Subject: RE: Further rights granted by draft-bradner-rfc-extracts-01.txt

From: "Contreras, Jorge" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 09:13:43 -0400

>My users require the right to be able to modify my products, and if I
>incorporate parts of RFCs, I can't fulfill the needs of my customers.
>I found that incorporating parts of RFCs is often required in
>implementations (think ASN.1 schemas, StringPrep tables).

Note that Scott's ID only relates to making derivatives of
the RFC documents themselves, and not to any technology
implemented in compliance with them.  

If you need to extract specific code segments or 
other text from an RFC (such as MIB or PIB modules)
those are addressed separately in Section 3.3.a(E) and
the right to make modifications is already granted
unless excluded by the owner under 5.2.  Does this address
your requirements?

-----Original Message-----
From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]]On Behalf
Of Simon Josefsson
Sent: Tuesday, July 12, 2005 4:24 AM
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Further rights granted by draft-bradner-rfc-extracts-01.txt

Thanks for writing this draft.  I'll bounce the text to the FSF
lawyers.  However, my feelings are that this is not sufficient to make
it possible for me to incorporate RFCs, and consequently to implement
them, in my free software projects.  Specifically:

   c. To the extent that a Contribution or any portion thereof is
      protected by copyright and other rights of authorship, the
      Contributor, and each named co-Contributor, and the organization
      he or she represents or is sponsored by (if any) grant a
      perpetual, irrevocable, non-exclusive, royalty-free, world-wide
      right and license to extract, copy, publish, display, distribute,
      and incorporate into other works, for any purpose (and not limited
      to use within the IETF Standards Process) any portion of the
      Contribution as long as the extract is not modified (other than
                   --------------------------------------
      translated into languages other than English), proper
      acknowledgement is given and as long as the ISOC copyright notice
      is included.  It also being understood that the licenses granted
      under this paragraph (c) shall not be deemed to grant any right
      under any patent, patent application or other similar intellectual
      property right.

My users require the right to be able to modify my products, and if I
incorporate parts of RFCs, I can't fulfill the needs of my customers.
I found that incorporating parts of RFCs is often required in
implementations (think ASN.1 schemas, StringPrep tables).

Further, it may be useful to clarify "proper acknowledgment".  I
dislike the acknowledgments required by the old 4 clause BSD license.

Thanks,
Simon

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---

From: Simon Josefsson <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 16:57:38 +0200

> unless excluded by the owner under 5.2.  Does this address

No.  For two reasons:

1) The rights granted by 3.3.a(E) are granted to the IETF and the
   ISOC, not to "third parties".  See the initial paragraph of 3.3.a.

2) The textual parts of RFCs are useful to incorporate in products,
   such as online help.  3.3.a(E) is thus not applicable.

I can't find anything that grant me the right to incorporate ASN.1
schemas or text from RFCs into my free software products today.  I
believe it would be in the interest of the IETF to make that possible.

Thanks,
Simon

---

From: Scott W Brim <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 13 Jul 2005 21:30:12 -0400

As in the other draft, shouldn't the last sentence be a sentence?

"It also being understood that the licenses granted under this
paragraph (c) shall not be deemed to grant any right under any patent,
patent application or other similar intellectual property right."