Subject: [I2nsf] Request for Comments, Interest and Support in I2NSF Re-Chartering

From: "Mr. Jaehoon Paul Jeong" <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2022 16:38:18 +0900

Hi I2NSF WG,
As you know, our I2NSF WG will discuss the I2NSF Re-Chartering
at IETF-113 I2NSF WG Session today.

I attach the text of the re-chartering as pdf and txt files.

Our five core I2NSF YANG data model drafts are almost completed.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1. Capability YANG Data Model
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-i2nsf-capability-data-model-27

2. NSF-Facing Interface YANG Data Model
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-i2nsf-nsf-facing-interface-dm-22

3. Monitoring Interface YANG Data Model
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-i2nsf-nsf-monitoring-data-model-16

4. Consumer-Facing Interface YANG Data Model
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-i2nsf-consumer-facing-interface-dm-17

5. Registration Interface YANG Data Model
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-i2nsf-registration-interface-dm-15
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The three of them (i.e., 1, 2, and 3) got the feedback of the IESG and
the revisions have been sent to the IESG reviewers.

The remaining two (i.e., 4, 5) are well-synchronized with the others.
I will present the updates of them today's I2NSF WG.
I attach the slides for them for your easy checking.

Our AD Roman has concerns about the low energy of our I2NSF WG for the new
work items in the I2NSF Re-chartering.

Could you speak up your voice about your comments, interest, and support of
our I2NSF Re-Chartering?

See you online at IETF-113 I2NSF WG Session today.

Thanks.

Best Regards,
Paul
-- 
===========================
Mr. Jaehoon (Paul) Jeong, Ph.D.
Associate Professor
Department Head
Department of Computer Science and Engineering
Sungkyunkwan University
Office: +82-31-299-4957
Email: [email-masked], [email-masked]
Personal Homepage: http://iotlab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php
<http://cpslab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php>

---

From: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2022 18:04:23 +0900

Hi all,

We believe that most of the current work will be completed in the near future.

It is appropriate to discuss next steps for the I2NSFWG in IETF113.

New issues based on the I2NSF framework will be discussed and adopted in this meeting.
I support the re-charting work for I2NSF WG.

Thanks

JungSoo

보낸 사람: "Mr. Jaehoon Paul Jeong" <[email-masked]>
날짜: 목요일, 2022년 3월 24일 오후 4:39
받는 사람: [email-masked] <[email-masked]>
참조: Roman Danyliw <[email-masked]>, tom petch <[email-masked]>, Susan Hares <[email-masked]>, DIEGO LOPEZ GARCIA <[email-masked]>, yangpenglin <[email-masked]>, Henk Birkholz <[email-masked]>, Panwei (William) <[email-masked]>
주제: Request for Comments, Interest and Support in I2NSF Re-Chartering

Hi I2NSF WG,

Could you speak up your voice about your comments, interest, and support of our I2NSF Re-Chartering?

Thanks.

Best Regards,

Paul
--

Department Head

---

From: 안태진(AI Security Service Proje) <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2022 09:31:30 +0000

Hi I2NSF WG,

As an internet service provider, KT(Korea Telecom) is very interested in standardizing network security for I2NSF.
Also as an author of the I2NSF WG draft, “Consumer-Facing Interface YANG Data Model”, I strongly support re-chartering with new Goals and Program of Work.

Best Regards,
Taejin

From: I2nsf [mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of Mr. Jaehoon Paul Jeong
Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2022 4:38 PM
To: [email-masked]
Cc: Roman Danyliw <[email-masked]>; Panwei (William) <[email-masked]>; Henk Birkholz <[email-masked]>; tom petch <[email-masked]>; yangpenglin <[email-masked]>; Susan Hares <[email-masked]>; DIEGO LOPEZ GARCIA <[email-masked]>
Subject: [I2nsf] Request for Comments, Interest and Support in I2NSF Re-Chartering

Hi I2NSF WG,

Thanks.

Best Regards,
Paul
--
===========================
Mr. Jaehoon (Paul) Jeong, Ph.D.
Associate Professor
Department Head
Department of Computer Science and Engineering
Sungkyunkwan University
Office: +82-31-299-4957
Email: [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>, [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>
Personal Homepage: http://iotlab.skku..edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php<http://cpslab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php>

---

From: hyunsikYang <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2022 18:38:35 +0900

Hello, all

I think I2NSF WG has completed the basic framework so far.

I think that the contents for Re-chartering in the mail below is
appropriate for the next step.

I will support the rechartering of the I2NSF WG and will continue to
participate in I2NSF activities.

Thanks

Best regards,

*----------------------------------------------------------------*

*Hyunsik Yang (Ph. D)*

*Distributed Cloud and Network lab / School of Electronic Engineering*

*Soongsil University *

*511 Sangdo-dong Dongjak-gu*

*Seoul, 156-743 Korea*

*TEL : (+82)-2-820-0841 *

*M.P: (+82)-10-9005-7439*

---

From: 선경재 <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2022 18:42:12 +0900

Hi Paul and I2NSF folks,

Thank you for updating drafts to move forward to the next step.

Also, I support re-chartering work for I2NSF WG.

Best Regards,
KJ.

-- 
====================================================================

선경재 / Kyoungjae Sun (KJ Sun)

연구원 / 클라우드 및 네트워크 연구실

Researcher / Distributed Cloud and Network lab

Office : +82-2-814-0151    Phone : +82-10-3643-5627

Email : [email-masked]

====================================================================

---

From: "Diego R. Lopez" <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2022 22:37:15 +0000

Hi,

I think I have expressed my opinion several times, on the list and at the WG meeting, but just for the record let me express my support for the re-chartering. It is ambitious but, as I mentioned during the meeting, we plan to base our work in many existing results, and I think it is achievable, and interesting to us as network operators.

Be goode,

--
"Esta vez no fallaremos, Doctor Infierno"

Dr Diego R. Lopez
Telefonica I+D
https://www.linkedin.com/in/dr2lopez/

e-mail: [email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>
Mobile:  +34 682 051 091
----------------------------------

On 24/03/2022, 08:39, "Mr. Jaehoon Paul Jeong" <[email-masked]<mailto:[email-masked]>> wrote:

Hi I2NSF WG,

Thanks.

Best Regards,
Paul
Personal Homepage: http://iotlab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php<http://cpslab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php>

________________________________

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---

From: 김평수/전자공학부/교원 <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2022 08:35:40 +0900

Hi I2NSF WG,

I support re-chartering work for I2NSF WG.

Thanks

PS Kim

2022년 3월 25일 (금) 오전 8:13, 김평수/전자공학부/교원 <[email-masked]>님이 작성:

> Hi I2NSF WG,
>
> I support re-chartering work for I2NSF WG.
>
> Thanks
>
> PS Kim
>

-- 
한국산업기술대학교가 한국공학대학교로 새롭게 도약합니다.

KPU changes its name to TU Korea(Tech 
University of Korea)

(우리 대학의 도메인이 kpu.ac.kr <http://kpu.ac.kr/> -> 
tukorea.ac.kr <http://tukorea.ac.kr/>로 변경됩니다)

(New domain name is 
tukorea.ac.kr <http://tukorea.ac.kr/>)

---

From: <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2022 09:54:09 +0900

Hi,

Support!

I think that it is reasonable to have the Re-chartering of I2NSF.

Regards,

Bin

From: I2nsf <[email-masked]> On Behalf Of Mr. Jaehoon Paul Jeong
Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2022 4:38 PM
To: [email-masked]
Cc: Roman Danyliw <[email-masked]>; Panwei (William) <[email-masked]>; Henk Birkholz <[email-masked]>; tom petch <[email-masked]>; yangpenglin <[email-masked]>; Susan Hares <[email-masked]>; DIEGO LOPEZ GARCIA <[email-masked]>
Subject: [I2nsf] Request for Comments, Interest and Support in I2NSF Re-Chartering

Hi I2NSF WG,

Thanks.

Best Regards,

Paul
-- 

Department Head
Department of Computer Science and Engineering
Sungkyunkwan University
Office: +82-31-299-4957
Email:  <mailto:[email-masked]> [email-masked], [email-masked] <mailto:[email-masked]> 
Personal Homepage: http://iotlab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php <http://cpslab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php>

---

From: YounHee Han <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2022 12:04:47 +0900

Hello,

I would like to express my support for the I2NSF re-chartering.

Regards,

Youn-Hee Han

---

From: t petch <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2022 09:04:35 +0000

> I attach the text of the re-chartering as pdf and txt files.

Those that have worked on the current five I2NSF I-D will know that they 
do not subscribe to the basic tenet of 'reference not replicate' and in 
doing so have created many issues of lack of coherence (some of which 
have been resolved, some of which may never be resolved) and have 
created much additional work.  In a sense, the current work is built on 
foundations of sand, which may or may not support ongoing work.

What is needed, and for me it is the overwhelming priority, before any 
new models are crafted, is a 'common' I-D to reduce or eliminate this 
replication even if it cannot be applied immediately to those five I-D. 
  The current charter hints at the need for this in its bullets and in 
its list of deliverables.  The terminology draft might have done this 
but has gone in a slightly different direction.  Common YANG capability 
statements are an obvious example but even a common base of plain text 
would make the work simpler, less error-prone.

Tom Petch

> _______________________________________________
> I2nsf mailing list
> [email-masked]
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/i2nsf
>

---

From: "Susan Hares" <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 26 Mar 2022 10:49:17 -0400

Tom: 

Thank you for this feedback.   

This error in the model comes from the initial assumptions during the start
of these models.  This error was a design choice in the early models based
on the flux in Yang during the NMDA model discussions.  Benoit's advice was
to try to get models out and then revise.   The security ADs were pushing
the working group to make progress.  Benoit and the security ADs wanted
progress.  The tenant of "replication" works in that environment.

Versioning in Yang models  is still a work in progress.  This round of
versioning is still  not complex enough for BGP policy modeling.  (And
IMHO/AFAIK  Open Config Yang modeling is behind IETF modeling in complex
versioning).   

Therefore, the error in that advice to Linda Dunbar and Paul Jeong is mine.
Paul, his co-authors, and his students have done the best possible based on
that advice.  Time has moved on in both realms (netmod) and security.   The
current security ADs were not privy to these pieces of advice. 

Would you suggest going back to square-1 to rework each of these models?
If so, should this be the first order of work?  

Just a warning, refactoring to remove the "replication" works best as Paul
Jeong has done it.  It is careful and precise work reviewed by a few
experts.  The working group reviews for high level content.  Paul Jeong's
presentation at IETF 113 gave that type of review.   I wish we would have
had a longer time period, but hybrid meetings shorten "off-line meetings". 

WGs focus on protocol content (routing or security WG) struggle to maintain
moment cycling around refactoring.   Combing the refactoring work with
additional work helps keep a working group functional.  
  
Any advice?  

Sue 

Opinion: The IETF needs to strong cross-area management as we head into 5G
work.   Security in all areas is key for 5G needs. 

-----Original Message-----
From: t petch [mailto:[email-masked]] 
Sent: Friday, March 25, 2022 5:05 AM
To: Mr. Jaehoon Paul Jeong; [email-masked]
Cc: Roman Danyliw; Panwei (William); Henk Birkholz; tom petch; yangpenglin;
Susan Hares; DIEGO LOPEZ GARCIA
Subject: Re: [I2nsf] Request for Comments, Interest and Support in I2NSF
Re-Chartering

Tom Petch

> Our five core I2NSF YANG data model drafts are almost completed.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------
> 1. Capability YANG Data Model
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-i2nsf-capability-data-model
-27
> 2. NSF-Facing Interface YANG Data Model
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-i2nsf-nsf-facing-interface-
dm-22
> 3. Monitoring Interface YANG Data Model
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-i2nsf-nsf-monitoring-data-m
odel-16
> 4. Consumer-Facing Interface YANG Data Model
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-i2nsf-consumer-facing-inter
face-dm-17
> 5. Registration Interface YANG Data Model
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-i2nsf-registration-interfac
e-dm-15
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------

---

From: t petch <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2022 16:49:08 +0100

> If so, should this be the first order of work?

Sue,

No way!  I look at OPSAWG who decided to produce four modules, got two 
to RFC and then realised how much was in common between the four so 
produced a common and used that in the latter two and will use it in any 
revision of the first two RFC.  Here you have five about to become RFC 
as-is, but I would like to see prioritised a 'common' - definitions, 
explanations (e.g. PMR, 'Base identity...', Capability, ...) and YANG 
(identity!), based on those five, as the next work item after that so 
that the I-D for the next YANG model - I see several have been suggested 
- after that can use that work, as can those that come after that; as 
could any revisions of the first five.

It is ironic, really.  In general, in YANG, I see a lot of 'common' YANG 
type, YANG grouping within a module which add nothing but complexity to 
the module and whatever the opposite of ease-of-use is; and I then see 
YANG doctors comment that this grouping is only used once, get rid of 
it; which I agree with. So, to be advocating a 'common' is unusual for me.

Tom Petch

> .

---

From: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2022 11:37:53 +0800

Hi all,

New architectures or new concepts of security have raised in different networks, like eNA (enablers for Network Automation) in 3GPP, zero-trust in SASE, trust computing in network device, DLT, etc. So I think we do need a re-charter to guide the WG to move forward. 
But as Roman mentioned in the meeting, I think we need to be more careful about the scope and the workload of the new charter to make sure that we can focus on the specific issue rather than a oblivious concept.

BR.
Penglin

From: Mr. Jaehoon Paul Jeong
Date: 2022-03-24 15:38
To: [email-masked]
CC: Roman Danyliw; Panwei \(William\); Henk Birkholz; tom petch; yangpenglin; Susan Hares; DIEGO LOPEZ GARCIA
Subject: [I2nsf] Request for Comments, Interest and Support in I2NSF Re-Chartering
Hi I2NSF WG,
As you know, our I2NSF WG will discuss the I2NSF Re-Chartering
at IETF-113 I2NSF WG Session today.

Thanks.

Best Regards,
Paul