Subject: Re: [dtn-users] [dtn-interest] Re(2): DTN2 vs Haggle
From: Stephen Farrell <[email-masked]>
To: Peter Lovell <[email-masked]>
Cc: [email-masked], [email-masked], Frederic Guidec <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2011 13:40:51 +0000
List-Id: dtn-users mailing list <dtn-users.maillists.intel-research.net>

There's also draft-farrell-dtnrg-bpq which is (yet another) way
we're looking at doing information centric networking with the BP.
We're (TCD) writing code for that btw. and should have some
feedback on how it works (or not:-) in a few months.

S.

On 16/02/11 13:20, Peter Lovell wrote:
> Hi Rui,
> 
> following on from Fred's comments ...
> 
> DTN does involve itself with the business of getting data from source to
> destination, and not much with the data content. However there are
> separate efforts under way that look at find-by-content, pre-positioning
> data, addressing bundles to users in a certain geographic area, and so
> on. This work is not part of the "messaging" part of DTN but you will
> find presentations included in the IETF proceedings (on-line) for example.
> 
> Regards.....Peter
> 
> 
> On Wed, Feb 16, 2011, Frederic Guidec <[email-masked]> wrote:
> 
>>
>> Hello Rui,
>>
>> The DTN2 approach is (at least currently) focused on destination-based 
>> networking: each bundle is adressed to a set destination, and is somehow 
>> routed toward that destination through DTN gateways.
>>
>> In contrast the Haggle platform supports content-based networking in 
>> disconnected MANETs: information (typically files) is "published" in the 
>> network, and it is received by hosts that have "subscribed" to receive 
>> this kind of information. The store-carry-and-forward approach is indeed 
>> used, as mobile hosts (or at least some of them) must store and carry 
>> messages while moving around in order to bridge the gap between 
>> non-connected parts of the network.
>>
>> You may find further information about the Haggle platform on 
>> http://code.google.com/p/haggle/wiki/FAQ, but you may also be interested 
>> to learn that there is another platform called DoDWAN (Document 
>> Dissemination in Wireless Ad hoc Networks), which is also devoted to 
>> content-based information dissemination in disconnected MANETs: 
>> http://www-valoria.univ-ubs.fr/CASA/DoDWAN
>>
>> Do not hesitate to contact me directly (or using this mailing-list) if 
>> you have any question about DoDWAN. For the Haggle platform, I'm afraid 
>> you'll have to wait until you can access their discussion list.  ;-)
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> Fred Guidec
>> --
>>
>>
>> On 02/15/2011 11:03 AM, Rui Quelhas wrote:
>>> Hi again,
>>>
>>> anything on my previous message? Am I really in the wrong place? :)
>>>
>>> On 2011/02/11, at 16:47, Rui Quelhas wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi there,
>>>>
>>>> I'm currently working on a project that requires the deployment of
>> opportunistic and delay-tolerant services and I was wondering how can
>> the DTN2 implementation and Haggle match? I'm perfectly aware that DTN
>> adapts to a broad set of challenged environments like deep-space
>> communications and military networks but my focus is all about
>> terrestrial mobile networks (social and community based) and my concerns
>> are specially about how can Haggle handle store-carry-forward.
>>>>
>>>> I'm probably talking nonsense and I should try to make theses
>> questions using the Haggle lists but I guess they require some sort of
>> authorization, and I'm still waiting for it. So, hopping that i can
>> actually reach some Haggle users over here I would ask if anyone knows
>> any good resource that establishes some kind of comparison between the
>> two (DTN2 and Haggle)?
>>>>
>>>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Dr. Frederic GUIDEC -------------------------------------
>> Laboratoire VALORIA -- Université de Bretagne Sud
>> Université Européenne de Bretagne
>> Campus de Tohannic
>> BP 573 - F-56017 Vannes, France
>> mailto:Frederic.Guidec%AT%univ-ubs.fr
>> http://www-valoria.univ-ubs.fr/Frederic.Guidec
>> tel : +33 (0)2 97 01 72 16
>> fax : +33 (0)2 97 01 72 79
>> ---------------------------------------------------------
>> _______________________________________________
>> dtn-interest mailing list
>> [email-masked]
>> http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-interest
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> dtn-interest mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-interest
> 

From: Rui Quelhas <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2011 10:23:37 +0000
To: [email-masked], [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] [dtn-interest] DTN2 vs Haggle

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Thanks for the help (including the off-list replies).

Keep up the good work.

On 02/15/2011 11:03 AM, Rui Quelhas wrote:
> Hi again,
>=20
> anything on my previous message? Am I really in the wrong place? :)
>=20
> On 2011/02/11, at 16:47, Rui Quelhas wrote:
>=20
>> Hi there,
>>=20
>> I'm currently working on a project that requires the deployment of =
opportunistic and delay-tolerant services and I was wondering how can =
the DTN2 implementation and Haggle match? I'm perfectly aware that DTN =
adapts to a broad set of challenged environments like deep-space =
communications and military networks but my focus is all about =
terrestrial mobile networks (social and community based) and my concerns =
are specially about how can Haggle handle store-carry-forward.
>>=20
>> I'm probably talking nonsense and I should try to make theses =
questions using the Haggle lists but I guess they require some sort of =
authorization, and I'm still waiting for it. So, hopping that i can =
actually reach some Haggle users over here I would ask if anyone knows =
any good resource that establishes some kind of comparison between the =
two (DTN2 and Haggle)?
>>=20
>>=20

---
Best regards,
Rui Quelhas.

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<html><head></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; =
"><div>Thanks for the help (including the off-list =
replies).</div><div><br></div><div>Keep up the good =
work.</div><div><br><div><div>On 02/15/2011 11:03 AM, Rui Quelhas =
wrote:<br><blockquote type=3D"cite">Hi =
again,<br></blockquote><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite">anything on my =
previous message? Am I really in the wrong place? =
:)<br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote =
type=3D"cite">On 2011/02/11, at 16:47, Rui Quelhas =
wrote:<br></blockquote><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><blockquote =
type=3D"cite">Hi there,<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><blockquote type=3D"cite">I'm currently working on a =
project that requires the deployment of opportunistic and delay-tolerant =
services and I was wondering how can the DTN2 implementation and Haggle =
match? I'm perfectly aware that DTN adapts to a broad set of challenged =
environments like deep-space communications and military networks but my =
focus is all about terrestrial mobile networks (social and community =
based) and my concerns are specially about how can Haggle handle =
store-carry-forward.<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><blockquote type=3D"cite">I'm probably talking nonsense =
and I should try to make theses questions using the Haggle lists but I =
guess they require some sort of authorization, and I'm still waiting for =
it. So, hopping that i can actually reach some Haggle users over here I =
would ask if anyone knows any good resource that establishes some kind =
of comparison between the two (DTN2 and =
Haggle)?<br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><br></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><blockquote type=3D"cite"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
color=3D"#144FAE"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
color=3D"#540000"><br></font></font></blockquote></blockquote></div></div>=
</div><br><div>
<span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; =
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: =
0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><span =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; color: =
rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: =
normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: =
normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: =
normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: =
0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><div =
style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; =
-webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
style=3D"border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: =
Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: =
normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; =
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; =
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><div =
style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; =
-webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><br><br></div><div =
style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; =
-webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">---<br>Best regards,<br>Rui =
Quelhas.</div></span></div></span></span>
</div>
<br></body></html>=

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Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2011 09:51:15 -0500
From: Daniel Ellard <[email-masked]>
Organization: BBN Technologies
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] [dtn-interest] DTN2 vs Haggle

On 2/15/11 5:03 AM, Rui Quelhas wrote:
> Hi again,
> 
> anything on my previous message? Am I really in the wrong place? :)

You're in the right place for DTN stuff, but maybe not for
Haggle...

I only have passing familiarity with Haggle, but it seems
like they overlap in their goals and approaches.  Some of
the differences may be because DTN approaches the issues
from a network-centric perspective, while Haggle approaches
the issues from a data-centric perspective.  There certainly
seems to be things we could learn from each other.

-Dan

-- 
Daniel Ellard, Ph.D.
Senior Scientist, Network Research
BBN Technologies
10 Moulton Street
Cambridge, MA 02138
[email-masked]

From: Rui Quelhas <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2011 10:03:36 +0000
To: [email-masked], [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] [dtn-interest] DTN2 vs Haggle

Hi again,

anything on my previous message? Am I really in the wrong place? :)

On 2011/02/11, at 16:47, Rui Quelhas wrote:

> Hi there,
> 
> I'm currently working on a project that requires the deployment of opportunistic and delay-tolerant services and I was wondering how can the DTN2 implementation and Haggle match? I'm perfectly aware that DTN adapts to a broad set of challenged environments like deep-space communications and military networks but my focus is all about terrestrial mobile networks (social and community based) and my concerns are specially about how can Haggle handle store-carry-forward. 
> 
> I'm probably talking nonsense and I should try to make theses questions using the Haggle lists but I guess they require some sort of authorization, and I'm still waiting for it. So, hopping that i can actually reach some Haggle users over here I would ask if anyone knows any good resource that establishes some kind of comparison between the two (DTN2 and Haggle)?
> 
> 
> 
> ---
> Best regards,
> Rui Quelhas
> _______________________________________________
> dtn-interest mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-interest

---
Best regards,
Rui Quelhas.

Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2011 15:59:46 +0000
From: Stephen Farrell <[email-masked]>
To: Darren Long <[email-masked]>
Cc: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] S10 logging curiosity in DTN2

On 13/02/11 15:51, Darren Long wrote:
> Ah, thanks.  Is there anything available to analyse the S10 logs?

Sort-of. We have a bunch of scripts to do various gnuplots but aren't
quite ready to release those yet (couple of months probably - we have
to get some papers written and want those to happen together).

However, if you "grep S10 logfile" the first few lines should explain
what's there. and the rest, once you delete the first N characters
up to the readable date, are good input to anything that takes CSV
format.

Let me know if you see ways to make this better.

S.

> 
> Darren
> 
> On 13/02/11 15:25, Stephen Farrell wrote:
>>
>>
>> On 13 Feb 2011, at 15:07, Darren Long <[email-masked]> wrote:
>>
>>> I've updated to the hg repo tip and have been wondering what to make of
>>> "OHCRAPBADEVENT" appearing in the logs in the S10 logging output.
>>
>> That's one of mine. When I added the S10 stuff I didn't know, and figured I didn't need to know, what these events represented, but just in case I put that in so I'd know it had happened,
>> S
>>
>>>
>>> A full exammple is below:
>>> 2011-02-10
>>> 21:10:00,1297372200.588607,dtn://g0hww-6.dtn,OHCRAPBADEVENT,71,dtn://g0hww-6.dtn,350687400.123,dtn://*/dtlsr?lsa_seqno=8,86400,,,,,0.000000,,0,__FILE__:__LINE__
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> Darren
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> dtn-users mailing list
>>> [email-masked]
>>> http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-users
> 
> 

Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2011 15:51:16 +0000
From: Darren Long <[email-masked]>
To: Stephen Farrell <[email-masked]>
Cc: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] S10 logging curiosity in DTN2

Ah, thanks.  Is there anything available to analyse the S10 logs?

Darren

On 13/02/11 15:25, Stephen Farrell wrote:
> 
> 
> On 13 Feb 2011, at 15:07, Darren Long <[email-masked]> wrote:
> 
>> I've updated to the hg repo tip and have been wondering what to make of
>> "OHCRAPBADEVENT" appearing in the logs in the S10 logging output.
> 
> That's one of mine. When I added the S10 stuff I didn't know, and figured I didn't need to know, what these events represented, but just in case I put that in so I'd know it had happened,
> S
> 
>>
>> A full exammple is below:
>> 2011-02-10
>> 21:10:00,1297372200.588607,dtn://g0hww-6.dtn,OHCRAPBADEVENT,71,dtn://g0hww-6.dtn,350687400.123,dtn://*/dtlsr?lsa_seqno=8,86400,,,,,0.000000,,0,__FILE__:__LINE__
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Darren
>> _______________________________________________
>> dtn-users mailing list
>> [email-masked]
>> http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-users

From: Stephen Farrell <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2011 15:25:55 +0000
To: Darren Long <[email-masked]>
Cc: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] S10 logging curiosity in DTN2

On 13 Feb 2011, at 15:07, Darren Long <[email-masked]> wrote:

> I've updated to the hg repo tip and have been wondering what to make of
> "OHCRAPBADEVENT" appearing in the logs in the S10 logging output.

That's one of mine. When I added the S10 stuff I didn't know, and figured I didn't need to know, what these events represented, but just in case I put that in so I'd know it had happened,
S

> 
> A full exammple is below:
> 2011-02-10
> 21:10:00,1297372200.588607,dtn://g0hww-6.dtn,OHCRAPBADEVENT,71,dtn://g0hww-6.dtn,350687400.123,dtn://*/dtlsr?lsa_seqno=8,86400,,,,,0.000000,,0,__FILE__:__LINE__
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Darren
> _______________________________________________
> dtn-users mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-users

Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2011 15:07:33 +0000
From: Darren Long <[email-masked]>
To: [email-masked]
Subject: [dtn-users] S10 logging curiosity in DTN2

I've updated to the hg repo tip and have been wondering what to make of
"OHCRAPBADEVENT" appearing in the logs in the S10 logging output.

A full exammple is below:
2011-02-10
21:10:00,1297372200.588607,dtn://g0hww-6.dtn,OHCRAPBADEVENT,71,dtn://g0hww-6.dtn,350687400.123,dtn://*/dtlsr?lsa_seqno=8,86400,,,,,0.000000,,0,__FILE__:__LINE__

Cheers,

Darren

Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 22:24:01 +0000
From: Stephen Farrell <[email-masked]>
To: DTN <[email-masked]>, DTN Security Discussion <[email-masked]>, "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] [dtn-interest] Migrating mailing list and wiki

Hi again,

Just an FYI, we've now migrated the wiki to its new
home. Please let Alex (cc'd) and I know if you spot
anything odd or broken. All current write access etc
should be just the same (mine worked anyway;-).

More on the mailing list next week, but the current
plan is to move to e.g. [email-masked] so when
we're ready we'll subscribe all the current list members
to the new list(s), send out a last message to each
of the lists being migrated (see the To: line above)
and then shut these lists. List archives (both old
and new) will be hosted at the new list info site.

Again, any issues there please let us know. Sorry
that you'll have to adjust your filters, but there
ya go. I hope that'll all happen next week.

Regards,
Stephen.

On 04/02/11 10:28, Stephen Farrell wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> Due to some machine changes with the current infrastructure
> we're planning to migrate the DTNRG related lists (dtn-interest,
> dtn-security and dtn-users) to the IETF/IRTF infrastructure in
> the next few weeks. That'll mean you'll need to change filters
> etc. but everything else should be the same.
> 
> We're also planning to move the wiki, which, all going well,
> should just result in a little downtime.
> 
> Once we're all set, we'll send another mail with the final
> details.
> 
> If there're any issues with the above please mail Kevin and
> I, and also cc Alex McMahon ([email-masked]) who'll
> be doing most of the real work involved.
> 
> Regards,
> Stephen.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> dtn-interest mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-interest
> 

From: Rui Quelhas <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 16:47:26 +0000
To: [email-masked], [email-masked]
Subject: [dtn-users] DTN2 vs Haggle

Hi there,

I'm currently working on a project that requires the deployment of opportunistic and delay-tolerant services and I was wondering how can the DTN2 implementation and Haggle match? I'm perfectly aware that DTN adapts to a broad set of challenged environments like deep-space communications and military networks but my focus is all about terrestrial mobile networks (social and community based) and my concerns are specially about how can Haggle handle store-carry-forward. 

I'm probably talking nonsense and I should try to make theses questions using the Haggle lists but I guess they require some sort of authorization, and I'm still waiting for it. So, hopping that i can actually reach some Haggle users over here I would ask if anyone knows any good resource that establishes some kind of comparison between the two (DTN2 and Haggle)?

---
Best regards,
Rui Quelhas

Sender: [email-masked]
From: Barrett Dillow <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 11:28:51 -0500
To: "Burleigh, Scott C (313B)" <[email-masked]>
Cc: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?

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To the entire list, thanks for all the great information!
You've been very helpful.

On Tue, Feb 8, 2011 at 3:06 PM, Burleigh, Scott C (313B) <
[email-masked]> wrote:

> Exactly right.  Cubesats can be configured in many, many ways, and plenty
> of those configurations would make them only suitable as low-rate data
> sources.
>
>
>
> On the other hand, there=92s a fairly inexpensive Cubesat-ready S-band
> transceiver you can buy from Microhard Systems that operates at up to 230=
.4
> kbps, enough bandwidth to support a fair amount of traffic if you deploye=
d a
> few dozen of the things.  There are lots of possibilities.
>
>
>
> Scott
>
>
>
> *From:* Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RHN0) [mailto:[email-masked]=
]
>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, February 08, 2011 11:28 AM
>
> *To:* Burleigh, Scott C (313B)
> *Cc:* <[email-masked]> <[email-masked]>;
> [email-masked]
> *Subject:* Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?
>
>
>
> True.  It depends what you are trying to do and the capabilities of the
> particular cubesat.
>
>
>
> Downlink is probably much higher (low rate) than the uplink.  It is a
> cubesat.  I probably has a whip antenna.  It might only have a downlink.
>
>
>
> - Will
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Feb 8, 2011, at 1:16 PM, Burleigh, Scott C (313B) wrote:
>
>
>
> I disagree, Will.  Cubesats could be very useful as delay-tolerant router=
s in a low-rate comsat network.
>
>
>
> Scott
>
>
>
> "Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RHN0)" <[email-masked]> wrote:
>
>
>
> For a cubesat you probably just need the shim.  You probably will only be
> sourcing data.  In addition, it may be over a unidirectional link.  On th=
e
> ground you can use full blown DTN.
>
>
>
> Regarding the Disaster Monitoring Constellation:  my contracts have ended
> and I am in the process or tearing the system down.
>
>
>
> - Will
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Feb 8, 2011, at 6:20 AM, <[email-masked]> <[email-masked]>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> Barrett,
>
>
>
> I don't believe dtn2 will ever run on an unmanned spacecraft; it's simply
> too resource-intensive and unix-y. I don't expect to see dtn2 implemented=
 on
> a nanosatellite. (We implemented a custom bundle shim on RTEMS on the UK-=
DMC
> satellite to generate bundles delivered to a full dtn2 implementation
> running on linux on the ground.)
>
>
>
> Cubesats are using AX.25 in comms for the most part, although arguments
> have been made for e.g. using HTTP to deliver files (a paper by Jamie Cut=
ler
> while at Stanford, before moving to Michigan). There has been much
> discussion of increased access to cubesats via networked ground stations;
> see e.g.
>
> http://www.genso.org/
>
> http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSOC5KXMF_index_0.html
>
> http://www.astro.mech.tohoku.ac.jp/~gsn/en/
>
> these are European/Japanese efforts building on radio amateur interest -
> little US involvement.
>
>
>
> The IP-based Disaster Monitoring Constellation has a number
> of internetworked IP-capable ground stations for exactly the reason you
> describe.
>
>
>
> Lloyd Wood
>
> http://sat-net.com/L.Wood/dtn
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* [email-masked] [mailto:
> [email-masked]] *On Behalf Of *Barrett
> Dillow
> *Sent:* 08 February 2011 02:21
> *To:* [email-masked]
> *Subject:* [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?
>
> Hello list,
>
> My university lab is competing for a nanosat project. I'm trying to gathe=
r
> information about DTN implementations to present to the group, and the
> following questions that I couldn't find answered online. Thanks for your
> consideration.
>
> Has DTN2 or ION been ported to QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone know t=
he
> depth of difference between QNX and VxWorks? (As I see ION has been
> implemented on VxWorks, perhaps porting to QNX would be a viable option.)
>
> I've seen very little about ground station configuration. I had almost
> expected Universities to have configured a basic ground station package (=
or
> list of requirements) so that a network of them across the globe could
> create DTN ground links, and share data with their experimental satellite=
s
> via the terrestrial internet. Has this happened and I just haven't found =
it
> yet? If my lab builds a ground station to talk to our nanosat, it will be
> idle (but operational) for all but the small windows of time in which we =
can
> see our satellite. I would be more than happy to have it configured to as=
k
> as another DTN ground station, if our project could be incorporated into =
a
> network of such shared-use ground stations.
>
> Thanks again for your thoughts.
> Cheers,
>
> Barrett Dillow
> PhD Candidate
> Space Systems Laboratory
> University of Maryland, College Park
>
> _______________________________________________
> dtn-users mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-users
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ******************************
> William D. Ivancic
> Phone 216-433-3494
> Fax 216-433-8705
> Networking Lab 216-433-2620
> DTN Lab 216-433-2981
> Mobile 440-503-4892
> http://roland.grc.nasa.gov/~ivancic
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> dtn-users mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-users
>
>

--001636283b4eb71acc049c04327e
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To the entire list, thanks for all the great information! <br>You&#39;ve be=
en very helpful. <br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Feb 8, 2011 at =
3:06 PM, Burleigh, Scott C (313B) <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:s=
[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt;</span> =
wrote:<br>

<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;"><div link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" style=
=3D"word-wrap:break-word" lang=3D"EN-US"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span =
style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">Exactly right.=A0 Cubesats can be =
configured in many, many ways, and plenty of those configurations would mak=
e them only suitable as low-rate data sources.</span></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">=A0</=
span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F49=
7D">On the other hand, there=92s a fairly inexpensive Cubesat-ready S-band =
transceiver you can buy from Microhard Systems that operates at up to 230.4=
 kbps, enough bandwidth to support a fair amount of traffic if you deployed=
 a few dozen of the things.=A0 There are lots of possibilities.</span></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D">=A0</=
span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F49=
7D">Scott</span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;=
color:#1F497D">=A0</span></p>

<div><div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt=
 0in 0in 0in"><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt">Fr=
om:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt"> Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RH=
N0) [mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank"=
>[email-masked]</a>] <br>

<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, February 08, 2011 11:28 AM</span></p><div class=3D"im=
"><br><b>To:</b> Burleigh, Scott C (313B)<br></div><b>Cc:</b> &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&g=
t; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">L.Wood@surr=
ey.ac.uk</a>&gt;; <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]"=
 target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a><br>

<b>Subject:</b> Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?<p></p></div></di=
v><div><div></div><div class=3D"h5"><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A0</p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal">True. =A0It depends what you are trying to do and the capabi=
lities of the particular cubesat. =A0</p>

<div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A0</p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Downli=
nk is probably much higher (low rate) than the uplink. =A0It is a cubesat. =
=A0I probably has a whip antenna. =A0It might only have a downlink.</p></di=
v><div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">
=A0</p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">- Will</p><div><p class=3D"MsoNorm=
al">=A0</p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A0</p></div><div><p class=3D"=
MsoNormal">=A0</p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A0</p><div><div><p cla=
ss=3D"MsoNormal">
On Feb 8, 2011, at 1:16 PM, Burleigh, Scott C (313B) wrote:</p>
</div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br><br></p><div><pre><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">I disagree, Will.=A0 Cubesats could be very useful as delay-tolerant ro=
uters in a low-rate comsat network.</span></pre><pre><span style=3D"color:b=
lack">=A0</span></pre>

<pre><span style=3D"color:black">Scott</span></pre><pre><span style=3D"colo=
r:black">=A0</span></pre><pre><span style=3D"color:black">&quot;Ivancic, Wi=
lliam D. (GRC-RHN0)&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]"=
 target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:</span></pre>

<pre><span style=3D"color:black">=A0</span></pre><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal=
">For a cubesat you probably just need the shim. =A0You probably will only =
be sourcing data. =A0In addition, it may be over a unidirectional link. =A0=
On the ground you can use full blown DTN. </p>

<div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A0</p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Regard=
ing the Disaster Monitoring Constellation: =A0my contracts have ended and I=
 am in the process or tearing the system down.</p></div><div><p class=3D"Ms=
oNormal">

=A0</p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">- Will</p><div><p class=3D"MsoNorm=
al">=A0</p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A0</p><div><p class=3D"MsoNor=
mal">=A0</p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A0</p></div><div><p class=3D=
"MsoNormal">=A0</p>
<div>
<div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Feb 8, 2011, at 6:20 AM, &lt;<a href=3D"mail=
to:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; &lt;<=
a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]=
</a>&gt; wrote:</p>

</div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br><br></p><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><=
span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;color:blue">Barrett,</span></p></div><div><p=
 class=3D"MsoNormal">=A0</p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=
=3D"font-size:10.0pt;color:blue">I don&#39;t believe dtn2 will ever run on =
an unmanned spacecraft; it&#39;s=A0simply too resource-intensive and unix-y=
. I don&#39;t expect to see dtn2 implemented on a nanosatellite. (We implem=
ented a custom bundle shim on RTEMS on the UK-DMC satellite to generate bun=
dles delivered to a full dtn2 implementation running on linux on the ground=
.)</span></p>

</div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A0</p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=
<span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;color:blue">Cubesats are using AX.25 in com=
ms for the most part, although arguments have been made for e.g. using HTTP=
 to deliver files (a paper by Jamie Cutler while at Stanford, before moving=
 to Michigan). There has been much discussion of increased access to cubesa=
ts via networked ground stations; see e.g.</span></p>

</div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;color:blu=
e"><a href=3D"http://www.genso.org/" target=3D"_blank">http://www.genso.org=
/</a></span></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:=
10.0pt;color:blue"><a href=3D"http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSOC5KXMF_index_0.=
html" target=3D"_blank">http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSOC5KXMF_index_0.html</=
a></span></p>

</div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;color:blu=
e"><a href=3D"http://www.astro.mech.tohoku.ac.jp/%7Egsn/en/" target=3D"_bla=
nk">http://www.astro.mech.tohoku.ac.jp/~gsn/en/</a></span></p></div><div><p=
 class=3D"MsoNormal">

<span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;color:blue">these are European/Japanese eff=
orts building on radio amateur interest=A0- little US involvement.</span></=
p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A0</p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal=
"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;color:blue">The IP-based Disaster Monitor=
ing Constellation has a=A0number of=A0internetworked IP-capable ground stat=
ions for exactly the reason you describe.</span></p>

</div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A0</p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=
<span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;color:blue">Lloyd Wood</span></p></div><div=
><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;color:blue"><a href=
=3D"http://sat-net.com/L.Wood/dtn" target=3D"_blank">http://sat-net.com/L.W=
ood/dtn</a></span></p>

</div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br><br></p><div class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"=
text-align:center" align=3D"center"><hr align=3D"center" size=3D"2" width=
=3D"100%"></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><b><s=
pan style=3D"font-size:10.0pt">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:10.=
0pt"> <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" tar=
get=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a> [mailto:<=
a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"=
_blank">[email-masked]</a>] <b>On Behalf Of=
 </b>Barrett Dillow<br>

<b>Sent:</b> 08 February 2011 02:21<br><b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:dtn-use=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]=
l-research.net</a><br><b>Subject:</b> [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations=
?</span></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Hello list,<br><br>My university lab is competing fo=
r a nanosat project. I&#39;m trying to gather information about DTN impleme=
ntations to present to the group, and the following questions that I couldn=
&#39;t find answered online. Thanks for your consideration.<br>

<br>Has DTN2 or ION been ported to QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone know=
 the depth of difference between QNX and VxWorks? (As I see ION has been im=
plemented on VxWorks, perhaps porting to QNX would be a viable option.) <br=
>

<br>I&#39;ve seen very little about ground station configuration. I had alm=
ost expected Universities to have configured a basic ground station package=
 (or list of requirements) so that a network of them across the globe could=
 create DTN ground links, and share data with their experimental satellites=
 via the terrestrial internet. Has this happened and I just haven&#39;t fou=
nd it yet? If my lab builds a ground station to talk to our nanosat, it wil=
l be idle (but operational) for all but the small windows of time in which =
we can see our satellite. I would be more than happy to have it configured =
to ask as another DTN ground station, if our project could be incorporated =
into a network of such shared-use ground stations. <br>

<br>Thanks again for your thoughts.<br>Cheers,<br><br>Barrett Dillow<br>PhD=
 Candidate<br>Space Systems Laboratory<br>University of Maryland, College P=
ark </p></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">______________________________________=
_________<br>

dtn-users mailing list<br><a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
rch.net" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a><br><a=
 href=3D"http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-users" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-us=
ers</a></p>

</div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A0</p><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span =
style=3D"font-size:13.5pt">=A0</span></p></div></div></div></div></div></di=
v></div></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A0</p><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal=
"><span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;color:#1F497D">********************=
**********</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;color:#1F497D"><br>

<span>William D. Ivancic</span><br><span>Phone 216-433-3494</span><br><span=
>Fax 216-433-8705</span><br><span>Networking Lab 216-433-2620</span><br><sp=
an>DTN Lab 216-433-2981</span><br><span>Mobile 440-503-4892</span><br>
<span><a href=3D"http://roland.grc.nasa.gov/%7Eivancic" target=3D"_blank">h=
ttp://roland.grc.nasa.gov/~ivancic</a></span></span><span style=3D"font-siz=
e:13.5pt;color:black"></span></p>
</div></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A0</p></div></div></div></div></div></d=
iv><br>_______________________________________________<br>
dtn-users mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">dtn-users@maillis=
ts.intel-research.net</a><br>
<a href=3D"http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-users" =
target=3D"_blank">http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-=
users</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br>

--001636283b4eb71acc049c04327e--

From: Darren Long <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2011 09:22:03 +0000
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?

Switched to dtn-interest for the follow up to this, as requested.

Darren

On 8 Feb 2011, at 16:59, Stephen Farrell wrote:

> 
> 
> On 08/02/11 16:49, Burleigh, Scott C (313B) wrote:
>> If someone is working on an AX.25 link service adapter for LTP in ION, I too would be very interested to hear about it; it would be most welcome.
> 
> Ditto.
> 
>> Darren, can you say a little more about which aspects of LTP make it ill-suited for the environment you're looking at?
> 
> Be v. interested in that too. If you do that though I think moving
> the thread to dtn-interest would be better since its (presumably)
> protocol-design that'd discussed and not code.
> 
> S.
> 
>> 
>> Scott
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Darren Long [mailto:[email-masked]] 
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 08, 2011 8:46 AM
>> To: Burleigh, Scott C (313B); Barrett Dillow; [email-masked]
>> Subject: Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?
>> 
>> I've heard rumours that an LTP over disconnected mode AX.25 (datagrams) may be forthcoming in ION. I'd be interested in learning more about these plans.  For my part, I'm currently dreaming up a derivative of LTP more suited for use on shared channels using LEO amateur satellites as bent pipe relays (digipeaters) with the intent to implement a CL for DTN2 in the near future.
>> 
>> The existing AX.25 connected mode CL I've implemented is better suited for terrestrial links.
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> 
>> Darren
>> 
>> ----- Original message -----
>>> Hi, Barrett.   ION has not yet been ported to QNX, but I suspect that the
>>> port would not be too difficult: QNX seems to be fully POSIX-compliant,
>>> and that's mainly what the portability shim in ION requires.   I'm
>>> guessing that the port might be similar to the RTEMS port, and possibly
>>> a bit easier; maybe 10-20 hours to tweak ici/include/platform.h and
>>> ici/library/platform.c and platform_sm.c, and maybe another 20-30 hours
>>> to develop a build environment along the lines of arch-rtems.   If you're
>>> interested in taking it on I would be glad to provide whatever helpful
>>> hints I can.
>>> 
>>> I don't know of an existing network of DTN-equipped ground stations, but
>>> as we see more and more Cubesats flying I think the motivation for
>>> building such a network will grow.   Either ION or DTN2 would work fine
>>> in ground stations, as they interoperate pretty well.   The major hurdle
>>> here, I guess, would be development of an AX.25 convergence-layer
>>> adapter or (better, I believe) an AX.25 link service adapter under LTP.
>>> 
>>> Scott
>>> 
>>> From: [email-masked]
>>> [mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of
>>> Barrett Dillow Sent: Monday, February 07, 2011 6:21 PM To:
>>> [email-masked] Subject: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX,
>>> ground stations?
>>> 
>>> Hello list,
>>> 
>>> My university lab is competing for a nanosat project. I'm trying to
>>> gather information about DTN implementations to present to the group,
>>> and the following questions that I couldn't find answered online. Thanks
>>> for your consideration.
>>> 
>>> Has DTN2 or ION been ported to QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone know
>>> the depth of difference between QNX and VxWorks? (As I see ION has been
>>> implemented on VxWorks, perhaps porting to QNX would be a viable option.)
>>> 
>>> I've seen very little about ground station configuration. I had almost
>>> expected Universities to have configured a basic ground station package
>>> (or list of requirements) so that a network of them across the globe
>>> could create DTN ground links, and share data with their experimental
>>> satellites via the terrestrial internet. Has this happened and I just
>>> haven't found it yet? If my lab builds a ground station to talk to our
>>> nanosat, it will be idle (but operational) for all but the small windows
>>> of time in which we can see our satellite. I would be more than happy to
>>> have it configured to ask as another DTN ground station, if our project
>>> could be incorporated into a network of such shared-use ground stations.
>>> 
>>> Thanks again for your thoughts.
>>> Cheers,
>>> 
>>> Barrett Dillow
>>> PhD Candidate
>>> Space Systems Laboratory
>>> University of Maryland, College Park
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> dtn-users mailing list
>> [email-masked]
>> http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-users

From: "Burleigh, Scott C (313B)" <[email-masked]>
To: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2011 12:06:50 -0800
Accept-Language: en-US
acceptlanguage: en-US
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?

--_000_F25A909AA776104A92E2780BFCB3AEA81D5B538BALTPHYEMBEVSP40_
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Exactly right.  Cubesats can be configured in many, many ways, and plenty o=
f those configurations would make them only suitable as low-rate data sourc=
es.

On the other hand, there's a fairly inexpensive Cubesat-ready S-band transc=
eiver you can buy from Microhard Systems that operates at up to 230.4 kbps,=
 enough bandwidth to support a fair amount of traffic if you deployed a few=
 dozen of the things.  There are lots of possibilities.

Scott

From: Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RHN0) [mailto:[email-masked]]
Sent: Tuesday, February 08, 2011 11:28 AM
To: Burleigh, Scott C (313B)
Cc: <[email-masked]> <[email-masked]>; [email-masked]=
research.net
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?

True.  It depends what you are trying to do and the capabilities of the par=
ticular cubesat.

Downlink is probably much higher (low rate) than the uplink.  It is a cubes=
at.  I probably has a whip antenna.  It might only have a downlink.

- Will

On Feb 8, 2011, at 1:16 PM, Burleigh, Scott C (313B) wrote:

I disagree, Will.  Cubesats could be very useful as delay-tolerant routers =
in a low-rate comsat network.

Scott

"Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RHN0)" <[email-masked]<mailto:william=
[email-masked]>> wrote:

For a cubesat you probably just need the shim.  You probably will only be s=
ourcing data.  In addition, it may be over a unidirectional link.  On the g=
round you can use full blown DTN.

Regarding the Disaster Monitoring Constellation:  my contracts have ended a=
nd I am in the process or tearing the system down.

- Will

On Feb 8, 2011, at 6:20 AM, <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]=
>> <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>> wrote:

Barrett,

I don't believe dtn2 will ever run on an unmanned spacecraft; it's simply t=
oo resource-intensive and unix-y. I don't expect to see dtn2 implemented on=
 a nanosatellite. (We implemented a custom bundle shim on RTEMS on the UK-D=
MC satellite to generate bundles delivered to a full dtn2 implementation ru=
nning on linux on the ground.)

Cubesats are using AX.25 in comms for the most part, although arguments hav=
e been made for e.g. using HTTP to deliver files (a paper by Jamie Cutler w=
hile at Stanford, before moving to Michigan). There has been much discussio=
n of increased access to cubesats via networked ground stations; see e.g.
http://www.genso.org/
http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSOC5KXMF_index_0.html
http://www.astro.mech.tohoku.ac.jp/~gsn/en/
these are European/Japanese efforts building on radio amateur interest - li=
ttle US involvement.

The IP-based Disaster Monitoring Constellation has a number of internetwork=
ed IP-capable ground stations for exactly the reason you describe.

Lloyd Wood
http://sat-net.com/L.Wood/dtn

________________________________
From: [email-masked]<mailto:dtn-users-bounc=
[email-masked]> [mailto:[email-masked]=
research.net] On Behalf Of Barrett Dillow
Sent: 08 February 2011 02:21
To: [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]=
-research.net>
Subject: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?
Hello list,

My university lab is competing for a nanosat project. I'm trying to gather =
information about DTN implementations to present to the group, and the foll=
owing questions that I couldn't find answered online. Thanks for your consi=
deration.

Has DTN2 or ION been ported to QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone know the=
 depth of difference between QNX and VxWorks? (As I see ION has been implem=
ented on VxWorks, perhaps porting to QNX would be a viable option.)

I've seen very little about ground station configuration. I had almost expe=
cted Universities to have configured a basic ground station package (or lis=
t of requirements) so that a network of them across the globe could create =
DTN ground links, and share data with their experimental satellites via the=
 terrestrial internet. Has this happened and I just haven't found it yet? I=
f my lab builds a ground station to talk to our nanosat, it will be idle (b=
ut operational) for all but the small windows of time in which we can see o=
ur satellite. I would be more than happy to have it configured to ask as an=
other DTN ground station, if our project could be incorporated into a netwo=
rk of such shared-use ground stations.

Thanks again for your thoughts.
Cheers,

Barrett Dillow
PhD Candidate
Space Systems Laboratory
University of Maryland, College Park
_______________________________________________
dtn-users mailing list
[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]=
earch.net>
http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-users

******************************
William D. Ivancic
Phone 216-433-3494
Fax 216-433-8705
Networking Lab 216-433-2620
DTN Lab 216-433-2981
Mobile 440-503-4892
http://roland.grc.nasa.gov/~ivancic

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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DEN-US link=3Dblue vli=
nk=3Dpurple style=3D'word-wrap: break-word;-webkit-nbsp-mode: space;-webkit=
-line-break: after-white-space'><div class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNor=
mal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";colo=
r:#1F497D'>Exactly right.&nbsp; Cubesats can be configured in many, many wa=
ys, and plenty of those configurations would make them only suitable as low=
-rate data sources.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=
=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p=
>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0p=
t;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>On the other hand, ther=
e&#8217;s a fairly inexpensive Cubesat-ready S-band transceiver you can buy=
 from Microhard Systems that operates at up to 230.4 kbps, enough bandwidth=
 to support a fair amount of traffic if you deployed a few dozen of the thi=
ngs.&nbsp; There are lots of possibilities.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=
=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-se=
rif";color:#1F497D'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'=
>Scott<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:1=
1.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></=
span></p><div><div style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padd=
ing:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span style=3D'font-size:10.=
0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style=3D'font-=
size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RH=
N0) [mailto:[email-masked]] <br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, February =
08, 2011 11:28 AM<br><b>To:</b> Burleigh, Scott C (313B)<br><b>Cc:</b> &lt;=
[email-masked]&gt; &lt;[email-masked]&gt;; [email-masked]=
tel-research.net<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground statio=
ns?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p>=
</p><p class=3DMsoNormal>True. &nbsp;It depends what you are trying to do a=
nd the capabilities of the particular cubesat. &nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><div><p=
 class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>Dow=
nlink is probably much higher (low rate) than the uplink. &nbsp;It is a cub=
esat. &nbsp;I probably has a whip antenna. &nbsp;It might only have a downl=
ink.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></d=
iv><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>- Will<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal=
><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>=
</div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D=
MsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>On Feb 8, 201=
1, at 1:16 PM, Burleigh, Scott C (313B) wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=
=3DMsoNormal><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><pre><span style=3D'font-family:"T=
ahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>I disagree, Will.&nbsp; Cubesats could be =
very useful as delay-tolerant routers in a low-rate comsat network.<o:p></o=
:p></span></pre><pre><span style=3D'font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color=
:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span style=3D'font-family:"Taho=
ma","sans-serif";color:black'>Scott<o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span style=
=3D'font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span>=
</pre><pre><span style=3D'font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>&q=
uot;Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RHN0)&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:william.d.iv=
[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></span>=
</pre><pre><span style=3D'font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'><o=
:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>For a cubesat you pro=
bably just need the shim. &nbsp;You probably will only be sourcing data. &n=
bsp;In addition, it may be over a unidirectional link. &nbsp;On the ground =
you can use full blown DTN. <o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&=
nbsp;</o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>Regarding the Disaster Monit=
oring Constellation: &nbsp;my contracts have ended and I am in the process =
or tearing the system down.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><=
o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>- Will<o:p></o:p></p><d=
iv><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNorma=
l><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div=
><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNo=
rmal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>On Feb 8, 2011, at=
 6:20 AM, &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a=
>&gt; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt=
; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><d=
iv><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"A=
rial","sans-serif";color:blue'>Barrett,</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><spa=
n style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'>I =
don't believe dtn2 will ever run on an unmanned spacecraft; it's&nbsp;simpl=
y too resource-intensive and unix-y. I don't expect to see dtn2 implemented=
 on a nanosatellite. (We implemented a custom bundle shim on RTEMS on the U=
K-DMC satellite to generate bundles delivered to a full dtn2 implementation=
 running on linux on the ground.)</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=
=3DMsoNormal>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span sty=
le=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'>Cubesat=
s are using AX.25 in comms for the most part, although arguments have been =
made for e.g. using HTTP to deliver files (a paper by Jamie Cutler while at=
 Stanford, before moving to Michigan). There has been much discussion of in=
creased access to cubesats via networked ground stations; see e.g.</span><o=
:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:10.0p=
t;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'><a href=3D"http://www.genso.=
org/">http://www.genso.org/</a></span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D=
MsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";=
color:blue'><a href=3D"http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSOC5KXMF_index_0.html">h=
ttp://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSOC5KXMF_index_0.html</a></span><o:p></o:p></p><=
/div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=
"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'><a href=3D"http://www.astro.mech.tohoku.ac=
.jp/~gsn/en/">http://www.astro.mech.tohoku.ac.jp/~gsn/en/</a></span><o:p></=
o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;fon=
t-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'>these are European/Japanese effor=
ts building on radio amateur interest&nbsp;- little US involvement.</span><=
o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div><d=
iv><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial"=
,"sans-serif";color:blue'>The IP-based Disaster Monitoring Constellation ha=
s a&nbsp;number of&nbsp;internetworked IP-capable ground stations for exact=
ly the reason you describe.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoN=
ormal>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'f=
ont-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'>Lloyd Wood</sp=
an><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:=
10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'><a href=3D"http://sat-n=
et.com/L.Wood/dtn">http://sat-net.com/L.Wood/dtn</a></span><o:p></o:p></p><=
/div><p class=3DMsoNormal><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div class=3DMsoNormal ali=
gn=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><hr size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=
=3Dcenter></div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><b><spa=
n style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span>=
</b><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> <a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">dtn-users-bo=
[email-masked]</a> [mailto:dtn-users-bounces@maillists.=
intel-research.net] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Barrett Dillow<br><b>Sent:</b> 08 F=
ebruary 2011 02:21<br><b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
l-research.net">[email-masked]</a><br><b>Subject:</=
b> [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DM=
soNormal>Hello list,<br><br>My university lab is competing for a nanosat pr=
oject. I'm trying to gather information about DTN implementations to presen=
t to the group, and the following questions that I couldn't find answered o=
nline. Thanks for your consideration.<br><br>Has DTN2 or ION been ported to=
 QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone know the depth of difference between Q=
NX and VxWorks? (As I see ION has been implemented on VxWorks, perhaps port=
ing to QNX would be a viable option.) <br><br>I've seen very little about g=
round station configuration. I had almost expected Universities to have con=
figured a basic ground station package (or list of requirements) so that a =
network of them across the globe could create DTN ground links, and share d=
ata with their experimental satellites via the terrestrial internet. Has th=
is happened and I just haven't found it yet? If my lab builds a ground stat=
ion to talk to our nanosat, it will be idle (but operational) for all but t=
he small windows of time in which we can see our satellite. I would be more=
 than happy to have it configured to ask as another DTN ground station, if =
our project could be incorporated into a network of such shared-use ground =
stations. <br><br>Thanks again for your thoughts.<br>Cheers,<br><br>Barrett=
 Dillow<br>PhD Candidate<br>Space Systems Laboratory<br>University of Maryl=
and, College Park <o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal>_______________=
________________________________<br>dtn-users mailing list<br><a href=3D"ma=
ilto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]=
arch.net</a><br><a href=3D"http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/list=
info/dtn-users">http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-us=
ers</a><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div>=
<div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helv=
etica","sans-serif"'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></=
div></div></div></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><div><=
p class=3DMsoNormal><span class=3Dapple-style-span><span style=3D'font-size=
:10.0pt;color:#1F497D'>******************************</span></span><span st=
yle=3D'font-size:10.0pt;color:#1F497D'><br><span class=3Dapple-style-span>W=
illiam D. Ivancic</span><br><span class=3Dapple-style-span>Phone 216-433-34=
94</span><br><span class=3Dapple-style-span>Fax 216-433-8705</span><br><spa=
n class=3Dapple-style-span>Networking Lab 216-433-2620</span><br><span clas=
s=3Dapple-style-span>DTN Lab 216-433-2981</span><br><span class=3Dapple-sty=
le-span>Mobile 440-503-4892</span><br><span class=3Dapple-style-span><a hre=
f=3D"http://roland.grc.nasa.gov/~ivancic">http://roland.grc.nasa.gov/~ivanc=
ic</a></span></span><span style=3D'font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Helvetica"=
,"sans-serif";color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=3DMso=
Normal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div></div></div></body></html>=

--_000_F25A909AA776104A92E2780BFCB3AEA81D5B538BALTPHYEMBEVSP40_--

From: "Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RHN0)" <[email-masked]>
To: "Burleigh, Scott C" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2011 13:27:51 -0600
Accept-Language: en-US
acceptlanguage: en-US
Cc: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>, "<[email-masked]> <[email-masked]>" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?

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True.  It depends what you are trying to do and the capabilities of the =
particular cubesat. =20

Downlink is probably much higher (low rate) than the uplink.  It is a =
cubesat.  I probably has a whip antenna.  It might only have a downlink.

- Will

On Feb 8, 2011, at 1:16 PM, Burleigh, Scott C (313B) wrote:

> I disagree, Will.  Cubesats could be very useful as delay-tolerant =
routers in a low-rate comsat network.
>=20
> Scott
>=20
> "Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RHN0)" <[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> For a cubesat you probably just need the shim.  You probably will only =
be sourcing data.  In addition, it may be over a unidirectional link.  =
On the ground you can use full blown DTN.
>=20
> Regarding the Disaster Monitoring Constellation:  my contracts have =
ended and I am in the process or tearing the system down.
>=20
> - Will
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> On Feb 8, 2011, at 6:20 AM, <[email-masked]> =
<[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
>> Barrett,
>> =20
>> I don't believe dtn2 will ever run on an unmanned spacecraft; it's =
simply too resource-intensive and unix-y. I don't expect to see dtn2 =
implemented on a nanosatellite. (We implemented a custom bundle shim on =
RTEMS on the UK-DMC satellite to generate bundles delivered to a full =
dtn2 implementation running on linux on the ground.)
>> =20
>> Cubesats are using AX.25 in comms for the most part, although =
arguments have been made for e.g. using HTTP to deliver files (a paper =
by Jamie Cutler while at Stanford, before moving to Michigan). There has =
been much discussion of increased access to cubesats via networked =
ground stations; see e.g.
>> http://www.genso.org/
>> http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSOC5KXMF_index_0.html
>> http://www.astro.mech.tohoku.ac.jp/~gsn/en/
>> these are European/Japanese efforts building on radio amateur =
interest - little US involvement.
>> =20
>> The IP-based Disaster Monitoring Constellation has a number of =
internetworked IP-capable ground stations for exactly the reason you =
describe.
>> =20
>> Lloyd Wood
>> http://sat-net.com/L.Wood/dtn
>>=20
>> From: [email-masked] =
[mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of =
Barrett Dillow
>> Sent: 08 February 2011 02:21
>> To: [email-masked]
>> Subject: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?
>>=20
>> Hello list,
>>=20
>> My university lab is competing for a nanosat project. I'm trying to =
gather information about DTN implementations to present to the group, =
and the following questions that I couldn't find answered online. Thanks =
for your consideration.
>>=20
>> Has DTN2 or ION been ported to QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone =
know the depth of difference between QNX and VxWorks? (As I see ION has =
been implemented on VxWorks, perhaps porting to QNX would be a viable =
option.)=20
>>=20
>> I've seen very little about ground station configuration. I had =
almost expected Universities to have configured a basic ground station =
package (or list of requirements) so that a network of them across the =
globe could create DTN ground links, and share data with their =
experimental satellites via the terrestrial internet. Has this happened =
and I just haven't found it yet? If my lab builds a ground station to =
talk to our nanosat, it will be idle (but operational) for all but the =
small windows of time in which we can see our satellite. I would be more =
than happy to have it configured to ask as another DTN ground station, =
if our project could be incorporated into a network of such shared-use =
ground stations.=20
>>=20
>> Thanks again for your thoughts.
>> Cheers,
>>=20
>> Barrett Dillow
>> PhD Candidate
>> Space Systems Laboratory
>> University of Maryland, College Park
>> _______________________________________________
>> dtn-users mailing list
>> [email-masked]
>> http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-users
>=20
>=20

******************************
William D. Ivancic
Phone 216-433-3494
Fax 216-433-8705
Networking Lab 216-433-2620
DTN Lab 216-433-2981
Mobile 440-503-4892
http://roland.grc.nasa.gov/~ivancic

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<html><head></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">True. =
&nbsp;It depends what you are trying to do and the capabilities of the =
particular cubesat. &nbsp;<div><br></div><div>Downlink is probably much =
higher (low rate) than the uplink. &nbsp;It is a cubesat. &nbsp;I =
probably has a whip antenna. &nbsp;It might only have a =
downlink.</div><div><br></div><div>- =
Will<br><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br><div><div>On=
 Feb 8, 2011, at 1:16 PM, Burleigh, Scott C (313B) wrote:</div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div =
style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; =
-webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">
<pre style=3D"word-wrap:break-word; font-size:10.0pt; =
font-family:Tahoma; color:black">I disagree, Will.  Cubesats could be =
very useful as delay-tolerant routers in a low-rate comsat network.

Scott

"Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RHN0)" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&=
gt; wrote:

</pre>
<div>For a cubesat you probably just need the shim. &nbsp;You probably =
will only be sourcing data. &nbsp;In addition, it may be over a =
unidirectional link. &nbsp;On the ground you can use full blown DTN.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Regarding the Disaster Monitoring Constellation: &nbsp;my contracts =
have ended and I am in the process or tearing the system down.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>- Will<br>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On Feb 8, 2011, at 6:20 AM, &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; =
wrote:</div>
<br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type=3D"cite">
<div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2"=
 face=3D"Arial">Barrett,</font></span></div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2"=
 face=3D"Arial"></font></span>&nbsp;</div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2"=
 face=3D"Arial">I don't believe dtn2 will ever run on an unmanned =
spacecraft; it's&nbsp;simply too resource-intensive and unix-y. I don't =
expect to see dtn2 implemented on a nanosatellite. (We implemented
 a custom bundle shim on RTEMS on the UK-DMC satellite to generate =
bundles delivered to a full dtn2 implementation running on linux on the =
ground.)</font></span></div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2"=
 face=3D"Arial"></font></span>&nbsp;</div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2"=
 face=3D"Arial">Cubesats are using AX.25 in comms for the most part, =
although arguments have been made for e.g. using HTTP to deliver files =
(a paper by Jamie Cutler while at Stanford, before
 moving to Michigan). There has been much discussion of increased access =
to cubesats via networked ground stations; see e.g.</font></span></div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2"=
 face=3D"Arial"><a =
href=3D"http://www.genso.org/">http://www.genso.org/</a></font></span></di=
v>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2"=
 face=3D"Arial"><a =
href=3D"http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSOC5KXMF_index_0.html">http://www.esa.=
int/esaCP/SEMSOC5KXMF_index_0.html</a></font></span></div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2"=
 face=3D"Arial"><a =
href=3D"http://www.astro.mech.tohoku.ac.jp/~gsn/en/">http://www.astro.mech=
.tohoku.ac.jp/~gsn/en/</a></font></span></div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2"=
 face=3D"Arial">these are European/Japanese efforts building on radio =
amateur interest&nbsp;- little US involvement.</font></span></div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2"=
 face=3D"Arial"></font></span>&nbsp;</div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2"=
 face=3D"Arial">The IP-based Disaster Monitoring Constellation has =
a&nbsp;number of&nbsp;internetworked IP-capable ground stations for =
exactly the reason you describe.</font></span></div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2"=
 face=3D"Arial"></font></span>&nbsp;</div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2"=
 face=3D"Arial">Lloyd Wood</font></span></div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2"=
 face=3D"Arial"><a =
href=3D"http://sat-net.com/L.Wood/dtn">http://sat-net.com/L.Wood/dtn</a></=
font></span></div>
<br>
<blockquote style=3D"border-left-color: rgb(0, 0, 255); =
border-left-width: 2px; border-left-style: solid; padding-left: 5px; =
margin-left: 5px; margin-right: 0px; position: static; z-index: auto; ">
<div dir=3D"ltr" lang=3D"en-us" class=3D"OutlookMessageHeader" =
align=3D"left">
<hr tabindex=3D"-1">
<font size=3D"2" face=3D"Tahoma"><b>From:</b> <a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">
[email-masked]</a> =
[mailto:[email-masked]]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Barrett Dillow<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 08 February 2011 02:21<br>
<b>To:</b> <a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">dtn-users@maillists=
.intel-research.net</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?<br>
</font><br>
</div>
<div></div>
Hello list,<br>
<br>
My university lab is competing for a nanosat project. I'm trying to =
gather information about DTN implementations to present to the group, =
and the following questions that I couldn't find answered online. Thanks =
for your consideration.<br>
<br>
Has DTN2 or ION been ported to QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone know =
the depth of difference between QNX and VxWorks? (As I see ION has been =
implemented on VxWorks, perhaps porting to QNX would be a viable =
option.)
<br>
<br>
I've seen very little about ground station configuration. I had almost =
expected Universities to have configured a basic ground station package =
(or list of requirements) so that a network of them across the globe =
could create DTN ground links, and share data
 with their experimental satellites via the terrestrial internet. Has =
this happened and I just haven't found it yet? If my lab builds a ground =
station to talk to our nanosat, it will be idle (but operational) for =
all but the small windows of time in which we
 can see our satellite. I would be more than happy to have it configured =
to ask as another DTN ground station, if our project could be =
incorporated into a network of such shared-use ground stations.
<br>
<br>
Thanks again for your thoughts.<br>
Cheers,<br>
<br>
Barrett Dillow<br>
PhD Candidate<br>
Space Systems Laboratory<br>
University of Maryland, College Park </blockquote>
</div>
_______________________________________________<br>
dtn-users mailing list<br>
<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">dtn-users@maillists=
.intel-research.net</a><br>
<a =
href=3D"http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-users">ht=
tp://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-users</a><br>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
<div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: =
separate; font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; font-variant: =
normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: =
normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: =
normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: =
0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; ">
<div><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" color=3D"#1F497D" face=3D"'Times =
New Roman', serif" size=3D"3"><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
style=3D"font-size: 13px;"><br>
</span></font></div>
</span></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div><br><div>
<span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"border-collapse: separate; =
color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-style: normal; =
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: =
0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: =
auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; font-size: medium; "><div><span =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125); =
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; font-size: 13px; =
">******************************</span><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
font-size: 13px; "><br></span><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
font-size: 13px; ">William D. Ivancic</span><span =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125); =
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; font-size: 13px; =
"><br></span><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"color: rgb(31, =
73, 125); font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; font-size: 13px; =
">Phone 216-433-3494</span><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
font-size: 13px; "><br></span><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
font-size: 13px; ">Fax 216-433-8705</span><span class=3D"Apple-style-span"=
 style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif; font-size: 13px; "><br></span><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
font-size: 13px; ">Networking Lab 216-433-2620</span><span =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125); =
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; font-size: 13px; =
"><br></span><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"color: rgb(31, =
73, 125); font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; font-size: 13px; ">DTN =
Lab 216-433-2981</span><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; font-size: =
13px; "><br></span><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; font-size: =
13px; ">Mobile 440-503-4892</span><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
font-size: 13px; "><br></span><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125); font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
font-size: 13px; "><a href=3D"http://roland.grc.nasa.gov/~ivancic" =
style=3D"color: blue; text-decoration: underline; =
">http://roland.grc.nasa.gov/~ivancic</a></span></div></span>
</div>
<br></div></div></body></html>=

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Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2011 19:09:33 -0000
From: [email-masked]
To: "Barrett Dillow" <[email-masked]>
Importance: Normal
Cc: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?

> Hello list,
>
> My university lab is competing for a nanosat project. I'm trying to gather
> information about DTN implementations to present to the group, and the
> following questions that I couldn't find answered online. Thanks for your
> consideration.
>
Good luck with it
> I've seen very little about ground station configuration. I had almost
> expected Universities to have configured a basic ground station package
> (or
Some cubesat's have Amateur Radio operators involved. Hence they use a
variety of frequencys and modes to send telemetry back to earth.

Probably the lowest common denominator would be 1200 baud AX.25 used on
PCSAT2 and others (http://www.usna.edu/Users/aero/bruninga/pcsat2.html).

Mr Bruninga is probably a good person to get guidance from re Amateur
Radio involvement (if you are thinking that way). Generally, as the
cubesats have a 'science' bent (and especially if there is a
repeater/transponder on board), Amateur Radio operators will get involved
and act as ground stations if their equipment allows.  I myself have a
relatively simple groundstation in place for receiving data from the
International Space Station. The APRS-IS backbone has been used in the
past to propagate telemetry to any/all stations interested in it.

If I can poke Darren hard enough, we might even get to exchange UI frames
through the ISS sometime this year.

Regards
John Ronan

From: Darren Long <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2011 18:28:26 +0000
To: "Burleigh, Scott C (313B)" <[email-masked]>
Cc: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?

On 8 Feb 2011, at 16:49, Burleigh, Scott C (313B) wrote:

> If someone is working on an AX.25 link service adapter for LTP in ION, I too would be very interested to hear about it; it would be most welcome.

I've just appended the contents of a a mail send last year to the interest list below.  This is all I've heard, but it is interesting indeed.

More on the LTP derivative later.

Cheers,

Darren

On 30 Jul 2010, at 00:13, Oyake, Amalaye (316D) wrote:

> That is generally the path I am thinking along!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Thursday07/29/2010 Thursday~07/29/2010 -4:08 PM, "Darren Long" <[email-masked]> wrote:
> 
> That is interesting.  I've been wondering about LTP over AX.25 UI frames (i.e. disconnected mode) and have wondered about doing that with ION rather than DTN2.  Are you having similar thoughts?
> 
> Darren
> 
> On 30 Jul 2010, at 00:05, Oyake, Amalaye (316D) wrote:
> 
> ION is what I have been working with ... I hope to add a CL Layer wrt to AX.25 ... It is a good fit.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> * Amalaye Oyake                                    *
> * Flight Software Applications & Data Product Mgmt */\
> * 818.393.7168 work   626.399.1707 cell            *||
> * Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena  CA 91109   */||\

From: "Burleigh, Scott C (313B)" <[email-masked]>
To: "Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RHN0)" <[email-masked]>, "<[email-masked]> <[email-masked]>" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2011 10:16:54 -0800
Accept-Language: en-US
acceptlanguage: en-US
Cc: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?

--_000_m4f1lu80c6fjbjt99oyjjvpg1297188741519emailandroidcom_
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I disagree, Will.  Cubesats could be very useful as delay-tolerant routers =
in a low-rate comsat network.

Scott

"Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RHN0)" <[email-masked]> wrote:

For a cubesat you probably just need the shim.  You probably will only be s=
ourcing data.  In addition, it may be over a unidirectional link.  On the g=
round you can use full blown DTN.

Regarding the Disaster Monitoring Constellation:  my contracts have ended a=
nd I am in the process or tearing the system down.

- Will

On Feb 8, 2011, at 6:20 AM, <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]=
>> <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>> wrote:

Barrett,

I don't believe dtn2 will ever run on an unmanned spacecraft; it's simply t=
oo resource-intensive and unix-y. I don't expect to see dtn2 implemented on=
 a nanosatellite. (We implemented a custom bundle shim on RTEMS on the UK-D=
MC satellite to generate bundles delivered to a full dtn2 implementation ru=
nning on linux on the ground.)

Cubesats are using AX.25 in comms for the most part, although arguments hav=
e been made for e.g. using HTTP to deliver files (a paper by Jamie Cutler w=
hile at Stanford, before moving to Michigan). There has been much discussio=
n of increased access to cubesats via networked ground stations; see e.g.
http://www.genso.org/
http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSOC5KXMF_index_0.html
http://www.astro.mech.tohoku.ac.jp/~gsn/en/
these are European/Japanese efforts building on radio amateur interest - li=
ttle US involvement.

The IP-based Disaster Monitoring Constellation has a number of internetwork=
ed IP-capable ground stations for exactly the reason you describe.

Lloyd Wood
http://sat-net.com/L.Wood/dtn

________________________________
From: [email-masked]<mailto:dtn-users-bounc=
[email-masked]> [mailto:[email-masked]=
research.net] On Behalf Of Barrett Dillow
Sent: 08 February 2011 02:21
To: [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]=
-research.net>
Subject: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?

Hello list,

My university lab is competing for a nanosat project. I'm trying to gather =
information about DTN implementations to present to the group, and the foll=
owing questions that I couldn't find answered online. Thanks for your consi=
deration.

Has DTN2 or ION been ported to QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone know the=
 depth of difference between QNX and VxWorks? (As I see ION has been implem=
ented on VxWorks, perhaps porting to QNX would be a viable option.)

I've seen very little about ground station configuration. I had almost expe=
cted Universities to have configured a basic ground station package (or lis=
t of requirements) so that a network of them across the globe could create =
DTN ground links, and share data with their experimental satellites via the=
 terrestrial internet. Has this happened and I just haven't found it yet? I=
f my lab builds a ground station to talk to our nanosat, it will be idle (b=
ut operational) for all but the small windows of time in which we can see o=
ur satellite. I would be more than happy to have it configured to ask as an=
other DTN ground station, if our project could be incorporated into a netwo=
rk of such shared-use ground stations.

Thanks again for your thoughts.
Cheers,

Barrett Dillow
PhD Candidate
Space Systems Laboratory
University of Maryland, College Park
_______________________________________________
dtn-users mailing list
[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]=
earch.net>
http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-users

--_000_m4f1lu80c6fjbjt99oyjjvpg1297188741519emailandroidcom_
Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html><head>
<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dus-ascii"=
>
</head>
<body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-lin=
e-break: after-white-space; ">
<pre style=3D"word-wrap:break-word; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:Tahoma; c=
olor:black">I disagree, Will.  Cubesats could be very useful as delay-toler=
ant routers in a low-rate comsat network.=0A=
=0A=
Scott=0A=
=0A=
&quot;Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RHN0)&quot; &lt;[email-masked]&g=
t; wrote:=0A=
=0A=
</pre>
<div>For a cubesat you probably just need the shim. &nbsp;You probably will=
 only be sourcing data. &nbsp;In addition, it may be over a unidirectional =
link. &nbsp;On the ground you can use full blown DTN.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Regarding the Disaster Monitoring Constellation: &nbsp;my contracts ha=
ve ended and I am in the process or tearing the system down.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>- Will<br>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On Feb 8, 2011, at 6:20 AM, &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]"=
>[email-masked]</a>&gt; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">L.W=
[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:</div>
<br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type=3D"cite">
<div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2" =
face=3D"Arial">Barrett,</font></span></div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2" =
face=3D"Arial"></font></span>&nbsp;</div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2" =
face=3D"Arial">I don't believe dtn2 will ever run on an unmanned spacecraft=
; it's&nbsp;simply too resource-intensive and unix-y. I don't expect to see=
 dtn2 implemented on a nanosatellite. (We implemented
 a custom bundle shim on RTEMS on the UK-DMC satellite to generate bundles =
delivered to a full dtn2 implementation running on linux on the ground.)</f=
ont></span></div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2" =
face=3D"Arial"></font></span>&nbsp;</div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2" =
face=3D"Arial">Cubesats are using AX.25 in comms for the most part, althoug=
h arguments have been made for e.g. using HTTP to deliver files (a paper by=
 Jamie Cutler while at Stanford, before
 moving to Michigan). There has been much discussion of increased access to=
 cubesats via networked ground stations; see e.g.</font></span></div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2" =
face=3D"Arial"><a href=3D"http://www.genso.org/">http://www.genso.org/</a><=
/font></span></div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2" =
face=3D"Arial"><a href=3D"http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSOC5KXMF_index_0.html=
">http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSOC5KXMF_index_0.html</a></font></span></div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2" =
face=3D"Arial"><a href=3D"http://www.astro.mech.tohoku.ac.jp/~gsn/en/">http=
://www.astro.mech.tohoku.ac.jp/~gsn/en/</a></font></span></div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2" =
face=3D"Arial">these are European/Japanese efforts building on radio amateu=
r interest&nbsp;- little US involvement.</font></span></div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2" =
face=3D"Arial"></font></span>&nbsp;</div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2" =
face=3D"Arial">The IP-based Disaster Monitoring Constellation has a&nbsp;nu=
mber of&nbsp;internetworked IP-capable ground stations for exactly the reas=
on you describe.</font></span></div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2" =
face=3D"Arial"></font></span>&nbsp;</div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2" =
face=3D"Arial">Lloyd Wood</font></span></div>
<div><span class=3D"802095710-08022011"><font color=3D"#0000ff" size=3D"2" =
face=3D"Arial"><a href=3D"http://sat-net.com/L.Wood/dtn">http://sat-net.com=
/L.Wood/dtn</a></font></span></div>
<br>
<blockquote style=3D"border-left-color: rgb(0, 0, 255); border-left-width: =
2px; border-left-style: solid; padding-left: 5px; margin-left: 5px; margin-=
right: 0px; position: static; z-index: auto; ">
<div dir=3D"ltr" lang=3D"en-us" class=3D"OutlookMessageHeader" align=3D"lef=
t">
<hr tabindex=3D"-1">
<font size=3D"2" face=3D"Tahoma"><b>From:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:dtn-users-b=
[email-masked]">
[email-masked]</a> [mailto:dtn-users-bounce=
[email-masked]]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Barrett Dillow<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 08 February 2011 02:21<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">dtn-us=
[email-masked]</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?<br>
</font><br>
</div>
<div></div>
Hello list,<br>
<br>
My university lab is competing for a nanosat project. I'm trying to gather =
information about DTN implementations to present to the group, and the foll=
owing questions that I couldn't find answered online. Thanks for your consi=
deration.<br>
<br>
Has DTN2 or ION been ported to QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone know the=
 depth of difference between QNX and VxWorks? (As I see ION has been implem=
ented on VxWorks, perhaps porting to QNX would be a viable option.)
<br>
<br>
I've seen very little about ground station configuration. I had almost expe=
cted Universities to have configured a basic ground station package (or lis=
t of requirements) so that a network of them across the globe could create =
DTN ground links, and share data
 with their experimental satellites via the terrestrial internet. Has this =
happened and I just haven't found it yet? If my lab builds a ground station=
 to talk to our nanosat, it will be idle (but operational) for all but the =
small windows of time in which we
 can see our satellite. I would be more than happy to have it configured to=
 ask as another DTN ground station, if our project could be incorporated in=
to a network of such shared-use ground stations.
<br>
<br>
Thanks again for your thoughts.<br>
Cheers,<br>
<br>
Barrett Dillow<br>
PhD Candidate<br>
Space Systems Laboratory<br>
University of Maryland, College Park </blockquote>
</div>
_______________________________________________<br>
dtn-users mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">dtn-users@maillis=
ts.intel-research.net</a><br>
http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-users<br>
</blockquote>
</div>
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From: "Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RHN0)" <[email-masked]>
To: "<[email-masked]> <[email-masked]>" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2011 12:00:59 -0600
Accept-Language: en-US
acceptlanguage: en-US
Cc: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?

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For a cubesat you probably just need the shim.  You probably will only =
be sourcing data.  In addition, it may be over a unidirectional link.  =
On the ground you can use full blown DTN.

Regarding the Disaster Monitoring Constellation:  my contracts have =
ended and I am in the process or tearing the system down.

- Will

On Feb 8, 2011, at 6:20 AM, <[email-masked]> <[email-masked]> =
wrote:

> Barrett,
> =20
> I don't believe dtn2 will ever run on an unmanned spacecraft; it's =
simply too resource-intensive and unix-y. I don't expect to see dtn2 =
implemented on a nanosatellite. (We implemented a custom bundle shim on =
RTEMS on the UK-DMC satellite to generate bundles delivered to a full =
dtn2 implementation running on linux on the ground.)
> =20
> Cubesats are using AX.25 in comms for the most part, although =
arguments have been made for e.g. using HTTP to deliver files (a paper =
by Jamie Cutler while at Stanford, before moving to Michigan). There has =
been much discussion of increased access to cubesats via networked =
ground stations; see e.g.
> http://www.genso.org/
> http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSOC5KXMF_index_0.html
> http://www.astro.mech.tohoku.ac.jp/~gsn/en/
> these are European/Japanese efforts building on radio amateur interest =
- little US involvement.
> =20
> The IP-based Disaster Monitoring Constellation has a number of =
internetworked IP-capable ground stations for exactly the reason you =
describe.
> =20
> Lloyd Wood
> http://sat-net.com/L.Wood/dtn
>=20
> From: [email-masked] =
[mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of =
Barrett Dillow
> Sent: 08 February 2011 02:21
> To: [email-masked]
> Subject: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?
>=20
> Hello list,
>=20
> My university lab is competing for a nanosat project. I'm trying to =
gather information about DTN implementations to present to the group, =
and the following questions that I couldn't find answered online. Thanks =
for your consideration.
>=20
> Has DTN2 or ION been ported to QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone =
know the depth of difference between QNX and VxWorks? (As I see ION has =
been implemented on VxWorks, perhaps porting to QNX would be a viable =
option.)=20
>=20
> I've seen very little about ground station configuration. I had almost =
expected Universities to have configured a basic ground station package =
(or list of requirements) so that a network of them across the globe =
could create DTN ground links, and share data with their experimental =
satellites via the terrestrial internet. Has this happened and I just =
haven't found it yet? If my lab builds a ground station to talk to our =
nanosat, it will be idle (but operational) for all but the small windows =
of time in which we can see our satellite. I would be more than happy to =
have it configured to ask as another DTN ground station, if our project =
could be incorporated into a network of such shared-use ground stations.=20=

>=20
> Thanks again for your thoughts.
> Cheers,
>=20
> Barrett Dillow
> PhD Candidate
> Space Systems Laboratory
> University of Maryland, College Park
> _______________________________________________
> dtn-users mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-users

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<html><head></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">For a cubesat you probably just need the shim. &nbsp;You probably will only be sourcing data. &nbsp;In addition, it may be over a unidirectional link. &nbsp;On the ground you can use full blown DTN.<div><br></div><div>Regarding the Disaster Monitoring Constellation: &nbsp;my contracts have ended and I am in the process or tearing the system down.</div><div><br></div><div>- Will<br><div><br></div><div><br><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br><div><div>On Feb 8, 2011, at 6:20 AM, &lt;<a href="mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; &lt;<a href="mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div><span class="802095710-08022011"><font color="#0000ff" size="2" face="Arial">Barrett,</font></span></div>
<div><span class="802095710-08022011"><font color="#0000ff" size="2" face="Arial"></font></span>&nbsp;</div>
<div><span class="802095710-08022011"><font color="#0000ff" size="2" face="Arial">I 
don't believe dtn2 will ever run on an unmanned spacecraft; it's&nbsp;simply too 
resource-intensive and unix-y. I don't expect to see dtn2 implemented on a 
nanosatellite. (We implemented a custom bundle shim on RTEMS on the UK-DMC 
satellite to generate bundles delivered to a full dtn2 implementation running on 
linux on the ground.)</font></span></div>
<div><span class="802095710-08022011"><font color="#0000ff" size="2" face="Arial"></font></span>&nbsp;</div>
<div><span class="802095710-08022011"><font color="#0000ff" size="2" face="Arial">Cubesats are using AX.25 in comms for the most part, although 
arguments have been made for e.g. using HTTP to deliver files (a paper by Jamie 
Cutler while at Stanford, before moving to Michigan). There has been much 
discussion of increased access to cubesats via networked ground stations; see 
e.g.</font></span></div>
<div><span class="802095710-08022011"><font color="#0000ff" size="2" face="Arial"><a href="http://www.genso.org/">http://www.genso.org/</a></font></span></div>
<div><span class="802095710-08022011"><font color="#0000ff" size="2" face="Arial"><a href="http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSOC5KXMF_index_0.html">http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSOC5KXMF_index_0.html</a></font></span></div>
<div><span class="802095710-08022011"><font color="#0000ff" size="2" face="Arial"><a href="http://www.astro.mech.tohoku.ac.jp/~gsn/en/">http://www.astro.mech.tohoku.ac.jp/~gsn/en/</a></font></span></div>
<div><span class="802095710-08022011"><font color="#0000ff" size="2" face="Arial">these 
are European/Japanese efforts building on radio amateur interest&nbsp;- little 
US involvement.</font></span></div>
<div><span class="802095710-08022011"><font color="#0000ff" size="2" face="Arial"></font></span>&nbsp;</div>
<div><span class="802095710-08022011"><font color="#0000ff" size="2" face="Arial">The 
IP-based Disaster Monitoring Constellation has a&nbsp;number 
of&nbsp;internetworked IP-capable ground stations for exactly the reason you 
describe.</font></span></div>
<div><span class="802095710-08022011"><font color="#0000ff" size="2" face="Arial"></font></span>&nbsp;</div>
<div><span class="802095710-08022011"><font color="#0000ff" size="2" face="Arial">Lloyd 
Wood</font></span></div>
<div><span class="802095710-08022011"><font color="#0000ff" size="2" face="Arial"><a href="http://sat-net.com/L.Wood/dtn">http://sat-net.com/L.Wood/dtn</a></font></span></div><br>
<blockquote style="border-left-color: rgb(0, 0, 255); border-left-width: 2px; border-left-style: solid; padding-left: 5px; margin-left: 5px; margin-right: 0px; position: static; z-index: auto; ">
  <div dir="ltr" lang="en-us" class="OutlookMessageHeader" align="left">
  <hr tabindex="-1">
  <font size="2" face="Tahoma"><b>From:</b> 
  <a href="mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a> 
  [mailto:[email-masked]] <b>On Behalf Of 
  </b>Barrett Dillow<br><b>Sent:</b> 08 February 2011 02:21<br><b>To:</b> 
  <a href="mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a><br><b>Subject:</b> [dtn-users] DTN, 
  QNX, ground stations?<br></font><br></div>
  <div></div>Hello list,<br><br>My university lab is competing for a nanosat 
  project. I'm trying to gather information about DTN implementations to present 
  to the group, and the following questions that I couldn't find answered 
  online. Thanks for your consideration.<br><br>Has DTN2 or ION been ported to 
  QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone know the depth of difference between QNX 
  and VxWorks? (As I see ION has been implemented on VxWorks, perhaps porting to 
  QNX would be a viable option.) <br><br>I've seen very little about ground 
  station configuration. I had almost expected Universities to have configured a 
  basic ground station package (or list of requirements) so that a network of 
  them across the globe could create DTN ground links, and share data with their 
  experimental satellites via the terrestrial internet. Has this happened and I 
  just haven't found it yet? If my lab builds a ground station to talk to our 
  nanosat, it will be idle (but operational) for all but the small windows of 
  time in which we can see our satellite. I would be more than happy to have it 
  configured to ask as another DTN ground station, if our project could be 
  incorporated into a network of such shared-use ground stations. <br><br>Thanks 
  again for your thoughts.<br>Cheers,<br><br>Barrett Dillow<br>PhD 
  Candidate<br>Space Systems Laboratory<br>University of Maryland, College Park 
</blockquote></div>
_______________________________________________<br>dtn-users mailing list<br><a href="mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a><br>http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-users<br></blockquote></div><br><div>
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Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2011 16:59:17 +0000
From: Stephen Farrell <[email-masked]>
To: "Burleigh, Scott C (313B)" <[email-masked]>
Cc: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?

On 08/02/11 16:49, Burleigh, Scott C (313B) wrote:
> If someone is working on an AX.25 link service adapter for LTP in ION, I too would be very interested to hear about it; it would be most welcome.

Ditto.

> Darren, can you say a little more about which aspects of LTP make it ill-suited for the environment you're looking at?

Be v. interested in that too. If you do that though I think moving
the thread to dtn-interest would be better since its (presumably)
protocol-design that'd discussed and not code.

S.

> 
> Scott
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Darren Long [mailto:[email-masked]] 
> Sent: Tuesday, February 08, 2011 8:46 AM
> To: Burleigh, Scott C (313B); Barrett Dillow; [email-masked]
> Subject: Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?
> 
> I've heard rumours that an LTP over disconnected mode AX.25 (datagrams) may be forthcoming in ION. I'd be interested in learning more about these plans.  For my part, I'm currently dreaming up a derivative of LTP more suited for use on shared channels using LEO amateur satellites as bent pipe relays (digipeaters) with the intent to implement a CL for DTN2 in the near future.
> 
> The existing AX.25 connected mode CL I've implemented is better suited for terrestrial links.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Darren
> 
> ----- Original message -----
>> Hi, Barrett.   ION has not yet been ported to QNX, but I suspect that the
>> port would not be too difficult: QNX seems to be fully POSIX-compliant,
>> and that's mainly what the portability shim in ION requires.   I'm
>> guessing that the port might be similar to the RTEMS port, and possibly
>> a bit easier; maybe 10-20 hours to tweak ici/include/platform.h and
>> ici/library/platform.c and platform_sm.c, and maybe another 20-30 hours
>> to develop a build environment along the lines of arch-rtems.   If you're
>> interested in taking it on I would be glad to provide whatever helpful
>> hints I can.
>>
>> I don't know of an existing network of DTN-equipped ground stations, but
>> as we see more and more Cubesats flying I think the motivation for
>> building such a network will grow.   Either ION or DTN2 would work fine
>> in ground stations, as they interoperate pretty well.   The major hurdle
>> here, I guess, would be development of an AX.25 convergence-layer
>> adapter or (better, I believe) an AX.25 link service adapter under LTP.
>>
>> Scott
>>
>> From: [email-masked]
>> [mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of
>> Barrett Dillow Sent: Monday, February 07, 2011 6:21 PM To:
>> [email-masked] Subject: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX,
>> ground stations?
>>
>> Hello list,
>>
>> My university lab is competing for a nanosat project. I'm trying to
>> gather information about DTN implementations to present to the group,
>> and the following questions that I couldn't find answered online. Thanks
>> for your consideration.
>>
>> Has DTN2 or ION been ported to QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone know
>> the depth of difference between QNX and VxWorks? (As I see ION has been
>> implemented on VxWorks, perhaps porting to QNX would be a viable option.)
>>
>> I've seen very little about ground station configuration. I had almost
>> expected Universities to have configured a basic ground station package
>> (or list of requirements) so that a network of them across the globe
>> could create DTN ground links, and share data with their experimental
>> satellites via the terrestrial internet. Has this happened and I just
>> haven't found it yet? If my lab builds a ground station to talk to our
>> nanosat, it will be idle (but operational) for all but the small windows
>> of time in which we can see our satellite. I would be more than happy to
>> have it configured to ask as another DTN ground station, if our project
>> could be incorporated into a network of such shared-use ground stations.
>>
>> Thanks again for your thoughts.
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Barrett Dillow
>> PhD Candidate
>> Space Systems Laboratory
>> University of Maryland, College Park
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> dtn-users mailing list
> [email-masked]
> http://maillists.intel-research.net/mailman/listinfo/dtn-users

From: "Burleigh, Scott C (313B)" <[email-masked]>
To: Darren Long <[email-masked]>, Barrett Dillow <[email-masked]>, "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2011 08:49:56 -0800
Accept-Language: en-US
acceptlanguage: en-US
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?

If someone is working on an AX.25 link service adapter for LTP in ION, I too would be very interested to hear about it; it would be most welcome.

Darren, can you say a little more about which aspects of LTP make it ill-suited for the environment you're looking at?

Scott

-----Original Message-----
From: Darren Long [mailto:[email-masked]] 
Sent: Tuesday, February 08, 2011 8:46 AM
To: Burleigh, Scott C (313B); Barrett Dillow; [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?

I've heard rumours that an LTP over disconnected mode AX.25 (datagrams) may be forthcoming in ION. I'd be interested in learning more about these plans.  For my part, I'm currently dreaming up a derivative of LTP more suited for use on shared channels using LEO amateur satellites as bent pipe relays (digipeaters) with the intent to implement a CL for DTN2 in the near future.

The existing AX.25 connected mode CL I've implemented is better suited for terrestrial links.

Cheers,

Darren

----- Original message -----
> Hi, Barrett.Â   ION has not yet been ported to QNX, but I suspect that the
> port would not be too difficult: QNX seems to be fully POSIX-compliant,
> and that's mainly what the portability shim in ION requires.Â   I'm
> guessing that the port might be similar to the RTEMS port, and possibly
> a bit easier; maybe 10-20 hours to tweak ici/include/platform.h and
> ici/library/platform.c and platform_sm.c, and maybe another 20-30 hours
> to develop a build environment along the lines of arch-rtems.Â   If you're
> interested in taking it on I would be glad to provide whatever helpful
> hints I can.
> 
> I don't know of an existing network of DTN-equipped ground stations, but
> as we see more and more Cubesats flying I think the motivation for
> building such a network will grow.Â   Either ION or DTN2 would work fine
> in ground stations, as they interoperate pretty well.Â   The major hurdle
> here, I guess, would be development of an AX.25 convergence-layer
> adapter or (better, I believe) an AX.25 link service adapter under LTP.
> 
> Scott
> 
> From: [email-masked]
> [mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of
> Barrett Dillow Sent: Monday, February 07, 2011 6:21 PM To:
> [email-masked] Subject: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX,
> ground stations?
> 
> Hello list,
> 
> My university lab is competing for a nanosat project. I'm trying to
> gather information about DTN implementations to present to the group,
> and the following questions that I couldn't find answered online. Thanks
> for your consideration.
> 
> Has DTN2 or ION been ported to QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone know
> the depth of difference between QNX and VxWorks? (As I see ION has been
> implemented on VxWorks, perhaps porting to QNX would be a viable option.)
> 
> I've seen very little about ground station configuration. I had almost
> expected Universities to have configured a basic ground station package
> (or list of requirements) so that a network of them across the globe
> could create DTN ground links, and share data with their experimental
> satellites via the terrestrial internet. Has this happened and I just
> haven't found it yet? If my lab builds a ground station to talk to our
> nanosat, it will be idle (but operational) for all but the small windows
> of time in which we can see our satellite. I would be more than happy to
> have it configured to ask as another DTN ground station, if our project
> could be incorporated into a network of such shared-use ground stations.
> 
> Thanks again for your thoughts.
> Cheers,
> 
> Barrett Dillow
> PhD Candidate
> Space Systems Laboratory
> University of Maryland, College Park

From: Darren Long <[email-masked]>
To: "Burleigh, Scott C (313B)" <[email-masked]>, Barrett Dillow <[email-masked]>, [email-masked]
Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2011 16:45:53 +0000
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?
Reply-To: Darren Long <[email-masked]>

I've heard rumours that an LTP over disconnected mode AX.25 (datagrams) may be forthcoming in ION. I'd be interested in learning more about these plans.  For my part, I'm currently dreaming up a derivative of LTP more suited for use on shared channels using LEO amateur satellites as bent pipe relays (digipeaters) with the intent to implement a CL for DTN2 in the near future.

The existing AX.25 connected mode CL I've implemented is better suited for terrestrial links.

Cheers,

Darren

----- Original message -----
> Hi, Barrett.Â   ION has not yet been ported to QNX, but I suspect that the
> port would not be too difficult: QNX seems to be fully POSIX-compliant,
> and that's mainly what the portability shim in ION requires.Â   I'm
> guessing that the port might be similar to the RTEMS port, and possibly
> a bit easier; maybe 10-20 hours to tweak ici/include/platform.h and
> ici/library/platform.c and platform_sm.c, and maybe another 20-30 hours
> to develop a build environment along the lines of arch-rtems.Â   If you're
> interested in taking it on I would be glad to provide whatever helpful
> hints I can.
> 
> I don't know of an existing network of DTN-equipped ground stations, but
> as we see more and more Cubesats flying I think the motivation for
> building such a network will grow.Â   Either ION or DTN2 would work fine
> in ground stations, as they interoperate pretty well.Â   The major hurdle
> here, I guess, would be development of an AX.25 convergence-layer
> adapter or (better, I believe) an AX.25 link service adapter under LTP.
> 
> Scott
> 
> From: [email-masked]
> [mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of
> Barrett Dillow Sent: Monday, February 07, 2011 6:21 PM To:
> [email-masked] Subject: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX,
> ground stations?
> 
> Hello list,
> 
> My university lab is competing for a nanosat project. I'm trying to
> gather information about DTN implementations to present to the group,
> and the following questions that I couldn't find answered online. Thanks
> for your consideration.
> 
> Has DTN2 or ION been ported to QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone know
> the depth of difference between QNX and VxWorks? (As I see ION has been
> implemented on VxWorks, perhaps porting to QNX would be a viable option.)
> 
> I've seen very little about ground station configuration. I had almost
> expected Universities to have configured a basic ground station package
> (or list of requirements) so that a network of them across the globe
> could create DTN ground links, and share data with their experimental
> satellites via the terrestrial internet. Has this happened and I just
> haven't found it yet? If my lab builds a ground station to talk to our
> nanosat, it will be idle (but operational) for all but the small windows
> of time in which we can see our satellite. I would be more than happy to
> have it configured to ask as another DTN ground station, if our project
> could be incorporated into a network of such shared-use ground stations.
> 
> Thanks again for your thoughts.
> Cheers,
> 
> Barrett Dillow
> PhD Candidate
> Space Systems Laboratory
> University of Maryland, College Park

From: "Burleigh, Scott C (313B)" <[email-masked]>
To: Barrett Dillow <[email-masked]>, "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2011 07:57:11 -0800
Accept-Language: en-US
acceptlanguage: en-US
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?

--_000_F25A909AA776104A92E2780BFCB3AEA81D5B533DALTPHYEMBEVSP40_
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Hi, Barrett.  ION has not yet been ported to QNX, but I suspect that the po=
rt would not be too difficult: QNX seems to be fully POSIX-compliant, and t=
hat's mainly what the portability shim in ION requires.  I'm guessing that =
the port might be similar to the RTEMS port, and possibly a bit easier; may=
be 10-20 hours to tweak ici/include/platform.h and ici/library/platform.c a=
nd platform_sm.c, and maybe another 20-30 hours to develop a build environm=
ent along the lines of arch-rtems.  If you're interested in taking it on I =
would be glad to provide whatever helpful hints I can.

I don't know of an existing network of DTN-equipped ground stations, but as=
 we see more and more Cubesats flying I think the motivation for building s=
uch a network will grow.  Either ION or DTN2 would work fine in ground stat=
ions, as they interoperate pretty well.  The major hurdle here, I guess, wo=
uld be development of an AX.25 convergence-layer adapter or (better, I beli=
eve) an AX.25 link service adapter under LTP.

Scott

From: [email-masked] [mailto:dtn-users-boun=
[email-masked]] On Behalf Of Barrett Dillow
Sent: Monday, February 07, 2011 6:21 PM
To: [email-masked]
Subject: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?

Hello list,

My university lab is competing for a nanosat project. I'm trying to gather =
information about DTN implementations to present to the group, and the foll=
owing questions that I couldn't find answered online. Thanks for your consi=
deration.

Has DTN2 or ION been ported to QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone know the=
 depth of difference between QNX and VxWorks? (As I see ION has been implem=
ented on VxWorks, perhaps porting to QNX would be a viable option.)

I've seen very little about ground station configuration. I had almost expe=
cted Universities to have configured a basic ground station package (or lis=
t of requirements) so that a network of them across the globe could create =
DTN ground links, and share data with their experimental satellites via the=
 terrestrial internet. Has this happened and I just haven't found it yet? I=
f my lab builds a ground station to talk to our nanosat, it will be idle (b=
ut operational) for all but the small windows of time in which we can see o=
ur satellite. I would be more than happy to have it configured to ask as an=
other DTN ground station, if our project could be incorporated into a netwo=
rk of such shared-use ground stations.

Thanks again for your thoughts.
Cheers,

Barrett Dillow
PhD Candidate
Space Systems Laboratory
University of Maryland, College Park

--_000_F25A909AA776104A92E2780BFCB3AEA81D5B533DALTPHYEMBEVSP40_
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<html xmlns:v=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o=3D"urn:schemas-micr=
osoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" =
xmlns:m=3D"http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns=3D"http:=
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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DEN-US link=3Dblue vli=
nk=3Dpurple><div class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'f=
ont-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Hi, Barre=
tt.&nbsp; ION has not yet been ported to QNX, but I suspect that the port w=
ould not be too difficult: QNX seems to be fully POSIX-compliant, and that&=
#8217;s mainly what the portability shim in ION requires.&nbsp; I&#8217;m g=
uessing that the port might be similar to the RTEMS port, and possibly a bi=
t easier; maybe 10-20 hours to tweak ici/include/platform.h and ici/library=
/platform.c and platform_sm.c, and maybe another 20-30 hours to develop a b=
uild environment along the lines of arch-rtems.&nbsp; If you&#8217;re inter=
ested in taking it on I would be glad to provide whatever helpful hints I c=
an.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0=
pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Cal=
ibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I don&#8217;t know of an existing network=
 of DTN-equipped ground stations, but as we see more and more Cubesats flyi=
ng I think the motivation for building such a network will grow. &nbsp;Eith=
er ION or DTN2 would work fine in ground stations, as they interoperate pre=
tty well.&nbsp; The major hurdle here, I guess, would be development of an =
AX.25 convergence-layer adapter or (better, I believe) an AX.25 link servic=
e adapter under LTP.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=
=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p=
>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0p=
t;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Scott<o:p></o:p></span>=
</p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calib=
ri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div style=3D'b=
order:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p cla=
ss=3DMsoNormal><b><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","san=
s-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Taho=
ma","sans-serif"'> [email-masked] [mailto:d=
[email-masked]] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Barrett =
Dillow<br><b>Sent:</b> Monday, February 07, 2011 6:21 PM<br><b>To:</b> dtn-=
[email-masked]<br><b>Subject:</b> [dtn-users] DTN, QNX,=
 ground stations?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbs=
p;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>Hello list,<br><br>My university lab is co=
mpeting for a nanosat project. I'm trying to gather information about DTN i=
mplementations to present to the group, and the following questions that I =
couldn't find answered online. Thanks for your consideration.<br><br>Has DT=
N2 or ION been ported to QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone know the depth=
 of difference between QNX and VxWorks? (As I see ION has been implemented =
on VxWorks, perhaps porting to QNX would be a viable option.) <br><br>I've =
seen very little about ground station configuration. I had almost expected =
Universities to have configured a basic ground station package (or list of =
requirements) so that a network of them across the globe could create DTN g=
round links, and share data with their experimental satellites via the terr=
estrial internet. Has this happened and I just haven't found it yet? If my =
lab builds a ground station to talk to our nanosat, it will be idle (but op=
erational) for all but the small windows of time in which we can see our sa=
tellite. I would be more than happy to have it configured to ask as another=
 DTN ground station, if our project could be incorporated into a network of=
 such shared-use ground stations. <br><br>Thanks again for your thoughts.<b=
r>Cheers,<br><br>Barrett Dillow<br>PhD Candidate<br>Space Systems Laborator=
y<br>University of Maryland, College Park <o:p></o:p></p></div></body></htm=
l>=

--_000_F25A909AA776104A92E2780BFCB3AEA81D5B533DALTPHYEMBEVSP40_--

From: <[email-masked]>
To: <[email-masked]>, <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2011 11:20:56 +0000
Accept-Language: en-US, en-GB
acceptlanguage: en-US, en-GB
Subject: Re: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?

--_000_FD7B10366AE3794AB1EC5DE97A93A3732150080287EXMB01CMSsurr_
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Barrett,

I don't believe dtn2 will ever run on an unmanned spacecraft; it's simply t=
oo resource-intensive and unix-y. I don't expect to see dtn2 implemented on=
 a nanosatellite. (We implemented a custom bundle shim on RTEMS on the UK-D=
MC satellite to generate bundles delivered to a full dtn2 implementation ru=
nning on linux on the ground.)

Cubesats are using AX.25 in comms for the most part, although arguments hav=
e been made for e.g. using HTTP to deliver files (a paper by Jamie Cutler w=
hile at Stanford, before moving to Michigan). There has been much discussio=
n of increased access to cubesats via networked ground stations; see e.g.
http://www.genso.org/
http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSOC5KXMF_index_0.html
http://www.astro.mech.tohoku.ac.jp/~gsn/en/
these are European/Japanese efforts building on radio amateur interest - li=
ttle US involvement.

The IP-based Disaster Monitoring Constellation has a number of internetwork=
ed IP-capable ground stations for exactly the reason you describe.

Lloyd Wood
http://sat-net.com/L.Wood/dtn

________________________________
From: [email-masked] [mailto:dtn-users-boun=
[email-masked]] On Behalf Of Barrett Dillow
Sent: 08 February 2011 02:21
To: [email-masked]
Subject: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?

Hello list,

My university lab is competing for a nanosat project. I'm trying to gather =
information about DTN implementations to present to the group, and the foll=
owing questions that I couldn't find answered online. Thanks for your consi=
deration.

Has DTN2 or ION been ported to QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone know the=
 depth of difference between QNX and VxWorks? (As I see ION has been implem=
ented on VxWorks, perhaps porting to QNX would be a viable option.)

I've seen very little about ground station configuration. I had almost expe=
cted Universities to have configured a basic ground station package (or lis=
t of requirements) so that a network of them across the globe could create =
DTN ground links, and share data with their experimental satellites via the=
 terrestrial internet. Has this happened and I just haven't found it yet? I=
f my lab builds a ground station to talk to our nanosat, it will be idle (b=
ut operational) for all but the small windows of time in which we can see o=
ur satellite. I would be more than happy to have it configured to ask as an=
other DTN ground station, if our project could be incorporated into a netwo=
rk of such shared-use ground stations.

Thanks again for your thoughts.
Cheers,

Barrett Dillow
PhD Candidate
Space Systems Laboratory
University of Maryland, College Park

--_000_FD7B10366AE3794AB1EC5DE97A93A3732150080287EXMB01CMSsurr_
Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dus-ascii" http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META name=3DGENERATOR content=3D"MSHTML 8.00.7600.16700"></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D802095710-08022011><FONT color=3D#0000ff size=3D2=20
face=3DArial>Barrett,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D802095710-08022011><FONT color=3D#0000ff size=3D2=20
face=3DArial></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D802095710-08022011><FONT color=3D#0000ff size=3D2 face=
=3DArial>I=20
don't believe dtn2 will ever run on an unmanned spacecraft; it's&nbsp;simpl=
y too=20
resource-intensive and unix-y. I don't expect to see dtn2 implemented on a=
=20
nanosatellite. (We implemented a custom bundle shim on RTEMS on the UK-DMC=
=20
satellite to generate bundles delivered to a full dtn2 implementation runni=
ng on=20
linux on the ground.)</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D802095710-08022011><FONT color=3D#0000ff size=3D2=20
face=3DArial></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D802095710-08022011><FONT color=3D#0000ff size=3D2=20
face=3DArial>Cubesats are using AX.25 in comms for the most part, although=
=20
arguments have been made for e.g. using HTTP to deliver files (a paper by J=
amie=20
Cutler while at Stanford, before moving to Michigan). There has been much=20
discussion of increased access to cubesats via networked ground stations; s=
ee=20
e.g.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D802095710-08022011><FONT color=3D#0000ff size=3D2 face=
=3DArial><A=20
href=3D"http://www.genso.org/">http://www.genso.org/</A></FONT></SPAN></DIV=
>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D802095710-08022011><FONT color=3D#0000ff size=3D2 face=
=3DArial><A=20
href=3D"http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEMSOC5KXMF_index_0.html">http://www.esa.i=
nt/esaCP/SEMSOC5KXMF_index_0.html</A></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D802095710-08022011><FONT color=3D#0000ff size=3D2 face=
=3DArial><A=20
href=3D"http://www.astro.mech.tohoku.ac.jp/~gsn/en/">http://www.astro.mech.=
tohoku.ac.jp/~gsn/en/</A></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D802095710-08022011><FONT color=3D#0000ff size=3D2 face=
=3DArial>these=20
are European/Japanese efforts building on radio amateur interest&nbsp;- lit=
tle=20
US involvement.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D802095710-08022011><FONT color=3D#0000ff size=3D2=20
face=3DArial></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D802095710-08022011><FONT color=3D#0000ff size=3D2 face=
=3DArial>The=20
IP-based Disaster Monitoring Constellation has a&nbsp;number=20
of&nbsp;internetworked IP-capable ground stations for exactly the reason yo=
u=20
describe.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D802095710-08022011><FONT color=3D#0000ff size=3D2=20
face=3DArial></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D802095710-08022011><FONT color=3D#0000ff size=3D2 face=
=3DArial>Lloyd=20
Wood</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D802095710-08022011><FONT color=3D#0000ff size=3D2 face=
=3DArial><A=20
href=3D"http://sat-net.com/L.Wood/dtn">http://sat-net.com/L.Wood/dtn</A></F=
ONT></SPAN></DIV><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5p=
x; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV dir=3Dltr lang=3Den-us class=3DOutlookMessageHeader align=3Dleft>
  <HR tabIndex=3D-1>
  <FONT size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><B>From:</B>=20
  [email-masked]=20
  [mailto:[email-masked]] <B>On Behalf Of=20
  </B>Barrett Dillow<BR><B>Sent:</B> 08 February 2011 02:21<BR><B>To:</B>=20
  [email-masked]<BR><B>Subject:</B> [dtn-users] DTN=
,=20
  QNX, ground stations?<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
  <DIV></DIV>Hello list,<BR><BR>My university lab is competing for a nanosa=
t=20
  project. I'm trying to gather information about DTN implementations to pr=
esent=20
  to the group, and the following questions that I couldn't find answered=20
  online. Thanks for your consideration.<BR><BR>Has DTN2 or ION been ported=
 to=20
  QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone know the depth of difference between =
QNX=20
  and VxWorks? (As I see ION has been implemented on VxWorks, perhaps porti=
ng to=20
  QNX would be a viable option.) <BR><BR>I've seen very little about ground=
=20
  station configuration. I had almost expected Universities to have configu=
red a=20
  basic ground station package (or list of requirements) so that a network =
of=20
  them across the globe could create DTN ground links, and share data with =
their=20
  experimental satellites via the terrestrial internet. Has this happened a=
nd I=20
  just haven't found it yet? If my lab builds a ground station to talk to o=
ur=20
  nanosat, it will be idle (but operational) for all but the small windows =
of=20
  time in which we can see our satellite. I would be more than happy to hav=
e it=20
  configured to ask as another DTN ground station, if our project could be=
=20
  incorporated into a network of such shared-use ground stations. <BR><BR>T=
hanks=20
  again for your thoughts.<BR>Cheers,<BR><BR>Barrett Dillow<BR>PhD=20
  Candidate<BR>Space Systems Laboratory<BR>University of Maryland, College =
Park=20
</BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

--_000_FD7B10366AE3794AB1EC5DE97A93A3732150080287EXMB01CMSsurr_--

Sender: [email-masked]
From: Barrett Dillow <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2011 21:21:15 -0500
To: [email-masked]
Subject: [dtn-users] DTN, QNX, ground stations?

--0016364ee4c0f08b2a049bbc0195
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

Hello list,

My university lab is competing for a nanosat project. I'm trying to gather
information about DTN implementations to present to the group, and the
following questions that I couldn't find answered online. Thanks for your
consideration.

Has DTN2 or ION been ported to QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone know the
depth of difference between QNX and VxWorks? (As I see ION has been
implemented on VxWorks, perhaps porting to QNX would be a viable option.)

I've seen very little about ground station configuration. I had almost
expected Universities to have configured a basic ground station package (or
list of requirements) so that a network of them across the globe could
create DTN ground links, and share data with their experimental satellites
via the terrestrial internet. Has this happened and I just haven't found it
yet? If my lab builds a ground station to talk to our nanosat, it will be
idle (but operational) for all but the small windows of time in which we can
see our satellite. I would be more than happy to have it configured to ask
as another DTN ground station, if our project could be incorporated into a
network of such shared-use ground stations.

Thanks again for your thoughts.
Cheers,

Barrett Dillow
PhD Candidate
Space Systems Laboratory
University of Maryland, College Park

--0016364ee4c0f08b2a049bbc0195
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1

Hello list,<br><br>My university lab is competing for a nanosat project.
 I&#39;m trying to gather information about DTN implementations to present 
to the group, and the following questions that I couldn&#39;t find answered 
online. Thanks for your consideration.<br>

<br>Has DTN2 or ION been ported to QNX for the spacecraft side? Anyone 
know the depth of difference between QNX and VxWorks? (As I see ION has 
been implemented on VxWorks, perhaps porting to QNX would be a viable 
option.) <br>

<br>I&#39;ve seen very little about ground station configuration. I had 
almost expected Universities to have configured a basic ground station 
package (or list of requirements) so that a network of them across the 
globe could create DTN ground links, and share data with their 
experimental satellites via the terrestrial internet. Has this happened 
and I just haven&#39;t found it yet? If my lab builds a ground station to 
talk to our nanosat, it will be idle (but operational) for all but the 
small windows of time in which we can see our satellite. I would be more
 than happy to have it configured to ask as another DTN ground station, 
if our project could be incorporated into a network of such shared-use 
ground stations. <br>

<br>Thanks again for your thoughts.<br>Cheers,<br><br>Barrett Dillow<br>PhD Candidate<br>Space Systems Laboratory<br>University of Maryland, College Park

--0016364ee4c0f08b2a049bbc0195--

Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2011 10:28:22 +0000
From: Stephen Farrell <[email-masked]>
To: DTN <[email-masked]>, DTN Security Discussion <[email-masked]>, "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Subject: [dtn-users] Migrating mailing list and wiki

Hi all,

Due to some machine changes with the current infrastructure
we're planning to migrate the DTNRG related lists (dtn-interest,
dtn-security and dtn-users) to the IETF/IRTF infrastructure in
the next few weeks. That'll mean you'll need to change filters
etc. but everything else should be the same.

We're also planning to move the wiki, which, all going well,
should just result in a little downtime.

Once we're all set, we'll send another mail with the final
details.

If there're any issues with the above please mail Kevin and
I, and also cc Alex McMahon ([email-masked]) who'll
be doing most of the real work involved.

Regards,
Stephen.