, "idr@ietf.org" <idr@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-safi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI
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Subject: Re: [bess] [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-safi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI
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From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
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Subject: [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
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Dear BESS,

Does anyone know if this draft has been picked up in another draft or is on i=
ts way to become standardized.  Please provide data tracker if so.

This is a much needed feature for operators for DC for mpls core connectivit=
y DCI extension.

https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-rabadan-sajassi-bess-evpn-ipvpn-inter=
working/

I see this draft is close to being published but is intra DC integration wit=
h IP mpls vpn.  I am not completely clear if the inter working function by t=
he draft above is completely picked up by this draft.

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-08


Kind regards=20

Gyan
Verizon=20
cell 301 502-1347

Sent from my iPhone=

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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto"><br>Dear BESS,<div><br></div><div>Does anyo=
ne know if this draft has been picked up in another draft or is on its way t=
o become standardized. &nbsp;Please provide data tracker if so.</div><div><b=
r></div><div>This is a much needed feature for operators for DC for mpls cor=
e connectivity DCI extension.</div><div><br></div><div><a href=3D"https://da=
tatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-rabadan-sajassi-bess-evpn-ipvpn-interworking/">=
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-rabadan-sajassi-bess-evpn-ipvpn-inter=
working/</a></div><div><br></div><div>I see this draft is close to being pub=
lished but is intra DC integration with IP mpls vpn. &nbsp;I am not complete=
ly clear if the inter working function by the draft above is completely pick=
ed up by this draft.</div><div><br></div><div><a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.=
org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-08">https://tools.ietf=
.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-08</a></div><div><br>=
</div><div><br></div><div>Kind regards&nbsp;</div><div><br></div><div>Gyan</=
div><div>Verizon&nbsp;</div><div>cell 301 502-1347</div><div><br></div><div>=
<div dir=3D"ltr">Sent from my iPhone</div></div></body></html>=

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From: "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>
To: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>, BESS <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
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Subject: Re: [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
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From: "UTTARO, JAMES" <ju1738@att.com>
To: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>, BESS <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
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Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2020 12:15:57 +0000
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Subject: Re: [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
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In-Reply-To: <880BA535-FCAE-4187-8A46-3E1E70FF662D@nokia.com>
From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2020 17:17:24 -0400
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To: "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>
Cc: BESS <bess@ietf.org>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/Wsq7xXfIfZWffwMC8hkQoulkw-0>
Subject: Re: [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
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Thank you!!

Gyan

On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 3:30 AM Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View) <
jorge.rabadan@nokia.com> wrote:

> Hi Gyan,
>
>
>
> The evpn ipvpn interworking draft was adopted as:
>
>
>
> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-ipvpn-interworking-02
>
>
>
> Thx
>
> Jorge
>
>
>
> *From: *BESS <bess-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Gyan Mishra <
> hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
> *Date: *Wednesday, March 25, 2020 at 6:38 AM
> *To: *BESS <bess@ietf.org>
> *Subject: *[bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
>
>
>
>
> Dear BESS,
>
>
>
> Does anyone know if this draft has been picked up in another draft or is
> on its way to become standardized.  Please provide data tracker if so.
>
>
>
> This is a much needed feature for operators for DC for mpls core
> connectivity DCI extension.
>
>
>
>
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-rabadan-sajassi-bess-evpn-ipvpn-interworking/
>
>
>
> I see this draft is close to being published but is intra DC integration
> with IP mpls vpn.  I am not completely clear if the inter working function
> by the draft above is completely picked up by this draft.
>
>
>
>
> https://tools.ietf..org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-08
> <https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-08>
>
>
>
>
>
> Kind regards
>
>
>
> Gyan
>
> Verizon
>
> cell 301 502-1347
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>


-- 

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

--000000000000640e0105a1b467e7
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr">Thank you!!<div><br></div><div>Gyan</div></div><br><div cl=
ass=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Wed, Mar 25, 2=
020 at 3:30 AM Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View) &lt;<a href=3D"mai=
lto:jorge.rabadan@nokia.com">jorge.rabadan@nokia.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></di=
v><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;borde=
r-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-US">
<div class=3D"gmail-m_5794431808710903406WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">Hi Gyan,
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">The evpn ipvpn interworking draft was adopted as:<u></u><u></u></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-be=
ss-evpn-ipvpn-interworking-02" target=3D"_blank">https://tools.ietf.org/htm=
l/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-ipvpn-interworking-02</a><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">Thx<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">Jorge<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(181,196,223);padding:3pt 0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><b><span style=3D"font-si=
ze:12pt;color:black">From:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">BESS &lt;<a href=3D"m=
ailto:bess-bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess-bounces@ietf.org</a>&gt=
; on behalf of Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Date: </b>Wednesday, March 25, 2020 at 6:38 AM<br>
<b>To: </b>BESS &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess=
@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject: </b>[bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard<u></u><u=
></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><br>
Dear BESS, <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Does anyone know if this =
draft has been picked up in another draft or is on its way to become standa=
rdized.=C2=A0 Please provide data tracker if so.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">This is a much needed fea=
ture for operators for DC for mpls core connectivity DCI extension.<u></u><=
u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><a href=3D"https://datatr=
acker.ietf.org/doc/draft-rabadan-sajassi-bess-evpn-ipvpn-interworking/" tar=
get=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-rabadan-sajassi-bess-=
evpn-ipvpn-interworking/</a><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">I see this draft is close=
 to being published but is intra DC integration with IP mpls vpn.=C2=A0 I a=
m not completely clear if the inter working function by the draft above is =
completely picked up by this draft.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><a href=3D"https://tools.=
ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-08" target=3D"_b=
lank">https://tools.ietf..org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwar=
ding-08</a><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Kind regards=C2=A0<u></u>=
<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Verizon=C2=A0<u></u><u></=
u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">cell 301 502-1347<u></u><=
u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Sent from my iPhone<u></u=
><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div><br clear=3D"all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"=
 class=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr=
"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font size=3D"1=
" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=C2=A0 Mi=
shra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000=
000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</fo=
nt></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"ge=
orgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"=
1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20904</font>=
</p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georg=
ia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=
=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:g=
yan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></=
font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div></div></=
div></div></div></div></div></div></div>

--000000000000640e0105a1b467e7--


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From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2020 17:42:14 -0400
Message-ID: <CABNhwV2-gDQCzZ5Q4ChEP2PHk=YZAYsHTKUJQtCFjFzNeEh55w@mail.gmail.com>
To: "UTTARO, JAMES" <ju1738@att.com>
Cc: BESS <bess@ietf.org>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/hFh4U03jKQ0mHl1QFZQ2dgKOUEU>
Subject: Re: [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
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--00000000000020104a05a1b4c02a
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
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Hi Jim

I read through the draft.  This is exactly what I was looking for.  So in
our scenario we would use the gateway PE option where we are exporting the
EVPN routes & importing  VPNv4 & VPNv6 and vice versa and would use the "D
Path" attribute for loop avoidance between domains.  Our DCI scenario would
be like  your drawing depicted where our Data Center core "router server"
box that inter-connects all the PODs vxlan fabrics via BGP EVPN in the Data
Center - This box would act as the demark between the "DC" and "Core" and
would be the one doing the import/export "gateway PE" inter-working
function to the IPVPN PE for core to data center reachability.

I noticed in section 4.3 the aggregation of routes option as we would not
want the host routes to be propagated into IPVPN.

In the ineterworking option if we wanted to extend each tenant VRF natively
1-1 mapping into unique L3 VPN VRF or take all the EVPN tenant VRFs ISF
SAFI and import all into a single IPVPN VRF do we have that flexibility to
map as desired.  Also if the Gateway PE was our DC route server box and we
wanted to extend to the core natively  each tenant VRF 1-1 mapping into
different unique IPVPN VRFs - since this is now an inter-AS LSP -exiting
the DC to the PE the DC PE & Core PE would be acting as "inter-as" ASBRs in
that case and would have to do an inter-as opt a,b,c,ab style.

I think the tricky part is where the Demark "Gateway PE" resides -- on the
Core side or DC side.  If it ends up being the DC box the DC to Core is
eBGP peering and then you would need to do inter-as L3 vpn option to extend
the LSP. However, if the "Gateway PE" function resides on the Core PE then
you would extend EVPN AFI to the core PE and then perform the gateway
function where now its iBGP in the core and use can use the core RR for
your LSP and now the edge inter-as LSP complexity does not occur.

Is it possible in either gateway or composite PE interworking function that
we can only export out the type 5 routes and block the type 4 host routes
from being exported into IPVPN.  In most all cases there would be a L3 VNI
tenant VRF prefix which would be represented by the Type 5 which is
sufficient of reachability.

Our other scenario for DCI interconnect would be extending EVPN AFI/SAFI
over the mpls core.  This scenario keeps IPVPN & EVPN separate.

I did notice at the bottom of page 6 & top of page 7 single domain scenario
depicted.  I was curious to understand in that scenario how does BGP-LU
come into play??

<------------------------------------------------->
                                BGP-LU
           <------------------------------------------------->

                          ASBR------------ASBR
                         +------+       +------+
           +-------------|      |       |      |-------------+
          PE1            +------+       +--+---+            PE2
        +------+   DC1      |     WAN      |     DC2     +------+
    TS1-|IP-VRF|   EVPN     |              |     EVPN    |IP-VRF|-TS2
        +------+          ASBR            ASBR           +---+--+
           |             +------+       +------+             |
           +-------------|      |       |      |-------------+
                         +------+       +------+
                            +--------------+

           <--------------------DOMAIN-1--------------------->


Kind regards

Gyan
Verizon
Cell 301 502-1347

On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 8:16 AM UTTARO, JAMES <ju1738@att.com> wrote:

> *Gyan,*
>
>
>
> *              Does the attached slide correlate with your requirement? M=
y
> thoughts are that the interworking needs to support both intra WAN and WA=
N
> connectivity to DCs.. The introduction of D-PATH is required to ensure th=
at
> a path p can traverse multiple signaling domains i.e EVPN<->L3VPN<->EVPN.=
.
> I would be interested in your use cases..*
>
>
>
> *Thanks,*
>
> *              Jim Uttaro*
>
>
>
> *From:* BESS <bess-bounces@ietf.org> *On Behalf Of * Gyan Mishra
> *Sent:* Wednesday, March 25, 2020 1:37 AM
> *To:* BESS <bess@ietf.org>
> *Subject:* [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
>
>
>
>
> Dear BESS,
>
>
>
> Does anyone know if this draft has been picked up in another draft or is
> on its way to become standardized.  Please provide data tracker if so.
>
>
>
> This is a much needed feature for operators for DC for mpls core
> connectivity DCI extension.
>
>
>
>
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-rabadan-sajassi-bess-evpn-ipvpn-in=
terworking/
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__datatracker.ietf.=
org_doc_draft-2Drabadan-2Dsajassi-2Dbess-2Devpn-2Dipvpn-2Dinterworking_&d=
=3DDwMFaQ&c=3DLFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&r=3Ds7ZzB4JbPv3nYuoSx5Gy8Q&m=3DQ5Qb9X0=
Q_fH2abLb-9fPBNqCki_KBGPuOaZeJsigPGA&s=3Dg_SDL98eh20_aja820tdFnjy-_G79Zekfv=
d3t5YTEoQ&e=3D>
>
>
>
> I see this draft is close to being published but is intra DC integration
> with IP mpls vpn.  I am not completely clear if the inter working functio=
n
> by the draft above is completely picked up by this draft.
>
>
>
>
> https://tools.ietf..org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding=
-08
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__tools.ietf.org_ht=
ml_draft-2Dietf-2Dbess-2Devpn-2Dinter-2Dsubnet-2Dforwarding-2D08&d=3DDwMFaQ=
&c=3DLFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&r=3Ds7ZzB4JbPv3nYuoSx5Gy8Q&m=3DQ5Qb9X0Q_fH2abLb=
-9fPBNqCki_KBGPuOaZeJsigPGA&s=3DBv-Oy0p0_u2EDBbejfuQYIoR8hOUinTQS0CF-Y_DpfU=
&e=3D>
>
>
>
>
>
> Kind regards
>
>
>
> Gyan
>
> Verizon
>
> cell 301 502-1347
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>


--=20

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

--00000000000020104a05a1b4c02a
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr">Hi Jim</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><d=
iv>I read through the draft.=C2=A0 This is exactly what I was looking for.=
=C2=A0 So in our scenario we would use the gateway PE option where we are e=
xporting the EVPN routes &amp; importing=C2=A0 VPNv4 &amp; VPNv6 and vice v=
ersa and would use the &quot;D Path&quot; attribute for loop avoidance betw=
een=C2=A0domains.=C2=A0 Our DCI scenario would be like=C2=A0 your drawing d=
epicted=C2=A0where our Data Center core &quot;router server&quot; box that =
inter-connects all the PODs vxlan fabrics via BGP EVPN in the Data Center -=
 This box would act as the demark between the &quot;DC&quot; and &quot;Core=
&quot; and would be the one doing the import/export &quot;gateway PE&quot; =
inter-working function to the IPVPN PE for core to data center reachability=
.=C2=A0=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>I noticed in section 4.3 the aggrega=
tion of routes option as we would not want the host routes to be propagated=
 into IPVPN.=C2=A0=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>In the ineterworking=C2=
=A0option if we wanted to extend each tenant VRF natively 1-1 mapping into =
unique=C2=A0L3 VPN VRF or take all the EVPN tenant VRFs ISF SAFI and import=
 all into a single IPVPN VRF do we have that flexibility to map as desired.=
=C2=A0 Also if the Gateway PE was our DC route server box and we wanted to =
extend to the core natively=C2=A0 each tenant VRF 1-1 mapping into differen=
t unique IPVPN VRFs - since this is now an inter-AS LSP -exiting the DC to =
the PE the DC PE &amp; Core PE would be acting as &quot;inter-as&quot; ASBR=
s in that case and would have to do an inter-as opt a,b,c,ab style.=C2=A0=
=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>I think the tricky part is where the Demark=
 &quot;Gateway PE&quot; resides -- on the Core side or DC side.=C2=A0 If it=
 ends up being the DC box the DC to Core is eBGP peering and then you would=
 need to do inter-as L3 vpn option to extend the LSP. However, if the &quot=
;Gateway PE&quot; function resides on the Core PE then you would extend EVP=
N AFI to the core PE and then perform the gateway function where now its iB=
GP in the core and use can use the core RR for your LSP and now the edge in=
ter-as LSP complexity does not occur.=C2=A0=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>=
Is it possible in either gateway or composite PE interworking function that=
 we can only export out the type 5 routes and block the type 4 host routes =
from being exported into IPVPN.=C2=A0 In most all cases there would be a L3=
 VNI tenant VRF prefix which would be represented by the Type 5 which is su=
fficient of reachability.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Our other scenario=
 for DCI interconnect would be extending EVPN AFI/SAFI over the mpls core.=
=C2=A0 This scenario keeps IPVPN &amp; EVPN separate.=C2=A0=C2=A0</div><div=
><br></div><div>I did notice at the bottom=C2=A0of page 6 &amp; top of page=
 7 single domain scenario depicted.=C2=A0 I was curious to understand in th=
at scenario how does BGP-LU come into play??</div><div><br></div><div><pre =
class=3D"gmail-newpage" style=3D"font-size:13.3333px;margin-top:0px;margin-=
bottom:0px;break-before:page;color:rgb(0,0,0)">&lt;------------------------=
-------------------------&gt;
                                BGP-LU
           &lt;-------------------------------------------------&gt;

                          ASBR------------ASBR
                         +------+       +------+
           +-------------|      |       |      |-------------+
          PE1            +------+       +--+---+            PE2
        +------+   DC1      |     WAN      |     DC2     +------+
    TS1-|IP-VRF|   EVPN     |              |     EVPN    |IP-VRF|-TS2
        +------+          ASBR            ASBR           +---+--+
           |             +------+       +------+             |
           +-------------|      |       |      |-------------+
                         +------+       +------+
                            +--------------+

           &lt;--------------------DOMAIN-1---------------------&gt;
</pre><br class=3D"gmail-Apple-interchange-newline"></div><div>Kind regards=
</div><div><br></div><div>Gyan</div>Verizon<div>Cell 301 502-1347</div><div=
><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On We=
d, Mar 25, 2020 at 8:16 AM UTTARO, JAMES &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ju1738@att.c=
om">ju1738@att.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote=
" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);=
padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-US">
<div class=3D"gmail-m_350447684222554702WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:rgb(112,48,16=
0)">Gyan,<u></u><u></u></span></b></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:rgb(112,48,16=
0)"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></b></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:rgb(112,48,16=
0)">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0 Does the attached slide correlate with your requirement? My thoug=
hts are that the interworking needs to support both intra WAN and WAN conne=
ctivity to DCs.. The introduction
 of D-PATH is required to ensure that a path p can traverse multiple signal=
ing domains i.e EVPN&lt;-&gt;L3VPN&lt;-&gt;EVPN.. I would be interested in =
your use cases..<u></u><u></u></span></b></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:rgb(112,48,16=
0)"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></b></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:rgb(112,48,16=
0)">Thanks,<u></u><u></u></span></b></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:rgb(112,48,16=
0)">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0 Jim Uttaro<u></u><u></u></span></b></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:rgb(112,48,16=
0)"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></b></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> BESS &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess-bounces=
@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess-bounces@ietf.org</a>&gt; <b>On Behalf Of =
</b>
Gyan Mishra<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, March 25, 2020 1:37 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> BESS &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess=
@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard<u></u><u=
></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br>
Dear BESS,<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Does anyone know if this draft has been picked up in=
 another draft or is on its way to become standardized.=C2=A0 Please provid=
e data tracker if so.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">This is a much needed feature for operators for DC f=
or mpls core connectivity DCI extension.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?=
u=3Dhttps-3A__datatracker.ietf.org_doc_draft-2Drabadan-2Dsajassi-2Dbess-2De=
vpn-2Dipvpn-2Dinterworking_&amp;d=3DDwMFaQ&amp;c=3DLFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&a=
mp;r=3Ds7ZzB4JbPv3nYuoSx5Gy8Q&amp;m=3DQ5Qb9X0Q_fH2abLb-9fPBNqCki_KBGPuOaZeJ=
sigPGA&amp;s=3Dg_SDL98eh20_aja820tdFnjy-_G79Zekfvd3t5YTEoQ&amp;e=3D" target=
=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-rabadan-sajassi-bess-evp=
n-ipvpn-interworking/</a><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I see this draft is close to being published but is =
intra DC integration with IP mpls vpn.=C2=A0 I am not completely clear if t=
he inter working function by the draft above is completely picked up by thi=
s draft.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?=
u=3Dhttps-3A__tools.ietf.org_html_draft-2Dietf-2Dbess-2Devpn-2Dinter-2Dsubn=
et-2Dforwarding-2D08&amp;d=3DDwMFaQ&amp;c=3DLFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&amp;r=3D=
s7ZzB4JbPv3nYuoSx5Gy8Q&amp;m=3DQ5Qb9X0Q_fH2abLb-9fPBNqCki_KBGPuOaZeJsigPGA&=
amp;s=3DBv-Oy0p0_u2EDBbejfuQYIoR8hOUinTQS0CF-Y_DpfU&amp;e=3D" target=3D"_bl=
ank">https://tools.ietf..org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forward=
ing-08</a><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Kind regards=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Verizon=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">cell 301 502-1347<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my iPhone<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div><br clear=3D"all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"=
 class=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr=
"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font size=3D"1=
" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=C2=A0 Mi=
shra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000=
000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</fo=
nt></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"ge=
orgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"=
1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20904</font>=
</p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georg=
ia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=
=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:g=
yan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></=
font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div></div></=
div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>

--00000000000020104a05a1b4c02a--


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From: "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>
To: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>, "UTTARO, JAMES" <ju1738@att.com>
CC: BESS <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
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From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2020 03:50:44 -0400
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To: "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/NkJZms4qMMXluSHUE7KTGiCDQZI>
Subject: Re: [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
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Hi Jorge

Thank you for the correction I did mean type 2 so that=E2=80=99s good the h=
ost
routes can be blocked.

What are your thoughts on the placement of the gateway or composite PE
inter-working function on the core or DC side?

Understood on eve BGP LU tunnel to stitch the domain together so it=E2=80=
=99s
contiguous.  Could you also just extend and overlay the BGP EVPN AFI/SAFI
over the MPLS core domains as an option for DCI.

Thanks

Gyan

On Thu, Mar 26, 2020 at 3:22 AM Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View) <
jorge.rabadan@nokia.com> wrote:

> Hi Gyan,
>
>
>
> =E2=80=9CIs it possible in either gateway or composite PE interworking fu=
nction
> that we can only export out the type 5 routes and block the type 4 host
> routes from being exported into IPVPN.  In most all cases there would be =
a
> L3 VNI tenant VRF prefix which would be represented by the Type 5 which i=
s
> sufficient of reachability. =E2=80=9C
>
>
>
> I think you mean EVPN type 2 routes. Yes, you should be able to do that.
>
>
>
> =E2=80=9CI did notice at the bottom of page 6 & top of page 7 single doma=
in
> scenario depicted.  I was curious to understand in that scenario how does
> BGP-LU come into play??=E2=80=9D
>
>
>
> Note that a =E2=80=9Cdomain=E2=80=9D is defined as follows: =E2=80=9CTwo =
PEs are in the same
> domain if they are attached to the same tenant and the packets between th=
em
> do not require a data path IP lookup (in the tenant space) in any
> intermediate router.=E2=80=9D In figure 3 we wanted to illustrate an exam=
ple where
> PE1 and PE2 belong to the same domain, no ip-lookups in between. For that=
,
> you need to connect PE1 and PE2 by a tunnel that can cross different ASNs=
,
> and BGP-LU can do that.
>
>
>
> Hope it helps.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Jorge
>
>
>
>
>
> *From: *BESS <bess-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Gyan Mishra <
> hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
> *Date: *Wednesday, March 25, 2020 at 10:44 PM
> *To: *"UTTARO, JAMES" <ju1738@att.com>
> *Cc: *BESS <bess@ietf.org>
> *Subject: *Re: [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
>
>
>
> Hi Jim
>
>
>
> I read through the draft.  This is exactly what I was looking for.  So in
> our scenario we would use the gateway PE option where we are exporting th=
e
> EVPN routes & importing  VPNv4 & VPNv6 and vice versa and would use the "=
D
> Path" attribute for loop avoidance between domains.  Our DCI scenario wou=
ld
> be like  your drawing depicted where our Data Center core "router server"
> box that inter-connects all the PODs vxlan fabrics via BGP EVPN in the Da=
ta
> Center - This box would act as the demark between the "DC" and "Core" and
> would be the one doing the import/export "gateway PE" inter-working
> function to the IPVPN PE for core to data center reachability..
>
>
>
> I noticed in section 4.3 the aggregation of routes option as we would not
> want the host routes to be propagated into IPVPN.
>
>
>
> In the ineterworking option if we wanted to extend each tenant VRF
> natively 1-1 mapping into unique L3 VPN VRF or take all the EVPN tenant
> VRFs ISF SAFI and import all into a single IPVPN VRF do we have that
> flexibility to map as desired.  Also if the Gateway PE was our DC route
> server box and we wanted to extend to the core natively  each tenant VRF
> 1-1 mapping into different unique IPVPN VRFs - since this is now an
> inter-AS LSP -exiting the DC to the PE the DC PE & Core PE would be actin=
g
> as "inter-as" ASBRs in that case and would have to do an inter-as opt
> a,b,c,ab style.
>
>
>
> I think the tricky part is where the Demark "Gateway PE" resides -- on th=
e
> Core side or DC side.  If it ends up being the DC box the DC to Core is
> eBGP peering and then you would need to do inter-as L3 vpn option to exte=
nd
> the LSP. However, if the "Gateway PE" function resides on the Core PE the=
n
> you would extend EVPN AFI to the core PE and then perform the gateway
> function where now its iBGP in the core and use can use the core RR for
> your LSP and now the edge inter-as LSP complexity does not occur.
>
>
>
> Is it possible in either gateway or composite PE interworking function
> that we can only export out the type 5 routes and block the type 4 host
> routes from being exported into IPVPN.  In most all cases there would be =
a
> L3 VNI tenant VRF prefix which would be represented by the Type 5 which i=
s
> sufficient of reachability.
>
>
>
> Our other scenario for DCI interconnect would be extending EVPN AFI/SAFI
> over the mpls core.  This scenario keeps IPVPN & EVPN separate.
>
>
>
> I did notice at the bottom of page 6 & top of page 7 single domain
> scenario depicted.  I was curious to understand in that scenario how does
> BGP-LU come into play??
>
>
>
> <------------------------------------------------->
>
>                                 BGP-LU
>
>            <------------------------------------------------->
>
>
>
>                           ASBR------------ASBR
>
>                          +------+       +------+
>
>            +-------------|      |       |      |-------------+
>
>           PE1            +------+       +--+---+            PE2
>
>         +------+   DC1      |     WAN      |     DC2     +------+
>
>     TS1-|IP-VRF|   EVPN     |              |     EVPN    |IP-VRF|-TS2
>
>         +------+          ASBR            ASBR           +---+--+
>
>            |             +------+       +------+             |
>
>            +-------------|      |       |      |-------------+
>
>                          +------+       +------+
>
>                             +--------------+
>
>
>
>            <--------------------DOMAIN-1--------------------->
>
>
>
> Kind regards
>
>
>
> Gyan
>
> Verizon
>
> Cell 301 502-1347
>
>
>
> On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 8:16 AM UTTARO, JAMES <ju1738@att.com> wrote:
>
> *Gyan,*
>
>
>
> *              Does the attached slide correlate with your requirement? M=
y
> thoughts are that the interworking needs to support both intra WAN and WA=
N
> connectivity to DCs.. The introduction of D-PATH is required to ensure th=
at
> a path p can traverse multiple signaling domains i.e EVPN<->L3VPN<->EVPN.=
.
> I would be interested in your use cases..*
>
>
>
> *Thanks,*
>
> *              Jim Uttaro*
>
>
>
> *From:* BESS <bess-bounces@ietf.org> *On Behalf Of *Gyan Mishra
> *Sent:* Wednesday, March 25, 2020 1:37 AM
> *To:* BESS <bess@ietf.org>
> *Subject:* [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
>
>
>
>
> Dear BESS,
>
>
>
> Does anyone know if this draft has been picked up in another draft or is
> on its way to become standardized.  Please provide data tracker if so.
>
>
>
> This is a much needed feature for operators for DC for mpls core
> connectivity DCI extension.
>
>
>
>
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-rabadan-sajassi-bess-evpn-ipvpn-in=
terworking/
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__datatracker.ietf.=
org_doc_draft-2Drabadan-2Dsajassi-2Dbess-2Devpn-2Dipvpn-2Dinterworking_&d=
=3DDwMFaQ&c=3DLFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&r=3Ds7ZzB4JbPv3nYuoSx5Gy8Q&m=3DQ5Qb9X0=
Q_fH2abLb-9fPBNqCki_KBGPuOaZeJsigPGA&s=3Dg_SDL98eh20_aja820tdFnjy-_G79Zekfv=
d3t5YTEoQ&e=3D>
>
>
>
> I see this draft is close to being published but is intra DC integration
> with IP mpls vpn.  I am not completely clear if the inter working functio=
n
> by the draft above is completely picked up by this draft.
>
>
>
>
> https://tools.ietf..org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding=
-08
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__tools.ietf.org_ht=
ml_draft-2Dietf-2Dbess-2Devpn-2Dinter-2Dsubnet-2Dforwarding-2D08&d=3DDwMFaQ=
&c=3DLFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&r=3Ds7ZzB4JbPv3nYuoSx5Gy8Q&m=3DQ5Qb9X0Q_fH2abLb=
-9fPBNqCki_KBGPuOaZeJsigPGA&s=3DBv-Oy0p0_u2EDBbejfuQYIoR8hOUinTQS0CF-Y_DpfU=
&e=3D>
>
>
>
>
>
> Kind regards
>
>
>
> Gyan
>
> Verizon
>
> cell 301 502-1347
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Gyan  Mishra
>
> Network Engineering & Technology
>
> Verizon
>
> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>
> Phone: 301 502-1347
>
> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>
>
>
>
>
--=20

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

--0000000000009e98ea05a1bd3eb5
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div><br></div><div><div dir=3D"auto">Hi Jorge=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"=
><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Thank you for the correction I did mean type 2=
 so that=E2=80=99s good the host routes can be blocked.</div><div dir=3D"au=
to"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">What are your thoughts on the placement of =
the gateway or composite PE inter-working function on the core or DC side? =
=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Understood on eve=
 BGP LU tunnel to stitch the domain together so it=E2=80=99s contiguous.=C2=
=A0 Could you also just extend and overlay the BGP EVPN AFI/SAFI over the M=
PLS core domains as an option for DCI. =C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></=
div><div dir=3D"auto">Thanks=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div di=
r=3D"auto">Gyan</div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=
=3D"gmail_attr">On Thu, Mar 26, 2020 at 3:22 AM Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/=
Mountain View) &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jorge.rabadan@nokia.com">jorge.rabadan=
@nokia.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=
=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">
<div class=3D"m_-4249498934852113263WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">Hi Gyan,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;-webkit-standard&qu=
ot;,serif;color:black">=E2=80=9CIs it possible in either gateway or composi=
te PE interworking function that we can only export out the type 5 routes a=
nd block the type 4 host routes from being exported into
 IPVPN.=C2=A0 In most all cases there would be a L3 VNI tenant VRF prefix w=
hich would be represented by the Type 5 which is sufficient of reachability=
.=C2=A0=E2=80=9C<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;-webkit-standard&qu=
ot;,serif;color:black"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">I think you mean EVPN type 2 routes. Yes, you should be able to do that.<=
u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;-webkit-standard&qu=
ot;,serif;color:black"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;-webkit-standard&qu=
ot;,serif;color:black">=E2=80=9CI did notice at the bottom=C2=A0of page 6 &=
amp; top of page 7 single domain scenario depicted.=C2=A0 I was curious to =
understand in that scenario how does BGP-LU come into play??=E2=80=9D<u></u=
><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">Note that a =E2=80=9Cdomain=E2=80=9D is defined as follows: =E2=80=9CTwo =
PEs are in the same domain if they are attached to the same tenant and the =
packets between them do not require a data path IP lookup (in
 the tenant space) in any intermediate router.=E2=80=9D In figure 3 we want=
ed to illustrate an example where PE1 and PE2 belong to the same domain, no=
 ip-lookups in between. For that, you need to connect PE1 and PE2 by a tunn=
el that can cross different ASNs, and BGP-LU
 can do that. <u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">Hope it helps.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">Thanks.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">Jorge<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><b><span style=3D"font-=
size:12.0pt;color:black">From:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">BESS &lt;<a href=3D=
"mailto:bess-bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess-bounces@ietf.org</a>&=
gt; on behalf of Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Date: </b>Wednesday, March 25, 2020 at 10:44 PM<br>
<b>To: </b>&quot;UTTARO, JAMES&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ju1738@att.com" =
target=3D"_blank">ju1738@att.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc: </b>BESS &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess=
@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard<u></=
u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Hi Jim<u></u><u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">I read through the draf=
t.=C2=A0 This is exactly what I was looking for.=C2=A0 So in our scenario w=
e would use the gateway PE option where we are exporting the EVPN routes &a=
mp; importing=C2=A0 VPNv4 &amp; VPNv6 and vice versa and would
 use the &quot;D Path&quot; attribute for loop avoidance between=C2=A0domai=
ns.=C2=A0 Our DCI scenario would be like=C2=A0 your drawing depicted=C2=A0w=
here our Data Center core &quot;router server&quot; box that inter-connects=
 all the PODs vxlan fabrics via BGP EVPN in the Data Center - This box woul=
d
 act as the demark between the &quot;DC&quot; and &quot;Core&quot; and woul=
d be the one doing the import/export &quot;gateway PE&quot; inter-working f=
unction to the IPVPN PE for core to data center reachability..=C2=A0=C2=A0<=
u></u><u></u></p>
</div></div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">=
<div class=3D"m_-4249498934852113263WordSection1"><div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">I noticed in section 4.=
3 the aggregation of routes option as we would not want the host routes to =
be propagated into IPVPN.=C2=A0=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">In the ineterworking=C2=
=A0option if we wanted to extend each tenant VRF natively 1-1 mapping into =
unique=C2=A0L3 VPN VRF or take all the EVPN tenant VRFs ISF SAFI and import=
 all into a single IPVPN VRF do we have that flexibility
 to map as desired.=C2=A0 Also if the Gateway PE was our DC route server bo=
x and we wanted to extend to the core natively=C2=A0 each tenant VRF 1-1 ma=
pping into different unique IPVPN VRFs - since this is now an inter-AS LSP =
-exiting the DC to the PE the DC PE &amp; Core
 PE would be acting as &quot;inter-as&quot; ASBRs in that case and would ha=
ve to do an inter-as opt a,b,c,ab style.=C2=A0=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">I think the tricky part=
 is where the Demark &quot;Gateway PE&quot; resides -- on the Core side or =
DC side.=C2=A0 If it ends up being the DC box the DC to Core is eBGP peerin=
g and then you would need to do inter-as L3 vpn option
 to extend the LSP. However, if the &quot;Gateway PE&quot; function resides=
 on the Core PE then you would extend EVPN AFI to the core PE and then perf=
orm the gateway function where now its iBGP in the core and use can use the=
 core RR for your LSP and now the edge inter-as
 LSP complexity does not occur.=C2=A0=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Is it possible in eithe=
r gateway or composite PE interworking function that we can only export out=
 the type 5 routes and block the type 4 host routes from being exported int=
o IPVPN.=C2=A0 In most all cases there would
 be a L3 VNI tenant VRF prefix which would be represented by the Type 5 whi=
ch is sufficient of reachability.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Our other scenario for =
DCI interconnect would be extending EVPN AFI/SAFI over the mpls core.=C2=A0=
 This scenario keeps IPVPN &amp; EVPN separate.=C2=A0=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">I did notice at the bot=
tom=C2=A0of page 6 &amp; top of page 7 single domain scenario depicted.=C2=
=A0 I was curious to understand in that scenario how does BGP-LU come into =
play??<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt;break-before:page"><span style=3D"color:bl=
ack">&lt;-------------------------------------------------&gt;<u></u><u></u=
></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 BGP-LU<u></u><u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 &lt;----------------------=
---------------------------&gt;<u></u><u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:black"><u></u>=C2=A0=
<u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ASBR-------=
-----ASBR<u></u><u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+<u></u><u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-------------|=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |-------------+<u></u><u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 PE1=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0 +--+---+=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0 PE2<u></u><u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+=C2=A0=C2=A0 DC1=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 WAN=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 DC2=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+<u></u><u></u>=
</span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 TS1-|IP-VRF|=C2=A0=C2=A0 EVPN=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 | =C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0EVPN=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |IP-VRF|-TS2<u></u><u></u></span><=
/pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ASBR=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ASBR=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 +---+--+<u></u><u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |<u></u><u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-------------|=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |-------------+<u></u><u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+<u></u><u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
 +--------------+<u></u><u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:black"><u></u>=C2=A0=
<u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 &lt;--------------------DO=
MAIN-1---------------------&gt;<u></u><u></u></span></pre>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Kind regards<u></u><u><=
/u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Verizon <u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Cell 301 502-1347<u></u=
><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at=
 8:16 AM UTTARO, JAMES &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ju1738@att.com" target=3D"_bla=
nk">ju1738@att.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0c=
m 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">Gyan,</span></b><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">=C2=A0</span></b><u></u><=
u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Does the attached sl=
ide correlate with your requirement? My thoughts are that the interworking =
needs to support both intra WAN and WAN connectivity to DCs.. The introduct=
ion of D-PATH is required
 to ensure that a path p can traverse multiple signaling domains i.e EVPN&l=
t;-&gt;L3VPN&lt;-&gt;EVPN.. I would be interested in your use cases..</span=
></b><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">=C2=A0</span></b><u></u><=
u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">Thanks,</span></b><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Jim Uttaro</span></b=
><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:#7030a0">=C2=A0</span></b><u></u><=
u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<b>From:</b> BESS &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess-bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_b=
lank">bess-bounces@ietf.org</a>&gt;
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Gyan Mishra<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, March 25, 2020 1:37 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> BESS &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess=
@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard<u></u><u=
></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<br>
Dear BESS,<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
Does anyone know if this draft has been picked up in another draft or is on=
 its way to become standardized.=C2=A0 Please provide data tracker if so.<u=
></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
This is a much needed feature for operators for DC for mpls core connectivi=
ty DCI extension.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<a href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__datatrack=
er.ietf.org_doc_draft-2Drabadan-2Dsajassi-2Dbess-2Devpn-2Dipvpn-2Dinterwork=
ing_&amp;d=3DDwMFaQ&amp;c=3DLFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&amp;r=3Ds7ZzB4JbPv3nYuoS=
x5Gy8Q&amp;m=3DQ5Qb9X0Q_fH2abLb-9fPBNqCki_KBGPuOaZeJsigPGA&amp;s=3Dg_SDL98e=
h20_aja820tdFnjy-_G79Zekfvd3t5YTEoQ&amp;e=3D" target=3D"_blank">https://dat=
atracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-rabadan-sajassi-bess-evpn-ipvpn-interworking/</=
a><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
I see this draft is close to being published but is intra DC integration wi=
th IP mpls vpn.=C2=A0 I am not completely clear if the inter working functi=
on by the draft above is completely picked up by this draft.<u></u><u></u><=
/p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<a href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__tools.iet=
f.org_html_draft-2Dietf-2Dbess-2Devpn-2Dinter-2Dsubnet-2Dforwarding-2D08&am=
p;d=3DDwMFaQ&amp;c=3DLFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&amp;r=3Ds7ZzB4JbPv3nYuoSx5Gy8Q&=
amp;m=3DQ5Qb9X0Q_fH2abLb-9fPBNqCki_KBGPuOaZeJsigPGA&amp;s=3DBv-Oy0p0_u2EDBb=
ejfuQYIoR8hOUinTQS0CF-Y_DpfU&amp;e=3D" target=3D"_blank">https://tools.ietf=
..org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-08</a><u></u><u></u=
></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
Kind regards=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
Verizon=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
cell 301 502-1347<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
Sent from my iPhone<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><br clear=3D"all">
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Gyan=C2=A0 Mishra</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Verizon=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Silver Spring, MD 20904</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Phone: 301 502-1347</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:&quot;Georgia&quot;,serif;color:=
black">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank=
">
gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature" =
data-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><=
div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font si=
ze=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=
=C2=A0 Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" colo=
r=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=
=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" =
face=3D"georgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><fon=
t size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20=
904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" fac=
e=3D"georgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><=
font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D=
"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.=
com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div=
></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>

--0000000000009e98ea05a1bd3eb5--


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From: "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>
To: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
CC: BESS <bess@ietf.org>, "UTTARO, JAMES" <ju1738@att.com>
Thread-Topic: [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
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Subject: Re: [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
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Subject: [bess] Shepherd's review of draft-ietf-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-03
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Hi Authors,

Please find my review of the document.

Nits to be fixed:

https://www6.ietf.org/tools/idnits?url=3Dhttps://www.ietf.org/archive/id/dr=
aft-ietf-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-03.txt


Section 1.1:

  *   s/it MUST add a link to both PE1/it must add a link to both PE1/ =3D>=
 this is not a normative statement
  *   Also, avoid upper case for ANY or ONLY. It doesn't bring anything.
  *   ECMP usually does not take care of flow bandwidth but rather than use=
s static hashing. ECMP is more a goal rather than a strong reality. I think=
 the text should try to bring more shades between theory and reality. As an=
 example, I found the statement "This traffic loss is due to the fact that =
PE1 and PE2 will continue to attract equal amount of CE1 destined traffic f=
rom remote PEs" too strong as remote PEs will drive the flow loadbalancing =
based on their hashing config and will try to provide equal cost loadbalanc=
ing without any guarantee, at least they will distribute flows equally, not=
 traffic.
  *   s/remote hosts MUST also/remote hosts must also/ =3D> I agree this is=
 the goal, but we are not really specifying anything here.


Section 1.2:

  *   You should mention that people usually implement "min-link" on LAGs t=
o overcome this issue. However this creates an overall loose of BW .

Section 3.1:
s/a additional/an additional/
s/EXT-COMM/extended community/ =3D> please do it across the document.

There is one instance of [BGP-LINK-BW] that is not displayed as an hyperlin=
k, should be an issue with source file.
Is the goal to have LINK-BW doc being modified ? If yes, we will not progre=
ss this doc until LINK-BW is ready. Today the doc is expired. This is a maj=
or issue that you should solve before moving forward.

Section 3.2:
s/A receiving PE should use/A receiving PE SHOULD use/

Do we need to standardize how we compute normalized weight ? Can't this be =
a local behavior as long as computation achieves the goal ?

Why using "receiving PE MUST compute" while first statement was a "SHOULD" =
?

Again, please avoid using upper case words, it brings confusion. Can we rep=
hrase the last paragraph:
"Normalized weights for a particular ESI MUST NOT be computed until a link =
bandwidth attribute is received on all BGP paths of the associated Route Ty=
pe 1. When one or more BGP paths of the route type 1 does not have the link=
 bandwidth attribute, regular ECMP procedures MUST be used."

Can't we consider an advertisement without community as W=3D1 instead of mo=
ving everything back to ECMP ? What would be the side effect ?


Section 4:
s/BW may/BW MAY/

Section 4.1:
[RFC8584] miss its hypertext link.

Did you get an early allocation for your bit number ? If not, please make i=
t TBD.

Section 4.2:
You should better describe the modifications done in RFC7432 and mention cl=
early that you modify RFC7432 behavior.
Using similar wording and sentences will help.

Basically, you should explain that a PE may have multiple ordinals and mod =
is performed against a new N value.

Section 4.3:
[RFC8584] miss its hypertext link.
[EVPN-PER-MCAST-FLOW-
   DF] miss its hypertext link

Section 4.3.1:
[EVPN-PER-MCAST-FLOW-
   DF] miss its hypertext link

s/bandwidth increment must/bandwidth increment MUST/

s/compute a random/computes a random/


Section 4.3.2:
Section uses "affinity" while RFC8584 does not have this vocabulary. As you=
 are modifying RFC8584, please use same vocabulary. What is changed is not =
fully clear.


Section 4.3.3:
"Same also applies to use"... would be good to mention this in 4.2 in that =
case

Section 4.4:
This document is still an individual draft. Your doc will be blocked until =
the WHRW becomes RFC...
I don't think it is a good idea. You should probably remove this section an=
d covers it in WHRW or another draft.
Same remark will apply to MCAST-FLOW-DF.


Section 4.5:
Is there any reason to prefer the highest BW link ? This is not the goal of=
 the draft.
If you want to keep UCMP, you should make Pref-DF not compatible with LBW w=
hich means that if it is advertised, PEs don't care about LBW community.


Section 6:
I can't parse: "A host MAC... control plane o Host" Is there an indentation=
 issue ?


IANA:

You should have an IANA section for your bit allocation.

SECURITY:

Should have a security section.





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</head>
<body lang=3D"FR" link=3D"#0563C1" vlink=3D"#954F72">
<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Hi Authors,<o:p></o:p></span></=
p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Please find my review of the do=
cument.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Nits to be fixed:<o:p></o:p></s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://www6.ietf.org/tools/idnits?url=3D=
https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-03.txt"><sp=
an lang=3D"EN-US">https://www6.ietf.org/tools/idnits?url=3Dhttps://www.ietf=
.org/archive/id/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-03.txt</span></a><o:p></o:p=
></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Section 1.1:<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0cm" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 level1 =
lfo3"><span lang=3D"EN-US">s/it MUST add a link to both PE1/it must add a l=
ink to both PE1/ =3D&gt; this is not a normative statement<o:p></o:p></span=
></li><li class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 l=
evel1 lfo3"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Also, avoid upper case for ANY or ONLY. It=
 doesn&#8217;t bring anything.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=3D"MsoListPa=
ragraph" style=3D"margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo3"><span lang=3D"EN=
-US">ECMP usually does not take care of flow bandwidth but rather than uses=
 static hashing. ECMP is more a goal rather than a strong reality. I think =
the text should
 try to bring more shades between theory and reality. As an example, I foun=
d the statement &#8220;This traffic loss is due to the fact that PE1 and PE=
2 will continue to attract equal amount of CE1 destined traffic from remote=
 PEs&#8221; too strong as remote PEs will drive
 the flow loadbalancing based on their hashing config and will try to provi=
de equal cost loadbalancing without any guarantee, at least they will distr=
ibute flows equally, not traffic.<o:p></o:p></span></li><li class=3D"MsoLis=
tParagraph" style=3D"margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo3"><span lang=3D=
"EN-US">s/remote hosts MUST also/remote hosts must also/ =3D&gt; I agree th=
is is the goal, but we are not really specifying anything here.<o:p></o:p><=
/span></li></ul>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Section 1.2:<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0cm" type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"margin-left:0cm;mso-list:l2 level1 =
lfo6"><span lang=3D"EN-US">You should mention that people usually implement=
 &#8220;min-link&#8221; on LAGs to overcome this issue. However this create=
s an overall loose of BW .<o:p></o:p></span></li></ul>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Section 3.1:<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">s/a additional/an additional/<o=
:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">s/EXT-COMM/extended community/ =
=3D&gt; please do it across the document.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">There is one instance of [BGP-L=
INK-BW] that is not displayed as an hyperlink, should be an issue with sour=
ce file.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Is the goal to have LINK-BW doc=
 being modified ? If yes, we will not progress this doc until LINK-BW is re=
ady. Today the doc is expired. This is a major issue that you should solve =
before moving forward.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Section 3.2:<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">s/A receiving PE should use/A r=
eceiving PE SHOULD use/<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Do we need to standardize how w=
e compute normalized weight ? Can&#8217;t this be a local behavior as long =
as computation achieves the goal ?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Why using &#8220;receiving PE M=
UST compute&#8221; while first statement was a &#8220;SHOULD&#8221; ?<o:p><=
/o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Again, please avoid using upper=
 case words, it brings confusion. Can we rephrase the last paragraph:<o:p><=
/o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">&#8220;Normalized weights for a=
 particular ESI MUST NOT be computed until a link bandwidth attribute is re=
ceived on all BGP paths of the associated Route Type 1. When one or more BG=
P paths of the route type 1 does not have
 the link bandwidth attribute, regular ECMP procedures MUST be used.&#8221;=
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Can&#8217;t we consider an adve=
rtisement without community as W=3D1 instead of moving everything back to E=
CMP ? What would be the side effect ?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Section 4:<o:p></o:p></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">s/BW may/BW MAY/<o:p></o:p></sp=
an></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Section 4.1:<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">[RFC8584] miss its hypertext li=
nk.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Did you get an early allocation=
 for your bit number ? If not, please make it TBD.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Section 4.2:<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">You should better describe the =
modifications done in RFC7432 and mention clearly that you modify RFC7432 b=
ehavior.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Using similar wording and sente=
nces will help.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Basically, you should explain t=
hat a PE may have multiple ordinals and mod is performed against a new N va=
lue.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Section 4.3:<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">[RFC8584] miss its hypertext li=
nk.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:black;mso-fareast-language:FR">[EVPN-P=
ER-MCAST-FLOW-<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:black;mso-fareast-language:FR">&nbsp;&=
nbsp; DF] miss its hypertext link<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Section 4.3.1:<o:p></o:p></span=
></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:black;mso-fareast-language:FR">[EVPN-P=
ER-MCAST-FLOW-<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:black;mso-fareast-language:FR">&nbsp;&=
nbsp; DF] miss its hypertext link<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">s/bandwidth increment must/band=
width increment MUST/<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">s/compute a random/computes a r=
andom/<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Section 4.3.2:<o:p></o:p></span=
></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Section uses &#8220;affinity&#8=
221; while RFC8584 does not have this vocabulary. As you are modifying RFC8=
584, please use same vocabulary. What is changed is not fully clear.<o:p></=
o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Section 4.3.3:<o:p></o:p></span=
></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">&#8220;Same also applies to use=
&#8221;&#8230; would be good to mention this in 4.2 in that case<o:p></o:p>=
</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Section 4.4:<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">This document is still an indiv=
idual draft. Your doc will be blocked until the WHRW becomes RFC&#8230;<o:p=
></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">I don&#8217;t think it is a goo=
d idea. You should probably remove this section and covers it in WHRW or an=
other draft.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Same remark will apply to MCAST=
-FLOW-DF.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Section 4.5:<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Is there any reason to prefer t=
he highest BW link ? This is not the goal of the draft.<o:p></o:p></span></=
p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">If you want to keep UCMP, you s=
hould make Pref-DF not compatible with LBW which means that if it is advert=
ised, PEs don&#8217;t care about LBW community.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Section 6:<o:p></o:p></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">I can&#8217;t parse: &#8220;A h=
ost MAC&#8230; control plane o Host&#8221; Is there an indentation issue ?<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">IANA:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">You should have an IANA section=
 for your bit allocation.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">SECURITY:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Should have a security section.=
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
</body>
</html>

--_000_MN2PR11MB3583E3686A3F3F7F5028DB75C2CF0MN2PR11MB3583namp_--


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In-Reply-To: <9E014550-3B6F-4CBD-8FFF-78213F122C02@nokia.com>
From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2020 18:14:05 -0400
Message-ID: <CABNhwV26h=G5rgYF7HrUW=uG2BH-5fcGY_PZK9X2H_R3-LdesQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>
Cc: BESS <bess@ietf.org>, "UTTARO, JAMES" <ju1738@att.com>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/k-jyA3mSXMe1cByF3l7VlNpdVUk>
Subject: Re: [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
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Hi Jorge & Jim

Thanks you for your responses.  I am all set.

In summary this is exactly what I am looking for as are many other
customers and the Gateway PE inter-working the the primary use case or
other alternative is to stretch EVPN AFI/SAFI over the core and keep EVPN &
IVPN separate.  As you said as more customers start moving to EVPN and
start using the inter-working features a composite PE may become more
popular down the road.

Kind regards,

Gyan

On Thu, Mar 26, 2020 at 5:11 AM Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View) <
jorge.rabadan@nokia.com> wrote:

> Hi Gyan,
>
>
>
> In-line, please.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jorge
>
>
>
> *From: *Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
> *Date: *Thursday, March 26, 2020 at 8:50 AM
> *To: *"Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.co=
m
> >
> *Cc: *BESS <bess@ietf.org>, "UTTARO, JAMES" <ju1738@att.com>
> *Subject: *Re: [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi Jorge
>
>
>
> Thank you for the correction I did mean type 2 so that=E2=80=99s good the=
 host
> routes can be blocked.
>
>
>
> What are your thoughts on the placement of the gateway or composite PE
> inter-working function on the core or DC side?
>
> [Jorge] as you can see we wrote procedures for the gateway and composite
> cases, and even for the gateway+composite case. With those three cases I
> think we can address most use-cases. My thoughts? Today I mostly see the
> gateway use-case, where the gateway function is placed into the DCGW. Jim
> was also showing his use-case, that it uses gateways connecting the EVPN
> domains into the ipvpn one. But as more features are added to EVPN, I can
> see evpn and ipvpn PEs in the same domain and the composite function bein=
g
> used more and more.
>
>
>
> Understood on eve BGP LU tunnel to stitch the domain together so it=E2=80=
=99s
> contiguous.  Could you also just extend and overlay the BGP EVPN AFI/SAFI
> over the MPLS core domains as an option for DCI.
>
> [Jorge] yup
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
> Gyan
>
>
>
> On Thu, Mar 26, 2020 at 3:22 AM Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)=
 <
> jorge.rabadan@nokia.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Gyan,
>
>
>
> =E2=80=9CIs it possible in either gateway or composite PE interworking fu=
nction
> that we can only export out the type 5 routes and block the type 4 host
> routes from being exported into IPVPN.  In most all cases there would be =
a
> L3 VNI tenant VRF prefix which would be represented by the Type 5 which i=
s
> sufficient of reachability. =E2=80=9C
>
>
>
> I think you mean EVPN type 2 routes. Yes, you should be able to do that.
>
>
>
> =E2=80=9CI did notice at the bottom of page 6 & top of page 7 single doma=
in
> scenario depicted.  I was curious to understand in that scenario how does
> BGP-LU come into play??=E2=80=9D
>
>
>
> Note that a =E2=80=9Cdomain=E2=80=9D is defined as follows: =E2=80=9CTwo =
PEs are in the same
> domain if they are attached to the same tenant and the packets between th=
em
> do not require a data path IP lookup (in the tenant space) in any
> intermediate router.=E2=80=9D In figure 3 we wanted to illustrate an exam=
ple where
> PE1 and PE2 belong to the same domain, no ip-lookups in between. For that=
,
> you need to connect PE1 and PE2 by a tunnel that can cross different ASNs=
,
> and BGP-LU can do that.
>
>
>
> Hope it helps.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Jorge
>
>
>
>
>
> *From: *BESS <bess-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Gyan Mishra <
> hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
> *Date: *Wednesday, March 25, 2020 at 10:44 PM
> *To: *"UTTARO, JAMES" <ju1738@att.com>
> *Cc: *BESS <bess@ietf.org>
> *Subject: *Re: [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
>
>
>
> Hi Jim
>
>
>
> I read through the draft.  This is exactly what I was looking for.  So in
> our scenario we would use the gateway PE option where we are exporting th=
e
> EVPN routes & importing  VPNv4 & VPNv6 and vice versa and would use the "=
D
> Path" attribute for loop avoidance between domains.  Our DCI scenario wou=
ld
> be like  your drawing depicted where our Data Center core "router server"
> box that inter-connects all the PODs vxlan fabrics via BGP EVPN in the Da=
ta
> Center - This box would act as the demark between the "DC" and "Core" and
> would be the one doing the import/export "gateway PE" inter-working
> function to the IPVPN PE for core to data center reachability..
>
>
>
> I noticed in section 4.3 the aggregation of routes option as we would not
> want the host routes to be propagated into IPVPN.
>
>
>
> In the ineterworking option if we wanted to extend each tenant VRF
> natively 1-1 mapping into unique L3 VPN VRF or take all the EVPN tenant
> VRFs ISF SAFI and import all into a single IPVPN VRF do we have that
> flexibility to map as desired.  Also if the Gateway PE was our DC route
> server box and we wanted to extend to the core natively  each tenant VRF
> 1-1 mapping into different unique IPVPN VRFs - since this is now an
> inter-AS LSP -exiting the DC to the PE the DC PE & Core PE would be actin=
g
> as "inter-as" ASBRs in that case and would have to do an inter-as opt
> a,b,c,ab style.
>
>
>
> I think the tricky part is where the Demark "Gateway PE" resides -- on th=
e
> Core side or DC side.  If it ends up being the DC box the DC to Core is
> eBGP peering and then you would need to do inter-as L3 vpn option to exte=
nd
> the LSP. However, if the "Gateway PE" function resides on the Core PE the=
n
> you would extend EVPN AFI to the core PE and then perform the gateway
> function where now its iBGP in the core and use can use the core RR for
> your LSP and now the edge inter-as LSP complexity does not occur.
>
>
>
> Is it possible in either gateway or composite PE interworking function
> that we can only export out the type 5 routes and block the type 4 host
> routes from being exported into IPVPN.  In most all cases there would be =
a
> L3 VNI tenant VRF prefix which would be represented by the Type 5 which i=
s
> sufficient of reachability.
>
>
>
> Our other scenario for DCI interconnect would be extending EVPN AFI/SAFI
> over the mpls core.  This scenario keeps IPVPN & EVPN separate.
>
>
>
> I did notice at the bottom of page 6 & top of page 7 single domain
> scenario depicted.  I was curious to understand in that scenario how does
> BGP-LU come into play??
>
>
>
> <------------------------------------------------->
>
>                                 BGP-LU
>
>            <------------------------------------------------->
>
>
>
>                           ASBR------------ASBR
>
>                          +------+       +------+
>
>            +-------------|      |       |      |-------------+
>
>           PE1            +------+       +--+---+            PE2
>
>         +------+   DC1      |     WAN      |     DC2     +------+
>
>     TS1-|IP-VRF|   EVPN     |              |     EVPN    |IP-VRF|-TS2
>
>         +------+          ASBR            ASBR           +---+--+
>
>            |             +------+       +------+             |
>
>            +-------------|      |       |      |-------------+
>
>                          +------+       +------+
>
>                             +--------------+
>
>
>
>            <--------------------DOMAIN-1--------------------->
>
>
>
> Kind regards
>
>
>
> Gyan
>
> Verizon
>
> Cell 301 502-1347
>
>
>
> On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 8:16 AM UTTARO, JAMES <ju1738@att.com> wrote:
>
> *Gyan,*
>
>
>
> *              Does the attached slide correlate with your requirement? M=
y
> thoughts are that the interworking needs to support both intra WAN and WA=
N
> connectivity to DCs.. The introduction of D-PATH is required to ensure th=
at
> a path p can traverse multiple signaling domains i.e EVPN<->L3VPN<->EVPN.=
.
> I would be interested in your use cases..*
>
>
>
> *Thanks,*
>
> *              Jim Uttaro*
>
>
>
> *From:* BESS <bess-bounces@ietf.org> *On Behalf Of *Gyan Mishra
> *Sent:* Wednesday, March 25, 2020 1:37 AM
> *To:* BESS <bess@ietf.org>
> *Subject:* [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard
>
>
>
>
> Dear BESS,
>
>
>
> Does anyone know if this draft has been picked up in another draft or is
> on its way to become standardized.  Please provide data tracker if so.
>
>
>
> This is a much needed feature for operators for DC for mpls core
> connectivity DCI extension.
>
>
>
>
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-rabadan-sajassi-bess-evpn-ipvpn-in=
terworking/
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__datatracker.ietf.=
org_doc_draft-2Drabadan-2Dsajassi-2Dbess-2Devpn-2Dipvpn-2Dinterworking_&d=
=3DDwMFaQ&c=3DLFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&r=3Ds7ZzB4JbPv3nYuoSx5Gy8Q&m=3DQ5Qb9X0=
Q_fH2abLb-9fPBNqCki_KBGPuOaZeJsigPGA&s=3Dg_SDL98eh20_aja820tdFnjy-_G79Zekfv=
d3t5YTEoQ&e=3D>
>
>
>
> I see this draft is close to being published but is intra DC integration
> with IP mpls vpn.  I am not completely clear if the inter working functio=
n
> by the draft above is completely picked up by this draft.
>
>
>
>
> https://tools.ietf..org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding=
-08
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__tools.ietf.org_ht=
ml_draft-2Dietf-2Dbess-2Devpn-2Dinter-2Dsubnet-2Dforwarding-2D08&d=3DDwMFaQ=
&c=3DLFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&r=3Ds7ZzB4JbPv3nYuoSx5Gy8Q&m=3DQ5Qb9X0Q_fH2abLb=
-9fPBNqCki_KBGPuOaZeJsigPGA&s=3DBv-Oy0p0_u2EDBbejfuQYIoR8hOUinTQS0CF-Y_DpfU=
&e=3D>
>
>
>
>
>
> Kind regards
>
>
>
> Gyan
>
> Verizon
>
> cell 301 502-1347
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Gyan  Mishra
>
> Network Engineering & Technology
>
> Verizon
>
> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>
> Phone: 301 502-1347
>
> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Gyan  Mishra
>
> Network Engineering & Technology
>
> Verizon
>
> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>
> Phone: 301 502-1347
>
> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>
>
>
>
>


--=20

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><div>Hi Jorge &amp; Jim</div><div><br></div><div>Thanks yo=
u for your responses.=C2=A0 I am all set.</div><div><br></div><div>In summa=
ry this is exactly what I am looking for as are many other customers and th=
e Gateway PE inter-working the the primary use case or other alternative is=
 to stretch EVPN AFI/SAFI over the core and keep EVPN &amp; IVPN separate.=
=C2=A0 As you said as more customers start moving to EVPN and start using t=
he inter-working features a composite PE may become more popular down the r=
oad.</div><div><br></div><div>Kind regards,</div><div><br></div><div>Gyan</=
div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On=
 Thu, Mar 26, 2020 at 5:11 AM Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View) &lt=
;<a href=3D"mailto:jorge.rabadan@nokia.com">jorge.rabadan@nokia.com</a>&gt;=
 wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px =
0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-US">
<div class=3D"gmail-m_3160507372523639669WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">Hi Gyan,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">In-line, please.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">Thanks,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">Jorge<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(181,196,223);padding:3pt 0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><b><span style=3D"font-si=
ze:12pt;color:black">From:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Gyan Mishra &lt;<a hr=
ef=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusagsm@gmail.com=
</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Date: </b>Thursday, March 26, 2020 at 8:50 AM<br>
<b>To: </b>&quot;Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)&quot; &lt;<a hre=
f=3D"mailto:jorge.rabadan@nokia.com" target=3D"_blank">jorge.rabadan@nokia.=
com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc: </b>BESS &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess=
@ietf.org</a>&gt;, &quot;UTTARO, JAMES&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ju1738@a=
tt.com" target=3D"_blank">ju1738@att.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard<u></=
u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Hi Jorge=C2=A0<u></u><u><=
/u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Thank you for the correct=
ion I did mean type 2 so that=E2=80=99s good the host routes can be blocked=
.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">What are your thoughts on=
 the placement of the gateway or composite PE inter-working function on the=
 core or DC side? =C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
">[Jorge] as you can see we wrote procedures for the gateway and composite =
cases, and even for the gateway+composite case. With those three cases I th=
ink we can address most use-cases. My
 thoughts? Today I mostly see the gateway use-case, where the gateway funct=
ion is placed into the DCGW. Jim was also showing his use-case, that it use=
s gateways connecting the EVPN domains into the ipvpn one. But as more feat=
ures are added to EVPN, I can see
 evpn and ipvpn PEs in the same domain and the composite function being use=
d more and more.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Understood on eve BGP LU =
tunnel to stitch the domain together so it=E2=80=99s contiguous.=C2=A0 Coul=
d you also just extend and overlay the BGP EVPN AFI/SAFI over the MPLS core=
 domains as an option for DCI. =C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">[Jorge] yup<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas=
"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Thanks=C2=A0<u></u><u></u=
></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">On Thu, Mar 26, 2020 at 3=
:22 AM Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View) &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jorg=
e.rabadan@nokia.com" target=3D"_blank">jorge.rabadan@nokia.com</a>&gt; wrot=
e:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;b=
order-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin-left:4=
.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas">Hi Gyan,</span><u></u=
><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas">=C2=A0</span><u></u><=
u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:-webkit-standard,serif;color:black">=E2=80=9CIs =
it possible in either gateway or composite PE interworking function that we=
 can only export out the type 5 routes and block the type 4 host routes fro=
m being exported into IPVPN.=C2=A0 In most all
 cases there would be a L3 VNI tenant VRF prefix which would be represented=
 by the Type 5 which is sufficient of reachability.=C2=A0=E2=80=9C</span><u=
></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:-webkit-standard,serif;color:black">=C2=A0</span=
><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas">I think you mean EVPN=
 type 2 routes. Yes, you should be able to do that.</span><u></u><u></u></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:-webkit-standard,serif;color:black">=C2=A0</span=
><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:-webkit-standard,serif;color:black">=E2=80=9CI d=
id notice at the bottom=C2=A0of page 6 &amp; top of page 7 single domain sc=
enario depicted.=C2=A0 I was curious to understand in that scenario how doe=
s BGP-LU come into play??=E2=80=9D</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas">=C2=A0</span><u></u><=
u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas">Note that a =E2=80=9C=
domain=E2=80=9D is defined as follows: =E2=80=9CTwo PEs are in the same dom=
ain if they are attached to the same tenant and the packets between them do=
 not require a data path IP lookup (in the tenant space) in
 any intermediate router.=E2=80=9D In figure 3 we wanted to illustrate an e=
xample where PE1 and PE2 belong to the same domain, no ip-lookups in betwee=
n. For that, you need to connect PE1 and PE2 by a tunnel that can cross dif=
ferent ASNs, and BGP-LU can do that.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas">=C2=A0</span><u></u><=
u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas">Hope it helps.</span>=
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas">Thanks.</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas">Jorge</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas">=C2=A0</span><u></u><=
u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas">=C2=A0</span><u></u><=
u></u></p>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(181,196,223);padding:3pt 0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">From: </span></b><span style=
=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">BESS &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess-bounces@iet=
f.org" target=3D"_blank">bess-bounces@ietf.org</a>&gt; on behalf of Gyan Mi=
shra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabus=
agsm@gmail.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Date: </b>Wednesday, March 25, 2020 at 10:44 PM<br>
<b>To: </b>&quot;UTTARO, JAMES&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ju1738@att.com" =
target=3D"_blank">ju1738@att.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc: </b>BESS &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess=
@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard</spa=
n><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
Hi Jim<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
I read through the draft.=C2=A0 This is exactly what I was looking for.=C2=
=A0 So in our scenario we would use the gateway PE option where we are expo=
rting the EVPN routes &amp; importing=C2=A0 VPNv4 &amp; VPNv6 and vice vers=
a and would use the &quot;D Path&quot; attribute for loop avoidance
 between=C2=A0domains.=C2=A0 Our DCI scenario would be like=C2=A0 your draw=
ing depicted=C2=A0where our Data Center core &quot;router server&quot; box =
that inter-connects all the PODs vxlan fabrics via BGP EVPN in the Data Cen=
ter - This box would act as the demark between the &quot;DC&quot; and &quot=
;Core&quot;
 and would be the one doing the import/export &quot;gateway PE&quot; inter-=
working function to the IPVPN PE for core to data center reachability..=C2=
=A0=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
I noticed in section 4.3 the aggregation of routes option as we would not w=
ant the host routes to be propagated into IPVPN.=C2=A0=C2=A0<u></u><u></u><=
/p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
In the ineterworking=C2=A0option if we wanted to extend each tenant VRF nat=
ively 1-1 mapping into unique=C2=A0L3 VPN VRF or take all the EVPN tenant V=
RFs ISF SAFI and import all into a single IPVPN VRF do we have that flexibi=
lity to map as desired.=C2=A0 Also if the Gateway
 PE was our DC route server box and we wanted to extend to the core nativel=
y=C2=A0 each tenant VRF 1-1 mapping into different unique IPVPN VRFs - sinc=
e this is now an inter-AS LSP -exiting the DC to the PE the DC PE &amp; Cor=
e PE would be acting as &quot;inter-as&quot; ASBRs
 in that case and would have to do an inter-as opt a,b,c,ab style.=C2=A0=C2=
=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
I think the tricky part is where the Demark &quot;Gateway PE&quot; resides =
-- on the Core side or DC side.=C2=A0 If it ends up being the DC box the DC=
 to Core is eBGP peering and then you would need to do inter-as L3 vpn opti=
on to extend the LSP. However, if the &quot;Gateway
 PE&quot; function resides on the Core PE then you would extend EVPN AFI to=
 the core PE and then perform the gateway function where now its iBGP in th=
e core and use can use the core RR for your LSP and now the edge inter-as L=
SP complexity does not occur.=C2=A0=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
Is it possible in either gateway or composite PE interworking function that=
 we can only export out the type 5 routes and block the type 4 host routes =
from being exported into IPVPN.=C2=A0 In most all cases there would be a L3=
 VNI tenant VRF prefix which would be
 represented by the Type 5 which is sufficient of reachability.=C2=A0<u></u=
><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
Our other scenario for DCI interconnect would be extending EVPN AFI/SAFI ov=
er the mpls core.=C2=A0 This scenario keeps IPVPN &amp; EVPN separate.=C2=
=A0=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
I did notice at the bottom=C2=A0of page 6 &amp; top of page 7 single domain=
 scenario depicted.=C2=A0 I was curious to understand in that scenario how =
does BGP-LU come into play??<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:72pt;break-before:page"><span style=3D"color:blac=
k">&lt;-------------------------------------------------&gt;</span><u></u><=
u></u></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:72pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 BGP-LU</span><u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:72pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 &lt;-------------------------=
------------------------&gt;</span><u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:72pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0</span><u=
></u><u></u></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:72pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ASBR----------=
--ASBR</span><u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:72pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+</span><u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:72pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-------------|=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |-------------+</span><u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:72pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 PE1=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 +--+---+=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 PE2</span><u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:72pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+=C2=A0=C2=A0 DC1=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 WAN=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 DC2=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+</span><u></u><u>=
</u></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:72pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0 TS1-|IP-VRF|=C2=A0=C2=A0 EVPN=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 | =C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0EVPN=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |IP-VRF|-TS2</span><u></u><u></u></pr=
e>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:72pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ASBR=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0 ASBR=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0 +---+--+</span><u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:72pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |</span><u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:72pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-------------|=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |-------------+</span><u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:72pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +------+</span><u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:72pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-=
-------------+</span><u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:72pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0</span><u=
></u><u></u></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:72pt"><span style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 &lt;--------------------DOMAI=
N-1---------------------&gt;</span><u></u><u></u></pre>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
Kind regards<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
Verizon <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
Cell 301 502-1347<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
On Wed, Mar 25, 2020 at 8:16 AM UTTARO, JAMES &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ju1738@=
att.com" target=3D"_blank">ju1738@att.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;b=
order-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6pt;margin:5pt 0c=
m 5pt 4.8pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:rgb(112,48,160)">Gyan,</span></b><u>=
</u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:rgb(112,48,160)">=C2=A0</span></b><u=
></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:rgb(112,48,160)">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Does the attac=
hed slide correlate with your requirement? My thoughts are that the interwo=
rking needs to support both intra WAN and WAN connectivity to DCs.. The int=
roduction of D-PATH is required
 to ensure that a path p can traverse multiple signaling domains i.e EVPN&l=
t;-&gt;L3VPN&lt;-&gt;EVPN.. I would be interested in your use cases..</span=
></b><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:rgb(112,48,160)">=C2=A0</span></b><u=
></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:rgb(112,48,160)">Thanks,</span></b><=
u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:rgb(112,48,160)">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Jim Uttaro</sp=
an></b><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<b><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:rgb(112,48,160)">=C2=A0</span></b><u=
></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<b>From:</b> BESS &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess-bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_b=
lank">bess-bounces@ietf.org</a>&gt;
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Gyan Mishra<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, March 25, 2020 1:37 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> BESS &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess=
@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [bess] vxlan evpn and L3 vpn interworking standard<u></u><u=
></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<br>
Dear BESS,<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
Does anyone know if this draft has been picked up in another draft or is on=
 its way to become standardized.=C2=A0 Please provide data tracker if so.<u=
></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
This is a much needed feature for operators for DC for mpls core connectivi=
ty DCI extension.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<a href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__datatrack=
er.ietf.org_doc_draft-2Drabadan-2Dsajassi-2Dbess-2Devpn-2Dipvpn-2Dinterwork=
ing_&amp;d=3DDwMFaQ&amp;c=3DLFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&amp;r=3Ds7ZzB4JbPv3nYuoS=
x5Gy8Q&amp;m=3DQ5Qb9X0Q_fH2abLb-9fPBNqCki_KBGPuOaZeJsigPGA&amp;s=3Dg_SDL98e=
h20_aja820tdFnjy-_G79Zekfvd3t5YTEoQ&amp;e=3D" target=3D"_blank">https://dat=
atracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-rabadan-sajassi-bess-evpn-ipvpn-interworking/</=
a><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
I see this draft is close to being published but is intra DC integration wi=
th IP mpls vpn.=C2=A0 I am not completely clear if the inter working functi=
on by the draft above is completely picked up by this draft.<u></u><u></u><=
/p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<a href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__tools.iet=
f.org_html_draft-2Dietf-2Dbess-2Devpn-2Dinter-2Dsubnet-2Dforwarding-2D08&am=
p;d=3DDwMFaQ&amp;c=3DLFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&amp;r=3Ds7ZzB4JbPv3nYuoSx5Gy8Q&=
amp;m=3DQ5Qb9X0Q_fH2abLb-9fPBNqCki_KBGPuOaZeJsigPGA&amp;s=3DBv-Oy0p0_u2EDBb=
ejfuQYIoR8hOUinTQS0CF-Y_DpfU&amp;e=3D" target=3D"_blank">https://tools.ietf=
..org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-08</a><u></u><u></u=
></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
Kind regards=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
Gyan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
Verizon=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
cell 301 502-1347<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
Sent from my iPhone<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<br clear=3D"all">
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
-- <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Gyan=
=C2=A0 Mishra</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Netwo=
rk Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Veriz=
on=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Silve=
r Spring, MD 20904</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Phone=
: 301 502-1347</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Email=
: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">
gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:72pt">
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Gyan=
=C2=A0 Mishra</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Netwo=
rk Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Veriz=
on=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Silve=
r Spring, MD 20904</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Phone=
: 301 502-1347</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:black">Email=
: <a href=3D"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">
gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt">
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div><br clear=3D"all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"=
 class=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr=
"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font size=3D"1=
" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=C2=A0 Mi=
shra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000=
000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</fo=
nt></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"ge=
orgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"=
1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20904</font>=
</p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georg=
ia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=
=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D"mailto:g=
yan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a></=
font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div></div></=
div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>

--000000000000ef096205a1c94f56--


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From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2020 01:48:01 -0400
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To: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
Cc: Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>, Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, "idr@ietf.org" <idr@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [bess] [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-safi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI
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--000000000000f2821e05a2201c3c
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Robert  & Linda

Sorry to inject myself into this thread.

You stated that that RFC 4364 SAFI 128 for vpnv4 vpnv6 is the BGP control
plane service layer overlay from PE to RR. Agreed.  By default all PEs
including the SDWAN PE have RT Filtering enabled by default and only import
the RT into the VRF at the control plane level if the VRF is configured
with RT advertised by the RR is being imported by the PE, if not the SAFI
128 prefixes are dropped.  So I understand that the BGP updates is a
control plane function, but how would the routes get imported by the PE if
the VRF is not defined on the PE.  RFC 4684 RTC capability allows only the
RTs imported on the PE to be advertised by the RR to reduced the SAFI 128
route advertised by the RR that would result in being filtered on the PE.

So how would that work using SAFI 128 RT to provide the network slicing for
SDWAN without VRF configured.

Also you mentioned that SAFI 128 L3 vpn services overlay can run over any
underlay and that does not have to be MPLS based.  I know SAFI 128 works
with SR-MPLS but there you are reusing the MPLS data plane.  With SRv6 due
to PM draft signaling by egress PE for end.dx instantiation, so there is
not any service label necessary as is with MPLS and thus SAFI 128 works
with SRv6.

How would SAFI 128 work with IP underlay used with SDWAN?

Even with  inter-as option b c ab, with BGP LU you do have topmost label
which is via BGP labeled unicast.  For inter as options if SAFI128 would
work w/o BGP LU you could just run SAFI 128 over IP.  I have never tried
but I think the control plane would come up but the data plane would be
broken.

Kind regards

Gyan

On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 9:26 PM Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
wrote:

> Robert,
>
>
>
> Want to confirm the following two points with you. Do I interpret your
> words correctly?
>
>
>
>    - If a CPE supports traditional VPN with multiple VRFs, and supports
>    multiple SDWAN instances, the traditional VRF configuration is still s=
ame
>    which are carried by BGP Route Target Extended community.
>    - For the SDWAN Instances supported by the same CPE, we can use
>    Extended Community with a different name (say SDWAN Target ID). When t=
he
>    SDWAN Target ID is used, the SAFI 128 can be used for routes for the S=
DWAN
>    instance,  with the exception that the label in the NLRI is not the MP=
LS
>    label carried by the data packets .
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
>
>
> Linda Dunbar
>
> *From:* Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, March 24, 2020 3:32 AM
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> *Cc:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org; bess@ietf.or=
g
> *Subject:* Re: [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-safi
> using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI
>
>
>
> Hi Linda,
>
>
>
> Nope you do not need VRFs. RT construct works at the control plane level.
> VRF may be useful for traffic separation purposes on multitenant CPEs or =
if
> you would like to relax requirements for unique IP across SDWAN sites - b=
ut
> not a must otherwise.
>
>
>
> My main point was  that BGP SAFI 128 gives you for free transport for
> multiple routing contexts so why not leverage it as is?
>
>
>
> Moreover you may suddenly also discover that RTC (RFC4684) is your
> SDWAN friend too.
>
>
>
> Many thx,
> R.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 5:15 AM Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> wrote:
>
> Robert,
>
>
>
> Thank you very much for the feedback.
>
>
>
> If using your suggested Route Target approach to represent the SDWAN
> Instance ID, does it mean that a SDWAN Edge has to use the same approach =
to
> configure the VRF for SDWAN instances?
>
> If the edge node supports both traditional VPN and SDWAN, will it cause
> confusion for RT to represent both?
>
>
>
> RT is encoded in the Extended_Communities Path Attribute, SAFI 128 is
> encoded in the MP_REACH_NLRI Path Attribute.
>
>
>
> What do you mean by saying =E2=80=9Cdifferent name to Route target(s) car=
ried in
> the SAFI 128=E2=80=9D?
>
> Do you mean having a different name (say SDWAN_Target) in
> Extended_Communities Path Attribute, and have MP_REACH_NLRI Path Attribut=
e
> including the SAFI 128?
>
>
>
> SDWAN Instance ID is for the control Plane, not to be carried by the data
> packets. SAFI 128 for VPN has the Label encoded in the NLRI field that is
> to be carried by the data packets. But SDWAN Instance ID is not carried b=
y
> the Data Packets. Is it correct?
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
> Linda
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
> *Sent:* Monday, March 23, 2020 2:28 PM
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> *Cc:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org; bess@ietf.or=
g
> *Subject:* Re: [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-safi
> using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI
>
>
>
> Hi Linda,
>
>
>
> I think you are mixing data plane and control plane.
>
>
>
> In SDWAN data plane is of no issue as you are interconnecting sites in a
> given VPN over mesh of secure tunnels.
>
>
>
> You are asking how to keep control plane separate between VPN instances.
> This is precisely what RFC4364 does already and RT import/export is used =
to
> indicate the instance which given set of reachability belongs. Why to
> reinvent the wheel and do something new just for the heck of it :) ?
>
>
>
> To be original you can at best invent a different name to Route target(s)
> carried in the SAFI 128 but let's keep the mechanism the same. That would
> be my suggestion.
>
>
>
> Kind regards,
>
> R.
>
>
>
> PS. While this is obvious for some many folks are still confused. RFC4364
> does not need to run over MPLS data plane. It can run over IPSec or over
> DTLS or over UDP/IP just fine.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 6:47 PM Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> wrote:
>
> IDR experts:
>
>
>
> SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks. A
> SDWAN edge node may need to map client traffic to different SDWAN network
> instances (or segmentations).
>
> It might not be feasible to use the AS number in the BGP message to
> differentiate the SDWAN network instances as multiple SDWAN instances may
> share the same AS number.
>
>
>
> We would like to hear feedback from IDR group on using similar method as
>  Binding MPLS Labels to Address Prefixes [RFC8277] to bind SDWAN Instance
> ID to  prefixes.
>
>
>
> When  MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) is present, MPLS label is carried by NLRI
> [RFC8277] as:
>
>
>
>       0                   1                   2                   3
>
>       0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
>
>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>      |    Length     |                 Label                 |Rsrv |S|
>
>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>      |                          Prefix                               ~
>
>      ~                                                               |
>
>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>
>
>                        Figure 2: NLRI with One Label
>
>
>
> We would like to  propose the SDWAN Instance ID being encoded in the Labe=
l
> field as follows when SDWAN SAFI (=3D74 allocated by IANA) is used,:
>
>
>
>       0                   1                   2                   3
>
>       0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
>
>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>      |    Length     |      SDWAN Instance ID (Label)        |Rsrv |S|
>
>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>      |                          Prefix                               ~
>
>      ~                                                               |
>
>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>
>
>                         NLRI with SDWAN Instance ID.
>
>
>
> Greatly appreciate any comments or other suggestions..
>
>
>
> Thank you,
>
> Linda Dunbar
>
>
>
> *From:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>
> *Sent:* Monday, March 23, 2020 9:14 AM
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org
> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>
>
>
> Hi Linda,
>
>
>
>     It seems that using another SAFI is a possible solution.
>
>
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Huaimo
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> *Sent:* Friday, March 20, 2020 12:54 AM
> *To:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org <idr@ietf.org=
>
> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org <bess@ietf.org>
> *Subject:* RE: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>
>
>
> Huaimo,
>
>
>
> Thank you very much for the suggestion.
>
> Do you mean using the similar approach as VPN Label carried by NLRI Path
> Attribute [RFC8277] for SDWAN Segmentation Identifier?
>
> If yes, the UPDATE message should not use the MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) to
> avoid confusion, right?
>
>
>
> Linda
>
>
>
> *From:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>
> *Sent:* Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:45 PM
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org
> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>
>
>
> Hi Linda,
>
>
>
>     It seems that a label may be used as an "Identifier" to differentiate
> SD-WAN Segmentation.
>
>
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Huaimo
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* Idr <idr-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Linda Dunbar <
> linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> *Sent:* Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM
> *To:* idr@ietf.org <idr@ietf.org>
> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org <bess@ietf.org>
> *Subject:* [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>
>
>
> BGP Experts,
>
>
>
> Do you know if  there is any problem of using  Private AS as  "Identifier=
"
> to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation? Here is the discussion in BESS WG.
> Want to get IDR WG feedbacks for this question.
>
>
>
> Thank you.
>
> Linda
>
>
>
> *From:* Linda Dunbar
> *Sent:* Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM
> *To:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>; bess@ietf.org
> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to
> differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>
>
>
> Based on Basil=E2=80=99s comment on needing an identifier to differentiat=
e SDWAN
> instances, I added a section to  draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . Want
> to hear people=E2=80=99s feedback.
>
>
> 3.1    Requirements 3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations
>
> The term =E2=80=9Cnetwork segmentation=E2=80=9D is used extensively in SD=
WAN deployment.
> In general (and in this document), the =E2=80=9CNetwork Segmentation=E2=
=80=9D is referring
> to the process of dividing the network into logical sub-networks using
> isolation techniques on a forwarding device such as a switch, router, or
> firewall. For a homogeneous network, such as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network,
> VRF or VLAN are used to separate network segments.
>
> As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks, i=
t
> is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN network
> instances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do no=
t
> have their own assigned AS numbers, a very easy way is to use Private AS
> numbers, in the range of 64512 to 65535, to differentiate different SDWAN
> segmentations.. When using BGP to control the SDWAN networks, the Private
> AS numbers are carried by the BGP UPDATE messages to their corresponding
> RRs.
>
>
>
> Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description.
>
>
>
> Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used?
>
>
>
> Thank you very much.
>
>
>
> Linda Dunbar
>
>
>
> *From:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>
> *Sent:* Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; bess@ietf.org
> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
> *Subject:* RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage
> description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application
> Based Segmentation
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi Linda;
>
>
>
> The SD-WAN Segment is part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there
> could be more than one Segment over a single underlay depending on the
> design and the business requirements.
>
>
>
> Each Segment represents a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I
> suggested that we may need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update
> messages in order to identify and build the routing the table for each
> Segment (based on the Segment ID).
>
>
>
> Hope this helps.
>
>
>
> Regards;
>
>
>
> Basil
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> *Sent:* February-03-20 10:40 AM
> *To:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>; bess@ietf.org
> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
> *Subject:* [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage
> description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application
> Based Segmentation
>
>
>
> Basil,
>
>
>
> Thank you very much for the comments.
>
> Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision.
>
>
>
> As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be
> included in the BGP UPDATE), does the =E2=80=9CSegment=E2=80=9D mean the =
different
> Underlay?
>
> In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to
> Public Internet.
>
> Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN =E2=80=9Csegments=E2=80=9D?
>
> If not, can you elaborate more?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Thanks, Linda
>
>
>
> *From:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>
> *Sent:* Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; bess@ietf.org
> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
> *Subject:* RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage
> description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application
> Based Segmentation
>
>
>
>
>
> Hello Linda;
>
>
>
> I haven=E2=80=99t gone through the entire document; however, I have the f=
ollowing
> quick comments
>
>
>
>    1. Regarding the following paragraph:
>
>
>
> 1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths
> over different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel
> overlay paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private
> networks over which traffic can traverse without encryption, others requi=
re
> encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
>
>
>
> The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either encrypted or
> unecrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is NOT
> encrypted is not always correct). I would change the parpagaph to the
> following (for clarity):
>
>
>
> 1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths
> over different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel
> overlay paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private
> networks over which traffic can traverse with or without encryption,
> others require encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
>
>
>
>
>
>    1. Another thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each
>    Segment (at the SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will m=
ap
>    the Application Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a =E2=80=9Cr=
outing
>    domain=E2=80=9D, the BGP update will be exchanged with the memebers of=
 a particular
>    Segment.
>
>
>
> As such: Should we include the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP
> update messages? Perhaps we need to further discuss this in details.
>
>
>
> Any feedback is welcomed and it=E2=80=99s highly appreciated.
>
>
>
> Regards;
>
>
>
> Basil
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> *Sent:* January-31-20 5:17 PM
> *To:* bess@ietf.org
> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
> *Subject:* [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage
> description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application
> Based Segmentation
>
>
>
> BESS participants:
>
>
>
> =E2=80=9CSDWAN=E2=80=9D networks is characterized by:
>
> 1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths
> over different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel
> overlay paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private
> networks over which traffic can traverse without encryption, others requi=
re
> encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
>
> 2.       Enable direct Internet access from remote sites, instead hauling
> all traffic to Corporate HQ for centralized policy control.
>
> 3.       Some traffic are routed based on application IDs instead of
> based on destination IP addresses.
>
>
>
>
>
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/
> <https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdata=
tracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&data=3D02%7C0=
1%7Clinda.dunbar%40futurewei.com%7Ce72069277dec49a5666a08d7cfcddf3f%7C0fee8=
ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637206355463932513&sdata=3DLtBJOxohSH=
jupWERqW88kUik96QA8iKzaucSLxh6rSU%3D&reserved=3D0>
> describes examples of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN
> Application Based Segmentation,  assuming that the applications are
> assigned with unique IP addresses.
>
> In the Figure below, the following BGP Updates can be advertised to ensur=
e
> that Payment Application only communicates with the Payment Gateway:
>
>
>
>
>
> BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topology (only propagated
> to Payment GW node:
>
> -        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:
>
>    - 30.1.1.x/24
>
> -        Tunnel Encap Path Attribute
>
>    - IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW ->C-PE2
>
>
>
> BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be reached by Purple:
>
> -        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:
>
>    - 10.1.x.x
>          - 12.4.x.x
>
> -        TunnelEncap Path Attribute:
>
>    - Any node to C-PE2
>
>
>
>
>
> Your feedback is greatly appreciated.
>
>
>
> Thank you very much.
>
>
>
> Linda Dunbar
> ------------------------------
>
> *External Email:** Please use caution when opening links and attachments
> / **Courriel externe:** Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints =
*
> ------------------------------
>
> *External Email:** Please use caution when opening links and attachments
> / **Courriel externe:** Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints =
*
>
> _______________________________________________
> Idr mailing list
> Idr@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/idr
> <https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww.=
ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fidr&data=3D02%7C01%7Clinda.dunbar%40futurew=
ei.com%7Ce72069277dec49a5666a08d7cfcddf3f%7C0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fed=
c%7C1%7C0%7C637206355463932513&sdata=3DeqN85C344P7RxfO%2FBxoVZ0zNgGBsAcH%2F=
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>
> _______________________________________________
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> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/idr
>
--=20

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

--000000000000f2821e05a2201c3c
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div><div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Robert =C2=A0&amp; Linda=C2=A0</div><=
div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Sorry to inject myself into th=
is thread.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">You stated th=
at that RFC 4364 SAFI 128 for vpnv4 vpnv6 is the BGP control plane service =
layer overlay from PE to RR. Agreed.=C2=A0 By default all PEs including the=
 SDWAN PE have RT Filtering enabled by default and only import the RT into =
the VRF at the control plane level if the VRF is configured with RT adverti=
sed by the RR is being imported by the PE, if not the SAFI 128 prefixes are=
 dropped.=C2=A0 So I understand that the BGP updates is a control plane fun=
ction, but how would the routes get imported by the PE if the VRF is not de=
fined on the PE.=C2=A0 RFC 4684 RTC capability allows only the RTs imported=
 on the PE to be advertised by the RR to reduced the SAFI 128 route adverti=
sed by the RR that would result in being filtered on the PE.</div></div><di=
v dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">So how would that work using SAF=
I 128 RT to provide the network slicing for SDWAN without VRF configured.</=
div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Also you mentioned that S=
AFI 128 L3 vpn services overlay can run over any underlay and that does not=
 have to be MPLS based.=C2=A0 I know SAFI 128 works with SR-MPLS but there =
you are reusing the MPLS data plane.=C2=A0 With SRv6 due to PM draft signal=
ing by egress PE for end.dx instantiation, so there is not any service labe=
l necessary as is with MPLS and thus SAFI 128 works with SRv6.</div><div di=
r=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">How would SAFI 128 work with IP unde=
rlay used with SDWAN?</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Ev=
en with =C2=A0inter-as option b c ab, with BGP LU you do have topmost label=
 which is via BGP labeled unicast.=C2=A0 For inter as options if SAFI128 wo=
uld work w/o BGP LU you could just run SAFI 128 over IP.=C2=A0 I have never=
 tried but I think the control plane would come up but the data plane would=
 be broken.<br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind reg=
ards=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Gyan=C2=A0</d=
iv><div><div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail=
_attr">On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 9:26 PM Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:l=
inda.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>=
&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 =
0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Robert, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Want to confirm the following two points with you. D=
o I interpret your words correctly?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li style=3D"margin-left:0in">If a CPE supports traditional VPN with multip=
le VRFs, and supports multiple SDWAN instances, the traditional VRF configu=
ration is still same which are carried by BGP Route Target Extended
 community. =C2=A0<u></u><u></u></li><li style=3D"margin-left:0in">For the =
SDWAN Instances supported by the same CPE, we can use Extended Community wi=
th a different name (say SDWAN Target ID). When the SDWAN Target ID is used=
, the SAFI 128 can be
 used for routes for the SDWAN instance, =C2=A0with the exception that the =
label in the NLRI is not the MPLS label carried by the data packets . =C2=
=A0<u></u><u></u></li></ul>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda Dunbar<u></u><u></u></p></div></div><div lang=
=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rob=
ert@raszuk.net" target=3D"_blank">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt; <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, March 24, 2020 3:32 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;; <a href=3D"mailto:idr@iet=
f.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org"=
 target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-s=
afi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI<u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Hi Linda,<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Nope you do not need VRFs. RT construct works at the=
 control plane level. VRF may be useful for traffic separation purposes on =
multitenant=C2=A0CPEs or if you would like to relax requirements for unique=
 IP across SDWAN sites - but not a must
 otherwise.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">My main point was=C2=A0 that BGP SAFI 128 gives you =
for free transport for multiple routing contexts so why not leverage=C2=A0i=
t as is?=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Moreover you may suddenly=C2=A0also discover that RT=
C (RFC4684) is your SDWAN=C2=A0friend too.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Many=C2=A0thx,<br>
R.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div><div></=
div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div><di=
v>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 5:15 AM Linda Dunbar &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@f=
uturewei.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div><=
div><blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;paddin=
g:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D=
"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div><div><blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-l=
eft:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-=
right:0in"><div><div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Robert,
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you very much for the feedback.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">If using your suggested Route Target approach to rep=
resent the SDWAN Instance ID, does it mean that a SDWAN Edge has to use the=
 same approach to configure the VRF for SDWAN instances?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">If the edge node supports both traditional VPN and S=
DWAN, will it cause confusion for RT to represent both?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">RT is encoded in the Extended_Communities Path Attri=
bute, SAFI 128 is encoded in the MP_REACH_NLRI Path Attribute.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">What do you mean by saying =E2=80=9Cdifferent name t=
o Route target(s) carried in the SAFI 128=E2=80=9D? =C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Do you mean having a different name (say SDWAN_Targe=
t) in Extended_Communities Path Attribute, and have MP_REACH_NLRI Path Attr=
ibute including the SAFI 128?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">SDWAN Instance ID is for the control Plane, not to b=
e carried by the data packets. SAFI 128 for VPN has the Label encoded in th=
e NLRI field that is to be carried by the data packets.
 But SDWAN Instance ID is not carried by the Data Packets. Is it correct? <=
u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rob=
ert@raszuk.net" target=3D"_blank">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, March 23, 2020 2:28 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a>; <a href=
=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">
bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-s=
afi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI<u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Hi Linda,<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I think you are mixing data plane and control plane.=
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">In SDWAN=C2=A0data plane is of no issue as you are i=
nterconnecting sites in a given VPN over mesh of secure tunnels.=C2=A0<u></=
u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">You are asking how to keep control plane separate=C2=
=A0between VPN instances. This is precisely what RFC4364 does already and R=
T import/export is used to indicate the instance which
 given set of reachability belongs. Why to reinvent the wheel and do someth=
ing new just for the heck of it :) ?=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">To be original you can at best invent=C2=A0a differe=
nt name to Route target(s) carried in the SAFI 128 but let&#39;s keep the m=
echanism=C2=A0the same. That would be my suggestion.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Kind regards,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">R.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">PS. While this is obvious for some many folks are st=
ill confused. RFC4364 does not need to run over MPLS data plane. It can run=
 over IPSec or over DTLS or over UDP/IP just fine.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue=
" vlink=3D"purple"><div><div><blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:s=
olid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right=
:0in"><div><div><div></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><div =
lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div><div><blockquote style=
=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;m=
argin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"><div><div><div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 6:47 PM Linda Dunbar &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@f=
uturewei.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US" link=
=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div><div><blockquote style=3D"border:none;borde=
r-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;marg=
in-right:0in"><div><div><div><blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:s=
olid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5=
.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></=
div><div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div><div><blockquot=
e style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in =
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"><div><div><div><blockquote style=
=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;m=
argin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt"><di=
v><div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">IDR experts:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple ty=
pes of networks. A SDWAN edge node may need to map client traffic to differ=
ent SDWAN network instances (or segmentations).<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">It might not be feasible to use the AS number in the=
 BGP message to differentiate the SDWAN network instances as multiple SDWAN=
 instances may share the same AS number.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We would like to hear feedback from IDR group on usi=
ng similar method as =C2=A0Binding MPLS Labels to Address Prefixes [RFC8277=
] to bind SDWAN Instance ID to =C2=A0prefixes.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">When =C2=A0MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) is present, MPLS l=
abel is carried by NLRI [RFC8277] as:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div style=3D"border:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:8.0pt 8.0pt 8.0pt 8.0pt">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#fffdf5;word=
-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 1=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 2=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 3</sp=
an><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#fffdf5;word=
-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 =
9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#fffdf5;word=
-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#fffdf5;word=
-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Length=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Label=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |Rsrv |S|</span><=
u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#fffdf5;word=
-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#fffdf5;word=
-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Prefix=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
~</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#fffdf5;word=
-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ~=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#fffdf5;word=
-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#fffdf5;word=
-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:#fffdf5;word=
-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Figure 2: N=
LRI with One Label</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We would like to =C2=A0propose the SDWAN Instance ID=
 being encoded in the Label field as follows when SDWAN SAFI (=3D74 allocat=
ed by IANA) is used,:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 1=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 2=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 3</span><u>=
</u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 =
2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Length=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 SDWAN Instance ID (Label)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |Rsrv |S|</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Prefix=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ~</span>=
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ~=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0|</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0NLRI with SDWAN Instance ID.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Greatly appreciate any comments or other suggestions=
..
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><=
div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div><div><blockquote sty=
le=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt=
;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"><div><div><div><blockquote style=3D"bo=
rder:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-=
left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt"><div><div=
><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you,<u></u><u></u></p></div></div></blockquot=
e></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US" link=
=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div><div><blockquote style=3D"border:none;borde=
r-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;marg=
in-right:0in"><div><div><div><blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:s=
olid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5=
.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt"><div><div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda Dunbar<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaim=
o.chen@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, March 23, 2020 9:14 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Hi Lind=
a,</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">=C2=A0<=
/span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">=C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 It seems that using another SAFI is a possible solution.</span><u></=
u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">=C2=A0<=
/span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Best Re=
gards,</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Huaimo<=
/span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center">
<hr size=3D"2" width=3D"98%" align=3D"center">
</div>
<div id=3D"m_-7541515435969773413m_-309718514547583260gmail-m_4952540666890=
611967gmail-m_4680921541555540591divRplyFwdMsg">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"color:black">From:</span></b><span=
 style=3D"color:black"> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@fut=
urewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, March 20, 2020 12:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a> &lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</=
a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?</span>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p>Huaimo, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you very much for the suggestion. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Do you mean using the similar approach as VPN Label carried by NLRI Path=
 Attribute [RFC8277] for SDWAN Segmentation Identifier?<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>If yes, the UPDATE message should not use the MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) to =
avoid confusion, right?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com=
" target=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:45 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Hi Linda,</span><u></u><u><=
/u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u>=
</p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">=C2=A0 =C2=A0 It seems that=
 a label may be used as an=C2=A0&quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-=
WAN Segmentation.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u>=
</p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Best Regards,</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Huaimo</span><u></u><u></u>=
</p>
</div>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center">
<hr size=3D"2" width=3D"98%" align=3D"center">
</div>
<div id=3D"m_-7541515435969773413m_-309718514547583260gmail-m_4952540666890=
611967gmail-m_4680921541555540591x_divRplyFwdMsg">
<p><b><span style=3D"color:black">From:</span></b><span style=3D"color:blac=
k"> Idr &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:idr-bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr-b=
ounces@ietf.org</a>&gt; on behalf of Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:lin=
da.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&g=
t;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</=
a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a>&g=
t;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</=
a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot=
;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bes=
s-bgp-sdwan-usage?</span>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p>BGP Experts, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Do you know if =C2=A0there is any problem of using=C2=A0 Private AS as=
=C2=A0 &quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation? Here is=
 the discussion in BESS WG. Want to get IDR WG feedbacks for this question.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" target=
=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot;Identifie=
r&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwa=
n-usage?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Based on Basil=E2=80=99s comment on needing an identifier to differentia=
te SDWAN instances, I added a section to =C2=A0draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-=
usage . Want to hear people=E2=80=99s feedback.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<h2 style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:45.0pt;line-=
height:12.0pt;break-after:avoid">
<a name=3D"m_-7541515435969773413_m_-309718514547583260_m_49525406668906119=
67_m_4680921541555540"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;;font-weight:normal">3.1</span></a><span></span><span style=
=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif;font-weig=
ht:normal">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;=
font-weight:normal">Requirements</span><u></u><u></u></h2>
<h3 style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-left:.75in;line-h=
eight:12.0pt;break-after:avoid">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;font-we=
ight:normal">3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations</span><u></u><u><=
/u></h3>
<p>The term =E2=80=9Cnetwork segmentation=E2=80=9D is used extensively in S=
DWAN deployment. In general (and in this document), the =E2=80=9CNetwork Se=
gmentation=E2=80=9D is referring to the process of dividing the network int=
o logical sub-networks using isolation techniques on a forwarding
 device such as a switch, router, or firewall. For a homogeneous network, s=
uch as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, VRF or VLAN are used to separate networ=
k segments.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks, =
it is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN network=
 instances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do not=
 have their own assigned AS numbers,
 a very easy way is to use Private AS numbers, in the range of 64512 to 655=
35, to differentiate different SDWAN segmentations.. When using BGP to cont=
rol the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numbers are carried by the BGP UPDAT=
E messages to their corresponding
 RRs.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used? <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you very much. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Linda Dunbar<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" tar=
get=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u>=
</p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u>=
</p>
<div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">Hi Linda;</span><u></u><u><=
/u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u>=
</p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">The SD-WAN Segment is part =
of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there could be more than one Segment =
over a single underlay depending on the design and the business requirement=
s.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u>=
</p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">Each Segment represents a s=
ingle and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I suggested that we may need to=
 include the Segment ID in the BGP update messages in order to identify and=
 build the routing the table for each
 Segment (based on the Segment ID).</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u>=
</p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">Hope this helps.</span><u><=
/u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u>=
</p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">Regards;</span><u></u><u></=
u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u>=
</p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">Basil</span><u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<p><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u>=
</p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.c=
om" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> February-03-20 10:40 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" target=
=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-us=
age description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application =
Based Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Basil, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you very much for the comments. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision.=
 <u></u>
<u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be =
included in the BGP UPDATE), does the =E2=80=9CSegment=E2=80=9D mean the di=
fferent Underlay?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to P=
ublic Internet.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN =E2=80=9Csegments=E2=80=9D? <u></u><u></u></=
p>
<p>If not, can you elaborate more? <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thanks, Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" tar=
get=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u>=
</p>
<div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">Hello Linda;</span><u></u><=
u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u>=
</p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">I haven=E2=80=99t gone thro=
ugh the entire document; however, I have the following quick comments</span=
><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u>=
</p>
<ol start=3D"1" type=3D"A">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:#1f497d">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA">Regarding the following paragraph:</span><u></u><u></u=
></li></ol>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D=
"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bot=
tom:.0001pt">
1.<span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,se=
rif">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0=
pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u>=
</u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.5in;margin-bott=
om:.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;co=
lor:#1f497d">The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either e=
ncrypted or unecrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is =
NOT encrypted is not always correct). I would
 change the parpagaph to the following (for clarity):</span><u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0=
pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u>=
</u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bot=
tom:.0001pt">
1.<span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,se=
rif">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse <span style=3D"color:red">with or </span>withou=
t encryption, others require encryption, e.g. over untrusted public network=
s.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0=
pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u>=
</u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0=
pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u>=
</u><u></u></p>
<ol start=3D"2" type=3D"A">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:#1f497d">
<span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif">A=
nother thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each Segment (at th=
e SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will map the Application =
Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a
 =E2=80=9Crouting domain=E2=80=9D, the BGP update will be exchanged with th=
e memebers of a particular Segment.
</span><u></u><u></u></li></ol>
<p style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&=
quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&=
quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d;background:yellow">As such: Shoul=
d we include the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP update messages? Per=
haps we need to further discuss this in details.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0=
pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u>=
</u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0=
pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Any feedback is =
welcomed and it=E2=80=99s highly appreciated.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0=
pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u>=
</u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0=
pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Regards;</span><=
u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0=
pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u>=
</u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0=
pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Basil</span><u><=
/u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d"=
>=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D=
"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt=
;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunb=
ar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> January-31-20 5:17 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage =
description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Base=
d Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><span lang=3D"EN-CA">=C2=A0</=
span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">BESS participants:<u></u><u><=
/u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">=E2=80=9CSDWAN=E2=80=9D netwo=
rks is characterized by:
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bot=
tom:.0001pt">
1.<span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,se=
rif">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bot=
tom:.0001pt">
2.<span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,se=
rif">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Enable direct Internet =
access from remote sites, instead hauling all traffic to Corporate HQ for c=
entralized policy control.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:.75in;margin-bot=
tom:.0001pt">
3.<span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,se=
rif">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Some traffic are routed=
 based on application IDs instead of based on destination IP addresses.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><a href=3D"https://nam11.safe=
links.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdatatracker.ietf.org%2Fdo=
c%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Clinda.dunbar%=
40futurewei.com%7Ce72069277dec49a5666a08d7cfcddf3f%7C0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a=
1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637206355463932513&amp;sdata=3DLtBJOxohSHjupWERqW88kUi=
k96QA8iKzaucSLxh6rSU%3D&amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https://datatra=
cker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/</a>
 describes examples of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Appli=
cation Based Segmentation, =C2=A0assuming that the applications are assigne=
d with unique IP addresses.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">In the Figure below, the foll=
owing BGP Updates can be advertised to ensure that Payment Application only=
 communicates with the Payment Gateway:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to R=
R for the RED P2P topology (only propagated to Payment GW node:<u></u><u></=
u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-b=
ottom:.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute: </span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:black">
30.1.1.x/24<u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-b=
ottom:.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">Tunnel Encap Path Attribute</span><u></u=
><u></u></p>
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:black">
IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW -&gt;C-PE2<u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:134.65pt;margin-=
bottom:.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to R=
R for the routes to be reached by Purple:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-b=
ottom:.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute:</span><u></u><u>=
</u></p>
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal">
<span style=3D"color:black">10.1.x.x</span><u></u><u></u></li><li class=3D"=
MsoNormal">
<span style=3D"color:black">12.4.x.x</span><u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-b=
ottom:.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif;color:black">-=
</span><span style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quo=
t;,serif;color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">TunnelEncap Path Attribute:</span><u></u=
><u></u></p>
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:black">
Any node to C-PE2<u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">Your feedback is greatly appr=
eciated.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">Thank you very much. <u></u><=
u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">Linda Dunbar<u></u><u></u></p=
>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center">
</span></div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><strong><i><span style=3D"fon=
t-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue">Externa=
l Email:</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:=
&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue"> Please use caution
 when opening links and attachments / </span></em><strong><i><span style=3D=
"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue">Cou=
rriel externe:</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-f=
amily:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue"> Soyez
 prudent avec les liens et documents joints </span></em><u></u><u></u></p>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center">
</span></div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><strong><i><span style=3D"fon=
t-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue">Externa=
l Email:</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:=
&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue"> Please use caution
 when opening links and attachments / </span></em><strong><i><span style=3D=
"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue">Cou=
rriel externe:</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-f=
amily:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:blue"> Soyez
 prudent avec les liens et documents joints </span></em><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">_______________________________________________<br>
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From: Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2020 12:42:55 +0200
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To: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Cc: Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>, Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>,  "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, "idr@ietf.org" <idr@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [bess] [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-safi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI
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Hi Gyan,

As topic 1 - Extended community which is used for filtering incoming
updates can be configured under BGP AF - there is nothing in the protocol
which mandates that such RTs need to be configured under VRF section.

As of topic 2 - This is huge misconception by many people who think that
SAFI 128 requires MPLS transport. So let me clearly state that SAFI 128
application can happily run for many years now over pure IP transport. VPN
labels and transport paradigm are completely separate. Hint: RFC7510 or
RFC4023. Moreover - let me also state that MPLS transport does not bring
any benefits other then few bits savings in the packet header as compared
with say IPv4 transport. Contrary it costs a lot of complexity in the
control plane and forwarding planes of the network elements.

Thx,
R.



On Tue, Mar 31, 2020 at 7:48 AM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote:

>
> Robert  & Linda
>
> Sorry to inject myself into this thread.
>
> You stated that that RFC 4364 SAFI 128 for vpnv4 vpnv6 is the BGP control
> plane service layer overlay from PE to RR. Agreed.  By default all PEs
> including the SDWAN PE have RT Filtering enabled by default and only impo=
rt
> the RT into the VRF at the control plane level if the VRF is configured
> with RT advertised by the RR is being imported by the PE, if not the SAFI
> 128 prefixes are dropped.  So I understand that the BGP updates is a
> control plane function, but how would the routes get imported by the PE i=
f
> the VRF is not defined on the PE.  RFC 4684 RTC capability allows only th=
e
> RTs imported on the PE to be advertised by the RR to reduced the SAFI 128
> route advertised by the RR that would result in being filtered on the PE.
>
> So how would that work using SAFI 128 RT to provide the network slicing
> for SDWAN without VRF configured.
>
> Also you mentioned that SAFI 128 L3 vpn services overlay can run over any
> underlay and that does not have to be MPLS based.  I know SAFI 128 works
> with SR-MPLS but there you are reusing the MPLS data plane.  With SRv6 du=
e
> to PM draft signaling by egress PE for end.dx instantiation, so there is
> not any service label necessary as is with MPLS and thus SAFI 128 works
> with SRv6.
>
> How would SAFI 128 work with IP underlay used with SDWAN?
>
> Even with  inter-as option b c ab, with BGP LU you do have topmost label
> which is via BGP labeled unicast.  For inter as options if SAFI128 would
> work w/o BGP LU you could just run SAFI 128 over IP.  I have never tried
> but I think the control plane would come up but the data plane would be
> broken.
>
> Kind regards
>
> Gyan
>
> On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 9:26 PM Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Robert,
>>
>>
>>
>> Want to confirm the following two points with you. Do I interpret your
>> words correctly?
>>
>>
>>
>>    - If a CPE supports traditional VPN with multiple VRFs, and supports
>>    multiple SDWAN instances, the traditional VRF configuration is still =
same
>>    which are carried by BGP Route Target Extended community.
>>    - For the SDWAN Instances supported by the same CPE, we can use
>>    Extended Community with a different name (say SDWAN Target ID). When =
the
>>    SDWAN Target ID is used, the SAFI 128 can be used for routes for the =
SDWAN
>>    instance,  with the exception that the label in the NLRI is not the M=
PLS
>>    label carried by the data packets .
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank you.
>>
>>
>>
>> Linda Dunbar
>>
>> *From:* Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
>> *Sent:* Tuesday, March 24, 2020 3:32 AM
>> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
>> *Cc:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org;
>> bess@ietf.org
>> *Subject:* Re: [Idr] Seeking feedback of
>> draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-safi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instan=
ce
>> ID in the NLRI
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi Linda,
>>
>>
>>
>> Nope you do not need VRFs. RT construct works at the control plane level=
.
>> VRF may be useful for traffic separation purposes on multitenant CPEs or=
 if
>> you would like to relax requirements for unique IP across SDWAN sites - =
but
>> not a must otherwise.
>>
>>
>>
>> My main point was  that BGP SAFI 128 gives you for free transport for
>> multiple routing contexts so why not leverage it as is?
>>
>>
>>
>> Moreover you may suddenly also discover that RTC (RFC4684) is your
>> SDWAN friend too.
>>
>>
>>
>> Many thx,
>> R.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 5:15 AM Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com=
>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Robert,
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank you very much for the feedback.
>>
>>
>>
>> If using your suggested Route Target approach to represent the SDWAN
>> Instance ID, does it mean that a SDWAN Edge has to use the same approach=
 to
>> configure the VRF for SDWAN instances?
>>
>> If the edge node supports both traditional VPN and SDWAN, will it cause
>> confusion for RT to represent both?
>>
>>
>>
>> RT is encoded in the Extended_Communities Path Attribute, SAFI 128 is
>> encoded in the MP_REACH_NLRI Path Attribute.
>>
>>
>>
>> What do you mean by saying =E2=80=9Cdifferent name to Route target(s) ca=
rried in
>> the SAFI 128=E2=80=9D?
>>
>> Do you mean having a different name (say SDWAN_Target) in
>> Extended_Communities Path Attribute, and have MP_REACH_NLRI Path Attribu=
te
>> including the SAFI 128?
>>
>>
>>
>> SDWAN Instance ID is for the control Plane, not to be carried by the dat=
a
>> packets. SAFI 128 for VPN has the Label encoded in the NLRI field that i=
s
>> to be carried by the data packets. But SDWAN Instance ID is not carried =
by
>> the Data Packets. Is it correct?
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank you.
>>
>> Linda
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
>> *Sent:* Monday, March 23, 2020 2:28 PM
>> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
>> *Cc:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org;
>> bess@ietf.org
>> *Subject:* Re: [Idr] Seeking feedback of
>> draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-safi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instan=
ce
>> ID in the NLRI
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi Linda,
>>
>>
>>
>> I think you are mixing data plane and control plane.
>>
>>
>>
>> In SDWAN data plane is of no issue as you are interconnecting sites in a
>> given VPN over mesh of secure tunnels.
>>
>>
>>
>> You are asking how to keep control plane separate between VPN instances.
>> This is precisely what RFC4364 does already and RT import/export is used=
 to
>> indicate the instance which given set of reachability belongs. Why to
>> reinvent the wheel and do something new just for the heck of it :) ?
>>
>>
>>
>> To be original you can at best invent a different name to Route target(s=
)
>> carried in the SAFI 128 but let's keep the mechanism the same. That woul=
d
>> be my suggestion.
>>
>>
>>
>> Kind regards,
>>
>> R.
>>
>>
>>
>> PS. While this is obvious for some many folks are still confused. RFC436=
4
>> does not need to run over MPLS data plane. It can run over IPSec or over
>> DTLS or over UDP/IP just fine.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 6:47 PM Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com=
>
>> wrote:
>>
>> IDR experts:
>>
>>
>>
>> SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks. A
>> SDWAN edge node may need to map client traffic to different SDWAN networ=
k
>> instances (or segmentations).
>>
>> It might not be feasible to use the AS number in the BGP message to
>> differentiate the SDWAN network instances as multiple SDWAN instances ma=
y
>> share the same AS number.
>>
>>
>>
>> We would like to hear feedback from IDR group on using similar method as
>>  Binding MPLS Labels to Address Prefixes [RFC8277] to bind SDWAN Instanc=
e
>> ID to  prefixes.
>>
>>
>>
>> When  MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) is present, MPLS label is carried by NLRI
>> [RFC8277] as:
>>
>>
>>
>>       0                   1                   2                   3
>>
>>       0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
>>
>>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>
>>      |    Length     |                 Label                 |Rsrv |S|
>>
>>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>
>>      |                          Prefix                               ~
>>
>>      ~                                                               |
>>
>>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>
>>
>>
>>                        Figure 2: NLRI with One Label
>>
>>
>>
>> We would like to  propose the SDWAN Instance ID being encoded in the
>> Label field as follows when SDWAN SAFI (=3D74 allocated by IANA) is used=
,:
>>
>>
>>
>>       0                   1                   2                   3
>>
>>       0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
>>
>>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>
>>      |    Length     |      SDWAN Instance ID (Label)        |Rsrv |S|
>>
>>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>
>>      |                          Prefix                               ~
>>
>>      ~                                                               |
>>
>>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>
>>
>>
>>                         NLRI with SDWAN Instance ID.
>>
>>
>>
>> Greatly appreciate any comments or other suggestions..
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank you,
>>
>> Linda Dunbar
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>
>> *Sent:* Monday, March 23, 2020 9:14 AM
>> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org
>> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org
>> *Subject:* Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
>> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
>> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi Linda,
>>
>>
>>
>>     It seems that using another SAFI is a possible solution.
>>
>>
>>
>> Best Regards,
>>
>> Huaimo
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> *From:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
>> *Sent:* Friday, March 20, 2020 12:54 AM
>> *To:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org <idr@ietf.or=
g
>> >
>> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org <bess@ietf.org>
>> *Subject:* RE: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
>> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
>> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>>
>>
>>
>> Huaimo,
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank you very much for the suggestion.
>>
>> Do you mean using the similar approach as VPN Label carried by NLRI Path
>> Attribute [RFC8277] for SDWAN Segmentation Identifier?
>>
>> If yes, the UPDATE message should not use the MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) to
>> avoid confusion, right?
>>
>>
>>
>> Linda
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>
>> *Sent:* Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:45 PM
>> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org
>> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org
>> *Subject:* Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
>> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
>> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi Linda,
>>
>>
>>
>>     It seems that a label may be used as an "Identifier" to differentiat=
e
>> SD-WAN Segmentation.
>>
>>
>>
>> Best Regards,
>>
>> Huaimo
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> *From:* Idr <idr-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Linda Dunbar <
>> linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
>> *Sent:* Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM
>> *To:* idr@ietf.org <idr@ietf.org>
>> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org <bess@ietf.org>
>> *Subject:* [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
>> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
>> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>>
>>
>>
>> BGP Experts,
>>
>>
>>
>> Do you know if  there is any problem of using  Private AS as
>> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation? Here is the discussio=
n
>> in BESS WG. Want to get IDR WG feedbacks for this question.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank you.
>>
>> Linda
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Linda Dunbar
>> *Sent:* Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM
>> *To:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>; bess@ietf.org
>> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
>> *Subject:* Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to
>> differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>>
>>
>>
>> Based on Basil=E2=80=99s comment on needing an identifier to differentia=
te SDWAN
>> instances, I added a section to  draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . Wan=
t
>> to hear people=E2=80=99s feedback.
>>
>>
>> 3.1    Requirements 3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations
>>
>> The term =E2=80=9Cnetwork segmentation=E2=80=9D is used extensively in S=
DWAN deployment.
>> In general (and in this document), the =E2=80=9CNetwork Segmentation=E2=
=80=9D is referring
>> to the process of dividing the network into logical sub-networks using
>> isolation techniques on a forwarding device such as a switch, router, or
>> firewall. For a homogeneous network, such as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network=
,
>> VRF or VLAN are used to separate network segments.
>>
>> As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks,
>> it is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN netw=
ork
>> instances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do n=
ot
>> have their own assigned AS numbers, a very easy way is to use Private AS
>> numbers, in the range of 64512 to 65535, to differentiate different SDWA=
N
>> segmentations.. When using BGP to control the SDWAN networks, the Privat=
e
>> AS numbers are carried by the BGP UPDATE messages to their corresponding
>> RRs.
>>
>>
>>
>> Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description.
>>
>>
>>
>> Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used?
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank you very much.
>>
>>
>>
>> Linda Dunbar
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>
>> *Sent:* Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM
>> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; bess@ietf.org
>> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
>> *Subject:* RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage
>> description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application
>> Based Segmentation
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi Linda;
>>
>>
>>
>> The SD-WAN Segment is part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there
>> could be more than one Segment over a single underlay depending on the
>> design and the business requirements.
>>
>>
>>
>> Each Segment represents a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I
>> suggested that we may need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update
>> messages in order to identify and build the routing the table for each
>> Segment (based on the Segment ID).
>>
>>
>>
>> Hope this helps.
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards;
>>
>>
>>
>> Basil
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
>> *Sent:* February-03-20 10:40 AM
>> *To:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>; bess@ietf.org
>> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
>> *Subject:* [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on
>> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage description of using BGP UPDATE messag=
es
>> to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segmentation
>>
>>
>>
>> Basil,
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank you very much for the comments.
>>
>> Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision.
>>
>>
>>
>> As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be
>> included in the BGP UPDATE), does the =E2=80=9CSegment=E2=80=9D mean the=
 different
>> Underlay?
>>
>> In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to
>> Public Internet.
>>
>> Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN =E2=80=9Csegments=E2=80=9D?
>>
>> If not, can you elaborate more?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks, Linda
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>
>> *Sent:* Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM
>> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; bess@ietf.org
>> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
>> *Subject:* RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage
>> description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application
>> Based Segmentation
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Hello Linda;
>>
>>
>>
>> I haven=E2=80=99t gone through the entire document; however, I have the =
following
>> quick comments
>>
>>
>>
>>    1. Regarding the following paragraph:
>>
>>
>>
>> 1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths
>> over different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel
>> overlay paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private
>> networks over which traffic can traverse without encryption, others requ=
ire
>> encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
>>
>>
>>
>> The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either encrypted o=
r
>> unecrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is NOT
>> encrypted is not always correct). I would change the parpagaph to the
>> following (for clarity):
>>
>>
>>
>> 1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths
>> over different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel
>> overlay paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private
>> networks over which traffic can traverse with or without encryption,
>> others require encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>    1. Another thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each
>>    Segment (at the SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will =
map
>>    the Application Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a =E2=80=9C=
routing
>>    domain=E2=80=9D, the BGP update will be exchanged with the memebers o=
f a particular
>>    Segment.
>>
>>
>>
>> As such: Should we include the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP
>> update messages? Perhaps we need to further discuss this in details.
>>
>>
>>
>> Any feedback is welcomed and it=E2=80=99s highly appreciated.
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards;
>>
>>
>>
>> Basil
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
>> *Sent:* January-31-20 5:17 PM
>> *To:* bess@ietf.org
>> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
>> *Subject:* [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage
>> description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application
>> Based Segmentation
>>
>>
>>
>> BESS participants:
>>
>>
>>
>> =E2=80=9CSDWAN=E2=80=9D networks is characterized by:
>>
>> 1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths
>> over different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple parallel
>> overlay paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private
>> networks over which traffic can traverse without encryption, others requ=
ire
>> encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
>>
>> 2.       Enable direct Internet access from remote sites, instead
>> hauling all traffic to Corporate HQ for centralized policy control.
>>
>> 3.       Some traffic are routed based on application IDs instead of
>> based on destination IP addresses.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/
>> <https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdat=
atracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&data=3D02%7C=
01%7Clinda.dunbar%40futurewei.com%7Ce72069277dec49a5666a08d7cfcddf3f%7C0fee=
8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637206355463932513&sdata=3DLtBJOxohS=
HjupWERqW88kUik96QA8iKzaucSLxh6rSU%3D&reserved=3D0>
>> describes examples of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN
>> Application Based Segmentation,  assuming that the applications are
>> assigned with unique IP addresses.
>>
>> In the Figure below, the following BGP Updates can be advertised to
>> ensure that Payment Application only communicates with the Payment Gatew=
ay:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topology (only propagated
>> to Payment GW node:
>>
>> -        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:
>>
>>    - 30.1.1.x/24
>>
>> -        Tunnel Encap Path Attribute
>>
>>    - IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW ->C-PE2
>>
>>
>>
>> BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be reached by Purple:
>>
>> -        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:
>>
>>    - 10.1.x.x
>>          - 12.4.x.x
>>
>> -        TunnelEncap Path Attribute:
>>
>>    - Any node to C-PE2
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Your feedback is greatly appreciated.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thank you very much.
>>
>>
>>
>> Linda Dunbar
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> *External Email:** Please use caution when opening links and attachments
>> / **Courriel externe:** Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints
>> *
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> *External Email:** Please use caution when opening links and attachments
>> / **Courriel externe:** Soyez prudent avec les liens et documents joints
>> *
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Idr mailing list
>> Idr@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/idr
>> <https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fwww=
.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fidr&data=3D02%7C01%7Clinda.dunbar%40future=
wei.com%7Ce72069277dec49a5666a08d7cfcddf3f%7C0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fe=
dc%7C1%7C0%7C637206355463932513&sdata=3DeqN85C344P7RxfO%2FBxoVZ0zNgGBsAcH%2=
F623Ye6TYHhs%3D&reserved=3D0>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Idr mailing list
>> Idr@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/idr
>>
> --
>
> Gyan  Mishra
>
> Network Engineering & Technology
>
> Verizon
>
> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>
> Phone: 301 502-1347
>
> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>
>
>
>

--0000000000009c3db405a2243bc8
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr">Hi Gyan,<div><br></div><div>As topic 1 - =
Extended community which is used for=C2=A0filtering incoming updates can be=
 configured under=C2=A0BGP AF - there is nothing in the protocol which mand=
ates that such RTs need to be configured under VRF section.=C2=A0</div><div=
><br></div><div>As of topic 2 - This is huge misconception by many people=
=C2=A0who think that SAFI 128 requires MPLS transport. So let me clearly st=
ate that SAFI 128 application can happily run for many years now over pure =
IP transport. VPN labels and transport paradigm are completely separate. Hi=
nt: RFC7510 or RFC4023. Moreover - let me also state that MPLS transport=C2=
=A0does not bring any benefits other then few bits savings in the packet he=
ader as=C2=A0compared with say IPv4 transport. Contrary it costs a lot of c=
omplexity in the control plane and forwarding planes of the network element=
s.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Thx,<br>R.</div><div>=C2=A0</div><div><br=
></div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail=
_attr">On Tue, Mar 31, 2020 at 7:48 AM Gyan Mishra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ha=
yabusagsm@gmail.com">hayabusagsm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockqu=
ote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px=
 solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div><div><br></div><div dir=3D"a=
uto">Robert =C2=A0&amp; Linda=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div d=
ir=3D"auto">Sorry to inject myself into this thread.</div><div dir=3D"auto"=
><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">You stated that that RFC 4364 SAFI 128 for vpn=
v4 vpnv6 is the BGP control plane service layer overlay from PE to RR. Agre=
ed.=C2=A0 By default all PEs including the SDWAN PE have RT Filtering enabl=
ed by default and only import the RT into the VRF at the control plane leve=
l if the VRF is configured with RT advertised by the RR is being imported b=
y the PE, if not the SAFI 128 prefixes are dropped.=C2=A0 So I understand t=
hat the BGP updates is a control plane function, but how would the routes g=
et imported by the PE if the VRF is not defined on the PE.=C2=A0 RFC 4684 R=
TC capability allows only the RTs imported on the PE to be advertised by th=
e RR to reduced the SAFI 128 route advertised by the RR that would result i=
n being filtered on the PE.</div></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=
=3D"auto">So how would that work using SAFI 128 RT to provide the network s=
licing for SDWAN without VRF configured.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><=
div dir=3D"auto">Also you mentioned that SAFI 128 L3 vpn services overlay c=
an run over any underlay and that does not have to be MPLS based.=C2=A0 I k=
now SAFI 128 works with SR-MPLS but there you are reusing the MPLS data pla=
ne.=C2=A0 With SRv6 due to PM draft signaling by egress PE for end.dx insta=
ntiation, so there is not any service label necessary as is with MPLS and t=
hus SAFI 128 works with SRv6.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"=
auto">How would SAFI 128 work with IP underlay used with SDWAN?</div><div d=
ir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Even with =C2=A0inter-as option b c=
 ab, with BGP LU you do have topmost label which is via BGP labeled unicast=
.=C2=A0 For inter as options if SAFI128 would work w/o BGP LU you could jus=
t run SAFI 128 over IP.=C2=A0 I have never tried but I think the control pl=
ane would come up but the data plane would be broken.<br></div><div dir=3D"=
auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind regards=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"=
><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Gyan=C2=A0</div><div><div><br><div class=3D"gm=
ail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 9:=
26 PM Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=
=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote =
class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px sol=
id rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-US">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Robert, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Want to confirm the following two points with you. D=
o I interpret your words correctly?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li style=3D"margin-left:0in">If a CPE supports traditional VPN with multip=
le VRFs, and supports multiple SDWAN instances, the traditional VRF configu=
ration is still same which are carried by BGP Route Target Extended
 community. =C2=A0<u></u><u></u></li><li style=3D"margin-left:0in">For the =
SDWAN Instances supported by the same CPE, we can use Extended Community wi=
th a different name (say SDWAN Target ID). When the SDWAN Target ID is used=
, the SAFI 128 can be
 used for routes for the SDWAN instance, =C2=A0with the exception that the =
label in the NLRI is not the MPLS label carried by the data packets . =C2=
=A0<u></u><u></u></li></ul>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda Dunbar<u></u><u></u></p></div></div><div lang=
=3D"EN-US"><div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rob=
ert@raszuk.net" target=3D"_blank">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt; <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, March 24, 2020 3:32 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;; <a href=3D"mailto:idr@iet=
f.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org"=
 target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-s=
afi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI<u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Hi Linda,<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Nope you do not need VRFs. RT construct works at the=
 control plane level. VRF may be useful for traffic separation purposes on =
multitenant=C2=A0CPEs or if you would like to relax requirements for unique=
 IP across SDWAN sites - but not a must
 otherwise.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">My main point was=C2=A0 that BGP SAFI 128 gives you =
for free transport for multiple routing contexts so why not leverage=C2=A0i=
t as is?=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Moreover you may suddenly=C2=A0also discover that RT=
C (RFC4684) is your SDWAN=C2=A0friend too.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Many=C2=A0thx,<br>
R.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US"><div><div></div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN=
-US"><div><div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 5:15 AM Linda Dunbar &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@f=
uturewei.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US"><div><div><blockquote style=3D"border=
-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt solid rgb(20=
4,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US"><div><d=
iv><blockquote style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:non=
e;border-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-lef=
t:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"><div><div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Robert,
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you very much for the feedback.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">If using your suggested Route Target approach to rep=
resent the SDWAN Instance ID, does it mean that a SDWAN Edge has to use the=
 same approach to configure the VRF for SDWAN instances?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">If the edge node supports both traditional VPN and S=
DWAN, will it cause confusion for RT to represent both?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">RT is encoded in the Extended_Communities Path Attri=
bute, SAFI 128 is encoded in the MP_REACH_NLRI Path Attribute.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">What do you mean by saying =E2=80=9Cdifferent name t=
o Route target(s) carried in the SAFI 128=E2=80=9D? =C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Do you mean having a different name (say SDWAN_Targe=
t) in Extended_Communities Path Attribute, and have MP_REACH_NLRI Path Attr=
ibute including the SAFI 128?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">SDWAN Instance ID is for the control Plane, not to b=
e carried by the data packets. SAFI 128 for VPN has the Label encoded in th=
e NLRI field that is to be carried by the data packets.
 But SDWAN Instance ID is not carried by the Data Packets. Is it correct? <=
u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rob=
ert@raszuk.net" target=3D"_blank">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, March 23, 2020 2:28 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a>; <a href=
=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">
bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-s=
afi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI<u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Hi Linda,<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I think you are mixing data plane and control plane.=
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">In SDWAN=C2=A0data plane is of no issue as you are i=
nterconnecting sites in a given VPN over mesh of secure tunnels.=C2=A0<u></=
u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">You are asking how to keep control plane separate=C2=
=A0between VPN instances. This is precisely what RFC4364 does already and R=
T import/export is used to indicate the instance which
 given set of reachability belongs. Why to reinvent the wheel and do someth=
ing new just for the heck of it :) ?=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">To be original you can at best invent=C2=A0a differe=
nt name to Route target(s) carried in the SAFI 128 but let&#39;s keep the m=
echanism=C2=A0the same. That would be my suggestion.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Kind regards,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">R.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">PS. While this is obvious for some many folks are st=
ill confused. RFC4364 does not need to run over MPLS data plane. It can run=
 over IPSec or over DTLS or over UDP/IP just fine.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US"><div><div><b=
lockquote style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;bor=
der-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-left:4.8=
pt;margin-right:0in"><div><div><div></div></div></div></blockquote></div></=
div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US"><div><div><blockquote style=3D"border-top:non=
e;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,20=
4);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"><div><div><d=
iv>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 6:47 PM Linda Dunbar &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@f=
uturewei.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US"><div><=
div><blockquote style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:no=
ne;border-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-le=
ft:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"><div><div><div><blockquote style=3D"border-top:n=
one;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,=
204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin:5pt 0in 5pt 4.8pt">
<div>
<div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></=
div><div lang=3D"EN-US"><div><div><blockquote style=3D"border-top:none;bord=
er-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);pad=
ding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"><div><div><div><bl=
ockquote style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;bord=
er-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin:5pt 0in 5=
pt 4.8pt"><div><div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">IDR experts:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple ty=
pes of networks. A SDWAN edge node may need to map client traffic to differ=
ent SDWAN network instances (or segmentations).<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">It might not be feasible to use the AS number in the=
 BGP message to differentiate the SDWAN network instances as multiple SDWAN=
 instances may share the same AS number.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We would like to hear feedback from IDR group on usi=
ng similar method as =C2=A0Binding MPLS Labels to Address Prefixes [RFC8277=
] to bind SDWAN Instance ID to =C2=A0prefixes.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">When =C2=A0MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) is present, MPLS l=
abel is carried by NLRI [RFC8277] as:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div style=3D"border:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:8pt">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 1=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 2=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 3</sp=
an><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 =
9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Length=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Label=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |Rsrv |S|</span><=
u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Prefix=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
~</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ~=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Figure 2: N=
LRI with One Label</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We would like to =C2=A0propose the SDWAN Instance ID=
 being encoded in the Label field as follows when SDWAN SAFI (=3D74 allocat=
ed by IANA) is used,:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 1=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 2=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 3</span><u>=
</u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 =
2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Length=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 SDWAN Instance ID (Label)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |Rsrv |S|</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Prefix=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ~</span>=
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ~=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0|</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0NLRI with SDWAN Instance ID.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Greatly appreciate any comments or other suggestions=
..
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><=
div lang=3D"EN-US"><div><div><blockquote style=3D"border-top:none;border-ri=
ght:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:=
0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"><div><div><div><blockqu=
ote style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-le=
ft:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin:5pt 0in 5pt 4.=
8pt"><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you,<u></u><u></u></p></div></d=
iv></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><div lang=
=3D"EN-US"><div><div><blockquote style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none=
;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in =
0in 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"><div><div><div><blockquote styl=
e=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt s=
olid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin:5pt 0in 5pt 4.8pt"><di=
v><div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda Dunbar<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaim=
o.chen@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, March 23, 2020 9:14 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Hi Linda,=
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0</s=
pan><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 It seems that using another SAFI is a possible solution.</span><u></=
u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0</s=
pan><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Best Rega=
rds,</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Huaimo</s=
pan><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center">
<hr size=3D"2" width=3D"98%" align=3D"center">
</div>
<div id=3D"gmail-m_-7254824953371920217m_-7541515435969773413m_-30971851454=
7583260gmail-m_4952540666890611967gmail-m_4680921541555540591divRplyFwdMsg"=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"color:black">From:</span></b><span=
 style=3D"color:black"> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@fut=
urewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, March 20, 2020 12:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a> &lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</=
a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?</span>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p>Huaimo, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you very much for the suggestion. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Do you mean using the similar approach as VPN Label carried by NLRI Path=
 Attribute [RFC8277] for SDWAN Segmentation Identifier?<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>If yes, the UPDATE message should not use the MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) to =
avoid confusion, right?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com=
" target=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:45 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Hi Linda,</span><u></u><u></u=
></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0 =C2=A0 It seems that a=
 label may be used as an=C2=A0&quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WA=
N Segmentation.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Best Regards,</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Huaimo</span><u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center">
<hr size=3D"2" width=3D"98%" align=3D"center">
</div>
<div id=3D"gmail-m_-7254824953371920217m_-7541515435969773413m_-30971851454=
7583260gmail-m_4952540666890611967gmail-m_4680921541555540591x_divRplyFwdMs=
g">
<p><b><span style=3D"color:black">From:</span></b><span style=3D"color:blac=
k"> Idr &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:idr-bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr-b=
ounces@ietf.org</a>&gt; on behalf of Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:lin=
da.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&g=
t;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</=
a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a>&g=
t;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</=
a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot=
;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bes=
s-bgp-sdwan-usage?</span>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p>BGP Experts, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Do you know if =C2=A0there is any problem of using=C2=A0 Private AS as=
=C2=A0 &quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation? Here is=
 the discussion in BESS WG. Want to get IDR WG feedbacks for this question.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" target=
=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot;Identifie=
r&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwa=
n-usage?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Based on Basil=E2=80=99s comment on needing an identifier to differentia=
te SDWAN instances, I added a section to =C2=A0draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-=
usage . Want to hear people=E2=80=99s feedback.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<h2 style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:45pt;line-heig=
ht:12pt;break-after:avoid">
<a name=3D"m_-7254824953371920217_m_-7541515435969773413_m_-309718514547583=
260_m_4952540666890611967_m_4680921541555540"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt=
;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;font-weight:normal">3.1</span></a><spa=
n></span><span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quo=
t;,serif;font-weight:normal">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;fo=
nt-weight:normal">Requirements</span><u></u><u></u></h2>
<h3 style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:0.75in;line-he=
ight:12pt;break-after:avoid">
<span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;font-weig=
ht:normal">3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations</span><u></u><u></u=
></h3>
<p>The term =E2=80=9Cnetwork segmentation=E2=80=9D is used extensively in S=
DWAN deployment. In general (and in this document), the =E2=80=9CNetwork Se=
gmentation=E2=80=9D is referring to the process of dividing the network int=
o logical sub-networks using isolation techniques on a forwarding
 device such as a switch, router, or firewall. For a homogeneous network, s=
uch as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, VRF or VLAN are used to separate networ=
k segments.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks, =
it is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN network=
 instances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do not=
 have their own assigned AS numbers,
 a very easy way is to use Private AS numbers, in the range of 64512 to 655=
35, to differentiate different SDWAN segmentations.. When using BGP to cont=
rol the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numbers are carried by the BGP UPDAT=
E messages to their corresponding
 RRs.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used? <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you very much. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Linda Dunbar<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" tar=
get=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Hi Linda;</span><u><=
/u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">The SD-WAN Segment i=
s part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there could be more than one S=
egment over a single underlay depending on the design and the business requ=
irements.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Each Segment represe=
nts a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I suggested that we may =
need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update messages in order to ident=
ify and build the routing the table for each
 Segment (based on the Segment ID).</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Hope this helps.</sp=
an><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Regards;</span><u></=
u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Basil</span><u></u><=
u></u></p>
<p><span style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.c=
om" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> February-03-20 10:40 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" target=
=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-us=
age description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application =
Based Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Basil, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you very much for the comments. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision.=
 <u></u>
<u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be =
included in the BGP UPDATE), does the =E2=80=9CSegment=E2=80=9D mean the di=
fferent Underlay?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to P=
ublic Internet.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN =E2=80=9Csegments=E2=80=9D? <u></u><u></u></=
p>
<p>If not, can you elaborate more? <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thanks, Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" tar=
get=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Hello Linda;</span><=
u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">I haven=E2=80=99t go=
ne through the entire document; however, I have the following quick comment=
s</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<ol start=3D"1" type=3D"A">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA">Regarding the following paragraph:</span><u></u><u></u=
></li></ol>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rg=
b(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
1.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.5in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,=
125)">The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either encrypte=
d or unecrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is NOT enc=
rypted is not always correct). I would
 change the parpagaph to the following (for clarity):</span><u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
1.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse <span style=3D"color:red">with or </span>withou=
t encryption, others require encryption, e.g. over untrusted public network=
s.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<ol start=3D"2" type=3D"A">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">
<span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif">Another thing t=
hat we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each Segment (at the SD-WAN Edge)=
 MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will map the Application Flow to the Se=
gment. Since the Segment is a
 =E2=80=9Crouting domain=E2=80=9D, the BGP update will be exchanged with th=
e memebers of a particular Segment.
</span><u></u><u></u></li></ol>
<p style=3D"margin-left:0.5in"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:Ar=
ial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-left:0.5in"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:Ar=
ial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);background:yellow">As such: Should we i=
nclude the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP update messages? Perhaps w=
e need to further discuss this in details.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Any feedback is welcomed and it=
=E2=80=99s highly appreciated.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Regards;</span><u></u><u></u></p=
>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Basil</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=
=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rg=
b(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futur=
ewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> January-31-20 5:17 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage =
description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Base=
d Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span lang=3D"EN-CA">=C2=A0</span><u><=
/u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">BESS participants:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=E2=80=9CSDWAN=E2=80=9D networks is ch=
aracterized by:
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
1.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
2.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Enable direct Internet =
access from remote sites, instead hauling all traffic to Corporate HQ for c=
entralized policy control.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
3.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Some traffic are routed=
 based on application IDs instead of based on destination IP addresses.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><a href=3D"https://nam11.safelinks.pro=
tection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdatatracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft=
-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Clinda.dunbar%40futurew=
ei.com%7Ce72069277dec49a5666a08d7cfcddf3f%7C0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fed=
c%7C1%7C0%7C637206355463932513&amp;sdata=3DLtBJOxohSHjupWERqW88kUik96QA8iKz=
aucSLxh6rSU%3D&amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ietf=
.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/</a>
 describes examples of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Appli=
cation Based Segmentation, =C2=A0assuming that the applications are assigne=
d with unique IP addresses.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">In the Figure below, the following BGP=
 Updates can be advertised to ensure that Payment Application only communic=
ates with the Payment Gateway:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the=
 RED P2P topology (only propagated to Payment GW node:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute: </span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:black">
30.1.1.x/24<u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">Tunnel Encap Path Attribute</span><u></u=
><u></u></p>
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:black">
IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW -&gt;C-PE2<u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:134.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the=
 routes to be reached by Purple:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute:</span><u></u><u>=
</u></p>
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal">
<span style=3D"color:black">10.1.x.x</span><u></u><u></u></li><li class=3D"=
MsoNormal">
<span style=3D"color:black">12.4.x.x</span><u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif;color:black">-=
</span><span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;=
,serif;color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">TunnelEncap Path Attribute:</span><u></u=
><u></u></p>
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:black">
Any node to C-PE2<u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">Your feedback is greatly appreciated.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">Thank you very much. <u></u><u></u></p=
>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">Linda Dunbar<u></u><u></u></p>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center">
</span></div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><strong><i><span style=3D"font-size:9p=
t;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:blue">External Email:</span></i></st=
rong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:=
blue"> Please use caution
 when opening links and attachments / </span></em><strong><i><span style=3D=
"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:blue">Courriel externe:=
</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sa=
ns-serif;color:blue"> Soyez
 prudent avec les liens et documents joints </span></em><u></u><u></u></p>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center">
</span></div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><strong><i><span style=3D"font-size:9p=
t;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:blue">External Email:</span></i></st=
rong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:=
blue"> Please use caution
 when opening links and attachments / </span></em><strong><i><span style=3D=
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</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sa=
ns-serif;color:blue"> Soyez
 prudent avec les liens et documents joints </span></em><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">_______________________________________________<br>
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<a href=3D"mailto:Idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">Idr@ietf.org</a><br>
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</blockquote>
</div>
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_______________________________________________<br>
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From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2020 21:51:41 -0400
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To: Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
Cc: Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>, Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>,  "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, "idr@ietf.org" <idr@ietf.org>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/bJONbffUqgm2mRmEXdVue1XBwuc>
Subject: Re: [bess] [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-safi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI
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Thanks Robert!! =F0=9F=91=8D

For me to really comprehend I have to have to put the tire to the road and
test in my Dev lab.  Any caveats with Cisco XR?  Ping me off list on cisco
specific reply.

Kind regards

Gyan

On Tue, Mar 31, 2020 at 6:43 AM Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net> wrote:

> Hi Gyan,
>
> As topic 1 - Extended community which is used for filtering incoming
> updates can be configured under BGP AF - there is nothing in the protocol
> which mandates that such RTs need to be configured under VRF section.
>
> As of topic 2 - This is huge misconception by many people who think that
> SAFI 128 requires MPLS transport. So let me clearly state that SAFI 128
> application can happily run for many years now over pure IP transport. VP=
N
> labels and transport paradigm are completely separate. Hint: RFC7510 or
> RFC4023. Moreover - let me also state that MPLS transport does not bring
> any benefits other then few bits savings in the packet header as compared
> with say IPv4 transport. Contrary it costs a lot of complexity in the
> control plane and forwarding planes of the network elements.
>
> Thx,
> R.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Mar 31, 2020 at 7:48 AM Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> wrote=
:
>
>>
>> Robert  & Linda
>>
>> Sorry to inject myself into this thread.
>>
>> You stated that that RFC 4364 SAFI 128 for vpnv4 vpnv6 is the BGP contro=
l
>> plane service layer overlay from PE to RR. Agreed.  By default all PEs
>> including the SDWAN PE have RT Filtering enabled by default and only imp=
ort
>> the RT into the VRF at the control plane level if the VRF is configured
>> with RT advertised by the RR is being imported by the PE, if not the SAF=
I
>> 128 prefixes are dropped.  So I understand that the BGP updates is a
>> control plane function, but how would the routes get imported by the PE =
if
>> the VRF is not defined on the PE.  RFC 4684 RTC capability allows only t=
he
>> RTs imported on the PE to be advertised by the RR to reduced the SAFI 12=
8
>> route advertised by the RR that would result in being filtered on the PE=
.
>>
>> So how would that work using SAFI 128 RT to provide the network slicing
>> for SDWAN without VRF configured.
>>
>> Also you mentioned that SAFI 128 L3 vpn services overlay can run over an=
y
>> underlay and that does not have to be MPLS based.  I know SAFI 128 works
>> with SR-MPLS but there you are reusing the MPLS data plane.  With SRv6 d=
ue
>> to PM draft signaling by egress PE for end.dx instantiation, so there is
>> not any service label necessary as is with MPLS and thus SAFI 128 works
>> with SRv6.
>>
>> How would SAFI 128 work with IP underlay used with SDWAN?
>>
>> Even with  inter-as option b c ab, with BGP LU you do have topmost label
>> which is via BGP labeled unicast.  For inter as options if SAFI128 would
>> work w/o BGP LU you could just run SAFI 128 over IP.  I have never tried
>> but I think the control plane would come up but the data plane would be
>> broken.
>>
>> Kind regards
>>
>> Gyan
>>
>> On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 9:26 PM Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com=
>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Robert,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Want to confirm the following two points with you. Do I interpret your
>>> words correctly?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>    - If a CPE supports traditional VPN with multiple VRFs, and supports
>>>    multiple SDWAN instances, the traditional VRF configuration is still=
 same
>>>    which are carried by BGP Route Target Extended community.
>>>    - For the SDWAN Instances supported by the same CPE, we can use
>>>    Extended Community with a different name (say SDWAN Target ID). When=
 the
>>>    SDWAN Target ID is used, the SAFI 128 can be used for routes for the=
 SDWAN
>>>    instance,  with the exception that the label in the NLRI is not the =
MPLS
>>>    label carried by the data packets .
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thank you.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Linda Dunbar
>>>
>>> *From:* Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
>>> *Sent:* Tuesday, March 24, 2020 3:32 AM
>>> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
>>> *Cc:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org;
>>> bess@ietf.org
>>> *Subject:* Re: [Idr] Seeking feedback of
>>> draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-safi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Insta=
nce
>>> ID in the NLRI
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Linda,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Nope you do not need VRFs. RT construct works at the control plane
>>> level. VRF may be useful for traffic separation purposes on
>>> multitenant CPEs or if you would like to relax requirements for unique =
IP
>>> across SDWAN sites - but not a must otherwise.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> My main point was  that BGP SAFI 128 gives you for free transport for
>>> multiple routing contexts so why not leverage it as is?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Moreover you may suddenly also discover that RTC (RFC4684) is your
>>> SDWAN friend too.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Many thx,
>>> R.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 5:15 AM Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.co=
m>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Robert,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thank you very much for the feedback.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> If using your suggested Route Target approach to represent the SDWAN
>>> Instance ID, does it mean that a SDWAN Edge has to use the same approac=
h to
>>> configure the VRF for SDWAN instances?
>>>
>>> If the edge node supports both traditional VPN and SDWAN, will it cause
>>> confusion for RT to represent both?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> RT is encoded in the Extended_Communities Path Attribute, SAFI 128 is
>>> encoded in the MP_REACH_NLRI Path Attribute.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> What do you mean by saying =E2=80=9Cdifferent name to Route target(s) c=
arried in
>>> the SAFI 128=E2=80=9D?
>>>
>>> Do you mean having a different name (say SDWAN_Target) in
>>> Extended_Communities Path Attribute, and have MP_REACH_NLRI Path Attrib=
ute
>>> including the SAFI 128?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> SDWAN Instance ID is for the control Plane, not to be carried by the
>>> data packets. SAFI 128 for VPN has the Label encoded in the NLRI field =
that
>>> is to be carried by the data packets. But SDWAN Instance ID is not carr=
ied
>>> by the Data Packets. Is it correct?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thank you.
>>>
>>> Linda
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* Robert Raszuk <robert@raszuk.net>
>>> *Sent:* Monday, March 23, 2020 2:28 PM
>>> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
>>> *Cc:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org;
>>> bess@ietf.org
>>> *Subject:* Re: [Idr] Seeking feedback of
>>> draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-safi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Insta=
nce
>>> ID in the NLRI
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Linda,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I think you are mixing data plane and control plane.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> In SDWAN data plane is of no issue as you are interconnecting sites in =
a
>>> given VPN over mesh of secure tunnels.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> You are asking how to keep control plane separate between VPN instances=
.
>>> This is precisely what RFC4364 does already and RT import/export is use=
d to
>>> indicate the instance which given set of reachability belongs. Why to
>>> reinvent the wheel and do something new just for the heck of it :) ?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> To be original you can at best invent a different name to Route
>>> target(s) carried in the SAFI 128 but let's keep the mechanism the same=
.
>>> That would be my suggestion.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Kind regards,
>>>
>>> R.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> PS. While this is obvious for some many folks are still confused.
>>> RFC4364 does not need to run over MPLS data plane. It can run over IPSe=
c or
>>> over DTLS or over UDP/IP just fine.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 6:47 PM Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.co=
m>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> IDR experts:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks. A
>>> SDWAN edge node may need to map client traffic to different SDWAN netwo=
rk
>>> instances (or segmentations).
>>>
>>> It might not be feasible to use the AS number in the BGP message to
>>> differentiate the SDWAN network instances as multiple SDWAN instances m=
ay
>>> share the same AS number.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> We would like to hear feedback from IDR group on using similar method a=
s
>>>  Binding MPLS Labels to Address Prefixes [RFC8277] to bind SDWAN Instan=
ce
>>> ID to  prefixes.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> When  MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) is present, MPLS label is carried by NLRI
>>> [RFC8277] as:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>       0                   1                   2                   3
>>>
>>>       0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
>>>
>>>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>>
>>>      |    Length     |                 Label                 |Rsrv |S|
>>>
>>>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>>
>>>      |                          Prefix                               ~
>>>
>>>      ~                                                               |
>>>
>>>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>                        Figure 2: NLRI with One Label
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> We would like to  propose the SDWAN Instance ID being encoded in the
>>> Label field as follows when SDWAN SAFI (=3D74 allocated by IANA) is use=
d,:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>       0                   1                   2                   3
>>>
>>>       0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
>>>
>>>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>>
>>>      |    Length     |      SDWAN Instance ID (Label)        |Rsrv |S|
>>>
>>>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>>
>>>      |                          Prefix                               ~
>>>
>>>      ~                                                               |
>>>
>>>      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>                         NLRI with SDWAN Instance ID.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Greatly appreciate any comments or other suggestions..
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thank you,
>>>
>>> Linda Dunbar
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>
>>> *Sent:* Monday, March 23, 2020 9:14 AM
>>> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org
>>> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org
>>> *Subject:* Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
>>> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
>>> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Linda,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>     It seems that using another SAFI is a possible solution.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Best Regards,
>>>
>>> Huaimo
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> *From:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
>>> *Sent:* Friday, March 20, 2020 12:54 AM
>>> *To:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org <
>>> idr@ietf.org>
>>> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org <bess@ietf.org>
>>> *Subject:* RE: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
>>> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
>>> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Huaimo,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thank you very much for the suggestion.
>>>
>>> Do you mean using the similar approach as VPN Label carried by NLRI Pat=
h
>>> Attribute [RFC8277] for SDWAN Segmentation Identifier?
>>>
>>> If yes, the UPDATE message should not use the MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) to
>>> avoid confusion, right?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Linda
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* Huaimo Chen <huaimo.chen@futurewei.com>
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:45 PM
>>> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; idr@ietf.org
>>> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org
>>> *Subject:* Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
>>> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
>>> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Linda,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>     It seems that a label may be used as an "Identifier" to
>>> differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Best Regards,
>>>
>>> Huaimo
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> *From:* Idr <idr-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Linda Dunbar <
>>> linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM
>>> *To:* idr@ietf.org <idr@ietf.org>
>>> *Cc:* bess@ietf.org <bess@ietf.org>
>>> *Subject:* [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as
>>> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for
>>> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> BGP Experts,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Do you know if  there is any problem of using  Private AS as
>>> "Identifier" to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation? Here is the discussi=
on
>>> in BESS WG. Want to get IDR WG feedbacks for this question.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thank you.
>>>
>>> Linda
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* Linda Dunbar
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM
>>> *To:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>; bess@ietf.org
>>> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
>>> *Subject:* Is there any problem of using Private AS as "Identifier" to
>>> differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage=
?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Based on Basil=E2=80=99s comment on needing an identifier to differenti=
ate SDWAN
>>> instances, I added a section to  draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage . Wa=
nt
>>> to hear people=E2=80=99s feedback.
>>>
>>>
>>> 3.1    Requirements 3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations
>>>
>>> The term =E2=80=9Cnetwork segmentation=E2=80=9D is used extensively in =
SDWAN deployment.
>>> In general (and in this document), the =E2=80=9CNetwork Segmentation=E2=
=80=9D is referring
>>> to the process of dividing the network into logical sub-networks using
>>> isolation techniques on a forwarding device such as a switch, router, o=
r
>>> firewall. For a homogeneous network, such as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 networ=
k,
>>> VRF or VLAN are used to separate network segments.
>>>
>>> As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks,
>>> it is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN net=
work
>>> instances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do =
not
>>> have their own assigned AS numbers, a very easy way is to use Private A=
S
>>> numbers, in the range of 64512 to 65535, to differentiate different SDW=
AN
>>> segmentations.. When using BGP to control the SDWAN networks, the Priva=
te
>>> AS numbers are carried by the BGP UPDATE messages to their correspondin=
g
>>> RRs.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thank you very much.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Linda Dunbar
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>
>>> *Sent:* Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM
>>> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; bess@ietf.org
>>> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
>>> *Subject:* RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage
>>> description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application
>>> Based Segmentation
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Linda;
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> The SD-WAN Segment is part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there
>>> could be more than one Segment over a single underlay depending on the
>>> design and the business requirements.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Each Segment represents a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, =
I
>>> suggested that we may need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update
>>> messages in order to identify and build the routing the table for each
>>> Segment (based on the Segment ID).
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hope this helps.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Regards;
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Basil
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
>>> *Sent:* February-03-20 10:40 AM
>>> *To:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>; bess@ietf.org
>>> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
>>> *Subject:* [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on
>>> draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage description of using BGP UPDATE messa=
ges
>>> to achieve SD-WAN Application Based Segmentation
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Basil,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thank you very much for the comments.
>>>
>>> Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision=
.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be
>>> included in the BGP UPDATE), does the =E2=80=9CSegment=E2=80=9D mean th=
e different
>>> Underlay?
>>>
>>> In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to
>>> Public Internet.
>>>
>>> Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN =E2=80=9Csegments=E2=80=9D?
>>>
>>> If not, can you elaborate more?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks, Linda
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* Najem, Basil <basil.najem@bell.ca>
>>> *Sent:* Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM
>>> *To:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>; bess@ietf.org
>>> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
>>> *Subject:* RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage
>>> description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application
>>> Based Segmentation
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hello Linda;
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I haven=E2=80=99t gone through the entire document; however, I have the
>>> following quick comments
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>    1. Regarding the following paragraph:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths
>>> over different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple paralle=
l
>>> overlay paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private
>>> networks over which traffic can traverse without encryption, others req=
uire
>>> encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either encrypted
>>> or unecrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is NOT
>>> encrypted is not always correct). I would change the parpagaph to the
>>> following (for clarity):
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths
>>> over different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple paralle=
l
>>> overlay paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private
>>> networks over which traffic can traverse with or without encryption,
>>> others require encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>    1. Another thing that we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each
>>>    Segment (at the SD-WAN Edge) MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will=
 map
>>>    the Application Flow to the Segment. Since the Segment is a =E2=80=
=9Crouting
>>>    domain=E2=80=9D, the BGP update will be exchanged with the memebers =
of a particular
>>>    Segment.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> As such: Should we include the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP
>>> update messages? Perhaps we need to further discuss this in details.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Any feedback is welcomed and it=E2=80=99s highly appreciated.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Regards;
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Basil
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* Linda Dunbar <linda.dunbar@futurewei.com>
>>> *Sent:* January-31-20 5:17 PM
>>> *To:* bess@ietf.org
>>> *Cc:* draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org
>>> *Subject:* [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage
>>> description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application
>>> Based Segmentation
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> BESS participants:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> =E2=80=9CSDWAN=E2=80=9D networks is characterized by:
>>>
>>> 1.       Augment of transport, which refers to utilizing overlay paths
>>> over different underlay networks. Very often there are multiple paralle=
l
>>> overlay paths between any two SDWAN edges, some of which are private
>>> networks over which traffic can traverse without encryption, others req=
uire
>>> encryption, e.g. over untrusted public networks.
>>>
>>> 2.       Enable direct Internet access from remote sites, instead
>>> hauling all traffic to Corporate HQ for centralized policy control.
>>>
>>> 3.       Some traffic are routed based on application IDs instead of
>>> based on destination IP addresses.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/
>>> <https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fda=
tatracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&data=3D02%7=
C01%7Clinda.dunbar%40futurewei.com%7Ce72069277dec49a5666a08d7cfcddf3f%7C0fe=
e8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637206355463932513&sdata=3DLtBJOxoh=
SHjupWERqW88kUik96QA8iKzaucSLxh6rSU%3D&reserved=3D0>
>>> describes examples of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN
>>> Application Based Segmentation,  assuming that the applications are
>>> assigned with unique IP addresses.
>>>
>>> In the Figure below, the following BGP Updates can be advertised to
>>> ensure that Payment Application only communicates with the Payment Gate=
way:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the RED P2P topology (only propagate=
d
>>> to Payment GW node:
>>>
>>> -        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:
>>>
>>>    - 30.1.1.x/24
>>>
>>> -        Tunnel Encap Path Attribute
>>>
>>>    - IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW ->C-PE2
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the routes to be reached by Purple:
>>>
>>> -        MP-NLRI Path Attribute:
>>>
>>>    - 10.1.x.x
>>>          - 12.4.x.x
>>>
>>> -        TunnelEncap Path Attribute:
>>>
>>>    - Any node to C-PE2
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Your feedback is greatly appreciated.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thank you very much.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Linda Dunbar
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> *External Email:** Please use caution when opening links and
>>> attachments / **Courriel externe:** Soyez prudent avec les liens et
>>> documents joints *
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> *External Email:** Please use caution when opening links and
>>> attachments / **Courriel externe:** Soyez prudent avec les liens et
>>> documents joints *
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Idr mailing list
>>> Idr@ietf.org
>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/idr
>>> <https://nam11.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fww=
w.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fidr&data=3D02%7C01%7Clinda.dunbar%40futur=
ewei.com%7Ce72069277dec49a5666a08d7cfcddf3f%7C0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591f=
edc%7C1%7C0%7C637206355463932513&sdata=3DeqN85C344P7RxfO%2FBxoVZ0zNgGBsAcH%=
2F623Ye6TYHhs%3D&reserved=3D0>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Idr mailing list
>>> Idr@ietf.org
>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/idr
>>>
>> --
>>
>> Gyan  Mishra
>>
>> Network Engineering & Technology
>>
>> Verizon
>>
>> Silver Spring, MD 20904
>>
>> Phone: 301 502-1347
>>
>> Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com
>>
>>
>>
>> --

Gyan  Mishra

Network Engineering & Technology

Verizon

Silver Spring, MD 20904

Phone: 301 502-1347

Email: gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com

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<div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Thanks Robert!=
! =F0=9F=91=8D</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">For me to=
 really comprehend I have to have to put the tire to the road and test in m=
y Dev lab.=C2=A0 Any caveats with Cisco XR?=C2=A0 Ping me off list on cisco=
 specific reply.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Kind=C2=
=A0regards</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Gyan</div><di=
v><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On T=
ue, Mar 31, 2020 at 6:43 AM Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:robert@rasz=
uk.net">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmai=
l_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left=
:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr">Hi Gyan,<div><br></div><div>As topi=
c 1 - Extended community which is used for=C2=A0filtering incoming updates =
can be configured under=C2=A0BGP AF - there is nothing in the protocol whic=
h mandates that such RTs need to be configured under VRF section.=C2=A0</di=
v><div><br></div><div>As of topic 2 - This is huge misconception by many pe=
ople=C2=A0who think that SAFI 128 requires MPLS transport. So let me clearl=
y state that SAFI 128 application can happily run for many years now over p=
ure IP transport. VPN labels and transport paradigm are completely separate=
. Hint: RFC7510 or RFC4023. Moreover - let me also state that MPLS transpor=
t=C2=A0does not bring any benefits other then few bits savings in the packe=
t header as=C2=A0compared with say IPv4 transport. Contrary it costs a lot =
of complexity in the control plane and forwarding planes of the network ele=
ments.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Thx,<br>R.</div><div>=C2=A0</div><div=
><br></div></div></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div=
 dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Tue, Mar 31, 2020 at 7:48 AM Gyan Mish=
ra &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:hayabusagsm@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">hayabusag=
sm@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" styl=
e=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);paddin=
g-left:1ex"><div><div><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Robert =C2=A0&amp; Linda=
=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Sorry to inject m=
yself into this thread.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">=
You stated that that RFC 4364 SAFI 128 for vpnv4 vpnv6 is the BGP control p=
lane service layer overlay from PE to RR. Agreed.=C2=A0 By default all PEs =
including the SDWAN PE have RT Filtering enabled by default and only import=
 the RT into the VRF at the control plane level if the VRF is configured wi=
th RT advertised by the RR is being imported by the PE, if not the SAFI 128=
 prefixes are dropped.=C2=A0 So I understand that the BGP updates is a cont=
rol plane function, but how would the routes get imported by the PE if the =
VRF is not defined on the PE.=C2=A0 RFC 4684 RTC capability allows only the=
 RTs imported on the PE to be advertised by the RR to reduced the SAFI 128 =
route advertised by the RR that would result in being filtered on the PE.</=
div></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">So how would that w=
ork using SAFI 128 RT to provide the network slicing for SDWAN without VRF =
configured.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Also you men=
tioned that SAFI 128 L3 vpn services overlay can run over any underlay and =
that does not have to be MPLS based.=C2=A0 I know SAFI 128 works with SR-MP=
LS but there you are reusing the MPLS data plane.=C2=A0 With SRv6 due to PM=
 draft signaling by egress PE for end.dx instantiation, so there is not any=
 service label necessary as is with MPLS and thus SAFI 128 works with SRv6.=
</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">How would SAFI 128 work=
 with IP underlay used with SDWAN?</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div di=
r=3D"auto">Even with =C2=A0inter-as option b c ab, with BGP LU you do have =
topmost label which is via BGP labeled unicast.=C2=A0 For inter as options =
if SAFI128 would work w/o BGP LU you could just run SAFI 128 over IP.=C2=A0=
 I have never tried but I think the control plane would come up but the dat=
a plane would be broken.<br></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"a=
uto">Kind regards=C2=A0</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">=
Gyan=C2=A0</div><div><div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" c=
lass=3D"gmail_attr">On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 9:26 PM Linda Dunbar &lt;<a hre=
f=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futu=
rewei.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=
=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding=
-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-US">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Robert, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Want to confirm the following two points with you. D=
o I interpret your words correctly?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<ul style=3D"margin-top:0in" type=3D"disc">
<li style=3D"margin-left:0in">If a CPE supports traditional VPN with multip=
le VRFs, and supports multiple SDWAN instances, the traditional VRF configu=
ration is still same which are carried by BGP Route Target Extended
 community. =C2=A0<u></u><u></u></li><li style=3D"margin-left:0in">For the =
SDWAN Instances supported by the same CPE, we can use Extended Community wi=
th a different name (say SDWAN Target ID). When the SDWAN Target ID is used=
, the SAFI 128 can be
 used for routes for the SDWAN instance, =C2=A0with the exception that the =
label in the NLRI is not the MPLS label carried by the data packets . =C2=
=A0<u></u><u></u></li></ul>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda Dunbar<u></u><u></u></p></div></div><div lang=
=3D"EN-US"><div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rob=
ert@raszuk.net" target=3D"_blank">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt; <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, March 24, 2020 3:32 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;; <a href=3D"mailto:idr@iet=
f.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org"=
 target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-s=
afi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI<u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Hi Linda,<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Nope you do not need VRFs. RT construct works at the=
 control plane level. VRF may be useful for traffic separation purposes on =
multitenant=C2=A0CPEs or if you would like to relax requirements for unique=
 IP across SDWAN sites - but not a must
 otherwise.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">My main point was=C2=A0 that BGP SAFI 128 gives you =
for free transport for multiple routing contexts so why not leverage=C2=A0i=
t as is?=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Moreover you may suddenly=C2=A0also discover that RT=
C (RFC4684) is your SDWAN=C2=A0friend too.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Many=C2=A0thx,<br>
R.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US"><div><div></div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN=
-US"><div><div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 5:15 AM Linda Dunbar &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@f=
uturewei.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US"><div><div><blockquote style=3D"border=
-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt solid rgb(20=
4,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US"><div><d=
iv><blockquote style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:non=
e;border-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-lef=
t:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"><div><div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Robert,
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you very much for the feedback.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">If using your suggested Route Target approach to rep=
resent the SDWAN Instance ID, does it mean that a SDWAN Edge has to use the=
 same approach to configure the VRF for SDWAN instances?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">If the edge node supports both traditional VPN and S=
DWAN, will it cause confusion for RT to represent both?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">RT is encoded in the Extended_Communities Path Attri=
bute, SAFI 128 is encoded in the MP_REACH_NLRI Path Attribute.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">What do you mean by saying =E2=80=9Cdifferent name t=
o Route target(s) carried in the SAFI 128=E2=80=9D? =C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Do you mean having a different name (say SDWAN_Targe=
t) in Extended_Communities Path Attribute, and have MP_REACH_NLRI Path Attr=
ibute including the SAFI 128?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">SDWAN Instance ID is for the control Plane, not to b=
e carried by the data packets. SAFI 128 for VPN has the Label encoded in th=
e NLRI field that is to be carried by the data packets.
 But SDWAN Instance ID is not carried by the Data Packets. Is it correct? <=
u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Robert Raszuk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rob=
ert@raszuk.net" target=3D"_blank">robert@raszuk.net</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, March 23, 2020 2:28 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a>; <a href=
=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">
bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] Seeking feedback of draft-dunbar-idr-sdwan-port-s=
afi using SDWAN SAFI to encode SDWAN Instance ID in the NLRI<u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Hi Linda,<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I think you are mixing data plane and control plane.=
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">In SDWAN=C2=A0data plane is of no issue as you are i=
nterconnecting sites in a given VPN over mesh of secure tunnels.=C2=A0<u></=
u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">You are asking how to keep control plane separate=C2=
=A0between VPN instances. This is precisely what RFC4364 does already and R=
T import/export is used to indicate the instance which
 given set of reachability belongs. Why to reinvent the wheel and do someth=
ing new just for the heck of it :) ?=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">To be original you can at best invent=C2=A0a differe=
nt name to Route target(s) carried in the SAFI 128 but let&#39;s keep the m=
echanism=C2=A0the same. That would be my suggestion.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Kind regards,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">R.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">PS. While this is obvious for some many folks are st=
ill confused. RFC4364 does not need to run over MPLS data plane. It can run=
 over IPSec or over DTLS or over UDP/IP just fine.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US"><div><div><b=
lockquote style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;bor=
der-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-left:4.8=
pt;margin-right:0in"><div><div><div></div></div></div></blockquote></div></=
div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US"><div><div><blockquote style=3D"border-top:non=
e;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,20=
4);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"><div><div><d=
iv>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Mon, Mar 23, 2020 at 6:47 PM Linda Dunbar &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@f=
uturewei.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US"><div><=
div><blockquote style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:no=
ne;border-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-le=
ft:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"><div><div><div><blockquote style=3D"border-top:n=
one;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,=
204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin:5pt 0in 5pt 4.8pt">
<div>
<div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></=
div><div lang=3D"EN-US"><div><div><blockquote style=3D"border-top:none;bord=
er-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);pad=
ding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"><div><div><div><bl=
ockquote style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;bord=
er-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin:5pt 0in 5=
pt 4.8pt"><div><div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">IDR experts:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple ty=
pes of networks. A SDWAN edge node may need to map client traffic to differ=
ent SDWAN network instances (or segmentations).<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">It might not be feasible to use the AS number in the=
 BGP message to differentiate the SDWAN network instances as multiple SDWAN=
 instances may share the same AS number.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We would like to hear feedback from IDR group on usi=
ng similar method as =C2=A0Binding MPLS Labels to Address Prefixes [RFC8277=
] to bind SDWAN Instance ID to =C2=A0prefixes.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">When =C2=A0MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) is present, MPLS l=
abel is carried by NLRI [RFC8277] as:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div style=3D"border:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:8pt">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 1=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 2=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 3</sp=
an><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 =
9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Length=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Label=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |Rsrv |S|</span><=
u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Prefix=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
~</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ~=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:7.9pt;background:rgb(255,253,=
245);word-break:break-all">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:b=
lack">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Figure 2: N=
LRI with One Label</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We would like to =C2=A0propose the SDWAN Instance ID=
 being encoded in the Label field as follows when SDWAN SAFI (=3D74 allocat=
ed by IANA) is used,:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 1=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 2=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 3</span><u>=
</u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 =
2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Length=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 SDWAN Instance ID (Label)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |Rsrv |S|</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Prefix=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ~</span>=
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ~=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0|</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0NLRI with SDWAN Instance ID.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Greatly appreciate any comments or other suggestions=
..
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><=
div lang=3D"EN-US"><div><div><blockquote style=3D"border-top:none;border-ri=
ght:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:=
0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"><div><div><div><blockqu=
ote style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-le=
ft:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin:5pt 0in 5pt 4.=
8pt"><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thank you,<u></u><u></u></p></div></d=
iv></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><div lang=
=3D"EN-US"><div><div><blockquote style=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none=
;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in =
0in 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"><div><div><div><blockquote styl=
e=3D"border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt s=
olid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin:5pt 0in 5pt 4.8pt"><di=
v><div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Linda Dunbar<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaim=
o.chen@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, March 23, 2020 9:14 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Hi Linda,=
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0</s=
pan><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 It seems that using another SAFI is a possible solution.</span><u></=
u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0</s=
pan><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Best Rega=
rds,</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Huaimo</s=
pan><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center">
<hr size=3D"2" width=3D"98%" align=3D"center">
</div>
<div id=3D"m_4002494523041957294gmail-m_-7254824953371920217m_-754151543596=
9773413m_-309718514547583260gmail-m_4952540666890611967gmail-m_468092154155=
5540591divRplyFwdMsg">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"color:black">From:</span></b><span=
 style=3D"color:black"> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@fut=
urewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, March 20, 2020 12:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a> &lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</=
a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?</span>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p>Huaimo, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you very much for the suggestion. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Do you mean using the similar approach as VPN Label carried by NLRI Path=
 Attribute [RFC8277] for SDWAN Segmentation Identifier?<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>If yes, the UPDATE message should not use the MPLS VPN SAFI (=3D128) to =
avoid confusion, right?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Huaimo Chen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:huaimo.chen@futurewei.com=
" target=3D"_blank">huaimo.chen@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:45 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &=
quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar=
-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Hi Linda,</span><u></u><u></u=
></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0 =C2=A0 It seems that a=
 label may be used as an=C2=A0&quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WA=
N Segmentation.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Best Regards,</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:black">Huaimo</span><u></u><u></u></=
p>
</div>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center">
<hr size=3D"2" width=3D"98%" align=3D"center">
</div>
<div id=3D"m_4002494523041957294gmail-m_-7254824953371920217m_-754151543596=
9773413m_-309718514547583260gmail-m_4952540666890611967gmail-m_468092154155=
5540591x_divRplyFwdMsg">
<p><b><span style=3D"color:black">From:</span></b><span style=3D"color:blac=
k"> Idr &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:idr-bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr-b=
ounces@ietf.org</a>&gt; on behalf of Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:lin=
da.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&g=
t;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 1:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</=
a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">idr@ietf.org</a>&g=
t;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</=
a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Idr] FW: Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot=
;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bes=
s-bgp-sdwan-usage?</span>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p>BGP Experts, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Do you know if =C2=A0there is any problem of using=C2=A0 Private AS as=
=C2=A0 &quot;Identifier&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation? Here is=
 the discussion in BESS WG. Want to get IDR WG feedbacks for this question.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, March 19, 2020 11:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" target=
=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Is there any problem of using Private AS as &quot;Identifie=
r&quot; to differentiate SD-WAN Segmentation for draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwa=
n-usage?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Based on Basil=E2=80=99s comment on needing an identifier to differentia=
te SDWAN instances, I added a section to =C2=A0draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-=
usage . Want to hear people=E2=80=99s feedback.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<h2 style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:45pt;line-heig=
ht:12pt;break-after:avoid">
<a name=3D"m_4002494523041957294_m_-7254824953371920217_m_-7541515435969773=
413_m_-309718514547583260_m_4952540666890611967_m_4680921541555540"><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;font-weight:norm=
al">3.1</span></a><span></span><span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&qu=
ot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif;font-weight:normal">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;fo=
nt-weight:normal">Requirements</span><u></u><u></u></h2>
<h3 style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12pt;margin-left:0.75in;line-he=
ight:12pt;break-after:avoid">
<span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;font-weig=
ht:normal">3.1.1Supporting Multiple SDWAN Segmentations</span><u></u><u></u=
></h3>
<p>The term =E2=80=9Cnetwork segmentation=E2=80=9D is used extensively in S=
DWAN deployment. In general (and in this document), the =E2=80=9CNetwork Se=
gmentation=E2=80=9D is referring to the process of dividing the network int=
o logical sub-networks using isolation techniques on a forwarding
 device such as a switch, router, or firewall. For a homogeneous network, s=
uch as MPLS VPN or Layer 2 network, VRF or VLAN are used to separate networ=
k segments.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>As SDWAN is an overlay network arching over multiple types of networks, =
it is important to have distinct identifiers to differentiate SDWAN network=
 instances (or segmentations). When different SDWAN network segments do not=
 have their own assigned AS numbers,
 a very easy way is to use Private AS numbers, in the range of 64512 to 655=
35, to differentiate different SDWAN segmentations.. When using BGP to cont=
rol the SDWAN networks, the Private AS numbers are carried by the BGP UPDAT=
E messages to their corresponding
 RRs.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Greatly appreciate any feedback on this description. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Is there any scenario that Private AS cannot be used? <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you very much. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Linda Dunbar<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" tar=
get=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, February 7, 2020 3:02 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Hi Linda;</span><u><=
/u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">The SD-WAN Segment i=
s part of the SD-WAN fabric; in other words, there could be more than one S=
egment over a single underlay depending on the design and the business requ=
irements.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Each Segment represe=
nts a single and an isolated L3 domain; therefore, I suggested that we may =
need to include the Segment ID in the BGP update messages in order to ident=
ify and build the routing the table for each
 Segment (based on the Segment ID).</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Hope this helps.</sp=
an><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Regards;</span><u></=
u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Basil</span><u></u><=
u></u></p>
<p><span style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.c=
om" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> February-03-20 10:40 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" target=
=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-us=
age description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application =
Based Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Basil, <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thank you very much for the comments. <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Your suggested wording change will be incorporated in the next revision.=
 <u></u>
<u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>As for your suggestion of Segment and Segment ID of a SDWAN node (to be =
included in the BGP UPDATE), does the =E2=80=9CSegment=E2=80=9D mean the di=
fferent Underlay?
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>In the figure below, C-PE1 has 3 WAN ports: 2 to MPLS network and 1 to P=
ublic Internet.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Do you mean C-PE1 has 3 WAN =E2=80=9Csegments=E2=80=9D? <u></u><u></u></=
p>
<p>If not, can you elaborate more? <u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>Thanks, Linda<u></u><u></u></p>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p><b>From:</b> Najem, Basil &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:basil.najem@bell.ca" tar=
get=3D"_blank">basil.najem@bell.ca</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, February 02, 2020 5:48 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futurewei.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage d=
escription of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Based=
 Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<div>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">Hello Linda;</span><=
u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">I haven=E2=80=99t go=
ne through the entire document; however, I have the following quick comment=
s</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<ol start=3D"1" type=3D"A">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">
<span lang=3D"EN-CA">Regarding the following paragraph:</span><u></u><u></u=
></li></ol>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rg=
b(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
1.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.5in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,=
125)">The traffic that traverses the privet networks can be either encrypte=
d or unecrypted (in other words, the assumption that the traffic is NOT enc=
rypted is not always correct). I would
 change the parpagaph to the following (for clarity):</span><u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
1.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse <span style=3D"color:red">with or </span>withou=
t encryption, others require encryption, e.g. over untrusted public network=
s.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<ol start=3D"2" type=3D"A">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">
<span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif">Another thing t=
hat we need to discuss is the Segment ID; each Segment (at the SD-WAN Edge)=
 MUST have an ID. The SD-WAN Policy will map the Application Flow to the Se=
gment. Since the Segment is a
 =E2=80=9Crouting domain=E2=80=9D, the BGP update will be exchanged with th=
e memebers of a particular Segment.
</span><u></u><u></u></li></ol>
<p style=3D"margin-left:0.5in"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:Ar=
ial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-left:0.5in"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:Ar=
ial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125);background:yellow">As such: Should we i=
nclude the Segment ID as an attribute in the BGP update messages? Perhaps w=
e need to further discuss this in details.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Any feedback is welcomed and it=
=E2=80=99s highly appreciated.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Regards;</span><u></u><u></u></p=
>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-fam=
ily:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Basil</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span style=3D"color:rgb(31,73,125)">=
=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span lang=3D"EN-CA" style=3D"color:rg=
b(31,73,125)">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-=
top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><b>From:</b> Linda Dunbar &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:linda.dunbar@futurewei.com" target=3D"_blank">linda.dunbar@futur=
ewei.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> January-31-20 5:17 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ietf.org=
</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">
draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXT]solicit feedback on draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage =
description of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve SD-WAN Application Base=
d Segmentation
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><span lang=3D"EN-CA">=C2=A0</span><u><=
/u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">BESS participants:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=E2=80=9CSDWAN=E2=80=9D networks is ch=
aracterized by:
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
1.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Augment of transport, w=
hich refers to utilizing overlay paths over different underlay networks. Ve=
ry often there are multiple parallel overlay paths between any two SDWAN ed=
ges, some of which are private networks over
 which traffic can traverse without encryption, others require encryption, =
e.g. over untrusted public networks.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
2.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Enable direct Internet =
access from remote sites, instead hauling all traffic to Corporate HQ for c=
entralized policy control.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:0.75in;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
3.<span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,seri=
f">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 </span>
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Some traffic are routed=
 based on application IDs instead of based on destination IP addresses.
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><a href=3D"https://nam11.safelinks.pro=
tection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fdatatracker.ietf.org%2Fdoc%2Fdraft=
-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage%2F&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Clinda.dunbar%40futurew=
ei.com%7Ce72069277dec49a5666a08d7cfcddf3f%7C0fee8ff2a3b240189c753a1d5591fed=
c%7C1%7C0%7C637206355463932513&amp;sdata=3DLtBJOxohSHjupWERqW88kUik96QA8iKz=
aucSLxh6rSU%3D&amp;reserved=3D0" target=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ietf=
.org/doc/draft-dunbar-bess-bgp-sdwan-usage/</a>
 describes examples of using BGP UPDATE messages to achieve the SDWAN Appli=
cation Based Segmentation, =C2=A0assuming that the applications are assigne=
d with unique IP addresses.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">In the Figure below, the following BGP=
 Updates can be advertised to ensure that Payment Application only communic=
ates with the Payment Gateway:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">BGP UPDATE #1 from C-PE2 to RR for the=
 RED P2P topology (only propagated to Payment GW node:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute: </span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:black">
30.1.1.x/24<u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">Tunnel Encap Path Attribute</span><u></u=
><u></u></p>
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:black">
IPsec Attributes for PaymentGW -&gt;C-PE2<u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:134.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">BGP UPDATE #2 from C-PE2 to RR for the=
 routes to be reached by Purple:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">-</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">MP-NLRI Path Attribute:</span><u></u><u>=
</u></p>
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal">
<span style=3D"color:black">10.1.x.x</span><u></u><u></u></li><li class=3D"=
MsoNormal">
<span style=3D"color:black">12.4.x.x</span><u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-left:62.65pt;margin-bottom:0.0001pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif;color:black">-=
</span><span style=3D"font-size:7pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;=
,serif;color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"color:black">TunnelEncap Path Attribute:</span><u></u=
><u></u></p>
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<ul type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"color:black">
Any node to C-PE2<u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</ul>
</ul>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">Your feedback is greatly appreciated.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">Thank you very much. <u></u><u></u></p=
>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt">Linda Dunbar<u></u><u></u></p>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center">
</span></div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><strong><i><span style=3D"font-size:9p=
t;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:blue">External Email:</span></i></st=
rong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:=
blue"> Please use caution
 when opening links and attachments / </span></em><strong><i><span style=3D=
"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:blue">Courriel externe:=
</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sa=
ns-serif;color:blue"> Soyez
 prudent avec les liens et documents joints </span></em><u></u><u></u></p>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:12pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">
<hr size=3D"1" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center">
</span></div>
<p style=3D"margin:0in 0in 0.0001pt"><strong><i><span style=3D"font-size:9p=
t;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:blue">External Email:</span></i></st=
rong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:=
blue"> Please use caution
 when opening links and attachments / </span></em><strong><i><span style=3D=
"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:blue">Courriel externe:=
</span></i></strong><em><span style=3D"font-size:9pt;font-family:Calibri,sa=
ns-serif;color:blue"> Soyez
 prudent avec les liens et documents joints </span></em><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">_______________________________________________<br>
Idr mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Idr@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">Idr@ietf.org</a><br>
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F%2Fwww.ietf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fidr&amp;data=3D02%7C01%7Clinda.dunb=
ar%40futurewei.com%7Ce72069277dec49a5666a08d7cfcddf3f%7C0fee8ff2a3b240189c7=
53a1d5591fedc%7C1%7C0%7C637206355463932513&amp;sdata=3DeqN85C344P7RxfO%2FBx=
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www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/idr</a><u></u><u></u></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>

_______________________________________________<br>
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</blockquote></div></div>
</div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div d=
ir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"l=
tr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font size=3D=
"1" color=3D"#000000">G</font><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000">yan=C2=A0 =
Mishra</font></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#0=
00000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Network Engineering &amp; Technology=C2=A0</=
font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"=
georgia, serif">Verizon=C2=A0</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=
=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20904</f=
ont></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"g=
eorgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font s=
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o:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com</a=
></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div></div=
></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>
</blockquote></div></div>
</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature" =
data-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><=
div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"georgia, serif"><font si=
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t size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Silver Spring, MD 20=
904</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" fac=
e=3D"georgia, serif">Phone: 301 502-1347</font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><=
font size=3D"1" color=3D"#000000" face=3D"georgia, serif">Email: <a href=3D=
"mailto:gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com" target=3D"_blank">gyan.s.mishra@verizon.=
com</a></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br></p></div><div><br></div></div=
></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>

--000000000000972e7305a230ed20--

