Subject: [v6ops] Apologies

From: Ray Hunter <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 09 May 2011 19:52:12 +0200

It has been brought to my attention (in a very polite way) that some 
recent posts to this list have not been received as being constructive, 
and that rather they are somehow perceived as part of a general attempt 
at spreading FUD and a DOS attack. That was certainly not the intention. 
It was suggested that if I had any honor then I would post a message 
apologizing to the list.

I understood that the v6ops list existed to solicit input from network 
operators and users to identify operational issues with the IPv4/IPv6 
Internet. Operational issues by their very nature may seem trivial or 
low level, but they may also make or break the roll out of IPv6. Not all 
users will have the same requirements or deployment methodology.

I can assure you that my only intention is to try to improve the end 
user experience and ease of roll out of IPv6, especially for large 
complex commercial environments who currently run production IPv4 
networks that are business critical. The issues I have raised seem to be 
of genuine operational concern to some large corporations who are 
planning on rolling out IPv6. In fact, some private answers from 
individuals have thanked me for my contribution and asked me to post 
further to the list to solicit opinions from a wider audience. Please 
also note that I have personally already observed several adverse 
effects arising from the unintentional deployment of IPv6 transition 
mechanisms in production IPv4 networks. These corporations seem unlikely 
or unwilling to post their operational problems to this list themselves, 
possibly for fear of reputational damage.

So please excuse me for not knowing the accepted "way of working" of the 
list. If you have any pointers on how contributions about operational 
issues from end users can be brought in a more positive and useful way 
to the WG, thus leading to the general good functioning of the WG in 
improving the overall end-user experience of IPv6, please do not be 
afraid to contact me in complete confidence.

In the meantime, I shall refrain from responding further to the list 
until I receive a clear "OK" to do so.

regards,
RayH

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From: Gert Doering <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 20:10:31 +0200

Hi,

> until I receive a clear "OK" to do so.

I found your e-mails pretty direct at some points, but in a "well, this
is what I'm worried about, so you should know about!" way.

I'm running a small(ish) ISP network here, and we are facing completely
different issues - and so are our customers, most of them small or medium
enterprises, nothing multinational or anywhere near the scale you describe,
and we tend to "turn things on, see what breaks, and fix those things"
(which works if you're small enough to be able to fix in reasonable time).

So for me, it was quite educational to hear about your point of view
from a very different background.

Gert Doering
        -- NetMaster
-- 
did you enable IPv6 on something today...?

SpaceNet AG                        Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard
Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14          Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann
D-80807 Muenchen                   HRB: 136055 (AG Muenchen)
Tel: +49 (89) 32356-444            USt-IdNr.: DE813185279

---

From: Fred Baker <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 11:21:01 -0700

> from a very different background.

That has been my view as well.

---

From: "STARK, BARBARA H (ATTSI)" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 14:34:19 -0400

+1
Please don't stop posting! I thought your comments were great -- concise
and filled with real-world experience. And professionally stated.
Barbara

---

From: Roger Jørgensen <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 9 May 2011 21:56:18 +0200

Don't stop posting, we need all sort of views on this list to make the best
out of whats ahead:) Have to say as Gert, it was quite educational.

Earlier I worked for an ISP and was part of building their first big IPv6
network, but currently I work for something which is more of a
network/organization or maybe you could call us one of the Enterprises.

Right now I finally got around to do something real with IPv6 and the issue
I get into are quite different from what I saw on the ISP side.
And just like you I don't have the option of try and fail, I have to
get it right
the first time around when it comes to things that are facing our customers.

The biggest problem right now are howto not do NAT when doing IPv6.
It is not an option to not run NAT in some form or another.

On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 7:52 PM, Ray Hunter <[email-masked]> wrote:
<snip>

-- 

Roger Jorgensen           |
[email-masked]          | - IPv6 is The Key!
http://www.jorgensen.no   | [email-masked]

---

From: Mark Andrews <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 09:26:13 +1000

> until I receive a clear "OK" to do so.

Ray, 
      I found benefit in your comments being one to which recent
comments were directed.  I'd rather see comments than not so please
don't stop commenting on my account.

Mark
-- 
Mark Andrews, ISC
1 Seymour St., Dundas Valley, NSW 2117, Australia
PHONE: +61 2 9871 4742                 INTERNET: [email-masked]