Subject: [rfc-i] RFC 7997 and non-ASCII in contact/bibliographic information

From: Julian Reschke <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 2017 18:29:01 +0100

Hi there...

I'm currently trying to see how the format extensions in RFC 7991 and 
the examples in RFC 7997 fit together.

I'm experimenting with a version of rfc2629.xslt that has most (?) of 
the V3 stuff implemented.

<https://greenbytes.de/tech/webdav/rfc7997.html#rfc.section.3.2>:

> Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF)                       J. Tong
> Request for Comments: 7380                                C. Bi, Ed.
> Category: Standards Track                              China Telecom
> ISSN: 2070-1721                                   רנוי אןב (R. Even)
>                                                     吴钦 (Q. Wu), Ed.
>                                                             R. Huang
>                                                               Huawei
>                                                        November 2014

So in the boilerplate, if there are ascii alternatives, they are 
repeated after the non-ascii variant. Easy, see for example the top of 
<https://greenbytes.de/tech/webdav/rfc2629xslt/v3test.html>.

However: currently, the boilerplate uses the abbreviated version of the 
organization name, when present (see 
<https://greenbytes.de/tech/webdav/rfc7749.html#element.organization.attribute.abbrev>). 
There is no equivalent in pure ASCII, maybe because we don't need it 
anymore? (It was there due to room constraints in the plain text 
version, after all...)

That said, here's another question: In

    נוי אןב

is this really "initials. surname"??? Where's the dot then?

Further down:

>    [RFC6630]  Cao, Z., Deng, H., 吴钦 (Wu, Q.), and G. Zorn, Ed., "EAP
>               Re-authentication Protocol Extensions for Authenticated
>               Anticipatory Keying (ERP/AAK)", RFC 6630, June 2012.

No problem, uses the same machinery.

In <https://greenbytes.de/tech/webdav/rfc7997.html#rfc.section.3.7>:

> [GOST3410] "Information technology. Cryptographic data security.
>            Signature and verification processes of [electronic]
>            digital signature.", GOST R 34.10-2001, Gosudarstvennyi
>            Standard of Russian Federation, Правительственная
>            комиссия России по стандартам (Government Committee of
>            Russia for Standards), 2001. (In Russian)

That's something that's relatively easy to produce, see 
<https://greenbytes.de/tech/webdav/rfc2629xslt/v3test.html#GOST3410>, 
rendering as:

"“Information technology. Cryptographic data security. Signature and 
verification processes of [electronic] digital signature.”, GOST R 
34.10-2001, Gosudarstvennyi Standard of Russian Federation, 
Правительственная комиссия России по стандартам (Government Committee of 
Russia for Standards), 2001.
(In Russian)"

Note that the "(In Russian)" appears on a separate line, as I had to use 
the <annotation> element to get it to the end of the citation. Like that:

<reference anchor="GOST3410">
   <front>
     <title>Information technology.  Cryptographic data security. 
Signature and verification processes of [electronic] digital 
signature.</title>
     <date year="2001"/>
   </front>
   <refcontent>Gosudarstvennyi Standard of Russian Federation, 
&#1055;&#1088;&#1072;&#1074;&#1080;&#1090;&#1077;&#1083;&#1100;&#1089;&#1090;&#1074;&#1077;&#1085;&#1085;&#1072;&#1103; 
&#1082;&#1086;&#1084;&#1080;&#1089;&#1089;&#1080;&#1103; 
&#1056;&#1086;&#1089;&#1089;&#1080;&#1080; &#1087;&#1086; 
&#1089;&#1090;&#1072;&#1085;&#1076;&#1072;&#1088;&#1090;&#1072;&#1084; 
(Government Committee of Russia for Standards)</refcontent>
   <seriesInfo name='GOST' value='R 34.10-2001'/>
   <annotation>(In Russian)</annotation>
</reference>

Is that a problem? Do we need to do more work on <reference>?

The other example:

> Allowable addition to the above citation:
>
>            "Информационная технология. Криптографическая защита
>            информации. Процессы формирования и проверки
>            электронной цифровой подписи", GOST R 34.10-2001,
>            Государственный стандарт Российской Федерации, 2001.

...could be generated using <annotation> as well, but that implies it'll 
just be unstructured text. Are we ok with that?

Finally, contact information, as shown in 
<https://greenbytes.de/tech/webdav/rfc7997.html#rfc.section.3.9>:

>   Qin Wu (editor)
>   Huawei
>   101 Software Avenue, Yuhua District
>   Nanjing, Jiangsu  210012
>   China
>
> Additional contact information:
>   吴钦 (editor)
>   华为技术有限公司
>   ⾬雨花区软件⼤大道101号
>   江苏南京 210012
>   中国
>
> ------
>
>   Roni Even
>   Huawei
>   14 David Hamelech
>   Tel Aviv  64953
>   Israel
>
> Additional contact information:
>   רוני אבן
>   וואווי
>   דוד המלך 14
>   תל אביב 64953
>   ישראל

This is also easy to do, see example in 
<https://greenbytes.de/tech/webdav/rfc2629xslt/v3test.html#rfc.authors>:

> Pythagoras of Samos
> Geometry Labs
> Phytagorio
> Greece
>
> Additional contact information:
> Πυθαγόρας ὁ Σάμιος
> Εργαστήριο γεωμετρία
> Πυθαγόρειο
> Ελλάδα

Feedback appreciated. I'm also interested in real-world contact info and 
bibliographic information to test-drive the code.

Best regards, Julian

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---

From: Viktor Dukhovni <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 2017 12:42:25 -0500

> On Jan 27, 2017, at 12:29 PM, Julian Reschke <[email-masked]> wrote:
> 

Those are not initials, rather what you have there is a mangled
version of the full name.  In particular some of the letters are
transposed and one dropped in a cut/paste error.  It should be:

         רוני אבן

Which reads "Roni Even" with "Even" pronounced like "ever", with
an "n" at the end instead of an "r".

-- 
	Viktor.

---

From: Julian Reschke <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 27 Jan 2017 19:00:10 +0100

> an "n" at the end instead of an "r".

Probably due copy & paste not doing the right thing. Please see 
<https://greenbytes.de/tech/webdav/rfc7997.html#rfc.section.3.2>.

Anyway, if

   R. Even

is the ASCII variant, what would the equivalent sequence of Hebrew 
characters?

Best regards, Julian

---

From: Yoav Nir <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2017 00:13:05 +0200

ר. אבן

> On 27 Jan 2017, at 20:00, Julian Reschke <[email-masked]> wrote:
> 
> Probably due copy & paste not doing the right thing. Please see <https://greenbytes.de/tech/webdav/rfc7997.html#rfc.section.3.2 <https://greenbytes.de/tech/webdav/rfc7997.html#rfc.section.3.2>>.
> 
> Anyway, if
> 
>  R. Even
> 
> is the ASCII variant, what would the equivalent sequence of Hebrew characters?
> 
> Best regards, Julian
> 
> [email-masked] <mailto:[email-masked]>
> https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest <https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest>

---

From: Julian Reschke <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2017 08:52:29 +0100

> ר. אבן

Thanks. Opened 
<https://github.com/rfc-format/draft-iab-rfc-nonascii-bis/issues/2>.

Best regards, Julian

---

From: Viktor Dukhovni <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2017 09:37:48 -0500

> On Jan 28, 2017, at 2:52 AM, Julian Reschke <[email-masked]> wrote:
> 
> Thanks. Opened <https://github.com/rfc-format/draft-iab-rfc-nonascii-bis/issues/2>.
> 
> Best regards, Julian

That still leaves a transposition in the letters of "Even".  Right now it is
"Enev":

Current:  ר. אןב
Correct:  ר. אבן

-- 
	Viktor.

---

From: Martin J. Dürst <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2017 18:04:33 +0900

>   <refcontent>Gosudarstvennyi Standard of Russian Federation,

Is that heap of numeric character references just an accident, or by 
design? In both cases, please let's fix that. It would be really strange 
if numeric character references were needed in the canonical XML source.

Regards,   Martin.

---

From: Julian Reschke <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2017 11:36:14 +0100

> if numeric character references were needed in the canonical XML source.

It's just my sample document. I prefer not to use non-ASCII characters 
in files that I have in source control.

Best regards, Julian