Subject: RE: [Mip6] comments on chakrabarti-mip6-bmip

From: Gerardo Giaretta <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 07 Dec 2004 20:27:15 +0100

Hi James, Alper,

I would follow up Alper's comments regarding AAA interaction.

This draft specifies a solution that could be very useful. In particular
I think that the scenario described in section 2.3 (non integrated ASP
scenario) is an important one and it has not been covered by
bootstrapping solution proposals yet. 

As Alper pointed out, in this scenario there could be a need for an
interaction between the HA and the AAA infrastructure of the MSP that is
only mentioned and not specified in the draft. Indeed, though it is true
that a local database might be used for very small mobility service
providers, in a real deployment scenario the MSP should exploit its AAA
infrastructure to authorize and bootstrap MIPv6 service. In this case an
interface between AAA and HA is needed. 
Some goals for such an interface have been listed in
draft-giaretta-mip6-aaa-ha-goals-00 (see in particular scenario 1).
Based on these goals, I think we should investigate whether the EAP
Diameter Application is suited for this scenario or whether it needs
some extensions. 

I think we also should investigate whether an unique interface can be
designed for all bootstrapping scenarios (both MSP and integrated ASP
scenarios) or not.

--Gerardo

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]] On 
> Behalf Of Alper Yegin
> Sent: Monday, December 06, 2004 11:58 PM
> To: [email-masked]
> Subject: [Mip6] comments on chakrabarti-mip6-bmip
> 
> 
> 
> Hello,
> 
> This is an interesting I-D for "discovering HA" part of MIP6
> bootstrapping problem. Instead of knowing a home subnet or IPv6
> addresses of home agents, knowing the domain name is 
> sufficient to learn
> HA addresses. 
> 
> I think for the "AAA" discussions, the document should clearly state
> what AAA-enabled service is being addressed. The implicit 
> assumption is
> that it refers to "AAA for network access service". But in fact, there
> is also "AAA for Mobile IPv6 service", and I'm not sure if a complete
> solution can be developed without that. The I-D is not 
> discussing how MN
> is authenticated/authorized for the mobility service.
> 
> It is not likely that an HA learned via DNS would already have
> authentication/authorization information for the MN. Hence, even a
> DNS-learned HA is likely to rely on a MIP6-AAA application to
> authenticate the MN. Please see draft-yegin-mip6-aaa-fwk-00.txt. And
> (imho) real value of IKEv2 is that it allows use of EAP, 
> which fits into
> MN-HA-AAA model described in mip6-aaa-fwk I-D. Not a standard, but
> products already assign IP addresses via IKEv1. 
> 
> Alper
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Mip6 mailing list
> [email-masked]
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mip6
> 

Gruppo Telecom Italia - Direzione e coordinamento di Telecom Italia S.p.A.

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---

From: "James Kempf" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2004 11:52:50 -0800

Hi Gerardo,

>Diameter Application is suited for this scenario or whether it needs

I agree.

>designed for all bootstrapping scenarios (both MSP and integrated ASP

Well, without putting a lot of thought into it, I can't see any obvious
reason why the same AAA interface shouldn't work for both integerated and
nonintegrated scenerios. Any differences should involve various business
rules, which should be encodable in the EAP method (for example, that an
AKA/SIM key should be used, for a UMTS service provider that decides it also
would like to offer MIPv6 service).

However, I do believe the matter requires more thought.

            jak

PS: BTW, I don't think we can simply assume that Diameter will be the only
back end protocol used for AAA, I believe we also need to consider Radius,
for reasons of its large installed base.

---

From: Alper Yegin <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 07 Dec 2004 16:38:42 -0800

> Diameter Application is suited for this scenario or whether it needs

I strongly think it is the latter, because:

   The new AAA application is required to associate a given
   authorization and accounting to the Mobile IPv6 service.  When a AAA
   client contacts a AAA server, it should be able to convey that the
   request is for Mobile IPv6 service, as opposed to any other services
   (network access, SIP, etc.).  Additionally, service authorization
   should take into account parameters like home address and binding
   lifetime, which are specific to a Mobile IPv6 service.

Alper

---

From: "Junghoon Jee" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2004 13:24:37 +0900

I agree with Alper.
We need a new AAA Application to support MIP6 bootstrapping.

As you know, a new DIAMETER application is specified in the draft, draft-jee-mip6-bootstrap-pana-00.txt.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-jee-mip6-bootstrap-pana-00.txt.

Junghoon

---

From: Julien Bournelle <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 12:08:41 +0100

Hi all,

> We need a new AAA Application to support MIP6 bootstrapping.

I would like to add that we have different options for this:

- use EAP to carry Mobile IPv6 parameters as defined in
(can be used with Diameter-EAP/RADIUS-EAP)

- define a new Diameter application for Mobile IPv6 
 draft-dupont-aaa-mipv6-01.txt (obsoloted)

(can't be used with EAP)

- modify Diameter-EAP (basically add AVPs to carry Mobile IPv6
  Parameters + interaction with HA)

I think that we could have 2 solutions for bootstrapping Mobile IPv6:

 - one based on AAA infrastructure

 - one that could be used without AAA 

-- 
[email-masked]

---

From: Marc Manthey <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 16:53:02 +0100

>> We need a new AAA Application to support MIP6 bootstrapping.
full ack

>  - one that could be used without AAA

thanks

marc
-- 
    "Fragmentation is like classful addressing , an interesting early
    architectural error that shows how much experimentation was going
    on while IP was being designed.