Subject: Re: 6. Proposal - Sender Pays - Article (was Re: [Asrg] ziff-daviseditorial on sender-pays)

From: "Adonis El Fakih" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2003 01:55:38 -0700

Hi, I thought this post will be a good place for me to contribute. I
have been involved in this type of spam prevention. I discussed this
model in a document I submitted to IETF early this year under AMDP.
Since then I developed a perl module available at CPAN that works with
the basics of AMDP design, and there is a commercial software out there
called surgemail from netwin (www.netwinsite.com) which also supports
epostage based on the proposed system. I also work for a company called
Centipaid Corporation which supports this type of payment. I will not
bore you with details, and I welcome any questions about this type of
spam prevention which we have done a lot of work on. We have conducted
good tests using this method, and provide constant feedback to
implemented solutions on tips for refining the process. In direct answer
to your questions: - The recipient collects from sender. - Sender pays
with a digital prepaid card. - the stamp is not attached since it could
be reused by others, instead a unique stamp (alphanumeric character) is
issued and is valid for one transaction. - A filter detects the postage,
autheticates it, and forwards it for delivery if payment checks out.
Thanks in advance Adonis <-----Original Message-----> From: david nicol
Sent: 10/1/2003 8:55:10 PM To: [email-masked] Cc: [email-masked] Subject:
Re: 6. Proposal - Sender Pays - Article (was Re: [Asrg]
ziff-daviseditorial on sender-pays) On Wed, 2003-10-01 at 16:28, Eric S.
Johansson wrote: a series of well-though out criticisms. > None of these
issues exist with > proof of work stamp based sender-pays. Yes, but how
does the recipient collect? Where do I trade my hashcash in for cash
and/or valuable prizes? > some folks might see it as a competitive
advantage to have a private currency. > They may perceive it as a "lock
in" and if they can just get a monopoly, they > will be set for life. I
certainly hope so! :) > What's more likely is that there will be a large
number of issuers some of which > will settle with others and some of
which won't. You have hit the nail on the head regarding my issues with
attached stamps. pay2send insists on prepayment by bulk mailers, and is
therefore concerned with easily authenticating identities of
bulk-mailers to avoid theft from their prepaid pay-to-spam accounts. --
david nicol _______________________________________________ Asrg mailing
list [email-masked] https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/asrg

---

From: Brad Knowles <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2003 15:52:43 +0200

At 1:55 AM -0700 2003/10/08, Adonis El Fakih wrote:

>  In direct answer to your questions:
>
>  - The recipient collects from sender.
>  - Sender pays with a digital prepaid card.

	Can the amount charged to the sender vary, based on whether or 
not the recipient thinks the message is spam?

	I.e., I wouldn't want to charge my family or friends anything (in 
most cases ;-), but I would want to charge spammers.

>  - the stamp is not attached since it could be reused by others,
>    instead a unique stamp (alphanumeric character) is issued and
>    is valid for one transaction.
>  - A filter detects the postage, autheticates it, and forwards it
>    for delivery if payment checks out.

	Does this mean that all mail has to be processed through a 
central system?  If so, is that then forwarded on to the users normal 
mailbox elsewhere in the world, or are they required to come to the 
central system to pick up their mail?

	How do you deal with mail which doesn't have a stamp?

-- 
Brad Knowles, <[email-masked]>

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
     -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania.

GCS/IT d+(-) s:+(++)>: a C++(+++)$ UMBSHI++++$ P+>++ L+ !E-(---) W+++(--) N+
!w--- O- M++ V PS++(+++) PE- Y+(++) PGP>+++ t+(+++) 5++(+++) X++(+++) R+(+++)
tv+(+++) b+(++++) DI+(++++) D+(++) G+(++++) e++>++++ h--- r---(+++)* z(+++)

_______________________________________________
Asrg mailing list
[email-masked]
https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/asrg