Subject: [Asrg] Join ASRG and display your email address for the spammers!!

From: "Shannon Jacobs" <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 14 Jun 2003 07:24:15 +0900

Hey, not trying to sound bent out of shape and all that, and it's too bloody
late now, but I just wanted to note that if I had realized that my email
address was going to be reposted on a publicly accessible Web site and in a
non-protected form, then I never would have dared to peek at this mailing
list.

Already mentioned that it's too late, but I'd still like to have my email
address expunged. I had been wondering why the new spam was coming through
this routing, and I don't want to waste more time dealing with it. And I am
not amused to discover that ASRG was probably the source of the leak.

_______________________________________________
Asrg mailing list
[email-masked]
https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/asrg

---

From: Yakov Shafranovich <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 15 Jun 2003 17:20:09 -0400

At 08:28 AM 6/15/2003 -0600, Vernon Schryver wrote:

> > From: Yakov Shafranovich <[email-masked]>
>[..]
>
> >                   Alas, for all we know that could be spammers on the list
> > as well who want revenge, also I highly doubt it.
>
>I don't know about "revenge," but I am convinced that certain superficial
>changes in some common spam in the last 60 days were prompted by
>discussions here.
>
>I trust you did not intend to suggest that you doubt that spammers
>would either subscribe to this mailing list or regularly check the
>archives, since that would be silly.  Spammers have more interest in
>effective spam defenses than almost anyone else except perhaps people
>working for organizations that are selling or want to sell spam defenses
>(effective or not).

Vernon is raising an interesting point - we are operating as a public 
organization and thus are in full view of the very people we are trying to 
stop - the spammers. I personally think that is an advantage since we can 
see the reactions of the spammers to our discussions very quickly and can 
adjust accordingly.

Yakov

---

From: "Peter Kay" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 16 Jun 2003 08:56:31 -1000

I think Vernon said it best about this topic:

> As I've said before, I think that the price of admission to 
> this mailing list should include sufficient practical 
> knowledge of spam and spam defenses to not need to worry 
> about exposing one's address. Besides, anyone advocating 
> challenge-response, authentication, or any of several other 
> spam defenses and complains about spam as a result of address 
> exposure here or anywhere is either admitting practical 
> ignorance of the adovcated defense or saying that the 
> advocated defense is useless.
> 

Anyone with reasonable knowledge of spam knows that public dicussions
are common source of email addresses for spammers and this list, if any,
would be one that spammers would monitor extremely closely (btw, I
suspect that an email inquirty I recently received from someone in
Hungary was a spammer) as a source of knowledge of the research as well
as email addresses.

So I would definitely say that if you don't have good anti-spam
processes working, don't post.