Subject: Re: [cso] Cross-Stratum Optimization Problem Statement revision

From: Young Lee <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2010 11:53:39 -0500

Hi Dave and Ning,

Relating to the issue of scoping the CSO work, I just wanted to make sure we
have the same understanding. 

The initial work under CSO is simply defining protocol between the ACG
(Application CSO Gateway) and NCG (Network CSO Gateway). I think you refer
to this as proxy-signaling. 

The following figure shows the focus of CSO work. 

                    -------------------------------------------

                   |                    Application Overlay    |

                   |                                           |

 ----------        |    -------------         --------------   |

| End-User |       |   | Application |. . . .| Application  |  |

|          |. . . >|   | CSO Gateway |       |  Processes   |  |

 ----------        |   |    (ACG)    |        --------------   |

                   |   |             |        --------------   |

                   |    ------------- . . . .| Application  |  |

                   |          /\             | Related Data |  |

                   |          ||              --------------   |

                    ----------||-------------------------------

                              ||

                              ||   Application - Network

                              ||   Communication Interface & 

                              ||   Protocol (Focus of WG)

                              ||   

                    ----------||-------------------------------

                   |          \/         Network Underlay      |

                   |                                           |

                   |    -------------        ------------------  |

                   |   |   Network   |. . . |    Network     | |

                   |   | CSO Gateway |      |    Processes   | |

                   |   |    (NCG)    |       ----------------  |

                   |   |             |       -----------------  |

                   |    ------------- . . . |    Network     | |

                   |                        |  Related Data  | |

                   |                         ----------------  |

                    -------------------------------------------

The protocol is simply request/reply and should support:

-          path estimation (from application to network) 

-          path configuration/reservation (from application to network -
here the application profile needs to be communicated)

-          notification (e.g., congestion/failure indication from/to
application to/from network)

-          virtual/abstract info query from/to application to/from network
(we need to define what information to exchange)

Once this protocol is clearly defined, then we have quite a few works to be
done in the network side at a minimum:  

-          Interface between NCG and PCE (including multi-domain PCE) 

-          Interface between NCG and Diameter/Radius (for IP network) and
Control Plane (for MPLS/GMPLS network) 

-          How can we make communication of properties (e.g., latency) more
dynamic/agile across functional groups in the network stratum

-          How to provide atomic NM/configuration for the whole network
elements

But these items need to be worked on other WG groups such as CCAMP/MPLS,
PCE, PCN, Diameter, netconf/ying, etc. I think the confusion takes place
because all these functions are thought to be part of CSO work. 

CSO is only the trigger for these works to be done in other WG's. 

Let's continue to discuss. 

Best Regards,

Young

---

From: "So, Ning" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2010 18:47:39 +0000

Young,

I like the way you described the goal and how you narrowed it down.
Just want to clarify that the definition of "network" in network CSO
Gateway include WAN (all Layer 1, 2 and 3) networks as well as LAN
networks, right?       

Ning So

Transport & Data Network Evolution Planning

Verizon, Inc.

(office) 972-729-7905

(Cell) 972-955-0914

________________________________

From: Young Lee [mailto:[email-masked]] 
Sent: Tuesday, August 31, 2010 11:54 AM
To: McDysan, David E (Dave); So, Ning
Cc: [email-masked]
Subject: RE: Cross-Stratum Optimization Problem Statement revision

Hi Dave and Ning,

Relating to the issue of scoping the CSO work, I just wanted to make
sure we have the same understanding. 

The initial work under CSO is simply defining protocol between the ACG
(Application CSO Gateway) and NCG (Network CSO Gateway). I think you
refer to this as proxy-signaling. 

                   |                    Application Overlay    |

                   |                                           |

                   |   |             |        --------------   |

                   |          /\             | Related Data |  |

                   |          ||              --------------   |

                              ||

                              ||   Application - Network

                              ||   

                   |          \/         Network Underlay      |

                   |                                           |

                   |                        |  Related Data  | |

                   |                         ----------------  |

 

-          virtual/abstract info query from/to application to/from
network (we need to define what information to exchange)

Once this protocol is clearly defined, then we have quite a few works to
be done in the network side at a minimum:  

-          Interface between NCG and Diameter/Radius (for IP network)
and Control Plane (for MPLS/GMPLS network) 

-          How can we make communication of properties (e.g., latency)
more dynamic/agile across functional groups in the network stratum

Best Regards,

Young

---

From: Young Lee <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2010 14:01:20 -0500

Ning,

Network refers to the network stratum which is defined in the latest Problem
Statement document as: 

The network stratum is the functional block which manages and controls
network resources and provides transport of data between clients/end-users
and application sources. Network Resources are resources of any layer 3 or
below (L1/L2/L3) such as bandwidth, links, paths, path processing (creation,
deletion, and management), network databases, path computation, admission
control, and resource reservation. 

I wasn't sure in what context LAN networks are included in your definition
of "network"?  I was thinking "network" more or less "transport" networks
that belong to carriers. There is a boundary between "carrier networks" and
"customer prem" --- Are you thinking about LAN belonging to customer
networks? 

Regards,

Young

  _____  

From: So, Ning [mailto:[email-masked]] 
Sent: Tuesday, August 31, 2010 1:48 PM
To: Young Lee; McDysan, David E (Dave)
Cc: [email-masked]
Subject: RE: Cross-Stratum Optimization Problem Statement revision

Young,

I like the way you described the goal and how you narrowed it down.  Just
want to clarify that the definition of "network" in network CSO Gateway
include WAN (all Layer 1, 2 and 3) networks as well as LAN networks, right?

Ning So

Verizon, Inc.

(office) 972-729-7905

(Cell) 972-955-0914

  _____  

Hi Dave and Ning,

                   |                    Application Overlay    |

                   |                                           |

                   |   |             |        --------------   |

                   |          /\             | Related Data |  |

                   |          ||              --------------   |

                              ||

                              ||   Application - Network

                              ||   

                   |          \/         Network Underlay      |

                   |                                           |

                   |                        |  Related Data  | |

                   |                         ----------------  |

 

Best Regards,

Young

---

From: "So, Ning" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 31 Aug 2010 19:33:46 +0000

Young,

I am thinking more of "customer Prem", in this case, intra-data center
and Intra-VLAN but inter-data center network.  

Ning So

Verizon, Inc.

(office) 972-729-7905

(Cell) 972-955-0914

From: Young Lee [mailto:[email-masked]] 
Sent: Tuesday, August 31, 2010 2:01 PM
To: So, Ning; McDysan, David E (Dave)
Cc: [email-masked]
Subject: RE: Cross-Stratum Optimization Problem Statement revision

Ning,

Network refers to the network stratum which is defined in the latest
Problem Statement document as: 

The network stratum is the functional block which manages and controls
network resources and provides transport of data between
clients/end-users and application sources. Network Resources are
resources of any layer 3 or below (L1/L2/L3) such as bandwidth, links,
paths, path processing (creation, deletion, and management), network
databases, path computation, admission control, and resource
reservation. 

I wasn't sure in what context LAN networks are included in your
definition of "network"?  I was thinking "network" more or less
"transport" networks that belong to carriers. There is a boundary
between "carrier networks" and "customer prem" --- Are you thinking
about LAN belonging to customer networks? 

Regards,

Young

Young,

Ning So

Verizon, Inc.

(office) 972-729-7905

(Cell) 972-955-0914

Hi Dave and Ning,

                   |                    Application Overlay    |

                   |                                           |

                   |   |             |        --------------   |

                   |          /\             | Related Data |  |

                   |          ||              --------------   |

                              ||

                              ||   Application - Network

                              ||   

                   |          \/         Network Underlay      |

                   |                                           |

                   |                        |  Related Data  | |

                   |                         ----------------  |

 

Best Regards,

Young