Subject: Re: Meetings in other regions

From: [email-masked] (Noel Chiappa)
Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2006 15:07:05 -0400 (EDT)

> From: Avri Doria <[email-masked]>

    >> the european and asiapac meetings, from the proceedings.
    >> ...
    >> Yokohama, for example, was 1977 folks, of which 1/4 were US and
    >> perhaps 40% were Japanese. Seoul was similar.

    > a large number of participants will come from whatever region the
    > meeting is in .. giving us no objective criteria for weighing one
    > region over another.

Try taking the overall NA data, and removing the NA people; the remaining
data should be relatively unbiased (e.g. the Asia/Europe ratio should be
fairly close to the "actual" value). Do the same for the European and Asian
meetings, only there remove the respective "local" numbers (i.e. European
and Asian). Judicious comparison of results should give you a pretty close
values for the true overall NA/European/Asian ratios.

	Noel

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From: Fred Baker <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2006 22:45:21 -0400

On Jul 14, 2006, at 3:07 PM, Noel Chiappa wrote:
> Try taking the overall NA data, and removing the NA people; the  
> remaining data should be relatively unbiased (e.g. the Asia/Europe  
> ratio should be fairly close to the "actual" value). Do the same  
> for the European and Asian meetings, only there remove the  
> respective "local" numbers (i.e. European and Asian). Judicious  
> comparison of results should give you a pretty close values for the  
> true overall NA/European/Asian ratios.

OK, so I have just gone through an analysis of this. Like any good  
researcher, I started with a simplifying assumption and then  
criticized my own assumptions.

Assumption: if a person is from a country, when they list their home  
address, they will list the country. So I can look for names of  
countries.

Criticism: US folks don't do that. They do well to get a two letter  
postal identifier in for their state. Mea Culpa. So the results one  
gets from this analysis will not reflect US population. (note: I did  
find 61 I-Ds that listed that the person was from the United States.)

Criticism: I found two internet drafts that take it upon themselves  
to list countries - one of them appears to try to list all of the  
countries in the world.

Criticism: "Aruba Networks" is a company. "Chad" is a common name for  
men. Atlanta is in "Georgia". And so on.

Assumption: the "we" in question is folks who post internet drafts.  
Attendance at an IETF meeting or being on the mailing list doesn't  
qualify for consideration here.

Criticism: there are SO many ways to approach that one. This is the  
assumption I made for this analysis. So there.

So I wound up putting a bit of work into this. If you don't like my  
analysis, do your own analysis :-)

I started from the Wikipedia list of countries. This is a very good  
article, BTW: it lists about 253 regions and peoples that think of  
themselves as countries whether anyone else thinks so or not,  
including self-ruled regions of Denmark (Greenland), Islands  
protected by nations (Guam, the Falklands), Cities that act a lot  
like countries (Hong Kong), people groups that don't like other  
people groups they live with (Palestine), and so on.

Basically, I assumed that if someone said they lived or worked at  
some address in a named place, they probably did.

Criticism: I know of some people who probably don't know where they  
live. I fly more than some of them :-)

By my analysis, the people that are involved in the IETF claim in  
Internet Drafts to have mailing addresses in: United States, Germany,  
France, Finland, Canada, Japan, China, Belgium, Sweden, Korea, United  
Kingdom, Israel, India, Italy, Switzerland, Spain, Austria, Norway,  
Australia, Netherlands, Ireland, Hungary, Singapore, Portugal,  
Turkey, Bulgaria, Denmark, Taiwan, Argentina, Egypt, Poland, Hong  
Kong, Venezuela, Croatia, New Zealand, Syria, Sudan, Romania,  
Lebanon, Mongolia, Greece, Thailand, or Costa Rica. Yes, there is an  
order to that list - the countries at the beginning have a lot of I- 
Ds posted, and the ones at the tail have one I-D posted.

---

From: Henrik Levkowetz <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2006 23:33:33 -0400

Hi Fred,

on 2006-07-14 22:45 Fred Baker said the following:
...
...

More data on this:

  http://www.arkko.com/tools/authorstats.html

and a subsidiary page listing authors of active drafts
by region (Note that since drafts can have multiple
authors, the sum of the following percentages are more
than 100%),
  http://www.arkko.com/tools/stats/d-contdistr.html:

# 1523 drafts (73.08%) have authors from North America.
# 1116 drafts (53.55%) have authors from Europe.
# 417 drafts (20.01%) have authors from Asia.
# 33 drafts (1.58%) have authors from Australia.
# 9 drafts (0.43%) have authors from South America.
# 3 drafts (0.14%) have authors from Africa.
# 1 drafts (0.05%) have authors from OTHER.

and by country:
http://www.arkko.com/tools/stats/d-countrydistr.html:

...
# 1395 drafts (66.94%) have authors from Usa.
# 218 drafts (10.46%) have authors from Germany.
# 196 drafts (9.40%) have authors from United kingdom.
# 170 drafts (8.16%) have authors from Finland.
# 163 drafts (7.82%) have authors from France.
# 151 drafts (7.25%) have authors from Japan.
# 128 drafts (6.14%) have authors from Canada.
# 83 drafts (3.98%) have authors from Sweden.
# 81 drafts (3.89%) have authors from China.
# 70 drafts (3.36%) have authors from South korea.
# 61 drafts (2.93%) have authors from Belgium.
# 53 drafts (2.54%) have authors from Israel.
# 41 drafts (1.97%) have authors from Spain.
# 41 drafts (1.97%) have authors from India.
# 38 drafts (1.82%) have authors from Italy.
# 36 drafts (1.73%) have authors from Switzerland.
# 29 drafts (1.39%) have authors from Australia.
# 21 drafts (1.01%) have authors from The netherlands.
# 19 drafts (0.91%) have authors from Norway.
# 17 drafts (0.82%) have authors from Austria.
# 11 drafts (0.53%) have authors from Ireland.
# 10 drafts (0.48%) have authors from Hungary.
...

---

From: Fred Baker <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 15 Jul 2006 05:24:45 -0400

Thanks. gee whiz, that was a bunch of work for me. You had a tool?  
arg...

:-)

---

From: Henrik Levkowetz <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 15 Jul 2006 08:49:29 -0400

> Thanks. gee whiz, that was a bunch of work for me. You had a tool?  

Well, in this case, I knew about a tool ;-) which was written by
Jari Arkko, not by me.

Best,

	Henrik

---

From: Jeffrey Hutzelman <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2006 03:03:54 -0400

On Saturday, July 15, 2006 05:24:45 AM -0400 Fred Baker <[email-masked]> 
wrote:

> Thanks. gee whiz, that was a bunch of work for me. You had a tool?  arg...

It's best to always ask Henrik and/or Bill if they have a tool.
Often they do, and if not, it may take less time to produce it than it 
would take one of us to realize we need it.

-- Jeff