Subject: RE: Why spam is a problem.

From: Franck Martin <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 14 Aug 2002 10:32:14 +1200

The problem is that the Whois system for IP numbers is not organised
hierarchically (like DNS).

So you have to use tricks to go down the list of delegations to find the
final one...

There ough to be an RFC?

Franck Martin
Network and Database Development Officer
SOPAC South Pacific Applied Geoscience Commission
Fiji
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-----Original Message-----
From: Markku Savela [mailto:[email-masked]]
Sent: Wednesday, 14 August 2002 9:19 
To: [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: Why spam is a problem.

> From: [email-masked]

> The problem is that ARIN is sending a bill to the owner of a /8 that it
> has to forward to the owner of the delegated /15 who sold bandwidth to
> a /24 - and the activity isn't violating the AUP of the /8 (remember,
> they only sell connectivity - and you do NOT want to get into
content-based
> stuff - there's a reason why 17 USC 512 gives a safe-harbor to ISPs
regarding
> their users).

---

From: Keith Moore <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 20:00:15 -0400

> hierarchically (like DNS).

maybe "the problem" is that there are too many people who want to insist 
that "the problem" can be stated in simple terms and/or can be solved 
to the satisfaction of hundreds of millions of email users by tweaking 
one single thing.

Keith

---

From: [email-masked]
Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 18:10:01 -0700 (PDT)

IP whois is not perfect but it is not a problem and all information is 
available even if sometimes more research is needed. In addition ARIN, 
APNIC and RIPE are all preparing new updates of whois service which are 
all in beta testing now. You'lre also welcome to check Completewhois.com 
and you'll get full idea of whois ip hearchical system (come in one month 
and you'll be even more impressed, interface update is coming soon...). 

And protocol does exist - rwhois is designed to provide hierchical whois 
system with redirects from one server to the next and it even used to work 
directly from root rwhois for both ip and dns. Unfortunetly root rwhois 
server is not really maintained any more.... 

But I seriously don't think, IP whois protocols are a problem - its ISPs 
that do not report information on their customers through already existing 
system (swip, rwhois, etc) that are creating problems.