Subject: [rbridge] Rbridge Management

From: "Eastlake III Donald-LDE008" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 17:10:32 -0500

Judging from the experience of previous documents in the IESG, I believe
it would be wise for the base protocol document to say something about
management.

So I think that something like the following should be added, perhaps as
a paragraph just before the 2.1 Section heading.

"Rbridges can be managed with SNMP [RFC3410]. The Rbridge MIB will be
specified in a separate document. SNMP can be transported directly by
Layer 2 (see [RFC4789]) so its use within the bounds of an Rbridge
campus does not require that Rbridges be configured with Layer 3
addresses such as IP addresses."

Any comments?

Donald

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From: "Eric Gray" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 06:21:23 -0600

Donald,

	Assuming that we can accept that RFC 3410 is the appropriate 
reference for SNMP generally (it seems to be an informational RFC
that talks about the relative advantages of different versions of
SNMP), this assertion is technically correct.  One can use SNMP in
the way it is described in RFC 4789 to manage RBridges.

	However, there are probably at least 3 management models that
may apply to RBridges, where there are issues/concerns with whether 
SNMP/L2 would be sufficient (e.g. - from a security perspective,
from a management platform support perspective, etc.).  The 3 models
I can quickly imagine - where SNMP/L2 may be either inadequate or 
not particularly useful - are:

1) litteral plug-and-play - no management is anticipated and what 
   small amount of management that may apply would most likely be
   done via web-access (IP address required, probably configured
   via DHCP) or direct connection to a computer;
2) some management anticipated (minimal VLAN configuration, or a
   deployment involving/expecting use of non-default behavior in
   one or more aspects (out-of-band, or console, management may
   be sufficient, SNMP/L2 may provide inadequate or incompatible
   security);
3) extensive management is the rule (plug and play is a non-goal,
   avoidance of address configuration is explicitly a non-goal,
   use of device interactive security access - requiring dialog
   via IP - is unavoidable, etc.).

	Considering (at least) these cases, while the paragraph you
propose may be technically correct, it may also be insufficient to 
address management of RBridges generally.

--
Eric Gray
Principal Engineer
Ericsson  

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email-masked] 
> [mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of Eastlake III 
> Donald-LDE008
> Sent: Tuesday, November 13, 2007 5:11 PM
> To: Developing a hybrid router/bridge.
> Subject: [rbridge] Rbridge Management
>

---

From: [email-masked]
Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 10:28:29 -0800

I wouldn't want us to agonize over that paragraph and delay putting out
the next version of the spec. It seems fine to me, and does not preclude
configuring (or otherwise acquiring, e.g., with
DHCP) an IP address for the RBridge and
configuring it using SNMP over IP.

Radia

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From: "Eastlake III Donald-LDE008" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 17:46:06 -0500

Hi Eric,

The suggested paragraph wasn't actually intended to "address management
of RBridges generally" and I would agree that it fails to do that.  I
think that should be done in a separate document. The paragraph was just
intended to reduce possible complaints that the document completely
ignored management or zero configuration management.

RFC 3410 seems to be the standard general SNMP reference when you just
want to mention just one RFC. As you say, RFC 3410 points to many
additional SNMP RFCs. If there is a better RFC to point to, the draft
should be changed to use that.

The text in protocol draft -06 was modified in response to your comment
to mention management via Layer 3.

Donald

> From: Eric Gray [mailto:[email-masked]] 
> Sent: Wednesday, November 14, 2007 7:21 AM
> To: Eastlake III Donald-LDE008; Developing a hybrid router/bridge.
> Subject: RE: [rbridge] Rbridge Management
> 
> Donald,
>